Rifle Scopes Deployment glass

[ARS031]

Hey guys,

I'm deploying and am equipping myself. In my military background, I have used a Schmidt and Bender PM II LP and a Unertle 10x. I have never had any issues with the SB, but am wanting to hear from those who have used other glass as well such as Nightforce and Premier. Am I good to stick with the SB, or in your personal experience has one of the above mention scopes out-performed the SB? As I will be spending my own money on my next scope, I want to make sure I am making the most sound choice.

 

[Luke]

Re: Deployment glass

In my opinion they're all great optics and it all comes down to what reticles or features you want on your scope. I am partial towards US Optics, but I don't think you can go wrong with any of the manufacturers you listed.

 

[700bdl]

Re: Deployment glass

IMPO a US optics SN-3 with a Horus H-25 reticle.Of course it depends on the weapon you are putting it on.Mine is on a 700P in .338 Lapua.absolutely love the combination.

 

[gstaylorg]

Re: Deployment glass

Nightforce may not be the absolute tops in the glass department (although very good IMO), but they are very rugged and reliable, which may be of some benefit for your intended use. Good luck with your search and let us know what you end up choosing.

 

[Advokaten]

Re: Deployment glass

Trained with a S&B, I think that you should stay with a S&B,

no reason to change now and yes I do belive the difference between a FFP scope and a SFP one,

really can be detrimental to a mans results while under pressure.

I have seen it at comps so why not in real life.

/Chris

 

[Longshot38]

Re: Deployment glass

Depends on what you are after. S&B, Premier, and Nightforce all make excellent scopes. I own a Premier and that thing is built like a tank and the glass is nothing shy of awesome. Also the company offers excellent support. I have been behind Nightforce a couple times and they are solid scopes and have good glass but nothing on par with the Premier. On the other hand I don't have experience with S&B but they have certainly earned their reputation and you can buy with confidence.

As for what I like about Premier. For starters the reticle. I really like the Gen II XR in the 5-25x56 model. Also the illumination system is really nice I like how it is integrated into the turret system. I also like the tool-less turret design.

 

[1kHIT]

Re: Deployment glass

As a side to this discussion - if you are in fact deploying, doesn't that imply with a military? Why are you having to provide your own equipment? I've not heard of this before?

 

[ARS031]

Re: Deployment glass

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1kHIT</div><div class="ubbcode-body">As a side to this discussion - if you are in fact deploying, doesn't that imply with a military? Why are you having to provide your own equipment? I've not heard of this before?
</div></div>

If you would like to have a side discussion, feel free to message me and I will discuss what is relevant.

 

[ARS031]

Re: Deployment glass

I appreciate all input so far.

Glass quality is high on my priority list while durability is not as important. I don't want to sacrifice optical clarity for ruggedness but I do need something in line with the above scopes mentioned.

Thanks for sharing that you found the glass on the premier was better than that of the nightforce.

 

[chittnp]

Re: Deployment glass

I'm currently deployed, and my unit opted out of issuing optics, so I bought my own Aimpoint T-1. My last tour, I had feeding issues due to worn out magazine springs, now I use my own P-mags. I also bought all my own "web gear" to carry the suff I know Ill need on patrol. last deployment I had an issued set of Peltor's, this time I had to bring my own. Some units get the good stuff, some units dont. sometimes it's the luck of the draw, sometimes it's a chain of command that doesnt see the need for it. It is more common than yo umight think for deployed soldiers to buy their own equipment.

 

[EventHorizon]

Re: Deployment glass

depending on the mag range and your need to glass with your scope you should be aware that at the lower mag ranges on a 5-25 S&B the FOV is smaller than those on a Premier or Hensoldt.

For the best, most rapid sight picture, IMHO nothing comes close to a Hensoldt. Very forgiving in the vertical and horizontal plane - meaning you don't have to be dead centre behind the optic to get a good picture. Don't know if it's a consideration for you but Hensoldt scopes are much more compact and lighter than the S&B and Premiers.

The plus on the S&B side is the variety of reticles you can choose.

