Whats the difference between these two platforms?
They look essentialy the same. Does EDM mfg the M200?
They look essentialy the same. Does EDM mfg the M200?
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Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
- Thread starter Wheres-Waldo
- Start date
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- cheytac difference m200 or edm
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
WW, What follows is one man's opinion on your questions, nothing more, nothing less.
Lets start with your second question first. You asked "Does EDM mfg the M200?" and the answer is no they do not. EDM Arms produces the .408XM. Cheytac produces the M2000.
Having said that we are left with your first question.
"Whats the difference between these two platforms?"
Great question and a remarkable and very interesting answer. Now, IMO, it is tough to broach this subject without asking two more questions.
Those questions would be:
"Who first designed this rifle/receiver concept?"
"Who built the first receivers and who built the first .408s in this style?"
Its a heck of an interesting story and most people kicking around these rifles long enough, well, they ask the very same questions you do.
My opinion of the answers:
"Who designed this rifle/receiver concept?"
The answer is Bill Ritchie, President of EDM, its first manifestation in 1992. By 1996, Bill had created and produced the model 99, the remarkable .50 caliber break down variant for the services that we have come to hear so much about. With the 99 came the vast majority of design efforts that led to the collapsable stock system, the wire cut receiver, bolt and barrel system. Single shot led to magazine fed, led to semi-auto magazine fed. Great piece of American weapon engineering history. "URWP" Unpack, rack, whack, pack was born.
"Who built the first receivers and who built the first .408s in this style?"
The answer is Bill Ritchie, President of EDM. The .408 M2000 that came into creation was first developed by taking the EDM .50 Caliber and addressing an interesting opportunity that came about between EDM and Cheytac. The first, Cheytac had developed the remarkable .408 cartridge and the second, they approached Bill Ritchie to have Cheytac's .408 catridge in Bill's Windrunner platform. It is my understanding that Bill was contracted to build the first .408 rifles in this style for Cheytac. It is also my understanding that all of the first fifty or so rifles were produced by EDM and sold through Cheytac. Those were the first .408 Cheytacs. Some of the most valuable and earliest pieces are the Israeli variant with the very thick camo paint on the EDM side and the engraved Cheytac banner on the other.
Your last question "what is the difference between these two platforms?"
If what I have told you thus far is correct, we can see why there is such a simularity between the two rifles.
I can see some important differences as well. Cheytac appears to have come to the conclusion that the EDM rifle design was better served by applying a free floating handguard. The handguard's attachement point appears to be Ritchie's orignal barrel nut. Two more interesting developments appear to be found here as well, a handle and bipod placement. A free floating handle is timed by the operator on the handguard, and when properly timed, is "locked down" with a "pin" on the receiver. The Cheytac handle allows the rifle to be carried upside down (making the top scope turret the lowest point of impact.) EDM has no handguard, EDM has no handle (operator would carry his 26 lbs rifle upright.) Whereas the EDM rifle uses a lower support pin for its bipod, the Cheytac places the bipod on top of their free floating handguard quite a bit more forward in a style that first appeared earlier in weapons like the Walther 2000.
Well, hope that helped.
WW, What follows is one man's opinion on your questions, nothing more, nothing less.
Lets start with your second question first. You asked "Does EDM mfg the M200?" and the answer is no they do not. EDM Arms produces the .408XM. Cheytac produces the M2000.
Having said that we are left with your first question.
"Whats the difference between these two platforms?"
Great question and a remarkable and very interesting answer. Now, IMO, it is tough to broach this subject without asking two more questions.
Those questions would be:
"Who first designed this rifle/receiver concept?"
"Who built the first receivers and who built the first .408s in this style?"
Its a heck of an interesting story and most people kicking around these rifles long enough, well, they ask the very same questions you do.
My opinion of the answers:
"Who designed this rifle/receiver concept?"
The answer is Bill Ritchie, President of EDM, its first manifestation in 1992. By 1996, Bill had created and produced the model 99, the remarkable .50 caliber break down variant for the services that we have come to hear so much about. With the 99 came the vast majority of design efforts that led to the collapsable stock system, the wire cut receiver, bolt and barrel system. Single shot led to magazine fed, led to semi-auto magazine fed. Great piece of American weapon engineering history. "URWP" Unpack, rack, whack, pack was born.
"Who built the first receivers and who built the first .408s in this style?"
