Custom MC Actions vs Traditional Custom Actions

[texastonk]

Looking to build a custom gun. I keep going back and forth on the action. Why are MC actions not the standard for most?
If barrel changes are inevitable due to high volume shooting or caliber changes, why not build off of the MC action and remove the vise, wrench and added time from the equation? Pre-fits are widely available from all the top barrel makers. Am I missing something?

 

[Supersubes]

Which system do you think should be the benchmark for a multi caliber action?

 

[DeathBeforeDismount]

Every modern quality custom action is MC. Using a barrel vise, action wrench and torque wrench it takes less than 5 minutes to change a barrel. You can even mount a vise to a trailer hitch adapter like some of us do so we can swap barrels in the field/matches/range.

Most people are still going to want to torque the barrel, and you need something to hold the barreled action. If you want true QC then buy a MRAD or newer AI, and get waffle fucked by accessory and bolt prices. Most of the guys i have seen running the Terminus Zues QC, are still running regular shoulder prefits.

 

[Varminterror]

I'm with DBD, most custom actions these days already are drop-in compatible with controlled headspace, so the optionality of MC actions is really moot - it's just a difference in the tools required for changing the barrels.

I have .473" and .532" bolts for my Defiance Ruckus, have three bolt heads for my Seekins Havak, ordered a magnum bolt to go with a new Impact... Barrels are high torque lightbulbs for all of these - plug and play - with drop in, shouldered barrels. So I have barrels in 6 creed, 6.5 PRC, and 223Wylde for my Havak, and I'm planning to get a 6.5 PRC barrel for my Ruckus as well. I have a Ruger M77 Hunting rifle for which I bought a spare .473" long action bolt and have 3 barrels for 280 AI, 300 WM, and 416 Ruger (have another 30 cal blank to be 300 PRC and 458 WM, as soon as I get around to opening the ejection port enough to eat the longer rounds). I don't really want to dick with overlength cartridges and mag blocks or changing bottom metals around, so I stay within the same action length for cartridge families, and I don't particularly want to have a 338LM on the same action as a 223rem, but a guy has a lot of options when you can fire a round of 223rem to 6 creed to 300WSM in the same rifle all within 20min or so with only a few tools.

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

What really limits things is the requirement to rezero when you change the barrel. I have 3 qc actions which I love and I have shouldered barrel torque on actions too which I love. Even with the qc actions its not like I'm changing barrels on the same rifle regularly. You can do the offset thing for each barrel but no one will ever trust that and still have to re zero if you change or at least check zero. I have found my qc actions to be very repeatable in terms of taking the same barrel on and off though so if that's what you want, go for it

 

[texastonk]

Which system do you think should be the benchmark for a multi caliber action?

I have no experience with any of them. From what I’ve seen and read AI and Terminus seem to be the most popular.

 

[texastonk]

Every modern quality custom action is MC. Using a barrel vise, action wrench and torque wrench it takes less than 5 minutes to change a barrel. You can even mount a vise to a trailer hitch adapter like some of us do so we can swap barrels in the field/matches/range.

Most people are still going to want to torque the barrel, and you need something to hold the barreled action. If you want true QC then buy a MRAD or newer AI, and get waffle fucked by accessory and bolt prices. Most of the guys i have seen running the Terminus Zues QC, are still running regular shoulder prefits.

My question is why not run the quick change/MC actions and skip the vise and wrench and added time? I have not read or seen any reasons not to use the MC/QC actions.

 

[DeathBeforeDismount]

My question is why not run the quick change/MC actions and skip the vise and wrench and added time? I have not read or seen any reasons not to use the MC/QC actions.

Because they are a solution looking for a problem. The market doesn't care for them

 

[308pirate]

Because they are a solution looking for a problem. The market doesn't care for them

He's asking for the why, not the what.

The market is not always the wisest or most intelligent.

 

[Supersubes]

I have no experience with any of them. From what I’ve seen and read AI and Terminus seem to be the most popular.

The reason I ask is because there are tradeoffs in every solution. Nobody can agree on what the best current solution is, or even what it should be in the future. Its certainly been tried a bunch. The manufactures are in the same boat.

