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Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
- Thread starter 6.5BR
- Start date
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
Button rifles suck in my opinion for numerous reasons.
Button rifles suck in my opinion for numerous reasons.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
There's obviously a big difference in the way they are both made and cut rifling is the new thing and the way to go, but for accuracy it's a flip of a coin. I shoot with some guys that have button barrels still and they are very accurate guns in the .25MOA range. I use a Bartlein 30" 5R cut rifled barrel with a 1:8.5" twist in 6.5mm.
There's obviously a big difference in the way they are both made and cut rifling is the new thing and the way to go, but for accuracy it's a flip of a coin. I shoot with some guys that have button barrels still and they are very accurate guns in the .25MOA range. I use a Bartlein 30" 5R cut rifled barrel with a 1:8.5" twist in 6.5mm.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
Here is my experience using a variety of different cut and button rifle barrels.
I have had great success with Krieger, Bartlien and Saturn barrels (all cut rifle barrels).
I also had my ass handed to me in a match practice by a group of shooters using <span style="font-weight: bold"><span style="font-style: italic">Benchmark barrels.</span></span> These were some of the guys who actually work at <span style="font-weight: bold">Benchmark.</span>
They were firing 6mm, 6.5mm, 7mm and a .30 caliber. Ron and company take a GREAT deal of pride in their work and make their barrels to win matches. I would not hesitate to buy a <span style="font-weight: bold">Benchmark barrel</span> for a match winning rifle.
http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2008/02/benchmark-expands-centerfire-barrel-line/
http://www.6mmbr.com/barrels.html
Here is my experience using a variety of different cut and button rifle barrels.
I have had great success with Krieger, Bartlien and Saturn barrels (all cut rifle barrels).
I also had my ass handed to me in a match practice by a group of shooters using <span style="font-weight: bold"><span style="font-style: italic">Benchmark barrels.</span></span> These were some of the guys who actually work at <span style="font-weight: bold">Benchmark.</span>
They were firing 6mm, 6.5mm, 7mm and a .30 caliber. Ron and company take a GREAT deal of pride in their work and make their barrels to win matches. I would not hesitate to buy a <span style="font-weight: bold">Benchmark barrel</span> for a match winning rifle.
http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2008/02/benchmark-expands-centerfire-barrel-line/
http://www.6mmbr.com/barrels.html
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
I have built alot of rifles on both. I haven't really seen any difference in life between the two types. I have 2 7mm STW's, one with a Broughton, one with a Rock, both went within 50rounds of eachother before dying. The Broughton was 90fps faster and exactly the same length.
My competition rifles wear both. My 243AI's have Broughtons and have outlasted the Kriegers so far. 6x47's are Broughton and Rock, 6.5x47 is a Rock. All are extremely accurate and have won a bunch of matches. Get a good quality barrel, make sure your smith cuts the chamber correctly, and go shoot.
I have built alot of rifles on both. I haven't really seen any difference in life between the two types. I have 2 7mm STW's, one with a Broughton, one with a Rock, both went within 50rounds of eachother before dying. The Broughton was 90fps faster and exactly the same length.
My competition rifles wear both. My 243AI's have Broughtons and have outlasted the Kriegers so far. 6x47's are Broughton and Rock, 6.5x47 is a Rock. All are extremely accurate and have won a bunch of matches. Get a good quality barrel, make sure your smith cuts the chamber correctly, and go shoot.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
I dont think there is any real life difference in accuracy or barrel life when the barrels are properly made and every thing else being equal. All that said I have been a cut rifled man my whole life. I have had button rifled barrels that were very good but I have always been a Krieger fan. But I have been seeing some great stuff coming from Broughton and that will be my next!
I dont think there is any real life difference in accuracy or barrel life when the barrels are properly made and every thing else being equal. All that said I have been a cut rifled man my whole life. I have had button rifled barrels that were very good but I have always been a Krieger fan. But I have been seeing some great stuff coming from Broughton and that will be my next!
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
A barrel is either right or it's not.How it got there is of little importance.
A barrel is either right or it's not.How it got there is of little importance.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
No doubt running SS, myself, but all SS is not the same is it? I know bbl steel is likely splitting hairs.
No doubt many getting great results w/cut, just wondering how real world results might vary.
So have you guys had just as many 'hammers' using button bbls?
No doubt running SS, myself, but all SS is not the same is it? I know bbl steel is likely splitting hairs.
No doubt many getting great results w/cut, just wondering how real world results might vary.
So have you guys had just as many 'hammers' using button bbls?
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
I have never used a button barrel but like others have mentioned it's not much of a difference. If you can develop the right loads for either one they will shoot identical. I believe the Stainless is always 416 Stainless Steel
I have never used a button barrel but like others have mentioned it's not much of a difference. If you can develop the right loads for either one they will shoot identical. I believe the Stainless is always 416 Stainless Steel
G
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Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Button rifles suck in my opinion for numerous reasons. </div></div>
.....because....?
Not disputing this as my understanding is that Cut can produce smaller variation with less stress to the barrel. But I must say that when I got my AE mk I and shot with the Archer barrel, it performed just as well as my AW. Perhaps i'm not precise enough to know a difference. Perhaps i'm not correct in that I am comparing a Border vs. an Archer barrel as I am told this is what the barrels are.
My basic understanding that a quality barrel is a quality barrel when it comes down to the bare bones of it. I recall a thread on here where someone noted that both cut and button have their share of appearances in the winner's circle of matches. It also speaks to me that there are some respectable names on the 6mmbr barrel manufacturers list that are button barrels (Shilen, Broughton, etc.)
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Button rifles suck in my opinion for numerous reasons. </div></div>
.....because....?
