Critique my build

[Chickentoast]

Building my first gasser since moving to a free state. Was going to buy one from MSTN or get a JP or V7, but decided to build - and learn from my mistakes.

Here's what I have incoming:

BAD556 Ambi set
V7 controls and dust cover
2A Ti Adjustable BCG
V7 Lightweight Fluted 16" barrel (comes w/ Ti gas block and stainless tube)
BAD LW Carbine Buffer Tube
Taccom Ultralight carbine buffers and Tubb Flatwire spring
Magpul SL-K
Raptor LT
TT Diamond
2A Balios G2 12" rail and Ti barrel nut - had thought about 15", but wanted to have the option of a 12.5" barrel later.
Ergo 0 degree grip w/ beavertail
Lancer Mags
Aero Ultralight mount
PLX Compact 1-8 Griffin Mil
Brake: wavering between SLR Synergy Minicomp and the SR22, both in Ti.

Hoping the system can be tuned without a weighted buffer, and hoping I didn't make any glaring mistakes otherwise.

Uses: fun, learn to shoot faster, target and steel, stand, kneel, prone, mostly inside 600, and if accurate enough, maybe some varminting. Going to try 55 blitzkings, 75 eldm's, and 69 & 77 smk's / tmk's. My bolt 223 is 26" and dialed with 80's, so I have a bunch of lighter components around to try.

 

[Chickentoast]

^Sounds like this journey may end up being long and expensive - I didn't mean to build a who's who, just looked at performance/weight along with availability, and went from there. With bolt guns, and especially with optics, I've learned the hard way that it's cheaper to buy once - so thought it would cross over, but expect I will learn what I wasted money on once I get more experience with the parts.

I do have chassis bolt guns that I could swap the grip with if vertical is weird... Hopefully not a biggie with the rail for now - I would prefer to run a bipod further forward, but don't expect to put one on this rifle, so thought less weight forward, and the option to swap. Trigger was difficult since I couldn't try many - pulled a component 2 stage and single stage (unsure of brands) in the gun shop, but both felt creepy, long overtravel, and heavy. I keep my bolt guns around ~6oz, so this is going to be a different animal for sure.

Agree re: free state. Need to file paperwork and let the wait begin. So happy to be back in a nice place with actual Americans around me.

 

[bfoosh006]

I will second the concerns over the 0 degree grip.

And that will be a spendy build. It will be interesting to see it when it is done.

 

[TonyTheTiger]

Those 75 ELD's are gonna be a no go.
Interesting choice on the Taccom plastic buffers. Not necessarily a bad choice, but they're best suited to race guns with super light carriers and springs and possibly even low powered ammo. I have a few and they work fine but are kinda niche.

 

[Chickentoast]

Those 75 ELD's are gonna be a no go.
Interesting choice on the Taccom plastic buffers. Not necessarily a bad choice, but they're best suited to race guns with super light carriers and springs and possible even low powered ammo. I have a few and they work fine but are kinda niche.

75 ELD's due to length or V7 barrels tend to not like them?

Plasti-buffers - yes, I'm interested to see how the whole reciprocating mass balances... hoping the ti adj block will allow me to smooth it out for different loads. Maybe the Blitzkings or some 50 or 60 VMAX's will do better with the lightweight build? I have a feeling I'm going to end up with 1 pistol and 2 rifles, each wearing some of these parts...

 

[MontanaMan]

More or less what Tony said, with a couple of other comments.

I do like all thinks V7 for the most part.

Having had both, the Radian Talon is far better than the BAD ambi safety.................not even close.
For sure, drop the plastic buffer idea, at least in the beginning for the reasons mentioned; if you don't want to start with a full mass BCG, then use a reduced weight one from Young or JP or RCA, short of titanium, as is will be much easier to get the gun tuned initially & you won't need low recoil handloads.

I also match handguard length to the gun, but have more or less settled on a 13.7" Geiselle MK-14 or SLR Ion Lite for 14.7" - 18" barrels...............personal preference depending on the intended use, some like the rail right to the end of the barrel or very close on everything.......I don't.

69 & 77 SMK's tipped or not, 70 -77 RDF's, & 75 Hornady's will do all that needs doing within the capabilities of 223W /5.56 IMHO.

LaRue grips fit my hand really well, otherwise mostly it's a Magpul K2+, not a big fan of zero angle stuff yet.

