JARD is coming out with an aftermarket MDR match grade trigger that we played with that is very nice for precision work.
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Desert Tech MDR Opinions?
- Thread starter Tritanium
- Start date
JARD is coming out with an aftermarket MDR match grade trigger that we played with that is very nice for precision work.
I'd love to sbr this thing if you guys would sell those mdr-c handguards and a 10 inch 223 barrel...
I had one...wanted to love it because I have owned and loved their bolt gun for years...but it was wildly unreliable and I ditched it in an optic trade pretty fast
Bench
Bench
The 2019 upgraded MDR's are 100% reliable now. We had initial issues with the gas system and extractor, both were remedied at the first of this year and all prior purchasers can send their MDR's in for the 2019 upgrades for free. It was a frustrating thing for everyone but we worked very fast to get on top of it and fix it.
You worked fast to get on top of it AFTER the issues became very public with InRange and Garand Thumb's videos. Early adopters were having the same issues since late 2017 but were told we were just trying to shoot "crap ammo".
It does actually seem better now after some of the changes we've been calling for for a while.
I juat got my mdr and it sure seems to want to shoot well with reman 150 grain fmj and 168 bthp ammo i am getting 1-1.25” groups at 100 yards with a 1-4 viper pst. So that is exciting and it has been very reliable so far. Only issue i have is it is definitely very gassy with a suppressor which aint a big deal and the main thing mine has wrong is the back pin walks out after just a few shots. Is this problem remedied in the 2019 upgrades? Definitely something i want to get fixed. Mine has a 6 position gas plug but it still needs all the other 2019 updates.
The gassiness is not fixed with 2019.
The pin walk isn't long-term fixed with the 2019 upgrades. Lots of people still waiting on that and a fix for the potential breakages in that rear pin area.
The pin walk isn't long-term fixed with the 2019 upgrades. Lots of people still waiting on that and a fix for the potential breakages in that rear pin area.
FWIW (which is not much, I admit), my '19 production MDR doesn't exhibit the pin walk as described. I have not yet fired it with a can installed (or rapid fired it), so I cannot comment on the gas issue.
Pretty much. I still think it extracts too early which with a can especially ends with more blowback from the chamber.
The pin walking issue seems sporadic. Mine did initially until the frame cracked and then it stopped. The new frame rails have an elongated hole so that the stress goes into the aluminum receiver instead. I'm not sure that it's a very good "fix".
How are these new MDRs functioning? Worth buying or still to be avoided. Really like the idea of a 308 bull pup. Being a lefty, the ease of switching sides is appealing
I have a '19 model, and it runs pretty well. Early on, there were a few minor issues with FTE/FTF, but nothing that required tools to clear. The user manual mentions a break-in period for a reason.
The round count at the moment is right around 100, and the last 60+ have been problem free. If I had it to do over again, I'd absolutely make the same decision. I know that a lot of folks have had a variety of issues, but my experience so far has been pretty good... so while I am keeping an eye out for some of the "known" problems, I'm also optimistic about the rifle and its usefulness for me.
Have you tested accuracy? If so, what kind of MOA are you seeing. Thinking about it for a pig hunting rifle.
Off of a bench/sandbags, I have been seeing average groups around 1.5 MOA or a little larger, but the last two groups I shot (with the same ammo) using a different technique (nestling the gun in the "V" of the sandbags, pulling the bags back hard with my off hand while shoving the rifle forward against them with my shoulder) were just below MOA and .62 MOA. I am fully prepared to admit that the .62 MOA group may have been a "planets in alignment" kind of thing, but I would tend to believe that further use of that technique will likely keep me around 1 MOA or perhaps even slightly better.
For a pig gun, I'd think that it'd be plenty accurate unless you're trying to hit them 250+ yards out. If people can hunt them with AKs/SKSs (and plenty do), then an MDR is certainly accurate enough.
Thanks! Trying to decide between this or building a small AR10. Me being a lefty And it’s small size makes this Very appealing
Mine is surprisingly accurate. Im shooting consistent 1.5” 3shot groups at 100 with 150fmj reman freedom munitions stuff. With a 1-4 power scope. Definitely happy.
The jard trigger is pretty decent. It's magnificent compared to the stock junk. After the latest gas valve and extractor mine hasn't ripped anymore rims off but has still had some sporadic FTE's. It still seems like it's just a finicky operating system. I had hoped by now that I could trust it but I don't.
It does show decent potential for accuracy. I'd say consistent 1.5 moa but 1moa doesn't seem uncommon.
Eta: If I could get my money back from it I'd probably look into a pof revolution or build up another Mars mws with the m-lock upper and a lw barrel.
It does show decent potential for accuracy. I'd say consistent 1.5 moa but 1moa doesn't seem uncommon.