 

[Varminterror]

My question is why not run the quick change/MC actions and skip the vise and wrench and added time? I have not read or seen any reasons not to use the MC/QC actions.

Where, in any competitive format, do MC/QC actions hold superiority? What advantage(s) do the more complex QC’s bring beyond what they call “QC”? Recognizing here, there’s a big difference between QC’s with non-conventional barrel designs like the MRAD or DesertTech vs. standard actions which simply use headspace control plus locking clamps/screws on shouldered prefit barrels, such as AI, Seekins Hit, WTO, Zeus…

Their advantage is the novelty of quick caliber/cartridge changes, which as mentioned multiple times above, is relatively moot - we still need to rezero, so whether it takes me 10min or 2min, is really a distinction without a difference. I really won’t be in the field hunting coyotes then suddenly - oh look, a bear! - then change barrels… But on the flip-side, there is extra cost, limited market of manufacturers, limited aftermarket, extra weight and extra complexity in the designs, and no improvement in performance, BUT with at least theoretical, if not demonstrable potential for reduced performance… all to do something nobody really wants or needs… THOSE are the reasons I personally don’t want the MC/QC rifles/actions and will use other actions with shouldered pre-fits and interchangeable bolts/bolt heads. Impact, Ruckus/Tenacity, Terminus, LP, Bighorn, Seekins, Bat, etc - they all use drop in barrels which require minimal tools to relatively quickly change barrels/cartridges/calibers, and several of these have demonstrated successes and superiority in the field and in competition.

 

[DeathBeforeDismount]

The only place it really makes sense is for forward deployed troops, Who need to swap calibers or a shot out barrel.
It requires less footprint and tools to haul with you.

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

Where, in any competitive format, do MC/QC actions hold superiority? What advantage(s) do the more complex QC’s bring beyond what they call “QC”? Recognizing here, there’s a big difference between QC’s with non-conventional barrel designs like the MRAD or DesertTech vs. standard actions which simply use headspace control plus locking clamps/screws on shouldered prefit barrels, such as AI, Seekins Hit, WTO, Zeus…

Their advantage is the novelty of quick caliber/cartridge changes, which as mentioned multiple times above, is relatively moot - we still need to rezero, so whether it takes me 10min or 2min, is really a distinction without a difference. I really won’t be in the field hunting coyotes then suddenly - oh look, a bear! - then change barrels… But on the flip-side, there is extra cost, limited market of manufacturers, limited aftermarket, extra weight and extra complexity in the designs, and no improvement in performance, BUT with at least theoretical, if not demonstrable potential for reduced performance… all to do something nobody really wants or needs… THOSE are the reasons I personally don’t want the MC/QC rifles/actions and will use other actions with shouldered pre-fits and interchangeable bolts/bolt heads. Impact, Ruckus/Tenacity, Terminus, LP, Bighorn, Seekins, Bat, etc - they all use drop in barrels which require minimal tools to relatively quickly change barrels/cartridges/calibers, and several of these have demonstrated successes and superiority in the field and in competition.

Well I can tell you why I run them. I have 3 qc actions that all will run the same barrels. I generally leave the same barrel on that action, but I can put a new barrel on easily that I already know shoots in the same caliber, I can easily swap things around if I need to should I have an issue with my rifle. I can also take em off to clean and not risk getting anything in my action.

I also had a bad experience with a brand new torque wrench not working and I over torqued an action once. It ended up ok and the awesome CS at @Zermatt Arms and Blue Mountain Precision took immediate and excellent care of me, but after talking to many who were running the qc actions and getting great results, I decided to do the same. It's worked out very well for me and I don't have to mess with a barrel vise and torque wrench. At the the same time, I'm not getting rid of my zermat actions either and I love running them.

 

[Varminterror]

There are a lot of actions which allow for barrel interchangeability - any Zeus, Ruckus, Tenacity, 737R, Bat, Nucleus, Havak etc can do that. Like I said, there’s a big difference between a hand-tight shouldered barrel with a locking screw/clamp and the slip-tenon models. Nut style barrels are another option, but again, all we’re talking about is a difference in having a rear entry wrench and a SAC vise on a bar vs. a nut wrench vs. an Allen key - it can all happen at the range, and the same interchangeability and ease of ordering barrels remotely applies.

