Curtis Custom Axiom Build

[Boot_Ass_Cpl]

New to the forum, so please forgive my etiquette. I'm building a couple rifles right now, but my favorite by far is my Axiom build. This thing is going to be amazing. This is going to be the rifle that I use for PRS type matches.

Action - Curtis Custom Axiom short action, magnum bolt face
Barrel - 26" Proof Research carbon fiber barrel, sendero contour, 7.5 twist
Caliber - 6.5 GAP 4S
Stock - Manners PRS1, mini chassis, adjustable butt, ect. (10 month back order, might get something to put the action in until it ships)
Trigger - Trigger Tech Diamond
Brake - ??? I want a QD mount for a can, but I'm not sure which one I want to get yet.
Glass - ??? I'm thinking I might try the Tract Toric 4-20x50 MRAD/MRAD
Rings - ??? I know Spuhr mounts are great, but idk, haven't bought rings yet.

I only have a few parts left to buy. I'm still waiting for my reamer and headspace gauge from PTG, so I have some time to get it all. I am REALLY excited about this rifle. If anybody has brass for cheap, let me know lol

Anyhow, I'm just excited and wanted to share the excitement with someone.

 

[b6graham]

krg bravo would be closest to manners and budget friendly to sell when manners comes(if you cant find one in PX or in stock somewhere)
brake: area 419 hellfire. compatible with TBAC cans
glass: meh choice with all the other options in that price range. ares etr. razon gen 2 3-18. sig tango 6 (call @gr8fuldoug )
rings: i prefer spuhr. but i'd run ARC rings if i went rings. MPA mount also gets good reviews. as well as seekins rings on cheaper side

i dont know if 6.5 saum is quite the best choice for PRS matches, especially in a short action. gonna be a lot of boom in a light package (manners / proof)

 

[Boot_Ass_Cpl]

Yeah, the scope choice is kind of just to see how well they perform. I think the permanent scope that will go on it will be a Razor Gen 2 4.5-27.

I know the caliber choice will give me some recoil issues, but I will be shooting slow in most cases. (closest PRS matches are about 3 hours away) Most of the time, I am going to be shooting at 1000-1200 yds and the extra powder is going to help. I want to be able to shoot longer distances with it in the future, and I will probably use a fiberglass stock then. I went with Manners/Proof because I'm taking a barrel fitting class right now (in gunsmithing school) and wanted to explore different build materials. I'm also building a .338 Lapua on a PTG B-52 action and MDT ESS chassis and Bartlein barrel. This one, I wanted as many parts carbon fiber as possible.

I appreciate the advice, I'll check out those parts.

 

[kthomas]

A couple of critiques & comments:

- that's a pretty overbored cartridge and not the best suited to PRS. This is more a long range hunting cartridge in my mind. Hard on barrels, hard on brass, extra recoil. Not much benefit over other cartridges to make up for the downfalls.

- a carbon fiber barrel is pretty costly for a consumable, especially on such a barrel burning cartridge. Weight helps in the PRS game, and you aren't really gaining anything by going to a carbon fiber barrel.

- trigger is a good choice for a single stage trigger. Consider a 2-stage trigger, much better trigger control. This is personal preference, but going from a single stage TT to a 2-stage BnA is one of the best gear decisions I've made.

- go Insite Arms Heathen. Direct thread the can to the barrel. Would be easy to swap back and forth, and you don't have any potential QD issues with a can. Unscrewing a thread is pretty "QD" in my mind. Plus, the Heathen is the best self timing brake out of the ones I've tried (Area 419, APA).

 

[Steel head]

6.5 saum is old news.
6.5 PRC is hip, fashionable and better supported.

Unless your rich, plan on mostly hunting or generally shoot very little a proof barrel is kinda silly with a cartridge that’s gonna eat it in probably less than 2000-2500 rounds if you shoot regularly.

 

[Dburns]

I was also thinking about getting a Curtis Custom Axiom just wish foundation stocks had a inlet for it

 

[Boot_Ass_Cpl]

Again, barrel material was because I wanted to see the differences in materials and how they perform. I know weight helps, but when you're trying to move fast and can't feel your legs, less weight is better.

I appreciate the advice on cartridges, but you must know, I can't exactly send the action back. So what is better than saum in 6.5 and a magnum bolt face? I'm open to changing it, but need to use the action and barrel I have.

 

[Boot_Ass_Cpl]

6.5 PRC is a possibility, thanks. I'll definitely think about it.

 

[b6graham]

Again, barrel material was because I wanted to see the differences in materials and how they perform. I know weight helps, but when you're trying to move fast and can't feel your legs, less weight is better.