Not disputing this as my understanding is that Cut can produce smaller variation with less stress to the barrel. But I must say that when I got my AE mk I and shot with the Archer barrel, it performed just as well as my AW. Perhaps i'm not precise enough to know a difference. Perhaps i'm not correct in that I am comparing a Border vs. an Archer barrel as I am told this is what the barrels are.
My basic understanding that a quality barrel is a quality barrel when it comes down to the bare bones of it. I recall a thread on here where someone noted that both cut and button have their share of appearances in the winner's circle of matches. It also speaks to me that there are some respectable names on the 6mmbr barrel manufacturers list that are button barrels (Shilen, Broughton, etc.)
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
I have a 6.5 lapua being built on a Schneider 5polygon button barrel.The same type of barrel David Tubb uses..Im sure its far from sucking.. There are good barrels and there are phenominal barrels in both cut and buttoned. I use both and have yet to see a distict advantage of one over the other regardless of what the maker claims on a top barrel make..availability and price has a lot to do in my opinion on the favoring of a particular make of barrel. Ive seen so many dumbasses who never even shot out a barrel claim to be barrel experts.
I have a 6.5 lapua being built on a Schneider 5polygon button barrel.The same type of barrel David Tubb uses..Im sure its far from sucking.. There are good barrels and there are phenominal barrels in both cut and buttoned. I use both and have yet to see a distict advantage of one over the other regardless of what the maker claims on a top barrel make..availability and price has a lot to do in my opinion on the favoring of a particular make of barrel. Ive seen so many dumbasses who never even shot out a barrel claim to be barrel experts.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Button rifles suck in my opinion for numerous reasons. </div></div>
with 2500 rounds through my .284 win, the button rifled broughton sure isn't keeping me from sitting in second place overall for the year at our local long range matches. i have another button rifled broughton on the way to replace this one when it shits the bed.
the broughton barrel shoots fantastic, never copper fouls and has had a decent barrel life. i don't know what else there is that sucks about them.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Button rifles suck in my opinion for numerous reasons. </div></div>
with 2500 rounds through my .284 win, the button rifled broughton sure isn't keeping me from sitting in second place overall for the year at our local long range matches. i have another button rifled broughton on the way to replace this one when it shits the bed.
the broughton barrel shoots fantastic, never copper fouls and has had a decent barrel life. i don't know what else there is that sucks about them.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 6.5BR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Anyone here running Lilja's by chance? </div></div>
I have a Lilja 24" 4 groove 1 in 10 remington sendero contour in .308 on one of my rifles, it shoots good. My average is just over 1/2 MOA with FGMM 168.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 6.5BR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Anyone here running Lilja's by chance? </div></div>
I have a Lilja 24" 4 groove 1 in 10 remington sendero contour in .308 on one of my rifles, it shoots good. My average is just over 1/2 MOA with FGMM 168.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
The reason is we are hearing "if it's made right, if it's made right". What happens when it's not? What happens when you order a 1:8 twist and it comes out 1:8.5 and the manufacture wont make it right? Or what happens if they will make it right but you're out time and money because you've already had the other barrel put on your rifle?
Sure, many have had good luck with them but what about the ones that don't?
I've shot buttons, but moving forward I'll stick with cut.
The reason is we are hearing "if it's made right, if it's made right". What happens when it's not? What happens when you order a 1:8 twist and it comes out 1:8.5 and the manufacture wont make it right? Or what happens if they will make it right but you're out time and money because you've already had the other barrel put on your rifle?
Sure, many have had good luck with them but what about the ones that don't?
I've shot buttons, but moving forward I'll stick with cut.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Snipedogg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have never used a button barrel but like others have mentioned it's not much of a difference. If you can develop the right loads for either one they will shoot identical. I believe the Stainless is always 416 Stainless Steel </div></div>
I mentioned different steel, as I do know Lothar Walther uses a harder type of SS and users claim superior bbl life.
Mike, is your last name Rock by chance? Curious.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Snipedogg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have never used a button barrel but like others have mentioned it's not much of a difference. If you can develop the right loads for either one they will shoot identical. I believe the Stainless is always 416 Stainless Steel </div></div>
I mentioned different steel, as I do know Lothar Walther uses a harder type of SS and users claim superior bbl life.
Mike, is your last name Rock by chance? Curious.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
Mike, if you go through a proven barrel company then I don't see how it will be an issue. I'm sure like with anything that every company will have a "lemon" here and there but for the most part I don't see how somebody could be worried about it being made right when button rifling was the standard for so many years and is still used today by some of the most reputable barrel makers. I think you are trying to back up your original post with information that isn't very valuable.
Go through a reputable company and not some joe blow that apparently makes button barrels and you will be fine 6.5BR
Mike, if you go through a proven barrel company then I don't see how it will be an issue. I'm sure like with anything that every company will have a "lemon" here and there but for the most part I don't see how somebody could be worried about it being made right when button rifling was the standard for so many years and is still used today by some of the most reputable barrel makers. I think you are trying to back up your original post with information that isn't very valuable.
Go through a reputable company and not some joe blow that apparently makes button barrels and you will be fine 6.5BR
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 6.5BR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I mentioned different steel, as I do know Lothar Walther uses a harder type of SS and users claim superior bbl life.
Mike, is your last name Rock by chance? Curious.
</div></div>
Some companies offered 410 SS but I don't know of any that still do as it is harder on the tooling. Maybe that's what LW uses.
Mike's last name isn't Rock. Mike Rock post under a different name (redmistsomethingorother I can't remember). Rock barrels offer both cut and button rifling.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 6.5BR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I mentioned different steel, as I do know Lothar Walther uses a harder type of SS and users claim superior bbl life.