But it’s probably fair to point out - there shouldn’t be any action out there on the market, 20yrs from now, which doesn’t accept drop in, prefit barrels.

 

[texastonk]

Thanks for the replies. It seems from the comments that it’s just a matter of preference?
Not much if any difference in function or accuracy between the two…other than manufacturer quality and how you take off and put on a barrel.

 

[Freebore221]

Do we get fries with our McActions?

Seriously WTF is an MC action?

 

[Supersubes]

Do we get fries with our McActions?

Seriously WTF is an MC action?

Multi-Caliber

 

[Bacarrat]

Do we get fries with our McActions?

Seriously WTF is an MC action?

Look at this McNewb!

 

[Long Range 338]

Where, in any competitive format, do MC/QC actions hold superiority? What advantage(s) do the more complex QC’s bring beyond what they call “QC”? Recognizing here, there’s a big difference between QC’s with non-conventional barrel designs like the MRAD or DesertTech vs. standard actions which simply use headspace control plus locking clamps/screws on shouldered prefit barrels, such as AI, Seekins Hit, WTO, Zeus…

Their advantage is the novelty of quick caliber/cartridge changes, which as mentioned multiple times above, is relatively moot - we still need to rezero, so whether it takes me 10min or 2min, is really a distinction without a difference. I really won’t be in the field hunting coyotes then suddenly - oh look, a bear! - then change barrels… But on the flip-side, there is extra cost, limited market of manufacturers, limited aftermarket, extra weight and extra complexity in the designs, and no improvement in performance, BUT with at least theoretical, if not demonstrable potential for reduced performance… all to do something nobody really wants or needs… THOSE are the reasons I personally don’t want the MC/QC rifles/actions and will use other actions with shouldered pre-fits and interchangeable bolts/bolt heads. Impact, Ruckus/Tenacity, Terminus, LP, Bighorn, Seekins, Bat, etc - they all use drop in barrels which require minimal tools to relatively quickly change barrels/cartridges/calibers, and several of these have demonstrated successes and superiority in the field and in competition.

Your premise is mistaken. The MC systems were not developed or marketed as an answer to any competitive discipline. They are designed, marketed, and manufactured almost exclusively for MIL/LEO use.
The MC rifles are offered as a complete system, from the action to the chassis to the trigger. You can custom franken any mix of parts together and have excellent results but the MC contracts provide hundreds if not thousands of rifles and they all must perform to the specification. The same result cannot be expected across multiple manufacturers each with their own tolerances in any given environment at any given time.
Competition rifles are not the same as working rifles. Different tools for different tasks.

 

[texastonk]

I'm very interest in the MC actions for the ease of swapping calibers without the added tools and time. I don't think it's something I would ever do at the range or in the field. Being able to keep the same custom set up for hunting and target shooting, and only swapping a barrel and bolt and or bolt head seems like a great way to go.
I really like the Zeus and I think this is what I will go with. Just wanted to see if I was missing something as why more shooters weren't using this action.
Thanks

 

[Long Range 338]

I'm very interest in the MC actions for the ease of swapping calibers without the added tools and time. I don't think it's something I would ever do at the range or in the field. Being able to keep the same custom set up for hunting and target shooting, and only swapping a barrel and bolt and or bolt head seems like a great way to go.
I really like the Zeus and I think this is what I will go with. Just wanted to see if I was missing something as why more shooters weren't using this action.
Thanks

Terminus has a great reputation, just pick the product that has the features you require and you’re good to go.

 

[just browsing]

I’ll admit that it’s nice to be able to swap barrels with an allen key, but wanna know where it’s most handy?

“Wow, I shot like an unmitigated dumpster fire on day 1. I think I’ll QC to my Creed barrel for day 2 because it’ll make me feel better and OBVIOUSLY fix my shooting.”

 

[Varminterror]

You can custom franken any mix of parts together and have excellent results but the MC contracts provide hundreds if not thousands of rifles and they all must perform to the specification. The same result cannot be expected across multiple manufacturers each with their own tolerances in any given environment at any given time.