Eta: If I could get my money back from it I'd probably look into a pof revolution or build up another Mars mws with the m-lock upper and a lw barrel.
I am glad I found this thread, I was literally headed to the gun store to pick up a MDR today. After reading this thread I am really taken back by all the issues, especially considering that this rifle is being advertised as a battle rifle not a competition toy.
Freaking hate it honestly it is such a killer idea, for the price of this firearm and its issues they should upgrade the MDR to the MDRX features especially the upgraded plastic
Freaking hate it honestly it is such a killer idea, for the price of this firearm and its issues they should upgrade the MDR to the MDRX features especially the upgraded plastic
I took my MDRX to the range for the 2nd time today.
until I'm approaching 1000 rounds I'll reserve judgement.
from an ergonomic & engineering standard there isn't anything else on the market. it reminds me of what an Aug would be if it was updated for 2020. my experience hasn't been snag free, but all of the issues I that made me hesitant to purchase one have proved to be moot.
until I'm approaching 1000 rounds I'll reserve judgement.
from an ergonomic & engineering standard there isn't anything else on the market. it reminds me of what an Aug would be if it was updated for 2020. my experience hasn't been snag free, but all of the issues I that made me hesitant to purchase one have proved to be moot.
If you don't mind me asking what issues have you had? Just wanting to know what the new models are doing. I do agree the thing is awesome with a lot of features that really make it unique
at this point I'm going to chalk my my issues to user error and not understanding the platform fully from a routine maintenance/lubrication/reassembly perspective. I've had exactly zero FTE/FTF/case ripping issues. recoil feels similar to my Aug, though it is about a pound heavier.
initial accuracy is fine, though I really haven't tested this yet. I'm running an Aimpoint PRO now. while the PRO is a quality red dot, with my eyes (astigmatism) they aren't great for making tiny groups. Once I have a LVPO mounted and I figure out a rest/bipod setup I'll report back. oh, and I'll swap out some 77 gr imi razorcore or FGM for the bulk 55 gr ball.
thehun, you aren't wrong. for the cost of the MDR I would think a 4150 or high quality stainless barrel should be included.
but, I've got ARs with thousands of rounds that are still sufficiently accurate with 4140 barrels... the barrel is a part of the system that will be replaced and I'm more interested in the mechanics/design of the MDR. If we aren't willing to stretch ourselves for a new platform all we'll ever get is AR15s. (I'm not bashing ARs, I just want some variety in my gun safe)
initial accuracy is fine, though I really haven't tested this yet. I'm running an Aimpoint PRO now. while the PRO is a quality red dot, with my eyes (astigmatism) they aren't great for making tiny groups. Once I have a LVPO mounted and I figure out a rest/bipod setup I'll report back. oh, and I'll swap out some 77 gr imi razorcore or FGM for the bulk 55 gr ball.
thehun, you aren't wrong. for the cost of the MDR I would think a 4150 or high quality stainless barrel should be included.
but, I've got ARs with thousands of rounds that are still sufficiently accurate with 4140 barrels... the barrel is a part of the system that will be replaced and I'm more interested in the mechanics/design of the MDR. If we aren't willing to stretch ourselves for a new platform all we'll ever get is AR15s. (I'm not bashing ARs, I just want some variety in my gun safe)
I have no problem with the 4140 button rifled barrel in theory. The reality is a bit different though. My MDR had rings all the way down the bore from poor reaming so it wasn't a problem with the material or the rifling process but with the quality of the work. My 308 barrel sucked. I sent the rifle back and what they did was fire about 500rds through it to "fix" it. I could have wasted that much ammo too but chose not to. It shouldn't have been an issue. They should have replaced the barrel right then. As nice as the barrels for the SRS and HTI are why are they cheaping out on the MDR? There is absolutely no excuse for that.
I pulled the extension and gas block off my piece of crap 308 barrel and made a 6.5X47 barrel for a friends MDR. It now shoots sub MOA. He had a first round hit cold bore at 1000yds in South Dakota with it last summer using Lapua factory ammo. After a couple of us had a few trys and managed to hit the target at 1000 yds he took the rifle again and nailed the target 2 more times to prove it wasn't a fluke. He shoots it at home with his own load and easily sub MOA.
So with the " piece of crap" button rifled blank I used to build the 6.5X47 barrel we got sub MOA along with reliable feed (after mods to the extension and ejection port) I later built a couple more barrels for the MDRs in 6.5X47 and 338 BR. Surprise of surprises, sub MOA. The 338BR barrels have gasblocks I built myself as they needed larger diameter pistons to operate subsonic and they work well. Still tells me that they screwed something up on the factory rifles and then wanted us to send them back for repairs. Still waiting for my 6 position gas port plug. Not sending my rifle back to them again.
