Defiance deviant ELITE vs. axiom vector..or maybe impact

[bjay]

For tactical shooting/prs and prone shooring with JAE chassis...all actions nitrated no plans on switching barrel so the option on vector "quick switching barrel" dont matter.prefer shoulder one time torque up barrel and integrated rail/lug...the 60 vs 90 degree bolt dont really matter much either..
And im talking about the extended tenon elite mechanical ejevtor deviant..
Which should you pick?

 

[briang7511]

watched the curtis custom crew do very well last weekend. being able to change a barrel without a gunsmith is an intrigueing idea. you do alot of shooting and need a new barrel very easy to change with minimal or no shift of zero. I do love my deviant and hard to talk me out of giving it up. i ran a gap tempest for the first time in that match. if time was a factor i would not recommend a tempest. mine is still new and still a little rough to cycle. From what i saw the curtis is smooth and i would buy one.

 

[Renomd]

Impact and don’t look back I just received my second action today!

 

[b6graham]

I'm not sure how big of a deal the quick change of the vector is now that we have barloc/switchlug etc especially if you don't plan to use it, it will always be an option down the road. If I didn't have a nucleus on order and was picking up a Mausingfield tomorrow it would be an impact

 

[bjay]

Impact l..is just a standard rem ie.surgeon right? What does this action offer vs. standard custom rem action (defiance,surgeon etc.)
The elite has this new firing pin system extended tenon,mech ejector (CRF) like big horn.
Im using deviant crf at the moment and its very smooth and doesn't bind like the standard deviant.
Axiom has 3 lugs 60bolt so these two not your standard rem clone...am i missing anything on IMPACT?

 

[bjay]

Just sold barreled action deviant CRF..and just wanna make sure the next action is an UPGRADE

 

[kthomas]

Maybe consider a Mausingfield? Has CRF plus a lot of other excellent design features. One of the few actions out there that is not just a "redesigned rem 700".

Out of the options you listed, I would go Impact. I would also consider a Lone Peak Fuzion.

You have a bunch of Defiances already - why not try something different? It's fun to Branch out, plus you get to discover different features that you may appreciate which are not on the Defiance.

The features of the Curtis Custom doesn't really do anything for me. 60° bolt throw is meh for me, and I think quick change barrels is just another failure point - would suck if that Allen screw came loose. I'll take a shouldered barrel with action wrench and barrel vice any day over a quick change unit.

I have a TacOps Rem700, a new DLC'ed Defiance Deviant, older Defiance Rebel, Mausingfield, had a TL3 for a hot minute and have a Lone Peak Fuzion on the way for the wife. I'm really impressed with the Mausingfield - it's a tier above the other actions, very well thought out and built. My gunsmith says I will be even more impressed with the Lone Peak Fuzion over the Mausingfield.

 

[bjay]

Maybe consider a Mausingfield? Has CRF plus a lot of other excellent design features. One of the few actions out there that is not just a "redesigned rem 700".

Out of the options you listed, I would go Impact. I would also consider a Lone Peak Fuzion.

You have a bunch of Defiances already - why not try something different? It's fun to Branch out, plus you get to discover different features that you may appreciate which are not on the Defiance.

The features of the Curtis Custom doesn't really do anything for me. 60° bolt throw is meh for me, and I think quick change barrels is just another failure point - would suck if that Allen screw came loose. I'll take a shouldered barrel with action wrench and barrel vice any day over a quick change unit.

I have a TacOps Rem700, a new DLC'ed Defiance Deviant, older Defiance Rebel, Mausingfield, had a TL3 for a hot minute and have a Lone Peak Fuzion on the way for the wife. I'm really impressed with the Mausingfield - it's a tier above the other actions, very well thought out and built. My gunsmith says I will be even more impressed with the Lone Peak Fuzion over the Mausingfield.

Yup i do have a lot of defiance..i also had mausingfield once...feel kinda sloppy for my taste..their un Integrated rail is so tall too
Fuzion is nice too though dnt really care about the titanium version its not a hunting rifle..