I'm relatively certain the latter statement made here is well disproven, as there are hundreds if not thousands of Impact, Defiance, Zermatt, Seekins, Terminus, ARC, Bat etc actions out there which all drop into the same or similar chassis footprints, using R700 pattern triggers and drop in barrels ordered from dozens if not hundreds of smiths and barrel makers which DO perform to specification...

I've always wondered how many "forward deployed" guys are out there carrying multiple barrels, mags, and ammo with an allen wrench to change the cartridge of their issued rifle in the field without returning to some sort of support base. The dudes being issued bolt action long guns seem to be a small niche even among military forces, so whatever value we think they're getting in THAT deployment vs. the civilian market would feel a little bit like owning a specialized brush for washing elephant nuts - I don't own an elephant, let alone an intact bull elephant, so while the 72 zookeepers in the US which DO have elephants a part of their day job, out of 350million Americans, might find the tool useful.

But a lot more of us benefit from headspace controlled actions with interchangeable aftermarket parts - such as those actions using R700 footprint stocks and triggers. As I mentioned, 20yrs from now, there really should not be any rifle on the market which doesn't offer controlled headspace to utilize drop-in, shouldered barrel compatibility. But I don't think the same value is found in the MRAD/Desert Tech "system" designs - the price for what you're getting isn't the same value.

 

[Long Range 338]

I'm relatively certain the latter statement made here is well disproven, as there are hundreds if not thousands of Impact, Defiance, Zermatt, Seekins, Terminus, ARC, Bat etc actions out there which all drop into the same or similar chassis footprints, using R700 pattern triggers and drop in barrels ordered from dozens if not hundreds of smiths and barrel makers which DO perform to specification...

You are just voicing your opinion here while I am trying to provoke some thought.... If you read the last part of the statement you are disagreeing with, your response doesn't address the more important aspect of the MC Systems.

Let me expound a bit. Lets say your ultimate use rifle is an Impact action, TT trigger, ACC chassis, Proof barrel, with MDT magazine - you mentioned competition so I am assuming here. Has your "system" been proven in all environments to provide the reliability across 2-300 units from desert to swamp to jungle to arctic conditions? And I don't mean just go bang. Can someone trust their life on the magazine to feed flawlessly or the trigger to not malfunction? What is the failure rate? These specific things are addressed during the MIL/LEO trials that lead to contracts.

Without being tested in the same manner that the MC systems are tested, all of our individual experiences are just anecdotal. The Impact/TT/ACC/Proof setup could be an extremely good setup - for its intended use. Assuming we could grab our own rifles and go jumping from planes and dragging it thru the mud/dirt/snow/ice and expect it to optimal in that use is ludicrous.

I'm not bagging on any of the actions you mentioned nor stating that they can't be used in a MC purpose. I'm stating that the MC systems that exist are built for a different purpose and do that purpose very well.

 

[carbonbased]

Look at this McNewb!

Damn that was pretty funny

 

[Varminterror]

What exactly are MRAD’s and DesertTech’s doing which wasn’t done with Stillers, Win70’s, R700/40x/M24’s in service application? Maybe I missed something…

 

[spife7980]

Barrel swaps with an Allen wrench only.

 

[hlee]

You are just voicing your opinion here while I am trying to provoke some thought.... If you read the last part of the statement you are disagreeing with, your response doesn't address the more important aspect of the MC Systems.

Let me expound a bit. Lets say your ultimate use rifle is an Impact action, TT trigger, ACC chassis, Proof barrel, with MDT magazine - you mentioned competition so I am assuming here. Has your "system" been proven in all environments to provide the reliability across 2-300 units from desert to swamp to jungle to arctic conditions? And I don't mean just go bang. Can someone trust their life on the magazine to feed flawlessly or the trigger to not malfunction? What is the failure rate? These specific things are addressed during the MIL/LEO trials that lead to contracts.

Without being tested in the same manner that the MC systems are tested, all of our individual experiences are just anecdotal. The Impact/TT/ACC/Proof setup could be an extremely good setup - for its intended use. Assuming we could grab our own rifles and go jumping from planes and dragging it thru the mud/dirt/snow/ice and expect it to optimal in that use is ludicrous.

I'm not bagging on any of the actions you mentioned nor stating that they can't be used in a MC purpose. I'm stating that the MC systems that exist are built for a different purpose and do that purpose very well.