I spoke with the guys at the shot show in January and was told I just needed to contact the warranty guy and he'd get me setup to fix my rifle and they'd take care of my customers too. So far after a few emails and phone messages I've had no contact with DT at all. They never call back and don't answer emails. I love the SRS and the HTI. Top notch and great rifles. The MDR, not so much. The company however has really dropped the ball and until they fix it I'm telling customers to look elsewhere. I don't want to have to fix the rifles and I know DT won't.
Just my thoughts based on my experience. Some of you may have had better results.
Frank
I pulled the extension and gas block off my piece of crap 308 barrel and made a 6.5X47 barrel for a friends MDR. It now shoots sub MOA. He had a first round hit cold bore at 1000yds in South Dakota with it last summer using Lapua factory ammo. After a couple of us had a few trys and managed to hit the target at 1000 yds he took the rifle again and nailed the target 2 more times to prove it wasn't a fluke. He shoots it at home with his own load and easily sub MOA.
So with the " piece of crap" button rifled blank I used to build the 6.5X47 barrel we got sub MOA along with reliable feed (after mods to the extension and ejection port) I later built a couple more barrels for the MDRs in 6.5X47 and 338 BR. Surprise of surprises, sub MOA. The 338BR barrels have gasblocks I built myself as they needed larger diameter pistons to operate subsonic and they work well. Still tells me that they screwed something up on the factory rifles and then wanted us to send them back for repairs. Still waiting for my 6 position gas port plug. Not sending my rifle back to them again.
I spoke with the guys at the shot show in January and was told I just needed to contact the warranty guy and he'd get me setup to fix my rifle and they'd take care of my customers too. So far after a few emails and phone messages I've had no contact with DT at all. They never call back and don't answer emails. I love the SRS and the HTI. Top notch and great rifles. The MDR, not so much. The company however has really dropped the ball and until they fix it I'm telling customers to look elsewhere. I don't want to have to fix the rifles and I know DT won't.
Just my thoughts based on my experience. Some of you may have had better results.
Frank
You can make a quality 4140 barrel that wasn't my point...my point was at this price point...DT should have spec'd a better, higher quality steel in their guns...
As far the their CS, its a revolving door from what I gathered... they fired their best CS person, Meghan, several months back...pretty much if you wanted to get things done on your MDR, you would need to be part of the MDR owner's group on FB, post and Meghan would get back to you...the official means of getting contact wasn't working since 2017 to late 2019...not sure how the new person is handling CS now but I do know they created their own warranty group on FB...
My hope is one day (which is when I will give it a go), they will upgrade the system to extend the gas system from a carbine to mid-length (at least for the .308), upgrade to a better barrel quality (I refuse to pay the money they are charging for a 4140 barrel...call me a snob but I expect more at this price range) and offer a .308 in side eject (the forward eject introduces too many friction and unnecessary parts in the action in my opinion). I literally cannot stand how the .308 feels in the MDR...their 5.56 is much better. Hope they can continue and innovate...I do believe the MDR is one feature packed rifle that could have a great future. Time will tell.
As far the their CS, its a revolving door from what I gathered... they fired their best CS person, Meghan, several months back...pretty much if you wanted to get things done on your MDR, you would need to be part of the MDR owner's group on FB, post and Meghan would get back to you...the official means of getting contact wasn't working since 2017 to late 2019...not sure how the new person is handling CS now but I do know they created their own warranty group on FB...
My hope is one day (which is when I will give it a go), they will upgrade the system to extend the gas system from a carbine to mid-length (at least for the .308), upgrade to a better barrel quality (I refuse to pay the money they are charging for a 4140 barrel...call me a snob but I expect more at this price range) and offer a .308 in side eject (the forward eject introduces too many friction and unnecessary parts in the action in my opinion). I literally cannot stand how the .308 feels in the MDR...their 5.56 is much better. Hope they can continue and innovate...I do believe the MDR is one feature packed rifle that could have a great future. Time will tell.
Since I don't and never will use facebook for anything I guess I'm excluded. I'm not alone either. If they can't work with customers who don't use facebook it tells me something is seriously wrong. Maybe its a good means of getting to the masses but its not the only way. If I told my customers I wouldn't answer the phone or reply to emails because I only work through facebook I would expect to lose a lot of customers. They should too.