I appreciate the advice on cartridges, but you must know, I can't exactly send the action back. So what is better than saum in 6.5 and a magnum bolt face? I'm open to changing it, but need to use the action and barrel I have.

6.5 PRC and 6.5SST will fit better in a short action.

PRC has factory ammo

 

[Boot_Ass_Cpl]

Rebarreling is easy to do. I can get barrels wholesale and I do the machining myself. I can rebarrel to stainless for under $300

 

[spife7980]

Not sure I trust it since a new bolt is 350 bucks from curtis but numrich has a bolt they say is for an axiom for 124. Might be worth some further research to get a more prs friendly cartridge.

Bolt, Stripped, 3 Lug, 60? Bolt Throw, Black, DLC Coated, New Factory |

Shop for your Bolt, Stripped, 3 Lug, 60? Bolt Throw, Black, DLC Coated, New Factory with Numrich Gun Parts - the world's largest supplier of gun parts.

www.gunpartscorp.com

Anyone know if the axiom uses the same firing pins and extractors between the different bolt faces?

 

[Boot_Ass_Cpl]

I will be reloading, so factory ammo is a nonissue

 

[Boot_Ass_Cpl]

No, I'm not going to lap another bolt in. The reason custom actions cost so much is because they come true. I'm going use my current bolt.

 

[spife7980]

No, I'm not going to lap another bolt in. The reason custom actions cost so much is because they come true. I'm going use my current bolt.

Exactly, they come "true" to a spec so I would assume that you could use any bolt of theirs in it like many other actions.
Curtis sells complete bolts for 375.
The fire control system is 75 bucks from curtis, that plus the numrich bolt makes it 200 bucks leaving a savings of 175 bucks if you can swap an ejector and extractor over or get replacements from curtis for much less than 175 bucks.
Now, if thats not the case and each bolt is required to be fitted then that sucks but thats why I said it might be worth some more research. Im betting that it doesnt need to be fitted.

The 200 buck expenditure on a smaller bolt/bolt face will come back to you in the form of savings on components and barrel life. But if you want to burn out a carbon barrel then go for. Oh, not to mention the mag capacity issues with the short mags if youre wanting to run prs.
Its the PRS style not playing well with magnums thats the bigest crux in your stated goals.



If youre wanting a can and not sure of which then go with the 419 hellfire, you can run a brake now and then when you do decide on a can the hell fire can probably support that, silencerco-thunderbeast.

Scope rings, doesnt matter, sphur is a luxury. I prefer ARC m10s myself.

 

[Shanerbanner10]

Get rid of the Proof Carbon barrel, get a regular ole' stainless barrel. Weight is your friend. Put that money saved toward optics. I'd rather have something like a KRG Bravo and a Schmidt than a Manners PRS1 with all the cool stuff and a POS optic.

As others have said I'd also look at a different cartridge. 6.5 Creed, 6.5x47, .260, 6mm Creed, 6x47, Dasher, 6br, 6BRA would all be good choices for PRS.

 

[Boot_Ass_Cpl]

Ok, I think everyone here has got the wrong idea. I did not post asking to get told to change everything in my build. I will be keeping the carbon barrel. I will be keeping the magnum bolt face. I will be keeping the manners stock... I'm not changing anything.

I am a gunsmith. I do all of my own machining. I get parts wholesale, so barrel life being at 2,500 rounds isn't an issue. I'm not rich, but I know what I'm doing and know what i want in this rifle.

I wont be buying factory ammo. I will reload every round, so not having factory ammo available isn't an issue.

I understand the criticisms about the cartridge I chose, but the rest is what I want. I'm the one that is going to be shooting it.

Lastly, after seeing that build list, what makes you think I'm going to have "cheap" glass? I said I want to try the Toric and see how it does. I might put it on my AR-10 after I shoot a bit with it, but the scope I'll have after that will probably be a Razor Gen 2 4.5-27. How can you guys think you know what I NEED better than me?

I thought this place was supposed to be supportive and give real advice. Instead, I have everybody telling me my build list is garbage and I need to start over. Give me a break.....

 

[spife7980]

I thought this place was supposed to be supportive and give real advice. Instead, I have everybody telling me my build list is garbage and I need to start over. Give me a break.....

Thats a load of shit. No one ever said we were supposed to be supportive. And we are giving you real advice based on your first post stating

This is going to be the rifle that I use for PRS type matches.