Hope the above was of some help. Thanks for your service and be well.

Good luck.

 

[BCP]

Re: Deployment glass

If you're familiar with the S&B that is what you should take (assuming you can afford it). There was a gentleman selling a 3-12 FFP S&B here in the classifieds for 2k and another guy selling 4-16 FFP single turn models for 2400 I think it was. Not sure if they are still there but might be worth checking out. Do you have all the necessary rings and mounts for whatever rifle it's going on? I think the S&B is 34mm.

Just out of curiosity what rifle is this going on?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1kHIT</div><div class="ubbcode-body">As a side to this discussion - if you are in fact deploying, doesn't that imply with a military? Why are you having to provide your own equipment? I've not heard of this before?
</div></div>

Pretty common actually. I have a couple family members who are deployed and have sent all sorts of different things to them. Never a riflescope though.

 

[Rob01]

Re: Deployment glass

If you are still military and want to get the military pricing for any S&B scope drop me a PM and i can provide you the contact info of the S&B LE/Mil rep to purchase the scope as well.

If you are happy and accustomed to S&B then by all means stay with them. You can't go wrong with an S&B scope.

 

[Gunn-Fighter]

Re: Deployment glass

I ve never purchased my own optic to deploy with, But personal items I have. My commander will let you add to your weapon but never take away. You cant switch out parts but you could add a pmag of vert grip. Alot of other units are the same

 

[BX1129]

Re: Deployment glass

You can get your chain of command to put in an operational need statement for optic you use in combat. But I have to ask, what weapon are you putting your optic on? If it's a M110/M24/M40, it comes with optics as a deployment kit.

 

[stefan73]

Re: Deployment glass

Doing an ONS takes time and money is getting short! Its not like the heydays of Iraq over here in the Ghan.
My first tour in Iraq I bought an optic for my M4 which was a vast improvement over the M68 that they tried to issue me.
Many of our DSM rifles didn't have optics. What optics were left from previous units on many occasions as TPE were damaged, beat up.
Having a good optic is nice.
I'm currently in the hunt for an optic but debating between USO, Nightforce and S&B which is all dependent on cost.


There has been plenty of soldiers buying lots of stuff for deployments. Going on deployment has always been expensive! Hell, I only have a couple of uniforms, my vest, helmet and some other small items since my RFI issue of uniforms never showed up before I deployed and still hasn't shown up. So I'm living in a mix and match of various sized uniforms that a supply guy was able to scrounge up. I'll tell you that it is going to be a very miserable, cold winter if my issue doesn't get here shortly!

 

[BX1129]

Re: Deployment glass

Stef, which unit are you in? That's just jacked up. Guys going on PDSS are supposed to ID the TPE shortfalls and address them when they get back. But I guess the days of unlimited $$$$ are gone..... The only time we had trouble with RFI is when we switched from multicam..... it was a goat fuck.

 

[stefan73]

Re: Deployment glass

Its not the units fault! They came in before me (I deployed 2 months late as a result of being assigned at the end of CGSC). The unit was handed a bunch of stuff! Most of which people had not seen before a result of the short timeline for the ARFORGEN cycle that this unit has been in. They have been running since they were last extended in Baghdad in 06. The problem doesn't just apply to here and this unit because I have seen it before in many, many instances.
The problem here it expanded with the economy of force or at least the impression of that in what had been dubbed the "forgotten war" since 2003 which is when Afghanistan earned that title. The money was funneled to Iraq and not so to Afghanistan or that is at least the appearance. The problems with the PDSS is that you have a limited amount of time to get an operational picture of the AO. Add in everything else involved in a PDSS and time does not necessarily support a good picture especially when the unit you are replacing does not have a firm grasp on their property which appears to have been the case.

We continue to work through it but it can be expensive. I spent probably about $2000 for my first deployment to take care of my guys. I bought repair parts, tools, an optic, and other wonderful crap. I didn't need all that stuff but a good majority of it came in handy to include the optic which now rests in my gun safe and was well worth the cost, however I'm not sure how excited Mahdi Militia was about me with it.