If it is using an AICS pattern mag in any of the wonder-comp cartridges (basically anything not 308) then the answer- in my observation- is NO!

 

[charnicus]

If AI would sell actions by themselves I bet people would buy them to out of stock status. Wasn’t MPA offering AI inlets? Surely the other big names would offer inlets as well if that was a thing. Most people aren’t bringing a bunch of barrels to the range but removing an action and vicing it up to remove and install barrels is a bit backwards in 2023 imho. Still the life I live of course.

 

[Bacarrat]

If AI would sell actions by themselves I bet people would buy them to out of stock status. Wasn’t MPA offering AI inlets? Surely the other big names would offer inlets as well if that was a thing. Most people aren’t bringing a bunch of barrels to the range but removing an action and vicing it up to remove and install barrels is a bit backwards in 2023 imho. Still the life I live of course.

Those actions suck. They have "extreme bolt lift". Most of the people on this forum can't even cycle the bolt on those actions.

 

[Bradu]

What exactly are MRAD’s and DesertTech’s doing which wasn’t done with Stillers, Win70’s, R700/40x/M24’s in service application? Maybe I missed something…

The desert tech can be switched from a 223 to a 338 lapua or almost any caliber in between in less than 5 minutes with an Allen wrench.

 

[texastonk]

The desert tech can be switched from a 223 to a 338 lapua or almost any caliber in between in less than 5 minutes with an Allen wrench.

This statement hits the core of this post. DT, AI and Terminus all put an easy button for barrel swaps on their actions.

 

[texastonk]

I’ll admit that it’s nice to be able to swap barrels with an allen key, but wanna know where it’s most handy?

“Wow, I shot like an unmitigated dumpster fire on day 1. I think I’ll QC to my Creed barrel for day 2 because it’ll make me feel better and OBVIOUSLY fix my shooting.”

My thought on use would be. I'm hunting this weekend using cartridge X and next week wanting to practice using a 223 or...
This day I'm hunting Elk and tomorrow I'm pig hunting.

 

[Bradu]

This statement hits the core of this post. DT, AI and Terminus all put an easy button for barrel swaps on their actions.

I don't mind using a barrel vice for other switch barrel setups I have but they don't have the ability to go from long action to short action. That's the biggest selling point for me since I have to travel quite a ways to shoot past 700 yards. It's hard to justify a $4-5k rifle when I can do a simple bolt and barrel swap.

 

[Edds]

I prefer a MC gun safe.

 

[carbonbased]

I prefer a MC gun safe.

Touché

 

[DeathBeforeDismount]

I’ll admit that it’s nice to be able to swap barrels with an allen key, but wanna know where it’s most handy?

“Wow, I shot like an unmitigated dumpster fire on day 1. I think I’ll QC to my Creed barrel for day 2 because it’ll make me feel better and OBVIOUSLY fix my shooting.”

Or just throw in a barrel vise/hitch and you can change any barrel on any action in the field/at range. Its so easy it makes these QC actions pointless for all but deployed and the retarded who cannot operate basic hand tools.

 

[DeathBeforeDismount]

I don't mind using a barrel vice for other switch barrel setups I have but they don't have the ability to go from long action to short action. That's the biggest selling point for me since I have to travel quite a ways to shoot past 700 yards. It's hard to justify a $4-5k rifle when I can do a simple bolt and barrel swap.

Go take a look at the bolt/barrel conversion prices for going from a 308 to a 300wm to a 300NM. You can build 3 separate rifles that will be superior in almost every way for similar money.

A swiss army knife makes a shitty carving knife, bayonet and box opener.

Use the right tool for the right job.

 

[Bradu]

Go take a look at the bolt/barrel conversion prices for going from a 308 to a 300wm to a 300NM. You can build 3 separate rifles that will be superior in almost every way for similar money.

A swiss army knife makes a shitty carving knife, bayonet and box opener.

Use the right tool for the right job.

I don't have to take a look at the prices, I have them and know what they cost. I also don't need to buy 3 scopes either. Considering the action I prefer costs about the same as a conversion kit, I don't see your math working out.

I don't see how having one gun is considered a Swiss army knife when it serves the purpose that I bought it for. It's good to see you think you know it's not the right tool for a guy you don't know

Go bother someone else.