If you are going to use it for PRS then build it for PRS, not long range hunting. If you dont want to build it for PRS and get advice aimed towards that goal then remove the last sentence of your opening paragraph.

 

[beretta_man11]

Spife is correct- you called it your PRS gun, these guys gave you advice that you didn't want to hear.
As for an interim-inexpensive stock, look at the krg bravo, mc3 or greyboe stuff.
As mentioned, area419 makes a break/can adapter, as does APA.
A used razor will run a little more than the tract, and has a pretty good following.
I've used Seekins/Vortex as well as aadmount rings with good experiences.

Also, you mentioned etiquette, most things can be overlooked but telling people you don't want advice, after asking for it.... not sure that's the right way.

 

[Boot_Ass_Cpl]

I always welcome constructive criticism, but telling me to completely rewrite my plans? No.. I ask people for brass, not help with reworking my whole build.

All I wanted to do is say that I'm building a gun, and that I'm excited about it. That's all man.. I figured people would be like "cool man, sounds like fun" or something to that nature, not "hey dude, you're an idiot and should build a completely different rifle"

I get that people dont like 6.5 SAUM, but through all of this, nobody has given me a real reason why. All I'm getting is "that's a hunting cartridge". Why cant you use it in PRS? Yeah, there are other, probably better options, but why can't it be used? You can push longer/heavier bullets faster than you can in smaller cases. Look at the ballistics on them, and try to look at something other than a Hornady ad. There can be cartridges that aren't made by the big bullet manufacturers that outperform some that y'all are talking about. So I want to use a wildcat.. so what.. just because it's not on the pro's list of calibers used in the top 100 prs shooters that you read before replying, doesn't mean it's a shit caliber and can't be used. The only real advice i got is that it's going to pack a punch on such a light build, and some good recommendations on scope mounts, muzzle brakes, and suppressors.

Thank you for those type of recommendations

 

[beretta_man11]

yes- the saum could be used in matches.
The cons were listed above, but also keep in mind there are speed limits, and if you try a lighter 130class bullet to help with recoil, you will need to remember the limits.

 

[Steel head]

yes- the saum could be used in matches.
The cons were listed above, but also keep in mind there are speed limits, and if you try a lighter 130class bullet to help with recoil, you will need to remember the limits.

The speed limit was a big factor in making 6.5 PRS.
It’s quite comfortable at those limits where as 6.5 saum is downloaded with them and ES/SD may suffer because of that.

 

[Boot_Ass_Cpl]

Yeah, I know. Recoil won't be THAT bad. It will be well mitigated. If I don't get a QD brake, I'll probably pick up an SJC Titan brake. I have one on a .300 win mag and it works really well.

 

[Boot_Ass_Cpl]

If you download 130s, yeah, but why not load 147s at 3050 fps?

 

[b6graham]

I will be reloading, so factory ammo is a nonissue

the same reason we went from 308 to 6.5 to 6mm
and then 6 creedmoor to 6BR/variants

recoil and barrel life

 

[kthomas]

In our defense it's hard to get excited about a gun that's being used for a completely different purpose than what it's spec's would have you believe it was built for. Just trying to help a guy out and have you avoid some potential "lessons" you may learn the hard and expensive way.

But hey, glad you are excited about it. At the end of the day, that's all that really counts.

 

[Shanerbanner10]

I guess we should ask if you want to be competitive or just have fun? If you want to be competitive... an ELR match is where a 6.5 SAUM is a solid choice, if you want to be competitive at a typical 2 day PRS match rethink your caliber choice. Again weight is your friend. Barrels are consumables. I too get them at wholesale, but dang I'm not paying proof prices for a barrel every 1500 rounds, no thank you.

There is solid advice here if you're willing to listen. If not, go do your thang and have a good time doing!

 

[Boot_Ass_Cpl]

In our defense it's hard to get excited about a gun that's being used for a completely different purpose than what it's spec's would have you believe it was built for. Just trying to help a guy out and have you avoid some potential "lessons" you may learn the hard and expensive way.

But hey, glad you are excited about it. At the end of the day, that's all that really counts.

I know I'm not winning any matches any time soon, especially since I can't move very fast. I need the light weight because my brain doesn't know where my feet are, so light weight means I can move easier. I am learning, and really wanted to explore carbon fiber as build material. My .338 LM is completely different and weighs like 15 lbs without a scope. I just want to see the differences. Thank you for supporting the fun part of it all.