Mike, is your last name Rock by chance? Curious.
</div></div>
Some companies offered 410 SS but I don't know of any that still do as it is harder on the tooling. Maybe that's what LW uses.
Mike's last name isn't Rock. Mike Rock post under a different name (redmistsomethingorother I can't remember). Rock barrels offer both cut and button rifling.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Snipedogg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mike, if you go through a proven barrel company then I don't see how it will be an issue. I'm sure like with anything that every company will have a "lemon" here and there but for the most part I don't see how somebody could be worried about it being made right when button rifling was the standard for so many years and is still used today by some of the most reputable barrel makers. I think you are trying to back up your original post with information that isn't very valuable. </div></div>
You are incorrect. I am not saying I don't care for button barrels for the sake of reading my own opinion. If your opinion is different then so be it. My original post says I think that button barrels suck. This opinion was formed after two separate instances with button barrels. If you don't care for my opinion, good for you. But that doesn't make my opinion any less "valuable".
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Snipedogg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mike, if you go through a proven barrel company then I don't see how it will be an issue. I'm sure like with anything that every company will have a "lemon" here and there but for the most part I don't see how somebody could be worried about it being made right when button rifling was the standard for so many years and is still used today by some of the most reputable barrel makers. I think you are trying to back up your original post with information that isn't very valuable. </div></div>
You are incorrect. I am not saying I don't care for button barrels for the sake of reading my own opinion. If your opinion is different then so be it. My original post says I think that button barrels suck. This opinion was formed after two separate instances with button barrels. If you don't care for my opinion, good for you. But that doesn't make my opinion any less "valuable".
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
OK
just info from shooting of several barrels
Rock, Bartlien, Broughton
I now only shoot broughton now period
then again im of opinion that any custom barrel make will provide you a good shooting barrel
Broughton are just my preference
as far as cut or buttoned i have yet to seen any empirical evidence of one being better than other
OK
just info from shooting of several barrels
Rock, Bartlien, Broughton
I now only shoot broughton now period
then again im of opinion that any custom barrel make will provide you a good shooting barrel
Broughton are just my preference
as far as cut or buttoned i have yet to seen any empirical evidence of one being better than other
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Snipedogg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mike, if you go through a proven barrel company then I don't see how it will be an issue. I'm sure like with anything that every company will have a "lemon" here and there but for the most part I don't see how somebody could be worried about it being made right when button rifling was the standard for so many years and is still used today by some of the most reputable barrel makers. I think you are trying to back up your original post with information that isn't very valuable. </div></div>
You are incorrect. I am not saying I don't care for button barrels for the sake of reading my own opinion. If your opinion is different then so be it. My original post says I think that button barrels suck. This opinion was formed after two separate instances with button barrels. If you don't care for my opinion, good for you. But that doesn't make my opinion any less "valuable". </div></div>
I'm trying to find out what your reasons are that they suck. You said you have numerous reasons but haven't stated one, just said that they suck. If you give us some reasons that they suck then maybe your opinion would be more credible because so far it isn't.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Snipedogg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mike, if you go through a proven barrel company then I don't see how it will be an issue. I'm sure like with anything that every company will have a "lemon" here and there but for the most part I don't see how somebody could be worried about it being made right when button rifling was the standard for so many years and is still used today by some of the most reputable barrel makers. I think you are trying to back up your original post with information that isn't very valuable. </div></div>
You are incorrect. I am not saying I don't care for button barrels for the sake of reading my own opinion. If your opinion is different then so be it. My original post says I think that button barrels suck. This opinion was formed after two separate instances with button barrels. If you don't care for my opinion, good for you. But that doesn't make my opinion any less "valuable". </div></div>
I'm trying to find out what your reasons are that they suck. You said you have numerous reasons but haven't stated one, just said that they suck. If you give us some reasons that they suck then maybe your opinion would be more credible because so far it isn't.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
A lot of good points here, but I have to lean a little in Mike's direction. I wouldn't go so far as to say that button barrels suck, as I've used a lot of great shooting button barrels (namely Broughton), but I've also had more issues with button over cut. I'll say now that there are a lot of button barrel makers that I haven't tried, so my comments shouldn't be taken across the board.
When it comes to the twist rate, the button process is less precise. It's not so bad when you have a little gain in twist toward the muzzle (and some shooters prefer this and have barrels made with gain twist on purpose), but a negative twist change toward the muzzle is not good. I've seen negative twist changes in button barrels, but not cut. The twist rate is made into the button and as the button is pulled through the barrel, changes in the steel can slow down or speed up the pull, thereby changing the twist rate.
Bore diameters are also less consistent with some button barrels and bores are more prone to opening when a button barrel is turned and threaded (such as muzzle brakes, etc) and/or fluted. I do have to say that I've not had issues fluting a Broughton barrel though. When I've fluted other button barrels and pushed a patch through afterwards, you could feel a difference as the patch rotated through the rifling. Definite loose spots....
I was a staunch Krieger user for the longest time before going to Broughton (as there were advantages in delivery time), but as of a few months ago, all of my barrels now come from Bartlein and Rock with an occasional Krieger. Much more consistancy across the board....Not saying that Cut is better, but different enough (to the good) for me to stick with Cut. I gave the button barrels a good go, but I've always been a cut guy at heart.
A lot of good points here, but I have to lean a little in Mike's direction. I wouldn't go so far as to say that button barrels suck, as I've used a lot of great shooting button barrels (namely Broughton), but I've also had more issues with button over cut. I'll say now that there are a lot of button barrel makers that I haven't tried, so my comments shouldn't be taken across the board.