It is a simple thing to make any MDR a side eject, take out the ejection port cover. I did it with my 308 to remove one more variable when I was having trouble. It kicks the empties about 30 feet with the standard gas system, at least it does when the cases don't stick in the chamber or have their rims ripped off. It does add to the problems with the overgassed system because it takes a lot of energy to jam the empty into the cover. The retaining lug they put in the cover is also a problem because of the sharp edges. I got the 6.5X47 barrel working great with the cover removed using a smaller gas port than I had to use with the cover installed. The same was true for the 338BR barrel. The gas ports had to be about 30% larger to operate the forward eject system. I also had to remove the lug and polish all the sharp edges, make sure it actually fit properly on the pivot pin and oil it. It worked much better after that and quit leaving gouges and grooves in the cases. Guys shooting lapua brass get a little pissy when their $1.25 cases get damaged by the ejection system. By taking off the cover you can turn the gasport plug down to the smallest port on the 6 port and have some hope of it working. It doesn't pitch the brass as far or dent it either. From what they told me at SHOT about the MDRX they don't do the forward eject on it. Good move. It is cool to have all your brass dropped right in front of you but not if it makes the gun screw up.
I will agree that they had some neat ideas and the rifles could be pretty cool. I like the bullpups and its why I have one. As you noted though, for the money I shouldn't have to rework and re-engineer the system. I bought this specific rifle so that I had some real caliber choices. If I'd wanted a 22 I could have had an AUG or TAVOR for a lot less and I know they work. I have no interest at all in the 223 so haven't even fooled with it. On the other hand I now have a rifle that will shoot the sub or supersonic 338BR and the 6.5X47 reliably and I'm pretty happy with it. Just not happy with having to fix a lot of other issues that shouldn't have been there.
Frank
It is a simple thing to make any MDR a side eject, take out the ejection port cover. I did it with my 308 to remove one more variable when I was having trouble. It kicks the empties about 30 feet with the standard gas system, at least it does when the cases don't stick in the chamber or have their rims ripped off. It does add to the problems with the overgassed system because it takes a lot of energy to jam the empty into the cover. The retaining lug they put in the cover is also a problem because of the sharp edges. I got the 6.5X47 barrel working great with the cover removed using a smaller gas port than I had to use with the cover installed. The same was true for the 338BR barrel. The gas ports had to be about 30% larger to operate the forward eject system. I also had to remove the lug and polish all the sharp edges, make sure it actually fit properly on the pivot pin and oil it. It worked much better after that and quit leaving gouges and grooves in the cases. Guys shooting lapua brass get a little pissy when their $1.25 cases get damaged by the ejection system. By taking off the cover you can turn the gasport plug down to the smallest port on the 6 port and have some hope of it working. It doesn't pitch the brass as far or dent it either. From what they told me at SHOT about the MDRX they don't do the forward eject on it. Good move. It is cool to have all your brass dropped right in front of you but not if it makes the gun screw up.
I will agree that they had some neat ideas and the rifles could be pretty cool. I like the bullpups and its why I have one. As you noted though, for the money I shouldn't have to rework and re-engineer the system. I bought this specific rifle so that I had some real caliber choices. If I'd wanted a 22 I could have had an AUG or TAVOR for a lot less and I know they work. I have no interest at all in the 223 so haven't even fooled with it. On the other hand I now have a rifle that will shoot the sub or supersonic 338BR and the 6.5X47 reliably and I'm pretty happy with it. Just not happy with having to fix a lot of other issues that shouldn't have been there.
Frank
MDRX still has forward eject and they have a sub model called MDRX SE for side eject only .223/300bo.
Fairly new to the forum, but long time lurker. I thought I would share my experience with the MDR for people who are looking at them now. I'm going to try to be detailed but keep this as succinct as possible.
I pre ordered the MDR in 308 in 2016 as a deployment gift to myself. I got the rifle at the end of May in 2018, a little over 2 years after I ordered it. Throughout the time I've had the rifle I experienced basically every problem you could have with the rifle, and every fix. I currently have a little over 1700 rounds through the rifle.
When I first got the rifle I had a a failure to extract with a ripped rim approx every 50 rounds, sometimes more with different ammunition. I primarily shot PMC 147 and the PPU match that I bought specifically to break in the rifle. I had a failure to eject about every 20 rounds due to short stroking. Removing the chute remedied those failures, but not the ripped rims. I received the first 6 position gas block and that solved a lot of my issues. I had a ripped rim about every 150 rounds, and a failure to eject much less frequently for about 500 rounds, then I got the 2019 gas block and the extractor upgrade. The barrel went back to the factory for that. I had zero ripped rims after that upgrade, and no other failures for about 500 rounds. Throughout owning the rifle I had a constant issue of the rear takedown pin working its way out just a little bit while firing. It would only be about 1/8" out of the receiver but that was enough to notice and the pin would not support where it needed to. When I received the barrel back they sent a new retaining pin for the takedown pin and a new takedown pin. The issue with the retaining pin continued to a lesser extent.
After about another 250 rounds I noticed the part of the rail the takedown pin was held in on the right side had a small crack forming along the bottom edge. I believe the takedown pin walking out was associated with the stout recoil, and the damage was caused by firing while the retaining pin had walked out. I let Desert Tech know and they paid shipping for the rifle to go back to the factory.