 

[kthomas]

Yup i do have a lot of defiance..i also had mausingfield once...feel kinda sloppy for my taste..their un Integrated rail is so tall too
Fuzion is nice too though dnt really care about the titanium version its not a hunting rifle..

They make it in non-titanium, my wifes Fuzion is not Titanium.

Weird that you thought the Mausingfield felt sloppy. I love how mine feels. My wife, who knows nothing about rifles even keyed in right away and noticed it was a tier above the other actions we have in the house.

 

[bjay]

This what i had and sold it here

 

[kthomas]

I have no experience with the raw version. Mine is DLC'ed.

 

[Tony1320]

This what i had and sold it hereView attachment 6913178

That stock is sexy I was thinking going that route on my next Manners or the Monroe camo

Also in the same boat as you for deciding on an action lol

 

[SuperSneakySniper]

Im not sure what action would feel like an upgrade over the ones you have tried.
The Curtis Custom actions feel like 60 degree Defiance actions. The TL3 is sloppier than Defiance, but mine ran better than the Defiance when it was dusty. It also had the best feeling, lightest bolt lift ive ever felt.
I hear the Lone Peak has a comparable bolt lift to the TL3, and I hear the Impact Precision is right inbetween, with great bolt lift, smooth operation, and reliability during rough conditions.

If i were to try a new action, it'd be the Impact. I currently have a Nucleus on order, but if you didnt like the Mausingfield, I doubt the Nucleus will feel much different.

 

[bjay]

Im not sure what action would feel like an upgrade over the ones you have tried.
The Curtis Custom actions feel like 60 degree Defiance actions. The TL3 is sloppier than Defiance, but mine ran better than the Defiance when it was dusty. It also had the best feeling, lightest bolt lift ive ever felt.
I hear the Lone Peak has a comparable bolt lift to the TL3, and I hear the Impact Precision is right inbetween, with great bolt lift, smooth operation, and reliability during rough conditions.

If i were to try a new action, it'd be the Impact. I currently have a Nucleus on order, but if you didnt like the Mausingfield, I doubt the Nucleus will feel much different.

Comparing all my deviant..the control round feed version has no bind and very smooth that's why im pretty confident that their elite just as smoth....the standard deviant keep kinda too tight on tolerance

 

[M338]

Yup i do have a lot of defiance..i also had mausingfield once...feel kinda sloppy for my taste..their un Integrated rail is so tall too
Fuzion is nice too though dnt really care about the titanium version its not a hunting rifle..

Gotta agree the MF and bighorn are a little sloppy for my liking,I’m about to pull the trigger on a Curtis or another tempest,I just love the short bolt throw!

 

[NateVA]

I have a Mausingfield based custom rifle and my next rifle will be a Desert Tech Covert. If I was going with another custom build instead, I'd probably choose a Curtis Vector.

 

[FJBPrecision]

I’m a huge fan of the 60 degree bolt throw. My Curtis Axioms are smooth as butter and have been 100% reliable since I got mine 4 months ago. You can’t go wrong with a Curtis. I haven’t got my hands on a Vector yet but if it’s anything like the Axiom it should be a homerun for them.

 

[Onebadstang16]

Impact and don't look back, Tate is about the most straight forward guy in the industry. You'll get what he says you'll get, when he says you'll get it plain and simple. The impact runs smooth as butter and simply flat out works in any conditions which is why so many of the top guys are using them. There's a huge difference in being paid to run an action and running one by choice, I won't mention any names but there's one particular company that's lined shooters pockets for the marketing. Tate at impact will flat out tell you, I don't sponsor shooters with free actions my work speaks for its self, yet many top guys are running them by choice. Tate also has these on the shelf and will at any later date spin up a barrel for you and mail it, many other companies will also due to the consistency of the impact action.

The Curtis stuff is nice but bolt lift is significant over 90 degree stuff, the actions nice but the customer service isn't what is say is good... Timelines tend to shift but the finished product seems nice enough. I think you'll find once behind a nice 90 throw the amazing wow of a 60 isn't all it's cracked up to be.