When it comes to the twist rate, the button process is less precise. It's not so bad when you have a little gain in twist toward the muzzle (and some shooters prefer this and have barrels made with gain twist on purpose), but a negative twist change toward the muzzle is not good. I've seen negative twist changes in button barrels, but not cut. The twist rate is made into the button and as the button is pulled through the barrel, changes in the steel can slow down or speed up the pull, thereby changing the twist rate.
Bore diameters are also less consistent with some button barrels and bores are more prone to opening when a button barrel is turned and threaded (such as muzzle brakes, etc) and/or fluted. I do have to say that I've not had issues fluting a Broughton barrel though. When I've fluted other button barrels and pushed a patch through afterwards, you could feel a difference as the patch rotated through the rifling. Definite loose spots....
I was a staunch Krieger user for the longest time before going to Broughton (as there were advantages in delivery time), but as of a few months ago, all of my barrels now come from Bartlein and Rock with an occasional Krieger. Much more consistancy across the board....Not saying that Cut is better, but different enough (to the good) for me to stick with Cut. I gave the button barrels a good go, but I've always been a cut guy at heart.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
Here you go "snipedogg". Mike from Skunkworks has explained why button barrels are different and may be more inconsistent, and why I have had issues with button barrels.
Here you go "snipedogg". Mike from Skunkworks has explained why button barrels are different and may be more inconsistent, and why I have had issues with button barrels.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Here you go "snipedogg". Mike from Skunkworks has explained why button barrels are different and may be more inconsistent, and why I have had issues with button barrels. </div></div>
I'm glad Mike from SW could give some reasoning to button rifling because you obviously couldn't. I'm familiar with the differences he stated in his post. My original post also said that I use a cut barrel and that it is now the way to go. I agree that cut is better, but like Mike also said, I wouldn't push to say button sucks. The OP asked about accuracy and barrel life and a good (I'm saying good Mike!) button barrel will do the job just as good once you get loads developed.
I understand you had your issues with button barrels but you never gave any reasoning for it but said you had plenty of them. That also doesn't mean that all button barrels suck because I've witnessed plenty of sub 1/2MOA button barrels. I don't like to stir shit up with people here but your original post didn't have any reasons behind it and I was looking for reasons which you still haven't provided.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Here you go "snipedogg". Mike from Skunkworks has explained why button barrels are different and may be more inconsistent, and why I have had issues with button barrels. </div></div>
I'm glad Mike from SW could give some reasoning to button rifling because you obviously couldn't. I'm familiar with the differences he stated in his post. My original post also said that I use a cut barrel and that it is now the way to go. I agree that cut is better, but like Mike also said, I wouldn't push to say button sucks. The OP asked about accuracy and barrel life and a good (I'm saying good Mike!) button barrel will do the job just as good once you get loads developed.
I understand you had your issues with button barrels but you never gave any reasoning for it but said you had plenty of them. That also doesn't mean that all button barrels suck because I've witnessed plenty of sub 1/2MOA button barrels. I don't like to stir shit up with people here but your original post didn't have any reasons behind it and I was looking for reasons which you still haven't provided.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Snipedogg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I'm glad Mike from SW could give some reasoning to button rifling because you obviously couldn't. I'm familiar with the differences he stated in his post. My original post also said that I use a cut barrel and that it is now the way to go. I agree that cut is better, but like Mike also said, I wouldn't push to say button sucks. The OP asked about accuracy and barrel life and a good (I'm saying good Mike!) button barrel will do the job just as good once you get loads developed.
I understand you had your issues with button barrels but you never gave any reasoning for it but said you had plenty of them. That also doesn't mean that all button barrels suck because I've witnessed plenty of sub 1/2MOA button barrels. I don't like to stir shit up with people here but your original post didn't have any reasons behind it and I was looking for reasons which you still haven't provided.</div></div>
I have a bad habit of making broad brush statements, especially when bitter or feel wronged.
So to clarify my position, let me restate my opinion.
Due to two separate instances with two different button barrels that were due to specific reasons outlined in Mike's(Skunkworks) posts, I will not shoot a button barrel again. Therefore all button barrel rifles do not suck however in my mind and opinion, they suck enough that I will not waste my money on them any more.
Is that clearer for you?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Snipedogg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I'm glad Mike from SW could give some reasoning to button rifling because you obviously couldn't. I'm familiar with the differences he stated in his post. My original post also said that I use a cut barrel and that it is now the way to go. I agree that cut is better, but like Mike also said, I wouldn't push to say button sucks. The OP asked about accuracy and barrel life and a good (I'm saying good Mike!) button barrel will do the job just as good once you get loads developed.
I understand you had your issues with button barrels but you never gave any reasoning for it but said you had plenty of them. That also doesn't mean that all button barrels suck because I've witnessed plenty of sub 1/2MOA button barrels. I don't like to stir shit up with people here but your original post didn't have any reasons behind it and I was looking for reasons which you still haven't provided.</div></div>
I have a bad habit of making broad brush statements, especially when bitter or feel wronged.
So to clarify my position, let me restate my opinion.
Due to two separate instances with two different button barrels that were due to specific reasons outlined in Mike's(Skunkworks) posts, I will not shoot a button barrel again. Therefore all button barrel rifles do not suck however in my mind and opinion, they suck enough that I will not waste my money on them any more.
Is that clearer for you?
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
Ive been advised by a couple of prominant button barrel makers unlike a cut barrel,fluting a button barrel is a no no unless done by the barrel maker . Did you stress relieve the buttoned barrels after fluting them?
Ive been advised by a couple of prominant button barrel makers unlike a cut barrel,fluting a button barrel is a no no unless done by the barrel maker . Did you stress relieve the buttoned barrels after fluting them?