Never used any of SLR's brake's....................but there are some good reviews available on effectiveness of various brakes if you search hard; if not suppressed or if not a flash hider, I like VG6's.

YYMV

MM

 

[Chickentoast]

More or less what Tony said, with a couple of other comments.

I do like all thinks V7 for the most part.

Having had both, the Radian Talon is far better than the BAD ambi safety.................not even close.
For sure, drop the plastic buffer idea, at least in the beginning for the reasons mentioned; if you don't want to start with a full mass BCG, then use a reduced weight one from Young or JP or RCA, short of titanium, as is will be much easier to get the gun tuned initially & you won't need low recoil handloads.

I also match handguard length to the gun, but have more or less settled on a 13.7" Geiselle MK-14 or SLR Ion Lite for 14.7" - 18" barrels...............personal preference depending on the intended use, some like the rail right to the end of the barrel or very close on everything.......I don't.

69 & 77 SMK's tipped or not, 70 -77 RDF's, & 75 Hornady's will do all that needs doing within the capabilities of 223W /5.56 IMHO.

LaRue grips fit my hand really well, otherwise mostly it's a Magpul K2+, not a big fan of zero angle stuff yet.

Never used any of SLR's brake's....................but there are some good reviews available on effectiveness of various brakes if you search hard; if not suppressed or if not a flash hider, I like VG6's.

YYMV

MM

You mean the ADAC-15 receiver or just the Talon controls? V7 told me I bought a flimsy receiver set... so much conflicting info online I just said f-it, I'll put one together and by the time I shoot a few K rounds, and probably swap out all the parts, I'll be intimately familiar with the platform, what I like, and how part changes affect (or don't affect) all aspects of the system.

Was hoping to run full power loads with the current build - figured worst case I could add a weighted buffer, or even swap to A5 length buffer tube plus weight - but then the super lightweight bolt makes less sense... Circular arguments will be the norm until I can use it and decide with more info and first-hand experience. Worst case is some of the parts might end up in the PX.

I'll probably exchange the Zero grip - looked at my bolt chassis' and neither have room for a beavertail.

Watched and read exhausting reviews about muzzle devices. For now, wanted to stick with Ti (given the lightweight build), and didn't want any holes on the bottom in case I was shooting prone. I have a radial brake on a 300RUM and the brake needs its own shooting mat . V7 Furion as well as their Competition brake both look interesting, but the SLR's are smaller.

 

[TonyTheTiger]

75 ELD's due to length or V7 barrels tend to not like them?

Plasti-buffers - yes, I'm interested to see how the whole reciprocating mass balances... hoping the ti adj block will allow me to smooth it out for different loads.

The 73gr ELD's are designed with AR mag constraints in mind. The 75's are way too long, to get them to mag length the ogive will be well inside the case neck. And they like to be closer to the lands. I once extensively modified an AR to make it work and it was cool but now we're getting really niche.

You can certainly get the low mass stuff to work with both heavy or light loads, problem is with setups like that you narrow your operational window considerably, so it becomes a one trick pony and will require gas adjustment to be optimized for one or the other. It's unlikely it'll be happy running both on the same tune.

I was going to wait for Tony to respond ref the ELDMs but he's probably at work.

You're darn right he is. Primers and car parts won't pay for themselves!

 

[Chickentoast]

^Cool, thanks - since I don't plan to run factory ammo, set and forget might be OK. Also, the 2A bcg doesn't need to be removed to adjust (unlike the RCA), so, in theory, fine tuning each load shouldn't be a huge PITA. 7 twist barrel, so hoping I can get a light projectile to work as well - assume the 69-77's will be easier though - and better BC anyway, but the light bullets seem to have 1/2 the recoil - which is nice if trying to stay on at longer range and higher magnification. Can't wait for the trial and error!

 

[Chickentoast]

^Very nice. And agree on all points - I found myself not choosing a part, or spending extra money on V7 lower parts, for example, so as not to nullify a prior chosen lightweight part. Will see how much I enjoy the light weight - I had a CZ527 youth carbine a while back and do miss it - this should be even lighter, and semi. Just hoping it isn't difficult to shoot/finicky with regard to hold/pressure.

 

[MontanaMan]

You mean the ADAC-15 receiver or just the Talon controls? V7 told me I bought a flimsy receiver set...