This deployment, I deployed here with two uniforms all of which were the wrong size. I'm a skinny guy so something with the sizes I was given looks like I'm covered in a parachute. Its not the units fault that my RFI never arrived and we are trying to work through it but if it doesn't arrive before winter it is going to be a very long and miserable tour!!!

 

[stefan73]

Re: Deployment glass

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BX1129</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Stef, which unit are you in? That's just jacked up. Guys going on PDSS are supposed to ID the TPE shortfalls and address them when they get back. But I guess the days of unlimited $$$$ are gone..... The only time we had trouble with RFI is when we switched from multicam..... it was a goat fuck. </div></div>
The money is gone and it looks like the Army is looking to ID soldiers for future release already. Problems back home have many soldiers worried about their careers with all the talk about taking away our retirements, reduction of forces etc etc etc.

 

[Flyingbullseye]

Re: Deployment glass

For those serving or have served do you have to use everything issued to you or can you purchase something private to replace it such as a scope? Say you're a DM or sniper and you're issued a leupold but have used a Premier or S&B and would rather have that. Are you allowed to use your own money to upgrade? Kind of curious, trying to stay somewhat on topic.

 

[buffybuster]

Re: Deployment glass

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ARS031</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I appreciate all input so far.

Glass quality is high on my priority list while <span style="font-weight: bold">durability is not as important</span>. I don't want to sacrifice optical clarity for ruggedness but I do need something in line with the above scopes mentioned.

Thanks for sharing that you found the glass on the premier was better than that of the nightforce.
</div></div>

Really?

 

[stefan73]

Re: Deployment glass

Depends on your chain of command. Some don't have problems with it and some do, but most don't have an issue.
It is perfectly legal to use your own optic!
I can legally place any optic I would like on my weapon system since it is not modifying the weapon to cause undue injury/harm.

 

[mlh29]

Re: Deployment glass

I wanted to chime in earlier.. Unsure of weapon type or what your role is.
I am Active Duty US Army, currently on my 5th tour in OEF . I have used all military issued optics for carbine( m68, acog, revised m68, newer version of acog and in a pinch a elcan, used a 10x,3.5x10 and 4.5x15 mk 4 on my dmr's when assigned to that role.

I do not like the aimpoints or acogs for most use. I have had good luck with an eotech 552 and a leupold 1.5 x5(older vari x 111 30mm illuminated reticle in a 1 pc mount)on my m4. With the eotech being AA powered I never had to search the supply for a battery when needed. however the s6 usually has all batterie sneeded in my unit( a plus as the leupold shares batts with the aimpoints)

Most commands will allow optic substitutions. Hard part is getting range time/ space to get them zeroed. Dont go cheap on optics reliabilty/repeatability are a must( always see NG and other units with barska / inset arbage optic here at ranges here and they cant zero etc), use reliable mounts( I like arms, rra one piece qd styles). Make sure you get your optics annotated with your command( eotechs, acogs, aimpoints, leupolds in 10x, 3.5x10, 4.5x14 are all in the supply system) Keep your receipts for proof of purchase.. Lost an acog that way in 06.. new COC weapons reset etc, during command inventories I was on leave and they found an extra acog in arms room, had it added to property books.. just went down hill form there..

Also, if you are spending your cash on this be prepared for a new optic to come home looking like crap after a yr of in /out of trucks, patrols etc.. Get scope caps or a gc&g cover if you have an eotech.. cheap insurance.

Lastly good luck come home safe.

 

[ARS031]

Re: Deployment glass

Thanks for the input. I did end up deciding to go with a Schmidt and Bender. It will be going on a gas gun.

Regarding the remark about durability, none of the glass I listed is questionable as far as it's ability to take a beating is concerned. So one being more durable than the other was not a major factor in my decision process.

Having never seen or heard much about a Hensoldt, given my fairly short time frame, I will have to try one when I get back.

If I missed answering someone's question I appologise, I have limited access to the Internet.

Again, thanks for taking the time to write your opinions.