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Snipedogg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I'm glad Mike from SW could give some reasoning to button rifling because you obviously couldn't. I'm familiar with the differences he stated in his post. My original post also said that I use a cut barrel and that it is now the way to go. I agree that cut is better, but like Mike also said, I wouldn't push to say button sucks. The OP asked about accuracy and barrel life and a good (I'm saying good Mike!) button barrel will do the job just as good once you get loads developed.
I understand you had your issues with button barrels but you never gave any reasoning for it but said you had plenty of them. That also doesn't mean that all button barrels suck because I've witnessed plenty of sub 1/2MOA button barrels. I don't like to stir shit up with people here but your original post didn't have any reasons behind it and I was looking for reasons which you still haven't provided.</div></div>
I have a bad habit of making broad brush statements, especially when bitter or feel wronged.
So to clarify my position, let me restate my opinion.
Due to two separate instances with two different button barrels that were due to specific reasons outlined in Mike's(Skunkworks) posts, I will not shoot a button barrel again. Therefore all button barrel rifles do not suck however in my mind and opinion, they suck enough that I will not waste my money on them any more.
Is that clearer for you? </div></div>
No big deal Mike. I know what you mean. It sucks getting screwed and I've had my fair share of negative words toward certain companies and/or products, I just disagreed with your statement because like you said, it was very broad. I use cut barrels and probably always will but I have had my ass handed to me by a couple button barrels too.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Snipedogg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I'm glad Mike from SW could give some reasoning to button rifling because you obviously couldn't. I'm familiar with the differences he stated in his post. My original post also said that I use a cut barrel and that it is now the way to go. I agree that cut is better, but like Mike also said, I wouldn't push to say button sucks. The OP asked about accuracy and barrel life and a good (I'm saying good Mike!) button barrel will do the job just as good once you get loads developed.
I understand you had your issues with button barrels but you never gave any reasoning for it but said you had plenty of them. That also doesn't mean that all button barrels suck because I've witnessed plenty of sub 1/2MOA button barrels. I don't like to stir shit up with people here but your original post didn't have any reasons behind it and I was looking for reasons which you still haven't provided.</div></div>
I have a bad habit of making broad brush statements, especially when bitter or feel wronged.
So to clarify my position, let me restate my opinion.
Due to two separate instances with two different button barrels that were due to specific reasons outlined in Mike's(Skunkworks) posts, I will not shoot a button barrel again. Therefore all button barrel rifles do not suck however in my mind and opinion, they suck enough that I will not waste my money on them any more.
Is that clearer for you? </div></div>
No big deal Mike. I know what you mean. It sucks getting screwed and I've had my fair share of negative words toward certain companies and/or products, I just disagreed with your statement because like you said, it was very broad. I use cut barrels and probably always will but I have had my ass handed to me by a couple button barrels too.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Snipedogg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have never used a button barrel but like others have mentioned it's not much of a difference. If you can develop the right loads for either one they will shoot identical. I believe the Stainless is always 416 Stainless Steel </div></div>
You sure have a strong opinion of something you have no firsthand experience of.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Snipedogg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have never used a button barrel but like others have mentioned it's not much of a difference. If you can develop the right loads for either one they will shoot identical. I believe the Stainless is always 416 Stainless Steel </div></div>
You sure have a strong opinion of something you have no firsthand experience of.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sniper2ndrep</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Snipedogg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have never used a button barrel but like others have mentioned it's not much of a difference. If you can develop the right loads for either one they will shoot identical. I believe the Stainless is always 416 Stainless Steel </div></div>
You sure have a strong opinion of something you have no firsthand experience of. </div></div>
I made that based on the fact that I know people that do own button barrels that do shoot great. I just had this conversation with Mike that I agree cut is better but I don't agree that button sucks. A button barrel that is done right which are obviously the ones I have witnessed, have the ability to shoot just as good. How is this not firsthand experience?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sniper2ndrep</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Snipedogg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have never used a button barrel but like others have mentioned it's not much of a difference. If you can develop the right loads for either one they will shoot identical. I believe the Stainless is always 416 Stainless Steel </div></div>
You sure have a strong opinion of something you have no firsthand experience of. </div></div>
I made that based on the fact that I know people that do own button barrels that do shoot great. I just had this conversation with Mike that I agree cut is better but I don't agree that button sucks. A button barrel that is done right which are obviously the ones I have witnessed, have the ability to shoot just as good. How is this not firsthand experience?
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
They are all good. With good quality control every custom barrel maker will produce a tack driver of a rifle barrel. I go with BENCHMARK barrels as well. They are button rifled and from what I can see from others that also shoot them it is pretty tough to beat 5 shot groups in the .2's. I would love to have a rifle that is more accurate than that but dont really know if it can be. At that point it might be the ammo or something else. BENCHMARK for me because they are local and I enjoy the great people that are there. If someone is local to you that makes custom barrels it really does not matter which way it is made as long as it is made correctly and with excellent quality control. That said call BENCHMARK and order a real barrel. You will be happy for sure.