When I received the rifle back I took it out to test it and it was completely different experience. The recoil was noticeably softer, the rifle ejected through the chute with more authority, and the rims lacked any sign of puling. This indicated to me that the timing in the gas system had been improved. Unfortunately America's oldest war required more of my time so I will have to wait on more testing till later this year.
Accuracy throughout has been good, as I expected for what the rifle was designed for. Using a Trijicon 1-8 my 10 round groups averaged about 1.5 MOA, and 20 rounds would be 2 MOA to a hair over. That accuracy held at distance, and 750m hits on 2/3 sized silhouettes were consistent. With the profile of the barrel I saw the groups open up after 6 or 7 rounds and peak at about 20 rounds. I regularly shot strings of 40 to 75 rounds. I didn't notice and appreciable POI shift , just groups opening up. Shooting 1 MOA with short strings of 3 to 5 isn't too difficult, but since I primarily shoot long strings at steel from 450m to 950m I don't see a lot of merit in making that claim. With a TA11 the rifle is significantly lighter, but I'm only able to get about 2 MOA, but I'm sure there are people who could do better with that optic.
I have been pleased with the rifle even through all of the updates and changes. I'm sure DT will continue to improve the rifle and I have ordered an MDRX in 6.5 that I intend to wear out. I think if the M16 came out in todays age with the amount of scrutiny manufacturers get I can't imagine it would go over well. People are quick to scrutinize and expect perfection, yet most are not designing rifles or investing in manufacturing. There are certainly things that the company should have and can do better, but it is very apparent that they are willing to make it right. I have not had any issues getting ahold of their warranty department, even from Afghanistan. I've talked to Nick directly, as well as a lot of their staff, and in my opinion they are doing a good job of standing behind their product. I'll continue to shoot it, and if it has issues I'll send it in under warranty. Hopefully this is helpful for people looking for info. I have had my fair share of frustration, but I choose to try to help remedy the issues. As long as the company is backing their product I'll support them.
I pre ordered the MDR in 308 in 2016 as a deployment gift to myself. I got the rifle at the end of May in 2018, a little over 2 years after I ordered it. Throughout the time I've had the rifle I experienced basically every problem you could have with the rifle, and every fix. I currently have a little over 1700 rounds through the rifle.
When I first got the rifle I had a a failure to extract with a ripped rim approx every 50 rounds, sometimes more with different ammunition. I primarily shot PMC 147 and the PPU match that I bought specifically to break in the rifle. I had a failure to eject about every 20 rounds due to short stroking. Removing the chute remedied those failures, but not the ripped rims. I received the first 6 position gas block and that solved a lot of my issues. I had a ripped rim about every 150 rounds, and a failure to eject much less frequently for about 500 rounds, then I got the 2019 gas block and the extractor upgrade. The barrel went back to the factory for that. I had zero ripped rims after that upgrade, and no other failures for about 500 rounds. Throughout owning the rifle I had a constant issue of the rear takedown pin working its way out just a little bit while firing. It would only be about 1/8" out of the receiver but that was enough to notice and the pin would not support where it needed to. When I received the barrel back they sent a new retaining pin for the takedown pin and a new takedown pin. The issue with the retaining pin continued to a lesser extent.
After about another 250 rounds I noticed the part of the rail the takedown pin was held in on the right side had a small crack forming along the bottom edge. I believe the takedown pin walking out was associated with the stout recoil, and the damage was caused by firing while the retaining pin had walked out. I let Desert Tech know and they paid shipping for the rifle to go back to the factory.
When I received the rifle back I took it out to test it and it was completely different experience. The recoil was noticeably softer, the rifle ejected through the chute with more authority, and the rims lacked any sign of puling. This indicated to me that the timing in the gas system had been improved. Unfortunately America's oldest war required more of my time so I will have to wait on more testing till later this year.
Accuracy throughout has been good, as I expected for what the rifle was designed for. Using a Trijicon 1-8 my 10 round groups averaged about 1.5 MOA, and 20 rounds would be 2 MOA to a hair over. That accuracy held at distance, and 750m hits on 2/3 sized silhouettes were consistent. With the profile of the barrel I saw the groups open up after 6 or 7 rounds and peak at about 20 rounds. I regularly shot strings of 40 to 75 rounds. I didn't notice and appreciable POI shift , just groups opening up. Shooting 1 MOA with short strings of 3 to 5 isn't too difficult, but since I primarily shoot long strings at steel from 450m to 950m I don't see a lot of merit in making that claim. With a TA11 the rifle is significantly lighter, but I'm only able to get about 2 MOA, but I'm sure there are people who could do better with that optic.