 

[Boot_Ass_Cpl]

I guess we should ask if you want to be competitive or just have fun? If you want to be competitive... an ELR match is where a 6.5 SAUM is a solid choice, if you want to be competitive at a typical 2 day PRS match rethink your caliber choice. Again weight is your friend. Barrels are consumables. I too get them at wholesale, but dang I'm not paying proof prices for a barrel every 1500 rounds, no thank you.

There is solid advice here if you're willing to listen. If not, go do your thang and have a good time doing!

I really just want to enjoy it man. I will be shooting some ELR type matches where they restrict calibers to .300 Win Mag or smaller. I cant use my .338, so this one will be great for multi purpose.

This is my first Proof barrel, and will probably be my last. I just really wanted to see what they're like. I've never had the opportunity to have nice rifles, so now that I can build them myself, I want to enjoy it. It's not always about winning. For me, i really just need range therapy, and matches are a really good time.

 

[generalzip]

Everyone here has just been trying to help you and they are right in giving you the advice they have for strictly a PRS rifle. The 6.5 Short Mags have the following downfalls:

1. Less magazine capacity (often you will have 10-12 round stages)
2. much less barrel life (expect 1500 round barrel life with a SAUM shot in match conditions)
3. Recoil- this is not your friend for spotting your own misses. This can be mitigated with weight (ie. a fat steel barrel) but you have stated you want to use the lightest barrel made.

The carbon barrel may weigh less but it's really reducing weight in the wrong part of the rifle. One of the most important aspects of a PRS rifle is balance. A 10 lb and a 20 lb gun may weigh differently but can balance the same. Ideally you want the gun to balance on the bag in front of the magwell (in my shooting style)

The way I see it you have 2 choices if you REALLY want to get into PRS and have a dedicated rifle. You can:

1. Listen to the advice of the folks above and take most of their recommendations.
2. Continue with your build. Shoot it in a few matches. Try other peoples rifles. Realize theirs is much better for what you're trying to achieve. Then build the rifle being described to you above by others.

Some people need to learn on their own. Can't say I'm not guilty of it either! But even if you pick option 2, no worries bud! That will be a badass long range hunting rig for white tail, hogs, and muleys.

 

[DangerRanger]

Not sure I trust it since a new bolt is 350 bucks from curtis but numrich has a bolt they say is for an axiom for 124. Might be worth some further research to get a more prs friendly cartridge.

Bolt, Stripped, 3 Lug, 60? Bolt Throw, Black, DLC Coated, New Factory |

Shop for your Bolt, Stripped, 3 Lug, 60? Bolt Throw, Black, DLC Coated, New Factory with Numrich Gun Parts - the world's largest supplier of gun parts.

www.gunpartscorp.com

Anyone know if the axiom uses the same firing pins and extractors between the different bolt faces?

Cross compatible within action length. That’s a stripped bolt so a firing assembly is 75$. Still makes for a good/really good deal on a new bolt. Would work and headspace correctly on any SA Axiom or Vector. If that was a .223 face I would have bought it before replying lol

 

[Boot_Ass_Cpl]

Like I said, I'm know I'm not going to be winning any matches. I just want to enjoy it. I can and will be building more rifles. This just happens to be the current build. The last few comments are more of what I expected from people. Giving advice, but not making me feel like a complete idiot. Thank you for understanding that it's fun. Even if it does turn into a long range hunting rig, it's still going to be able to shoot in matches. The next one will probably be a 6 creed in a chassis system, which will turn into my match gun. I have the parts and know what I want to build for now. There's never too little space for another rifle.

 

[DangerRanger]

Rifle sounds cool, it’s very much like my vectors current configuration.

 

[kthomas]

I know I'm not winning any matches any time soon, especially since I can't move very fast. I need the light weight because my brain doesn't know where my feet are, so light weight means I can move easier. I am learning, and really wanted to explore carbon fiber as build material. My .338 LM is completely different and weighs like 15 lbs without a scope. I just want to see the differences. Thank you for supporting the fun part of it all.

Regardless, it's going to be a badass rifle and you are going to have fun with it. Enjoy!

 

[Isacpotatoes]

Thats a load of shit. No one ever said we were supposed to be supportive. And we are giving you real advice based on your first post stating


If you are going to use it for PRS then build it for PRS, not long range hunting. If you dont want to build it for PRS and get advice aimed towards that goal then remove the last sentence of your opening paragraph.

Checked out this chat because of the mention of a Curtis action. I’m only about 8 yrs in the shooting sports, but I’ll tell you this; there are a lot of bullshitters in the firearms community lol. This guy isn’t a smith...