They are all good. With good quality control every custom barrel maker will produce a tack driver of a rifle barrel. I go with BENCHMARK barrels as well. They are button rifled and from what I can see from others that also shoot them it is pretty tough to beat 5 shot groups in the .2's. I would love to have a rifle that is more accurate than that but dont really know if it can be. At that point it might be the ammo or something else. BENCHMARK for me because they are local and I enjoy the great people that are there. If someone is local to you that makes custom barrels it really does not matter which way it is made as long as it is made correctly and with excellent quality control. That said call BENCHMARK and order a real barrel. You will be happy for sure.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sniper2ndrep</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ive been advised by a couple of prominant button barrel makers unlike a cut barrel,fluting a button barrel is a no no unless done by the barrel maker . Did you stress relieve the buttoned barrels after fluting them? </div></div>
Yep. I stress relieve most all barrels after they've been chambered and fit to the action and all fluted barrels get stress relieved. The only button barrels I've actually installed and used after fluting have been the Broughtons. Other button barrels were pre-threaded and short chambered examples that I "expiremented" on. They're still sitting in the scrap barrel rack.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sniper2ndrep</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ive been advised by a couple of prominant button barrel makers unlike a cut barrel,fluting a button barrel is a no no unless done by the barrel maker . Did you stress relieve the buttoned barrels after fluting them? </div></div>
Yep. I stress relieve most all barrels after they've been chambered and fit to the action and all fluted barrels get stress relieved. The only button barrels I've actually installed and used after fluting have been the Broughtons. Other button barrels were pre-threaded and short chambered examples that I "expiremented" on. They're still sitting in the scrap barrel rack.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
For the past several years I have been completly obsessed with precion shooting at great distance, chasing that one hole dream. I have spent a fortune of money chasing this dream and subsequently have gained a great deal of experince.
While I am a fan of krieger, simply because I have never been let down, I would not hesitate to rebarrel with another manufacturer as I've done many times. I know of three Broughton die hards that have recently been disapointed by poor quality control. If you take a lead plug and pull it through a bore, the speed it travels should stay consistant. If this does not happen then some one dropped the ball. But if all is well then you should have a great shooting barrel regardless of the rifling procedure.If the barrel was not stress relieved properly then you will have groups that like to "walk" as the barrel becomes warm. Its mainly about quality control and catching the lemons before the leave the building.
I will end by saying that even though I mainly shoot cut rifled barrels, some of the best performing barrels I have ever owned were button rifled.
For the past several years I have been completly obsessed with precion shooting at great distance, chasing that one hole dream. I have spent a fortune of money chasing this dream and subsequently have gained a great deal of experince.
While I am a fan of krieger, simply because I have never been let down, I would not hesitate to rebarrel with another manufacturer as I've done many times. I know of three Broughton die hards that have recently been disapointed by poor quality control. If you take a lead plug and pull it through a bore, the speed it travels should stay consistant. If this does not happen then some one dropped the ball. But if all is well then you should have a great shooting barrel regardless of the rifling procedure.If the barrel was not stress relieved properly then you will have groups that like to "walk" as the barrel becomes warm. Its mainly about quality control and catching the lemons before the leave the building.
I will end by saying that even though I mainly shoot cut rifled barrels, some of the best performing barrels I have ever owned were button rifled.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
<span style="font-weight: bold">It’s all about Consistency</span>. Cut Rifled Barrels are more consistent. Button Not so much.
First two steps in making a barrel are the same weather its cut or buttoned
1. Drill a straight hole
2. Ream it to size
Button: A Carbide Button is pulled or pushed through the barrel, the rate of twist set by the button. If the steel is consistent all the way through the twist will be consistent. If not you will get a gain or a negative or both. The buttoning process induces stress it’s then relieved either by a furnace / cryogenically or both which also changes the properties of the metal, then lapped to try to get the bore back to a uniform size. If all of the above goes well then the end result is good. If not you get an inconsistent barrel.
Cut rifling. A single point cutter is pulled through the bore removing a couple tenths of material a pull. The rate of twist is either controlled by a lead screw and gear or a CNC Computer (Bartlein) the twist remains consistent to the machine unless changed. There is no stress developed with this method as the amount of material is removed slowly and not displaced. Lapping is fast and easy as the bore is already at size, the lapping is for finish only. This process lets the barrel remain consistent from start to finish.
Can something go wrong in the Cut Rifling process?? Yes but its obvious when it does and the barrel can be scrapped on the spot or sent back to the start to be drilled up to the next size. If something happens in the button process it’s not so obvious and may get out the door.
If both are made correctly can they both shoot well. Absolutely
But back to my original statement "Its all about Consistency"
Look at the Benchrest Score cards. They always have an Equipment List printed for every match. Look at the Nationals, The Cactus Classic, the Supershoot. Bartlein, Kreiger and Rock are 95% of the top 20 <span style="font-weight: bold">"Consistently"!!!!!</span> All Cut Rifled!
<span style="font-weight: bold">It’s all about Consistency</span>. Cut Rifled Barrels are more consistent. Button Not so much.
First two steps in making a barrel are the same weather its cut or buttoned
1. Drill a straight hole
2. Ream it to size
Button: A Carbide Button is pulled or pushed through the barrel, the rate of twist set by the button. If the steel is consistent all the way through the twist will be consistent. If not you will get a gain or a negative or both. The buttoning process induces stress it’s then relieved either by a furnace / cryogenically or both which also changes the properties of the metal, then lapped to try to get the bore back to a uniform size. If all of the above goes well then the end result is good. If not you get an inconsistent barrel.
Cut rifling. A single point cutter is pulled through the bore removing a couple tenths of material a pull. The rate of twist is either controlled by a lead screw and gear or a CNC Computer (Bartlein) the twist remains consistent to the machine unless changed. There is no stress developed with this method as the amount of material is removed slowly and not displaced. Lapping is fast and easy as the bore is already at size, the lapping is for finish only. This process lets the barrel remain consistent from start to finish.
Can something go wrong in the Cut Rifling process?? Yes but its obvious when it does and the barrel can be scrapped on the spot or sent back to the start to be drilled up to the next size. If something happens in the button process it’s not so obvious and may get out the door.