The arc stuff while maybe nice isnt something I'd even consider because of the lack of customer service and support from Ted, I mean even magazines are out of stock.... Mythical nucleus actions hundreds are waiting on speaks volumes.

The defiance stuff is very nice, however the tolerances tend to be to tight for any real dirty conditions, on more than one occasion I've seen a defiance guy saying how smooth his action is only to be oiling down and cleaning the bolt half way through a match because he's got some grit in the action. Your look at HUGE leads if you can't find what you want exactly in stock, but call Norm he's a very nice guy and will do what he can to help.

The big horn is a rock solid action all around, I can say the mechanical extraction is not for everyone and does require a full bolt stroke. The play in full open tends to make if bind when I run the bolt but many have no issue.

Hope this helped some, flat out I've been behind them all, the impact is a rock solid choice.

 

[bjay]

Impact and don't look back, Tate is about the most straight forward guy in the industry. You'll get what he says you'll get, when he says you'll get it plain and simple. The impact runs smooth as butter and simply flat out works in any conditions which is why so many of the top guys are using them. There's a huge difference in being paid to run an action and running one by choice, I won't mention any names but there's one particular company that's lined shooters pockets for the marketing. Tate at impact will flat out tell you, I don't sponsor shooters with free actions my work speaks for its self, yet many top guys are running them by choice. Tate also has these on the shelf and will at any later date spin up a barrel for you and mail it, many other companies will also due to the consistency of the impact action.

The Curtis stuff is nice but bolt lift is significant over 90 degree stuff, the actions nice but the customer service isn't what is say is good... Timelines tend to shift but the finished product seems nice enough. I think you'll find once behind a nice 90 throw the amazing wow of a 60 isn't all it's cracked up to be.

The arc stuff while maybe nice isnt something I'd even consider because of the lack of customer service and support from Ted, I mean even magazines are out of stock.... Mythical nucleus actions hundreds are waiting on speaks volumes.

The defiance stuff is very nice, however the tolerances tend to be to tight for any real dirty conditions, on more than one occasion I've seen a defiance guy saying how smooth his action is only to be oiling down and cleaning the bolt half way through a match because he's got some grit in the action. Your look at HUGE leads if you can't find what you want exactly in stock, but call Norm he's a very nice guy and will do what he can to help.

The big horn is a rock solid action all around, I can say the mechanical extraction is not for everyone and does require a full bolt stroke. The play in full open tends to make if bind when I run the bolt but many have no issue.

Hope this helped some, flat out I've been behind them all, the impact is a rock solid choice.

First on first ty for contributing and sharing your thoughts...
I still haven't choose the action..but im not leaning towards a 90° after speaking with mark at SAC why he prefer 90 over 60...
Also there's only one issue i keep hearing about deviant being tight tolerance and thats when bolt got dusty/dirty and binding..
This issue is NOT existing with their CRF..ive beem using them little tighter vs (IMO) sloppy mausingfield but not as tight as standard bolt deviant

 

[Onebadstang16]

First on first ty for contributing and sharing your thoughts...
I still haven't choose the action..but im not leaning towards a 90° after speaking with mark at SAC why he prefer 90 over 60...
Also there's only one issue i keep hearing about deviant being tight tolerance and thats when bolt got dusty/dirty and binding..
This issue is NOT existing with their CRF..ive beem using them little tighter vs (IMO) sloppy mausingfield but not as tight as standard bolt deviant

The defiance tactical stuff in my opinion was tighter than most like in prs, it's only a matter of time before you shoot a match in dust and sand.

Again I'd strongly recommend giving Tate a call at impact and let him tell you what they did to the impact and why it works. I think youll find his customer service second to none. There's a reason so many top prs shooters are using them, they work and do everything you need them to without all the other bs. Take away the folks being paid to run actions and see how many folks of the top prs shooters are using impacts.