The answer is Bill Ritchie, President of EDM. The .408 M2000 that came into creation was first developed by taking the EDM .50 Caliber and addressing an interesting opportunity that came about between EDM and Cheytac. The first, Cheytac had developed the remarkable .408 cartridge and the second, they approached Bill Ritchie to have Cheytac's .408 catridge in Bill's Windrunner platform. It is my understanding that Bill was contracted to build the first .408 rifles in this style for Cheytac. It is also my understanding that all of the first fifty or so rifles were produced by EDM and sold through Cheytac. Those were the first .408 Cheytacs. Some of the most valuable and earliest pieces are the Israeli variant with the very thick camo paint on the EDM side and the engraved Cheytac banner on the other.
Your last question "what is the difference between these two platforms?"
If what I have told you thus far is correct, we can see why there is such a simularity between the two rifles.
I can see some important differences as well. Cheytac appears to have come to the conclusion that the EDM rifle design was better served by applying a free floating handguard. The handguard's attachement point appears to be Ritchie's orignal barrel nut. Two more interesting developments appear to be found here as well, a handle and bipod placement. A free floating handle is timed by the operator on the handguard, and when properly timed, is "locked down" with a "pin" on the receiver. The Cheytac handle allows the rifle to be carried upside down (making the top scope turret the lowest point of impact.) EDM has no handguard, EDM has no handle (operator would carry his 26 lbs rifle upright.) Whereas the EDM rifle uses a lower support pin for its bipod, the Cheytac places the bipod on top of their free floating handguard quite a bit more forward in a style that first appeared earlier in weapons like the Walther 2000.
Well, hope that helped.
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
Thanks Thunder, sounds like what I suspected.
Apart from the float tube/handle. As for the action, trigger,
butt-stock...the major functional parts of the rifle are the same.
I couldnt find a price on the Cheytac, but the XM seems moderatly priced for a premier .408 platform.
Still trying to decide between the .338 or the .408, as they are the same price, but .408 components are up there.
Thanks Thunder, sounds like what I suspected.
Apart from the float tube/handle. As for the action, trigger,
butt-stock...the major functional parts of the rifle are the same.
I couldnt find a price on the Cheytac, but the XM seems moderatly priced for a premier .408 platform.
Still trying to decide between the .338 or the .408, as they are the same price, but .408 components are up there.
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
IMO, you have come to the right place to ask questions and really read deeply and broadly on just these types of subjects.
As to the costs involved, you should know that as the result of your asking these questions you can perhaps now afford to worry less about the cost difference between .338/.408 components and worry more about the appropriate round for your requirements.
I am hoping others will weigh in here and help.
Both Cheytac and EDM can help you understand your options in all these decision.
IMO, you have come to the right place to ask questions and really read deeply and broadly on just these types of subjects.
As to the costs involved, you should know that as the result of your asking these questions you can perhaps now afford to worry less about the cost difference between .338/.408 components and worry more about the appropriate round for your requirements.
I am hoping others will weigh in here and help.
Both Cheytac and EDM can help you understand your options in all these decision.
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RollingThunder51</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
As to the costs involved, you should know that as the result of your asking these questions you can perhaps now afford to worry less about the cost difference between .338/.408 components and worry more about the appropriate round for your requirements.
</div></div>
Which I believe would be .338
Long range paper, and any sort of end of the world scenario.
Ide like to invest in one with the intent of owning a "world class rifle" that I can keep for a life time. One that will fill the need of pretty much ANYTHING I ever needed in a precision rifle, on which I may only need to own a single other rifle, in a much smaller cal. which I already have.
Just looking into the rifle I'll never have to worry about replacing with something better. I think the Windrunner is that, in M98, no?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RollingThunder51</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
As to the costs involved, you should know that as the result of your asking these questions you can perhaps now afford to worry less about the cost difference between .338/.408 components and worry more about the appropriate round for your requirements.
</div></div>
Which I believe would be .338
Long range paper, and any sort of end of the world scenario.
Ide like to invest in one with the intent of owning a "world class rifle" that I can keep for a life time. One that will fill the need of pretty much ANYTHING I ever needed in a precision rifle, on which I may only need to own a single other rifle, in a much smaller cal. which I already have.
Just looking into the rifle I'll never have to worry about replacing with something better. I think the Windrunner is that, in M98, no?
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
WW,
I am on the same trail you are but perhaps slightly ahead. Thankfully, I have had some help from people (thank you jimmyM40A2) here on the Hide to answer some of the same questions.