If both are made correctly can they both shoot well. Absolutely
But back to my original statement "Its all about Consistency"
Look at the Benchrest Score cards. They always have an Equipment List printed for every match. Look at the Nationals, The Cactus Classic, the Supershoot. Bartlein, Kreiger and Rock are 95% of the top 20 <span style="font-weight: bold">"Consistently"!!!!!</span> All Cut Rifled!
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
On the stress relieving, is it important for cut rifled barrels? Do US or GAP stress relieve their cut rifled barrels?
If using a fluted barrel that was fluted at the factory, say Bartlein, is any stress relieving recommended after threading and chambering?
-Steve
On the stress relieving, is it important for cut rifled barrels? Do US or GAP stress relieve their cut rifled barrels?
If using a fluted barrel that was fluted at the factory, say Bartlein, is any stress relieving recommended after threading and chambering?
-Steve
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7m
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Skunkworks</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A lot of good points here, but I have to lean a little in Mike's direction. I wouldn't go so far as to say that button barrels suck, as I've used a lot of great shooting button barrels (namely Broughton), but I've also had more issues with button over cut. I'll say now that there are a lot of button barrel makers that I haven't tried, so my comments shouldn't be taken across the board.
When it comes to the twist rate, the button process is less precise. It's not so bad when you have a little gain in twist toward the muzzle (and some shooters prefer this and have barrels made with gain twist on purpose), but a negative twist change toward the muzzle is not good. I've seen negative twist changes in button barrels, but not cut. The twist rate is made into the button and as the button is pulled through the barrel, changes in the steel can slow down or speed up the pull, thereby changing the twist rate.
Bore diameters are also less consistent with some button barrels and bores are more prone to opening when a button barrel is turned and threaded (such as muzzle brakes, etc) and/or fluted. I do have to say that I've not had issues fluting a Broughton barrel though. When I've fluted other button barrels and pushed a patch through afterwards, you could feel a difference as the patch rotated through the rifling. Definite loose spots....
I was a staunch Krieger user for the longest time before going to Broughton (as there were advantages in delivery time), but as of a few months ago, all of my barrels now come from Bartlein and Rock with an occasional Krieger. Much more consistancy across the board....Not saying that Cut is better, but different enough (to the good) for me to stick with Cut. I gave the button barrels a good go, but I've always been a cut guy at heart. </div></div>
Oh now ya tell me...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Skunkworks</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A lot of good points here, but I have to lean a little in Mike's direction. I wouldn't go so far as to say that button barrels suck, as I've used a lot of great shooting button barrels (namely Broughton), but I've also had more issues with button over cut. I'll say now that there are a lot of button barrel makers that I haven't tried, so my comments shouldn't be taken across the board.
When it comes to the twist rate, the button process is less precise. It's not so bad when you have a little gain in twist toward the muzzle (and some shooters prefer this and have barrels made with gain twist on purpose), but a negative twist change toward the muzzle is not good. I've seen negative twist changes in button barrels, but not cut. The twist rate is made into the button and as the button is pulled through the barrel, changes in the steel can slow down or speed up the pull, thereby changing the twist rate.
Bore diameters are also less consistent with some button barrels and bores are more prone to opening when a button barrel is turned and threaded (such as muzzle brakes, etc) and/or fluted. I do have to say that I've not had issues fluting a Broughton barrel though. When I've fluted other button barrels and pushed a patch through afterwards, you could feel a difference as the patch rotated through the rifling. Definite loose spots....
I was a staunch Krieger user for the longest time before going to Broughton (as there were advantages in delivery time), but as of a few months ago, all of my barrels now come from Bartlein and Rock with an occasional Krieger. Much more consistancy across the board....Not saying that Cut is better, but different enough (to the good) for me to stick with Cut. I gave the button barrels a good go, but I've always been a cut guy at heart. </div></div>
Oh now ya tell me...
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7m
Just my 2 cents...
With todays machinery and the barrel technology that is in use...WE have more options today then ever when it comes to a quality match barrel.
<span style="font-weight: bold">A lot of the QUALITY now comes down to the steel their drilling!</span>
Some say we only sell one type of barrel others say select and select match...AS lo ng as you order a 1-8" and get a TRUE 1-8" and its straight
Brux, Krieger, lilja, Schneider, Shilen, Pac-Nor, Douglas (still in the game), Hart.
I know one custom barrel maker that won't get any more business froma friend of mine...he recently dialed in a barrel and found out that the rifling itself was out...AFTER a HEATED phone call he told them he did not care if they swapped it out or NOT! IT was coming back and if no one cared enough to scope and check check it further...They could keep it and he would go elsewhere...
Just my 2 cents...
With todays machinery and the barrel technology that is in use...WE have more options today then ever when it comes to a quality match barrel.
<span style="font-weight: bold">A lot of the QUALITY now comes down to the steel their drilling!</span>
Some say we only sell one type of barrel others say select and select match...AS lo ng as you order a 1-8" and get a TRUE 1-8" and its straight
Brux, Krieger, lilja, Schneider, Shilen, Pac-Nor, Douglas (still in the game), Hart.
I know one custom barrel maker that won't get any more business froma friend of mine...he recently dialed in a barrel and found out that the rifling itself was out...AFTER a HEATED phone call he told them he did not care if they swapped it out or NOT! IT was coming back and if no one cared enough to scope and check check it further...They could keep it and he would go elsewhere...
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7m
I have never had a bad barrel from a premium maker...whether button rifled or cut. Heck, I even have a Douglas that will hold its own with the big boys. Right now I am on a Brux kick. Krieger is what I have the most of and they all just shoot lights out.