Sorry, I meant just the Talon controls. I've not used that receiver, so can't say. I have used V7 receivers & they are good.

SLR's, Cross Machine & SanTan's receiver's are great too, but there's really no real (quantifiable) gain over a quality forging except aesthetics. BCM's thermofit uppers are very good, very straight / concentric & a very tight fit to the barrel extension.

IMO, the stiffest uppers are Cross, Vltor MUR & SanTan...............but again, seeing a quantifiable gain (in accuracy) is hard to find, but it makes a lot of people feel good & surely doesn't hurt.

MM

 

[Chickentoast]

^Right, quantifiable gain is different than showing me the rigidity of my BAD billet receiver is inferior to another. There was a SanTan locally at another shop, but I bought the BAD at stop #1, which effectively set me on the lightweight path

Less of a point getting a White Oak Brux 20" or similar SPR type barrel with the super lightweight receiver set. Also, wasn't what I was after initially - have my bolt guns for that kind of shooting - but still want to maximize accuracy for the size/weight of the system. If it's not <3" @ 300 in no wind, I'll be disappointed. Under 1.5" and I'll be ecstatic. Similarly, if I can dump 5 rounds, and still put 5 into 3" @ 300, I'll also be very happy, given the weight of the barrel.

 

[Molon]

75 ELD's due to length?

Loaded to magazine length . . .

For use in a semi-automatic AR-15 at shorter distances, you'll be hard pressed to find a better bullet than the Sierra 55 grain BlitzKing.

....

 

[Jsp556]

For your first AR, nothing wrong with an Aero receiver set, Midwest Industries handguard, Toolcraft BCG, VLTOR A5 system, and WOA 3Gun 16" barrel. Maybe get fancy with a PWS ratchet lock castle nut or a short throw safety. Play around with a Black River Tactical pinnable gas block and ez tune gas tube vs an SLR Sentry AGB.

I think to justify all the super lightweight niche titanium parts, EVERYTHING has to be super light. If you build the gun paying 60% more for very small weight savings in a bunch of small parts but then undermine it by a heavy scope mount, muzzle device, or buttstock or buffer system then it was just kinda waste of money. A person could probably get to the same weight without all the fancy small parts by just being selective with barrels, BCGs, handguards, and stocks.

This build is 8lbs 1oz as you see it. I by no means built it with weight in mind. But seeing some of the parts you can see how weight sneaks up. The suppressor weighs 1lb and the suppressor cover weighs 5oz. IMO the unnecessary fancy shit on this is the receiver set. AR Performance 16" melonited barrel cut down to 13.7" p&w DA KeyMo brake. The barrel was 1lb 8oz before it lost 2.6". VLTOR A5 buffer system with a H1 buffer. PRI M84 charging handle. CMC single stage 2.5lb drop in. SLR BCG(kind of unnecessary but it's at least a quality part). BRT pinned lo profile gas block(I drilled the gas block and barrel). BRT mid-length .073 gas tube. SLR's lo profile ambi mag catch. Some dudes castle nut, endplate, and safety selector. Rex Silentium MOD X .45 cal suppressor in short mode with a .223 endcap. KeyMo adapter. ColeTac python cover.

View attachment 8016698View attachment 8016699

But this is just my style of interest. Different strokes....

Stop buying up the few available melonite 5.56 ARP barrels. Lol

 

[Chickentoast]

So is ARP the Urbanrifleman of AR barrels? Sounds great actually, maybe I should grab a 12.5 just to have...

 

[Jsp556]

So is ARP the Urbanrifleman of AR barrels? Sounds great actually, maybe I should grab a 12.5 just to have...

They’re really good barrels that shoot a lot better than the price point suggests. I saw 1 melonited 16” scout barrel left on the site, $175…. Tempting but I checked and still have a Socom squirreled away.

I like the older, heavier, 16” Socom and 18” SPR profiles with 5/8x24 muzzles but haven’t seen them offered in quite a while. The new owner said he had no plans for those profiles or muzzle threads in the near future.

 

[91Eunozs]

I’ve built several light and ultralight ARs over the past few years, and it was a learning experience for sure…. Posted all my builds, along with what worked and what didn’t over on the now defunct Zombie Squad website, but in short be ready to tune your rifle to get it to run perfect and reliably…with both gas and reciprocating mass.