As best as I can tell from my research the original barrel maker was K&P, a cut rifle manufacturer out of NM (Chey-tac White papers). Ken supposedly now works for HS Precision but may still make some barrels on the side. The M-200 is basically the same except for the above mentioned differences and also that the M-200 barrels are better suited to shooting the solid projectiles (originally from Lost River). I have some of their solids for my .300WM but the criticism has been that people had difficulty getting them to "shoot" because they required, for lack of a better way to put it, a tighter bore. Then came Lawton. Not sure who makes the barrels for EDM now, Lawton or perhaps Lilja. If you go to the 1000yard threads you can see JimmyM40A2's Windrunner that he converted to look like the M-200 with a tube conversion. The person to ask would be Triggerfifty who was in on the development from the beginning - I thought he was out of the country for the next month or so but I see he has just posted. Knesek guns was a dealer and if you go to their website you can get prices ($11,000 +) for the M-200. Not sure if they still have them. Maybe we can swing a deal if we order 2 of them LOL.
Hope this helps and if I got any info wrong I apologize to any and all.
Len
WW,
I am on the same trail you are but perhaps slightly ahead. Thankfully, I have had some help from people (thank you jimmyM40A2) here on the Hide to answer some of the same questions.
As best as I can tell from my research the original barrel maker was K&P, a cut rifle manufacturer out of NM (Chey-tac White papers). Ken supposedly now works for HS Precision but may still make some barrels on the side. The M-200 is basically the same except for the above mentioned differences and also that the M-200 barrels are better suited to shooting the solid projectiles (originally from Lost River). I have some of their solids for my .300WM but the criticism has been that people had difficulty getting them to "shoot" because they required, for lack of a better way to put it, a tighter bore. Then came Lawton. Not sure who makes the barrels for EDM now, Lawton or perhaps Lilja. If you go to the 1000yard threads you can see JimmyM40A2's Windrunner that he converted to look like the M-200 with a tube conversion. The person to ask would be Triggerfifty who was in on the development from the beginning - I thought he was out of the country for the next month or so but I see he has just posted. Knesek guns was a dealer and if you go to their website you can get prices ($11,000 +) for the M-200. Not sure if they still have them. Maybe we can swing a deal if we order 2 of them LOL.
Hope this helps and if I got any info wrong I apologize to any and all.
Len
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
Good info.
Link to that which you mentioned:
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...rue#Post1233430
Good info.
Link to that which you mentioned:
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...rue#Post1233430
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
Much appreciated Rob.
Honestly, I see myself buying an EDM WAY before a Cheytac, for 2 reasons....
1. Im questioning weather a .408 or .338 would be more appropriate for my intentions....Me thinks .338?
2. Cheytac is addidng an arm and leg for the cost of that tube/handle, which frankly I dont see myself needing...I liked Walburg in shooter, but not that much!
If your serious about a double order, and want to go with EDM, Ill probably be buying a reciever in a few monthes, and pay things off witht their plan. Once everything is warm n fuzzy I'll be heading to OEF...so she should be ready once I get back home....
Oh, and Thunder.... (850)228-5392
(I'm on the range this week, so if you wanna leave me a message I'll add you into contacts and call back in a timely manner.)
Rob, dont you already own an EDM? Or was that Septic?
Much appreciated Rob.
Honestly, I see myself buying an EDM WAY before a Cheytac, for 2 reasons....
1. Im questioning weather a .408 or .338 would be more appropriate for my intentions....Me thinks .338?
2. Cheytac is addidng an arm and leg for the cost of that tube/handle, which frankly I dont see myself needing...I liked Walburg in shooter, but not that much!
If your serious about a double order, and want to go with EDM, Ill probably be buying a reciever in a few monthes, and pay things off witht their plan. Once everything is warm n fuzzy I'll be heading to OEF...so she should be ready once I get back home....
Oh, and Thunder.... (850)228-5392
(I'm on the range this week, so if you wanna leave me a message I'll add you into contacts and call back in a timely manner.)
Rob, dont you already own an EDM? Or was that Septic?
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
I just picked up a edm 96 in 50 bmg. I am mostly a hand gun guy but I picked up a springfield M1A NM and have had a blast with it. I wanted a nice 50 and the ed seemed to fit my needs best. To be honest with you...I am shocked the Windrunner doesn't cost more. Compared to a Barrett it is a lot nicer when it comes to fit/function!
I just picked up a edm 96 in 50 bmg. I am mostly a hand gun guy but I picked up a springfield M1A NM and have had a blast with it. I wanted a nice 50 and the ed seemed to fit my needs best. To be honest with you...I am shocked the Windrunner doesn't cost more. Compared to a Barrett it is a lot nicer when it comes to fit/function!
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
The shop pictures are truley worth a 1,000 words. Thanks for posting them.
The shop pictures are truley worth a 1,000 words. Thanks for posting them.
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
does the chey-tac use a switch barrel system like the edm?
does the chey-tac use a switch barrel system like the edm?