 

[DeathBeforeDismount]

The market has spoken no one wants a 12-18k kit when you can build 3. 4k rifles that will shoot circles around it for not much more. Not to mention one parts breakage and all your shooting is done until you get a replacement/repair. Easier to pick up another gun and keep shooting and fix/repair at leisure.

 

[Mr. F]

Or just throw in a barrel vise/hitch and you can change any barrel on any action in the field/at range. Its so easy it makes these QC actions pointless for all but deployed and the retarded who cannot operate basic hand tools.

Right but then i need to carry a hitch mount, a vice, the barrel vice with the correct insert (s) a tq wrench and action wrench to the hill i might be shooting off after work... vs. just carrying a 4mm hex

So not pointless. Let's call it a luxury. Kinda like heated seats, or a wolf gas range... you know like eehhh i dont really need it but damn its just a nice thing to have and it makes my life less burdensome.

So not pointless

 

[DJL2]

A big part of this is "horses for courses." Let's say I've got a perfect MC action - can swap to any caliber I want with totally reliability, no issues on accessories, no insane cost - just a perfect, pick what I want to shoot, and bolt it up system. Why would I want a .223/.22-250 bolt gun for prairie poodles setup on the same action as my .300 Norma? Would I want that action serving running my .375 Chey Tac ELR, .284 Shehane F-class, and 6 BR PRS needs? Would I run the same stock in each of those disciplines? What about the same optic? What about magazines?

For plenty of (most?) people, the supposed advantage of a MC system doesn't hold against the convenience of being able to pull a purpose-built system out of the safe and just use it as intended versus fucking with a single action every time you want to do a different type of shooting. It doesn't stand against the convenience of getting something setup of just how you like and leaving it alone. Even the time spent swapping QD optic mounts, barrels, and bolt/unbolting a chassis is time you don't need to spend when you run a dedicated rifle. The simplicity and advantage of that "every so often" burnt barrel swap doesn't amount to much.

 

[Mr. F]

A big part of this is "horses for courses." Let's say I've got a perfect MC action - can swap to any caliber I want with totally reliability, no issues on accessories, no insane cost - just a perfect, pick what I want to shoot, and bolt it up system. Why would I want a .223/.22-250 bolt gun for prairie poodles setup on the same action as my .300 Norma? Would I want that action serving running my .375 Chey Tac ELR, .284 Shehane F-class, and 6 BR PRS needs? Would I run the same stock in each of those disciplines? What about the same optic? What about magazines?

For plenty of (most?) people, the supposed advantage of a MC system doesn't hold against the convenience of being able to pull a purpose-built system out of the safe and just use it as intended versus fucking with a single action every time you want to do a different type of shooting. It doesn't stand against the convenience of getting something setup of just how you like and leaving it alone. Even the time spent swapping QD optic mounts, barrels, and bolt/unbolting a chassis is time you don't need to spend when you run a dedicated rifle. The simplicity and advantage of that "every so often" burnt barrel swap doesn't amount to much.

Correct

owning 4-5 purpose built rifles will, in theory, yield more performance that owning a QC system that probably will yield 80-90% of the performance when compared to the purpose built rigs all things being equal.

On that we agree

 

[DeathBeforeDismount]

Right but then i need to carry a hitch mount, a vice, the barrel vice with the correct insert (s) a tq wrench and action wrench to the hill i might be shooting off after work... vs. just carrying a 4mm hex

So not pointless. Let's call it a luxury. Kinda like heated seats, or a wolf gas range... you know like eehhh i dont really need it but damn its just a nice thing to have and it makes my life less burdensome.

So not pointless

You plan to roadmarch to the range? If you can throw your gun, pack and all shooting gear in truck, you can can throw a action wrench, vise and torque wrench.

 

[DeathBeforeDismount]

The irony is buying a MC system with extra barrels/kits is going to cost you over $10K, at that point spend a few more bills for tools built for the right job. Its penny wise and pound foolish.

I can right now go online order the parts and put together a gun in less than 30 minutes that will shoot circles around any MC system you can buy. MC systsems make sense for big insituitions or agencies. For civies, they are retarded. Just makes you look like a tactical timmy wanabee.