 

[Tony1320]

What about Lone Peak? I'm in the same boat as you looking at the same actions and I keep hearing the Lone Peak is real nice

I use a Borden for FTR and it's excellent and I believe Jim is making a PRS action that would be interesting

 

[Onebadstang16]

What about Lone Peak? I'm in the same boat as you looking at the same actions and I keep hearing the Lone Peak is real nice

I use a Borden for FTR and it's excellent and I believe Jim is making a PRS action that would be interesting

I have never used a lone peak or have I put my hands on one so I wouldnt feel right speaking to it but I hear it's nice. Jim does make a prs style action already called the mountaineer and it's nice as all of Jim's stuff is but to me it does have more of a hunting hybrid benchrest feel than a tactical prs action. But Jim's stuff is always a very very nice action.

 

[bjay]

I have never used a lone peak or have I put my hands on one so I wouldnt feel right speaking to it but I hear it's nice. Jim does make a prs style action already called the mountaineer and it's nice as all of Jim's stuff is but to me it does have more of a hunting hybrid benchrest feel than a tactical prs action. But Jim's stuff is always a very very nice action.

Erik cortina just built one 6x47 out of that action im waiting for his review..it does looks good

 

[Fig]

For tactical shooting/prs and prone shooring with JAE chassis...all actions nitrated no plans on switching barrel so the option on vector "quick switching barrel" dont matter.prefer shoulder one time torque up barrel and integrated rail/lug...the 60 vs 90 degree bolt dont really matter much either..
And im talking about the extended tenon elite mechanical ejevtor deviant..
Which should you pick?

Based on what you say your criteria are both (and a half dozen others) equally meet them, and either one will play. From further down the thread I'd go Axiom rather than Vector since you're not looking for a switch barrel (unless you're chasing the new shiny just cuz).

I would offer a word of caution about "sloppy" actions (or sloppy bi-pods, or a lot of other "sloppy" gear). These are all pieces of equipment machined to the .000th. It's not that these are accidents, bad Mfg., or design flaws. They are design features that may or may not come into play depending on how you shoot. I'm sure my tightest field rifle would make a bench rest shooter cringe at how loose and sloppy it is, and yet the bolt will start to get sticky with only a smattering of dust in the action... Others, that would send them into fits of apoplexy, are looser and can take a whole day of crud before they start failing.

I shoot a Curtis and love it, but my next action is going to be an Impact just because I like them, and in a Foundation stock, just because I like it. Really, I can justify that or bash it either way, because everything we're talking about is high dollar, premium kit that will probably last several lifetimes. It really does boil down to taste, and despite soliciting opinions often they're already made up and these threads are more an exercise in validation and as a talisman to ward off buyer's remorse...

De gustibus non est disputandum.
(There is no accounting for taste.)

 

[Tony1320]

Erik cortina just built one 6x47 out of that action im waiting for his review..it does looks good

I think there's a new Mountaineer "PRS" though I think its a multiflat integral lug and rail?

That's good to know I'd be curious as well I'm sure it will be an excellent action just wonder how it will do in the field.

If it works out that's probably what I will go with. I love my BRM

 

[bjay]

I think there's a new Mountaineer "PRS" though I think its a multiflat integral lug and rail?

That's good to know I'd be curious as well I'm sure it will be an excellent action just wonder how it will do in the field.

If it works out that's probably what I will go with. I love my BRM

It does have integrated recoil lug..looks nice..im sure jim already coming out with everything integrated

 

[Onebadstang16]

I think there's a new Mountaineer "PRS" though I think its a multiflat integral lug and rail?

That's good to know I'd be curious as well I'm sure it will be an excellent action just wonder how it will do in the field.

If it works out that's probably what I will go with. I love my BRM

He told you it was a 6x47 lol sly devil him, Erik's a buddy of mine he's doing my next barrel for my impact.

 

[Onebadstang16]

I think there's a new Mountaineer "PRS" though I think its a multiflat integral lug and rail?

That's good to know I'd be curious as well I'm sure it will be an excellent action just wonder how it will do in the field.

If it works out that's probably what I will go with. I love my BRM

Erik told you it was a 6x47 huh that sly devil, he's a buddy he's doing my next barrel.