I have been pleased with the rifle even through all of the updates and changes. I'm sure DT will continue to improve the rifle and I have ordered an MDRX in 6.5 that I intend to wear out. I think if the M16 came out in todays age with the amount of scrutiny manufacturers get I can't imagine it would go over well. People are quick to scrutinize and expect perfection, yet most are not designing rifles or investing in manufacturing. There are certainly things that the company should have and can do better, but it is very apparent that they are willing to make it right. I have not had any issues getting ahold of their warranty department, even from Afghanistan. I've talked to Nick directly, as well as a lot of their staff, and in my opinion they are doing a good job of standing behind their product. I'll continue to shoot it, and if it has issues I'll send it in under warranty. Hopefully this is helpful for people looking for info. I have had my fair share of frustration, but I choose to try to help remedy the issues. As long as the company is backing their product I'll support them.
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you have the patience of a saint. Unfortunately most of us don't. Especially when you have a lot of guns/projects to work on. I don't have the time nor inclination to buy guns with issues, especially when I am buying a new gun.
Also, while I can appreciate your relationship with Nick, his behavior on the forums, and not taking responsibility for most of the issues over the years(blaming suppliers, and flat out denying), makes it hard to trust the man. He ended up getting flamed so hard on those forums, that he did the smart thing, and disappeared. He kept digging himself deeper in a hole.
Overall, I think the MDR has potential. I hope they do make something great out of it, but I feel like they are at a disadvantage with DT on the machining and decision making.
I definitely dealt with my fair share of disappointment and frustration throughout the whole ordeal, but I also understand that there is way more that goes into it than we know. I've got a good friend who's a smaller manufacturer that I do a good bit of testing for. He deals with a lot of delays, especially when he puts in a larger order with barrel manufacturers. Seeing how much tinkering it takes to get designs that are decades old to function properly gave me an appreciation for doing something new.
I wouldn't say I have a relationship with him necessarily, I just talked to him directly a few times for a while. I've read through his responses on the forums, and I think some of the bad rap is undeserved, and some of it is. One thing the internet is good at is bringing out people with very strong opinions based off very limited information. Especially when it comes to the hypothetical and being "combat ready". That's a very polarizing thing for some reason. I try to avoid getting emotional and just rely on facts and performance, and really that's all I want to do here is share my experience with it.
I have no doubt DT faced a ton of issues with the things they claimed, and I think a lot of people took their optimism as lies. In hindsight the right thing to do would be what they did with the MDRX, not say a word until it's ready to ship. I think in their case they needed an investment, were excited about their product, and when delays happened they tried to be as positive and optimistic and those things just don't translate well. Of course, that is my opinion, and if they were dishonest I think that is a poor business practice and I don't support it. I've been following this rifle since it was first announced and I am not aware of any direct lies. There's a difference between them lying, and them being wrong. Maybe they were aware the delays were more substantial than they let on, but I'm not going to make any claims unless I have factual evidence. I don't think their intent was to have customers be beta testers, I think they woefully underestimated the amount of variables in ammunition and conditions the rifles ended up in. Some of the things I do take issue with are promising parts to places like ES Tactical for barrels they're building and then delaying those parts to finish rifles in the factory. I think there are some significant improvements to be made in QC as well.
I am biased, I have always wanted to like this rifle, and I've always wanted it to be what it was supposed to. At this point I believe it is. As the SE line expands I may compare the FE and SE in 308 if that ever happens. I feel you with having too many projects. In the MDR time frame I assembled half a dozen large frame semi autos. There were lot's of issues I found in common with those, especially the 6.5 CM. I had several cases in my AR pattern 308's where the extractor nearly pulled through the rim, but since they only got close and still functioned I didn't notice till I was doing brass prep. I had a 6.5 CM barrel that was a turd from the day I got it, and that was my introduction the the caliber. Ended up getting it replaced and all the issues went away, and I ended up with a barrel that shoots better than I do. I actually had my issued M4 pull through a case rim on the qual I did prior to heading out, and its one of the upgraded ones made by FN. They're machines, and eventually they all encounter issues, which is why you practice for the day they do.
I agree with the potential of the rifle, but I think in order for that to happen people need to take a chance on it. To me it's worth it for the features, which there is no equal on the market. Imagine the price of a SCAR that could swap calibers without the reciprocating charging handle.
I'm interested in hearing from those that have purchased the New MDRX rifles.
I've seen reports that they still haven't ironed out all the bugs with the magazine release. But other then that, mostly positive reports.
I've seen reports that they still haven't ironed out all the bugs with the magazine release. But other then that, mostly positive reports.
Mine has been mostly ok since I started shooting a bunch of federal 180gr sp. Sico hybrid suppressor needs the gas set on 3 to function reliably. My vox s just cleared and it seems to do fine on 2. It has smoked a dozen or so pigs in the last week. Life industries aluminum rail is much better than the plastic factory junk but still flexes a few moa but only if it's clamped into a tripod and I'm torquing on it. The factory plastic would flex 5-6moa at least from hand pressure only.