Its nice to grab a gun off the rack and go shoot without having to fuck with anything. Got friends or fam coming over who want to shoot? Sure lets bring 3 guns instead of 1. Got a PRS match? ELR match? Go hunting? Go bang ground chucks? ect ect ect.

Jack of all, master of none is fine for poor people who cant afford good shit and dont shoot often. If you actually shoot alot, you want tools tailored to whatever you are doing. Lifes to short for compromises when shooting.

Go look at MH and EO and look at the dozens/hundreds of AXSR in stock that no one fucking wants.

Go look at EO and see what MRAD's are going for. Over $1000 off, they can''t move them which is nuts considering it was just selected as the SWS of the US military.

If you can find one, go look for a SAKO M10

 

[Tokay444]

Thanks for the replies. It seems from the comments that it’s just a matter of preference?
Not much if any difference in function or accuracy between the two…other than manufacturer quality and how you take off and put on a barrel.

I don’t think that’s what anyone is saying. People who compete in disciplines where accuracy matters by and large don’t run QC arrangements.

 

[Tokay444]

I'm very interest in the MC actions for the ease of swapping calibers without the added tools and time. I don't think it's something I would ever do at the range or in the field. Being able to keep the same custom set up for hunting and target shooting, and only swapping a barrel and bolt and or bolt head seems like a great way to go.
I really like the Zeus and I think this is what I will go with. Just wanted to see if I was missing something as why more shooters weren't using this action.
Thanks

If you don’t intend on doing it at the range, there’s literally no advantage.

 

[Long Range 338]

The market has spoken no one wants a 12-18k kit when you can build 3. 4k rifles that will shoot circles around it for not much more. Not to mention one parts breakage and all your shooting is done until you get a replacement/repair. Easier to pick up another gun and keep shooting and fix/repair at leisure.

Someone forgot to tell AI, Barrett, DT, Cadex, and Sako that nobody is interested in their junk MC rifles. That or you are talking out your ass... Hunters don't buy them, PRS shooters don't buy them, everybody running a Savage doesn't buy them either. There are however lots of Tactical Timmies, Gamers, collectors, and ELR shooters who LOVE the system and its capabilities. The market also spoke and they love rifles that cost $600 or less, competitive/tactical/PRS shooters are a tiny slice of the pie.

 

[Mr. F]

The irony is buying a MC system with extra barrels/kits is going to cost you over $10K, at that point spend a few more bills for tools built for the right job. Its penny wise and pound foolish.

I can right now go online order the parts and put together a gun in less than 30 minutes that will shoot circles around any MC system you can buy. MC systsems make sense for big insituitions or agencies. For civies, they are retarded. Just makes you look like a tactical timmy wanabee.

Its nice to grab a gun off the rack and go shoot without having to fuck with anything. Got friends or fam coming over who want to shoot? Sure lets bring 3 guns instead of 1. Got a PRS match? ELR match? Go hunting? Go bang ground chucks? ect ect ect.

Jack of all, master of none is fine for poor people who cant afford good shit and dont shoot often. If you actually shoot alot, you want tools tailored to whatever you are doing. Lifes to short for compromises when shooting.

Go look at MH and EO and look at the dozens/hundreds of AXSR in stock that no one fucking wants.

Go look at EO and see what MRAD's are going for. Over $1000 off, they can''t move them which is nuts considering it was just selected as the SWS of the US military.

If you can find one, go look for a SAKO M10

Read luxury/ nice to have above.

I digress

 

[texastonk]

Quality with options is more important than price. I was just curious why more don't go with the MC actions.
$8k-10K for a build is not what I see. Here are 3 quick price outs form well respected builders.

I see the advantage being Terminus due to what I get for the same price and quality.

Just priced out a build with 2 barrels.
Terminus Zeus SA with 2 bolts-$2199
Trigger Tech Trigger-$250
Barrels from PVA (2)- $1250
Foundation Genises Stock SA-$1330 - Maners or MPA or KRG chassis/Stock run around this amount as well.
Hawkins DBM-$205
$5234

Gap Rifles-$5k plus
PVA- BA- $2149 Plus all remaining items listed get you above $4500-5k.