Start out with a standard BCG and standard carbine buffer and spring and the gas wide open …tune the gas down first.

Once it’s perfect, replace one piece of the buffer/BCG at a time with lightweight stuff and adjust the gas down as needed.

If you get it right, you’ll have a gun that’s ridiculously easy to shoot well, and drive onto the target…it’ll feel like a toy.

Here’s a couple of my builds:

4#, 9 oz with no tax stamp…including red dot and mount + BUIS; based on 2A Arms Balios lite set, Smoke Composite stock, etc. with tons of V7 guts and a Boomfab Titane titanium bolt carrier.

And the one I went nuts with to see how light I could get with an AR (again no tax stamp or pistol brace to cut weight with a shorter barrel). 3#, 4.4oz including a 10-rd magazine:

Parts list with weights/sources:

edit; and yes, both are actually used…albeit pretty much range use only For the ultralight build.

 

[Chickentoast]

you sick b! That's awesome.

Can I tune the gun in the opposite fashion - set it up with the parts I've purchased, but with the gas off, and slowly increase the gas until I achieve ejection @ 4 o-clock? Was also planning to build some light loads for this process until I trust her...

 

[91Eunozs]

Re: AR barrels, I’m a huge fan of BCM and DD, but I don’t specifically build my ARs for precision…I’m very happy to be +/- 1MOA at 100 yards. That said, the most accurate barrel on an AR I’ve personally built was with a barrel from a company called MicroMoa…. Don’t think they’re around anymore though.

Here’s that barrel on it’s third incarnation, after I retrofitted the FSB and gas block from a Ruger 556 onto it…yes, I had to drill new ’upside down’ slots for the pins on my drill press in my garage! Still shoots awesome…

 

[TonyTheTiger]

Will see how much I enjoy the light weight - I had a CZ527 youth carbine a while back and do miss it - this should be even lighter, and semi. Just hoping it isn't difficult to shoot/finicky with regard to hold/pressure.

Good luck. You want a lot of different things and some of them are at odds with each other. A really light AR that also has to shoot .5 moa at 300 yards is a tall order.
I once assembled a 5lb AR for my oldest son. As soon as he got a little bigger we started adding weight. That thing sucked to shoot. Lightness isn't all it's hyped up to be.

 

[91Eunozs]

you sick b! That's awesome.

Can I tune the gun in the opposite fashion - set it up with the parts I've purchased, but with the gas off, and slowly increase the gas until I achieve ejection @ 4 o-clock? Was also planning to build some light loads for this process until I trust her...

You can, but easier to go the other way; for me anyway…. Keep cutting off the gas until it fails to feed, then back off 1/4 turn or so and run through a regular drill, including at least one 3 or 5-rd ‘mag dump’ to ensure it cycles.

It’d be fun to run some ‘mouse fart’ sub loads through it to see how it shoots. Probably feel like a very accurate bb gun!

That one is so light, it literally feels like a toy. During the build, someone said I should put an airsoft mag in it and just leave it out in the open to see what people say when they come over. Had to file down some edges on the magazine to make it work, but it (sort of) fits in the magwell…close enough to fool non-AR folks, LOL.

I’m seriously thinking of hanging it over the mantle like this to get some folk’s goat! LOL

With a regular 10-rd AR mag in for comparison:

 

[MontanaMan]

Good luck. You want a lot of different things and some of them are at odds with each other. A really light AR that also has to shoot .5 moa at 300 yards is a tall order.
I once assembled a 5lb AR for my oldest son. As soon as he got a little bigger we started adding weight. That thing sucked to shoot. Lightness isn't all it's hyped up to be.

Tony is one of the few guys here that I always pay attention to & he's given you (the OP) some good direction on hardware as well as raising some issues to deal with or to maybe take a different tack on. Tony has tried a LOT of really different stuff, & if he raise some issue, you can pretty much bet it's real.

But, similar to another thread running here right now, you are another new person here with a lot of internet based info formulated into some fairly rigid notions, some of which are more or less contradictory to each other. All with no experience.

Add to that, & seeing that you are new to AR's, is the fact that shooting a semi-auto AR is very much different than a bolt gun, & expecting the kind of performance you are expecting from both the gun configuration you want & yourself (at least initially), is a tall, tall order.
Even with more ideal equipment, .5MOA at 300 yards still very tough, unless you're talking about 1 or 2 or maybe 3 shot groups.....................the standard is 2x10 shots or 5x5 shots, more or less.