I have never had a bad barrel from a premium maker...whether button rifled or cut. Heck, I even have a Douglas that will hold its own with the big boys. Right now I am on a Brux kick. Krieger is what I have the most of and they all just shoot lights out.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
I've had 3 Kriegers,1 Bartlien,2 Schneiders,1 Broughton.Oddly enough the Bartlien shot only average.So did the last Schneider.The rest all shot great.The two most accurate were a Krieger 30cal and a Broughton 6mm.The Broughton lasted to 2400 rounds in 6x47L.The recent Schneider 6x47L went south at 1500 rounds.I think it was the R-17 that contributed to torching the throat.
I've had 3 Kriegers,1 Bartlien,2 Schneiders,1 Broughton.Oddly enough the Bartlien shot only average.So did the last Schneider.The rest all shot great.The two most accurate were a Krieger 30cal and a Broughton 6mm.The Broughton lasted to 2400 rounds in 6x47L.The recent Schneider 6x47L went south at 1500 rounds.I think it was the R-17 that contributed to torching the throat.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
Steve,
You results kinda mirror my experiences as well. Look at the 1000yd benchrest stats....Krieger and Broughton. I know Broughton looks at his barrels before ever sending them out to customers. This way, you don't have any problems. Maybe cut rifling is more consistent, but quality control is quality control whether its cut or button rifled.
Steve,
You results kinda mirror my experiences as well. Look at the 1000yd benchrest stats....Krieger and Broughton. I know Broughton looks at his barrels before ever sending them out to customers. This way, you don't have any problems. Maybe cut rifling is more consistent, but quality control is quality control whether its cut or button rifled.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
Steve123,
I agree with you. I have used and have most of them. My current rifles have PacNor, Kreiger and Bartlien on them. My Bartlien barrel on my 260 is what I would call an "Average" but my PacNor and Kreigers have always been consistantly accurate rifles.(One button one cut) I have a Kreiger on hand to replace my Bartlien when it goes south.
I just orderd a Broughton to try out for a 284 build I hope its a shooter because they sure as hell cost a lot more!!!! Most all the good companies will build great barrels most of the time but they can all let a turd get by once in awhile. Its what they do about it after it leaves the shop that counts. Bartlien offered to replace the barrel if I was not happy with it but I already had it parkerized and it shot good enough for what I was using it for. I know Bartlein makes great barrels and I would not hesitate to try another one down the road because of their customer service.
Steve123,
I agree with you. I have used and have most of them. My current rifles have PacNor, Kreiger and Bartlien on them. My Bartlien barrel on my 260 is what I would call an "Average" but my PacNor and Kreigers have always been consistantly accurate rifles.(One button one cut) I have a Kreiger on hand to replace my Bartlien when it goes south.
I just orderd a Broughton to try out for a 284 build I hope its a shooter because they sure as hell cost a lot more!!!! Most all the good companies will build great barrels most of the time but they can all let a turd get by once in awhile. Its what they do about it after it leaves the shop that counts. Bartlien offered to replace the barrel if I was not happy with it but I already had it parkerized and it shot good enough for what I was using it for. I know Bartlein makes great barrels and I would not hesitate to try another one down the road because of their customer service.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
Thanks for the info 7mmAM!
I already have another Schneider on order because they get em done quick and they're close by but if it doesn't shoot any better than the last one I'll be going back to the tried and true.
Thanks for the info 7mmAM!
I already have another Schneider on order because they get em done quick and they're close by but if it doesn't shoot any better than the last one I'll be going back to the tried and true.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
Most of my experience is with button barrels- Hart and Broughton. Both are extremely accurate - sub .25 MOA with factory hunting ammunition. I would report what the handloads do, but you'd never believe me. George Gardner's discussion, above, is well taken though.
Most of my experience is with button barrels- Hart and Broughton. Both are extremely accurate - sub .25 MOA with factory hunting ammunition. I would report what the handloads do, but you'd never believe me. George Gardner's discussion, above, is well taken though.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
I used to take a magazine that was all about bench rest shooting and competitions. In that magazine, they published results of various matches. These results noted the barrel used, action type, cartridge, scope used, maker of the rifle, and other information.
I found it interesting that the winners circle had all kinds of barrels in it. It didn't seem to matter whether the barrels were button, or cut rifled. The biggest variables seemed to be whether the barrel was made by a quality barrel maker, and the overall construction of the rifle. Lilja, Kreiger, Obermeyer, Broughton, Schneider, and many other makers seemed to be in the top places.
I guess you get what you pay for. If you buy a cheap barrel from an unknown maker from a barrel wholesaler, don't be surprised if it is only providing hunting type accuracy (1-3 MOA at 100 yards). The best barrel blanks seem to cost about the same, regardless of which method was used to rifle them.
I used to take a magazine that was all about bench rest shooting and competitions. In that magazine, they published results of various matches. These results noted the barrel used, action type, cartridge, scope used, maker of the rifle, and other information.
I found it interesting that the winners circle had all kinds of barrels in it. It didn't seem to matter whether the barrels were button, or cut rifled. The biggest variables seemed to be whether the barrel was made by a quality barrel maker, and the overall construction of the rifle. Lilja, Kreiger, Obermeyer, Broughton, Schneider, and many other makers seemed to be in the top places.
I guess you get what you pay for. If you buy a cheap barrel from an unknown maker from a barrel wholesaler, don't be surprised if it is only providing hunting type accuracy (1-3 MOA at 100 yards). The best barrel blanks seem to cost about the same, regardless of which method was used to rifle them.
Re: Cut vs Button...what's your fav 6mm, 6.5, & 7mm
Top 1000 yard Benchrest guys are using mostly Bartlein and Kreiger barrels.
Top 1000 yard Benchrest guys are using mostly Bartlein and Kreiger barrels.