 

[bjay]

He told you it was a 6x47 lol sly devil him, Erik's a buddy of mine he's doing my next barrel for my impact.

I always ask himto coach me when going to f class competition.hed help me a lot and always great guy giving advice..oppsi guess i nit suppose to tell you haha.yup he already put it together with mpa stocks

 

[Onebadstang16]

I always ask himto coach me when going to f class competition.hed help me a lot and always great guy giving advice..oppsi guess i nit suppose to tell you haha.yup he already put it together with mpa stocks

Oh I know I talked to him yesterday on the phone, Erik is a stand up guy a around. He told me it was a different caliber than 6x47 lapua, I was the dealer who sold him the chassis.

 

[bjay]

Eriks bad ass mountaineer

 

[bjay]

Oh I know I talked to him yesterday on the phone, Erik is a stand up guy a around. He told me it was a different caliber than 6x47 lapua, I was the dealer who sold him the chassis.

Unless he's pulling legs lol..i dont think he going build shehane for his prs.but we know how much he love his 6x47

 

[earthquake]

.....thesethreads are more an exercise in validation and as a talisman to ward off buyer's remorse...

No thruther truth has ever been truthed!

 

[Tony1320]

View attachment 6914461
It does have integrated recoil lug..looks nice..im sure jim already coming out with everything integrated

That's not the one I'm thinking of I think that one is a blind pinned recoil lug like my BRM and that rail doesn't look integrated either

I think the one I'm thinking of is called a Mountaineer PRS last I heard anyway

 

[Tony1320]

Eriks bad ass mountaineerView attachment 6914500

Very nice, do you know what coating he has on the action?

 

[Tony1320]

I found this early drawing on Jim's facebook. This is what I was talking about multiflat action with integral lug but I was pretty sure it's gonna be available with integral rail too

 

[Birddog6424]

My PRS traveling partner won a 50% off cert to for a Curtis action at JC Steel in early May. Spoke to them once on the phone, then spent 5 weeks trying to get someone on the phone or to answer an email with a simple question. No responses. He sold the Cert for $350 on Monday.

He's trying to get a build from Straight Jacket Armory who told him essentially the same thing. He went from building bunches of rifles on Curtis actions, to not being able to get them. Even their sponsored shooter says he has a hard time reaching them. So not sure what's going on with Curtis.

So he's trying to decide between Lone Peak and Defiance now. I told him Defiance. The one I have on my 300 Norma is money.

 

[bjay]

My PRS traveling partner won a 50% off cert to for a Curtis action at JC Steel in early May. Spoke to them once on the phone, then spent 5 weeks trying to get someone on the phone or to answer an email with a simple question. No responses. He sold the Cert for $350 on Monday.

He's trying to get a build from Straight Jacket Armory who told him essentially the same thing. He went from building bunches of rifles on Curtis actions, to not being able to get them. Even their sponsored shooter says he has a hard time reaching them. So not sure what's going on with Curtis.

So he's trying to decide between Lone Peak and Defiance now. I told him Defiance. The one I have on my 300 Norma is money.

I also tried contacting chase Curtis directly trough FB messenger...no luck

 

[mustang-cars]

Ive called Curtis 2 or 3 times in the last month or two. I left a message and was always called back. I haven’t purchased anything from them I just had a few stupid questions. Just my experience lately.

 

[kthomas]

Impact or Lone Peak then. Try something new.

 

[B-P-UU]

What about Lone Peak? I'm in the same boat as you looking at the same actions and I keep hearing the Lone Peak is real nice

I use a Borden for FTR and it's excellent and I believe Jim is making a PRS action that would be interesting

Lone Peak Fuzion is great.. top tier. Flip a coin between Fuzion and Impact and go.. to me, fuzion is a touch better in terms of hanging up the bolt when all the way back.

My 5 year old can't get it to hang up when cycling the bolt.

 

[B-P-UU]

I don't understand the 60 degree draw.. you realize you are doing the same amount of mechanical "work" in a shorter distance right.. there is no free lunch. The only way to keep bolt lift from being higher than competitors is to decrease the K of the spring being used.