I'll refer you to a couple of really good articles that you can read at your leisure for reference. And as rubenski has also said, get back to us with an (honest) report after you're done.

Both these articles are classics; the author of the 2nd one is JacK Leuba, who is a honcho at Knight's Armament & industry icon.

The Trouble with 3 Shot Groups

Let's Talk About Accuracy

So I can just say Good Luck as well, hopa all works out.

MM

 

[Chickentoast]

^I'm not new here, just new to gas guns. I've got bolt guns that shoot in the 1's and 2's, but each one does it differently, so I definitely understand your point. I'm looking forward to the learning curve.

Reminds me of long range optics... thread after thread, article after article... But not until I bought and sold most of the "go to" scopes did I understand, separate the BS from truth, as well as recognize what I needed/wanted/enjoyed, as well as what my use case demands/doesn't need.

I will certainly keep the thread going with pics and updates - and likely have q's as I'm assembling and breaking in. Haven't even been to a range since moving here (North DFW area), but would be cool to meet folks in real life if anyone commenting is local. And need to at least check zero on my bolt setups since moving...

Re: the build, I've been taking in everything that has been said here... and as I said before, I now expect these parts will probably wind up in 3 different builds, but I'm going to follow through with this first one and get some experience with the platform before buying more stuff.

 

[TonyTheTiger]

Tony is one of the few guys here that I always pay attention to & he's given you (the OP) some good direction on hardware as well as raising some issues to deal with or to maybe take a different tack on. Tony has tried a LOT of really different stuff, & if he raise some issue, you can pretty much bet it's real.

Thanks MM!
I definitely don't know it all, but if it's off the beaten path I'm usually willing to try it and share the experience when relevant.

 

[TheOE800]

Your build sucks and I hate you.


Didn’t read build list.

 

[BuyDirt]

^I'm not new here, just new to gas guns. I've got bolt guns that shoot in the 1's and 2's, but each one does it differently, so I definitely understand your point. I'm looking forward to the learning curve.

Reminds me of long range optics... thread after thread, article after article... But not until I bought and sold most of the "go to" scopes did I understand, separate the BS from truth, as well as recognize what I needed/wanted/enjoyed, as well as what my use case demands/doesn't need.

I will certainly keep the thread going with pics and updates - and likely have q's as I'm assembling and breaking in. Haven't even been to a range since moving here (North DFW area), but would be cool to meet folks in real life if anyone commenting is local. And need to at least check zero on my bolt setups since moving...

Re: the build, I've been taking in everything that has been said here... and as I said before, I now expect these parts will probably wind up in 3 different builds, but I'm going to follow through with this first one and get some experience with the platform before buying more stuff.

I'm in Corsicana. If you ever make it this way I'd love to chat.
I'm up in Allen/McKinney a bit. Shoot me a PM and we'll see if we can make something work.

I like your ambition. And I agree with the above. I moved here from NJ. My first muzzle device required paperwork.
If you're in the Allen/Plano/McKinney I can't recommend Hush Dist. highly enough. Super solid guy with a great working knowledge of all things stamped.

 

[Chickentoast]

Parts are here - hopefully didn't forget anything!

 

[Chickentoast]

Handguard shipped without screws, so waiting on those, but otherwise good to go!

 

[Chickentoast]

^I got the bolts - 2A actually priority mailed me 2 sets of screws no charge - it's on now. I didn't loctite anything - figured I'd get it running and then go back over it with some blue. Just need to lube it now and put some rounds through it.

I torqued the barrel up to 35 ft-lbs in stages, but the barrel nut wasn't perfectly aligned at that torque spec. Thought it would be at least 45 if I went to the next rung, so I backed it off a bit to line up the gas tube perfectly. Sitting at 32 lbs on the nut now.

 

[Chickentoast]

First shots today! Started with gas off and slowly turned it up, putting just one round in the mag until I had enough gas to lock her back. Then put 2 rounds in the mag to see if she would cycle.

Cycled fine, but trigger was already released when the bolt closed on the 2nd round - round didn't go off, but did mildly dent the primer. Put the round back in and fired as a single to make sure it wasn't an ammo issue, no problem. Did that 3 more times before putting her away for the day.