The rear take down pin still walks out and I need to install the stronger retainer spring for the ejector panel.
The rear take down pin still walks out and I need to install the stronger retainer spring for the ejector panel.
the forward mag release is very stiff. usable, but more effort than I'd like.
that's the only significant issue as I see it now with a sample size of one. the trigger could be better, but is acceptable for what it is. the hardguard stinks, but most/all plastic handguards do. this rifle, like any other needs aftermarket to thrive and right now that support is limited. we all expect everything to have glock 19/AR15/rem700 level of support...
I have a new one bought this March. I wouldn't call it an accurate rifle but I didn't buy it for a target gun. That said, I have over 1K down the pipe with everything from wolf steel case to GMM and it runs great/no jams or stoppages. I have disassembled and cleaned it once... The magazine releases are stiff but the trigger isn't bad enough to be looking at aftermarket as of yet... the egos are good but I do wish you could swap out the grip for a magpul style... I t is not and will never be considered a precision rifle but it would serve out to 3- 400 meters for CM hits...
I spent this Saturday at an intermediate carbine class with my MDRX and walked away feeling pretty good.
the good. ran like a top. more than acceptable accuracy. my final tally in the timed accuracy portion was second in our class.
ergonomics are great. the safety placement is just perfect. I've found myself using the rear mag release more - my muscle memory from my Aug is kicking in.
the bad. the muzzle break, while effective is very loud. trade off was that I wasn't throwing spent casings on my neighbors.
part of the class involved clearing jams setup by the instructors. the forward eject plates are slower to remove to do a thorough inspection vs. an AR. With the mag removed though jamming your fingers are able to solve most issues however (just like an AR) accept you can't see what you are working on. I ended up running without the forward ejection plates for the final timed run to save a few seconds. man do the ejected cases get flung!
the ugly. the small length made shooting under weird barricades a little difficult as I wanted to ensure an errant shot didn't damage the prop as they were definitely laid out for conventional rifles.
overall I'm more confident in this rifle than I was. I still need to get it out to 500+ and print some groups with match ammo, but I'm impressed so far. my experiences so far do not echo many of those on the forums & youtube.
the good. ran like a top. more than acceptable accuracy. my final tally in the timed accuracy portion was second in our class.
ergonomics are great. the safety placement is just perfect. I've found myself using the rear mag release more - my muscle memory from my Aug is kicking in.
the bad. the muzzle break, while effective is very loud. trade off was that I wasn't throwing spent casings on my neighbors.
part of the class involved clearing jams setup by the instructors. the forward eject plates are slower to remove to do a thorough inspection vs. an AR. With the mag removed though jamming your fingers are able to solve most issues however (just like an AR) accept you can't see what you are working on. I ended up running without the forward ejection plates for the final timed run to save a few seconds. man do the ejected cases get flung!
the ugly. the small length made shooting under weird barricades a little difficult as I wanted to ensure an errant shot didn't damage the prop as they were definitely laid out for conventional rifles.
overall I'm more confident in this rifle than I was. I still need to get it out to 500+ and print some groups with match ammo, but I'm impressed so far. my experiences so far do not echo many of those on the forums & youtube.
At least with the price dropped closer to where comparable bullpup rifles are selling its not such a bad deal. If you pay high end you expect high end which the rifle wasn't when it came out. In my opinion that was the biggest complaint. We waited a long time for a rifle that was promised to be accurate with a target grade trigger and got a rifle that was so so and had a really bad trigger in addition to the other little details that even keltech got right and DT didn't. Looks like the new rifles have a slot so you can adjust the gas port without taking the handguard off at least. Things take time and development to get to a point where everything works right.
There are good aftermarket triggers out there though I can't recall who did them. A friend has one on his rifle and it makes a huge difference.
DT is selling custom barrel kits so you can buy the parts you need to make up good barrels if you're interested in better accuracy. Of course by the time you buy the kit, a blank and have someone make it for you you're into the barrel for half the cost of the rifle or more. A good barrel and trigger do improve things a lot.
Whether you have a brake on your rifle or not you'll find the blast is worse due to the end of the barrel being so much closer to your face and ears. Not sure what brake you've got (or whether its a break which would probably be kind of noisy too) but the best brake for these is a can. Even the little surefire cans that don't reduce the sound that much take out a lot of the blast which helps a lot. They help damp the recoil as well and its only a 308 so not much of that anyway. If you want to rain down brass on everyone thirty feet or more to your right just pop off the ejection port cover. Reliability goes up and you can probably reduce the port size by a notch or more too. It takes some energy to jam the empty into the ejection port cover. It is nice to have all the brass dropped at your feet but its not always that important.