 

[ballistic1]

Bj, how about i text momma some pics of all your gear... and then she will
decide which nut you keep...

 

[bjay]

Bj, how about i text momma some pics of all your gear... and then she will
decide which nut you keep...

Lmao hussshhh...she said shes getting that feeling again...that im about to drop dough since im buying cheap milk,bread and meal again lol

 

[arm017]

I don't understand the 60 degree draw.. you realize you are doing the same amount of mechanical "work" in a shorter distance right.. there is no free lunch. The only way to keep bolt lift from being higher than competitors is to decrease the K of the spring being used.

But you know - it's got 'magggical' roller bearings.

 

[Fig]

It's not that. IMO the idea isn't for a lighter throw. Its a faster one. Once you get used to running a 60 a 90 feels like you're pulling the bolt knob all the way to China. A 60 deg was not even on my radar, nor would I have cared when ordering my last custom. It came with it and I shrugged, but after shooting it for six months (a lot) I am so used to 60 deg that my other rifles feel super long and ungainly next to it.

I don't compete in F Class, but I imagine that a 60 deg would be a big advantage when trying to get off as many shots as possible once the wind starts doing what you want it to. I've shot PRS with some good F class shooters, and when they get an impact they start ripping shots like they were running a gas gun. I have been mightily impressed a time or two.

 

[Birddog6424]

I run a Tempest on my PRS rifle, and I have to say that I do like the 60 degree throw, If you run it slow it's not smoother than a 90, run it quicker and it's very quick and easy. It does make 90 degree throw bolts feel funny.

Having said that, I don't think it's a huge time saver. I think the guy with a 90 degree that he is used to is just as fast as the 60. If I were to do it over again I would probably just buy another Defiance. I really like their actions and it would give me some uniformity across 3 of my rifles. I'm thinking for next season I'll probably do that.

 

[bjay]

VECTOR is now out!! Now what?

 

[nickw]

Maybe consider a Mausingfield? Has CRF plus a lot of other excellent design features. One of the few actions out there that is not just a "redesigned rem 700".

Out of the options you listed, I would go Impact. I would also consider a Lone Peak Fuzion.

You have a bunch of Defiances already - why not try something different? It's fun to Branch out, plus you get to discover different features that you may appreciate which are not on the Defiance.

The features of the Curtis Custom doesn't really do anything for me. 60° bolt throw is meh for me, and I think quick change barrels is just another failure point - would suck if that Allen screw came loose. I'll take a shouldered barrel with action wrench and barrel vice any day over a quick change unit.

I have a TacOps Rem700, a new DLC'ed Defiance Deviant, older Defiance Rebel, Mausingfield, had a TL3 for a hot minute and have a Lone Peak Fuzion on the way for the wife. I'm really impressed with the Mausingfield - it's a tier above the other actions, very well thought out and built. My gunsmith says I will be even more impressed with the Lone Peak Fuzion over the Mausingfield.

Also recommend Mausingfield. Just got my 1st and it’s pretty slick. Action is smooth and I’d have to say a bit smoother (specifically when pushing bolt forward and clambering a round) than my Surgeon which has a lot of cycles. Wanted to try a M for design features and ability to run a savage threaded prefit bbl or a shouldered bbl. Had Hunter Philips of HP Precision spin up a 6XC bbl for it and the Mullerworks 7T looks like it’s gunna be a hammer. Shots 7-11 in the pic through the new bbl during load dev.

 

[7mm08mate]

I shot two different Lone Peak Fuzions Sat along side a Defiance Deviant and I can honestly say the Lone Peak was smoother. The defiance was nice no doubt about it, but the nod went to lone peak. the first 5 rounds i cycled i had to check because It felt like it didn't pick up the round, it had.... the lone peak is supper smooth and solid.

On a side note, I use to be worried about the whole 90 degree through and being slow, until I started paying attention to the fact that a lot of the fastest guys are shooting 90 degree bolt throw actions. If you have a 60 degree throw but the slightly heavier bolt lift throws you off target and you have to find it again what time did the 60 degree save you? just a thought.