Got her back home and checked the trigger - might have an issue... if rifle is on safe, and I pull the trigger (safety works), then as I click off the safety, the trigger releases, without touching the blade, i.e. the safety lever essentially becomes the trigger shoe. This happens whether it's set very light or very heavy.

Also, re: the 2 round tests, I'm thinking the sear either never caught, or had released when the bolt was cycling, and was following the bolt back as it was closing. This slowed the hammer down enough to not double fire.

So, before I send it back to Triggertech, any other thoughts?

 

[MontanaMan]

Probably little or no sear engagement.
I don't have any TT's though & never had that with any of the (adjjustable) single stage triggers that I have, Rise, Elftmann or Lantac.

MM

 

[db2000]

I will second the concerns over the 0 degree grip.

And that will be a spendy build. It will be interesting to see it when it is done.

3rd. Get the Ergo deluxe regular angle

 

[S197]

you need to get a better mount for your PLx. Aeros are known for damaging tubes and failing.
Badger Ordnance Condition one 141g
scalarworks - 154g
Reptilia - 158g

 

[Chickentoast]

Local shop swapped out for a fresh Diamond and the trigger is now fine.

Worked up a load for the 53 V-Max and settled around 24 grains of Benchmark. Loaded some more from 23.9-24.2 and shot some 10 round groups after fouling and re-zeroing.

I was cheating for the 10 round groups though... slapped a G3 on top and rested on bags. Next will try shooting offhand with irons vs with the PLxC...

 

[Chickentoast]

you need to get a better mount for your PLx. Aeros are known for damaging tubes and failing.
Badger Ordnance Condition one 141g
scalarworks - 154g
Reptilia - 158g

Thanks, hadn't read the negatives on the Aero mount.

 

[Chickentoast]

That's pretty good accuracy already. Interesting to see some sort of accuracy review on those V7 super lightweight barrels

I couldn't find any reviews, but talked with the owner for almost an hour when I called to ask random q's. Super generous with his time and free with his knowledge, even about other brands, since I guess I built a Frankenstein of sorts.

Barrel is probably close to being broken in now - will do a 2nd cleaning before loading some more. I'm sure I could cherrypick some 3 and even 5 round groups in the 1/4" range, as I had numerous cloverleafs within each group, but the full 10 round groups tell a more honest story. I think the barrel is really close to 0.5". Beyond that is just my learning curve with a light gas gun. Also never got the barrel hot.

And weighed her... 4lbs 14oz with no mag no scope.

 

[Chickentoast]

I think I enjoy shooting her with the magpul flip-ups more than with the scope! So light and handy... Aero mount held zero after I re-installed and checked it, so sticking with it for now.

Will hopefully get out to 200 yds this weekend with it - just have to build some more ammo.

Also picked up a 16" Proof in 308 to start a large frame build - thinking the 2A Xanthos for another lightweight, but all ears about other options.

 

[MontanaMan]

Nice shooting...........never used a V7 barrel but everything else that I've used from them is top notch. Looks like their barrels are too.

MM

 

[Chickentoast]

200 yards finally - New Win brass, 53 v-max, CCI 400's, 24gr Benchmark, 2.255 COAL.

First 2 groups to get on...

1 more a little faster...

Finally a 10-rounder and 5-rounder slow, concentrating... flyer in the 10-rd group I pulled as a dude next to me pulled up with an 8.5" SBR with a brake


Very impressed with the V7 barrel and the build - can't believe it's under 6lbs scoped and shoots like a decent bolt gun.

 

[Chickentoast]

Would've gotten out again this weekend, but like this gasser so much I bought stuff for an AR10 and built it today instead - might put a bolt gun or 2 up in the PX soon, since these 2 builds create some redundancy.

AR10 Build:
2A Xanthos set
V7 Hyper light 13.5" handguard and Titanium barrel nut
Proof 16" 308
Toolcraft Titanium BCG
Triggertech Diamond
SLR Synergy Ti mini-comp
SLR Ti Adjustable gas block
Taccom 3-stage buffer and Tubb Spring
Magpul SL-K
Ergo grip
Magpul flip ups

Unsure on optic, but, will try the PLxC on this as well - might also try an LHT 4.5-22 that I have on a different rifle.