Frank
There are good aftermarket triggers out there though I can't recall who did them. A friend has one on his rifle and it makes a huge difference.
DT is selling custom barrel kits so you can buy the parts you need to make up good barrels if you're interested in better accuracy. Of course by the time you buy the kit, a blank and have someone make it for you you're into the barrel for half the cost of the rifle or more. A good barrel and trigger do improve things a lot.
Whether you have a brake on your rifle or not you'll find the blast is worse due to the end of the barrel being so much closer to your face and ears. Not sure what brake you've got (or whether its a break which would probably be kind of noisy too) but the best brake for these is a can. Even the little surefire cans that don't reduce the sound that much take out a lot of the blast which helps a lot. They help damp the recoil as well and its only a 308 so not much of that anyway. If you want to rain down brass on everyone thirty feet or more to your right just pop off the ejection port cover. Reliability goes up and you can probably reduce the port size by a notch or more too. It takes some energy to jam the empty into the ejection port cover. It is nice to have all the brass dropped at your feet but its not always that important.
Frank
I have long thought that a side-eject port cover for the MDR would be a great accessory because as others have said, the forward eject is great and all, but I have to question whether or not it's worth the headaches (that said, mine works pretty well). It just seems like a complication that could be removed, and as long as that port cover could be swapped side-to-side as can the current forward-eject cover, the rifle would maintain its ambidextrous functionality.
As for the muzzle brake issue, I've unfortunately managed to tear up a damned fine set of my sandbags with the muzzle blast out of a SiCo ASR brake... but it is at least alleviated with the fitment of a blast shield. The gun eventually WILL be shot suppressed (hence the fitment of the ASR brake), but I am still working through the initial break-in (yeah, I know... I don't get to the range NEARLY as much as I'd like to).
As for the muzzle brake issue, I've unfortunately managed to tear up a damned fine set of my sandbags with the muzzle blast out of a SiCo ASR brake... but it is at least alleviated with the fitment of a blast shield. The gun eventually WILL be shot suppressed (hence the fitment of the ASR brake), but I am still working through the initial break-in (yeah, I know... I don't get to the range NEARLY as much as I'd like to).
My experience with the MDRX, chambered in 6.5 CM, has been excellent. No malfunctions out of the Hornady rounds that I shoot. Just a few primer-strike malfunctions out of the cheap "Sellier & Bellot Ammunition 6.5 Creedmoor 140 Grain Full Metal Jacket." While standing, I get roughly 2.66 MOA from shooting "Hornady American Whitetail Ammunition 6.5 Creedmoor 129 Grain Interlock." While benched, that becomes an average of 1 MOA. Although, take into account that I haven't used the most stabilizing tools, just the bench and tripod.
I chose to zero my offset HS509T and scope to the Hornady Whitetail Interlock ammo. With the heavy Vortex Razor HD Gen 2 3-18, it's a heave setup--probably coming in around 12-13 pounds. I consider it to be the heaviest setup for a battle rifle that I would use.
My plan for it is to order a 14.5" threaded barrel from ES Tactical, chambered in 7.62, to keep suppressed by a HX-QD 762 MG from OSS.
Also, I emailed Franklin Armory about the prospect of them making a binary trigger for this platform and others like it. I received a prompt response indicating that the project was under revision; hence, why I plan to buy the full-auto rated OSS suppressor. That's very exciting to me and other bullpup fanatics.
I chose to zero my offset HS509T and scope to the Hornady Whitetail Interlock ammo. With the heavy Vortex Razor HD Gen 2 3-18, it's a heave setup--probably coming in around 12-13 pounds. I consider it to be the heaviest setup for a battle rifle that I would use.
My plan for it is to order a 14.5" threaded barrel from ES Tactical, chambered in 7.62, to keep suppressed by a HX-QD 762 MG from OSS.
Also, I emailed Franklin Armory about the prospect of them making a binary trigger for this platform and others like it. I received a prompt response indicating that the project was under revision; hence, why I plan to buy the full-auto rated OSS suppressor. That's very exciting to me and other bullpup fanatics.
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You really don't need the MG version of the OSS cans to run a binary trigger on the MDR. I've got the magnum TI and the IFM6 OSS suppressors and either would handle the rate of fire you're talking about without issue. The MG version is designed for belt fed machine guns and you wouldn't be able to match that rate of fire with the MDR no matter how hard you tried. The MG can adds a lot of weight, you would probably be better off with the standard HX QD 762. My next can will be the HX QD 762 TI because the weight savings is significant and the MDR is already heavy enough as it is.
My OSS BPR/SRM and Helix cans have been running just fine. What issues are you referring to? I can say the OSS runs well on the MDRX. You are not choking on blowback and there is very little carbon buildup in the receiver.