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
The cheytac also uses the controlled spin technology for their barrels. I have seen myself about 12 or so of the M200's at EDM ready for shipment to Cheytac but money issues caused a stop shipment. This I saw I am not the bookkeeper. From what I observed it appears to have been a HUGE falling out.
The cheytac also uses the controlled spin technology for their barrels. I have seen myself about 12 or so of the M200's at EDM ready for shipment to Cheytac but money issues caused a stop shipment. This I saw I am not the bookkeeper. From what I observed it appears to have been a HUGE falling out.
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: The Mechanic</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The cheytac also uses the controlled spin technology for their barrels. I have seen myself about 12 or so of the M200's at EDM ready for shipment to Cheytac but money issues caused a stop shipment. This I saw I am not the bookkeeper. From what I observed it appears to have been a HUGE falling out. </div></div>
Yes but this is only one side of the story. In order to make a judgement on this basis you would need all the info on this subject. Nothing against EDM or CheyTac but i have been keeping quite on this subject untill now. I cant or more I wont go into bashing other companys so I just cant say anymore(atleast I try not too).
On the switch barrel subject I know that cheytac is considering some switch barrel systems but you would have to ask them. I know I built some but what they are planning I have no idea.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: The Mechanic</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The cheytac also uses the controlled spin technology for their barrels. I have seen myself about 12 or so of the M200's at EDM ready for shipment to Cheytac but money issues caused a stop shipment. This I saw I am not the bookkeeper. From what I observed it appears to have been a HUGE falling out. </div></div>
Yes but this is only one side of the story. In order to make a judgement on this basis you would need all the info on this subject. Nothing against EDM or CheyTac but i have been keeping quite on this subject untill now. I cant or more I wont go into bashing other companys so I just cant say anymore(atleast I try not too).
On the switch barrel subject I know that cheytac is considering some switch barrel systems but you would have to ask them. I know I built some but what they are planning I have no idea.
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body">WW, here's some pics of Chey Tac's shop if you wanted to see where they are made.
</div></div>
Rob01. I am assuming you have seen "The Vault". I have some pics trying to find them. There is some really neat stuff in their.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body">WW, here's some pics of Chey Tac's shop if you wanted to see where they are made.
Rob01. I am assuming you have seen "The Vault". I have some pics trying to find them. There is some really neat stuff in their.
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: The Mechanic</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The cheytac also uses the controlled spin technology for their barrels. I have seen myself about 12 or so of the M200's at EDM ready for shipment to Cheytac but money issues caused a stop shipment. This I saw I am not the bookkeeper. From what I observed it appears to have been a HUGE falling out. </div></div>
Yes but this is only one side of the story. In order to make a judgement on this basis you would need all the info on this subject. Nothing against EDM or CheyTac but i have been keeping quite on this subject untill now. I cant or more I wont go into bashing other companys so I just cant say anymore(atleast I try not too).
On the switch barrel subject I know that cheytac is considering some switch barrel systems but you would have to ask them. I know I built some but what they are planning I have no idea.</div></div>
That is why I used a lot of soft squishy words like "saw", "observed", "I am not a bookkeeper" and "appears". I am sure I am not getting the whole story, although I have gotten additional info from Dean. Since there has been no one to really give the Cheytac side I have nothing that would show their side.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: The Mechanic</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The cheytac also uses the controlled spin technology for their barrels. I have seen myself about 12 or so of the M200's at EDM ready for shipment to Cheytac but money issues caused a stop shipment. This I saw I am not the bookkeeper. From what I observed it appears to have been a HUGE falling out. </div></div>
Yes but this is only one side of the story. In order to make a judgement on this basis you would need all the info on this subject. Nothing against EDM or CheyTac but i have been keeping quite on this subject untill now. I cant or more I wont go into bashing other companys so I just cant say anymore(atleast I try not too).
On the switch barrel subject I know that cheytac is considering some switch barrel systems but you would have to ask them. I know I built some but what they are planning I have no idea.</div></div>
That is why I used a lot of soft squishy words like "saw", "observed", "I am not a bookkeeper" and "appears". I am sure I am not getting the whole story, although I have gotten additional info from Dean. Since there has been no one to really give the Cheytac side I have nothing that would show their side.
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
As a disclaimer, I own a Windrunner.
That said, I have been to EDM and seen the shop. I had not been to Cheytac but now I've seen pictures.
As my personal impression and opinion only, in comparing the two a stranger to the weapons might use a car comparison where EDM's shop looks like they are making the latest Porsche or Ferrari, whilst Cheytac makes Model T's.
This does not mean one is better than the other regarding quality or function. But if you've seen both shops (remember I've only seen the pictures above of Cheytac), you would know what I mean.
As a disclaimer, I own a Windrunner.
That said, I have been to EDM and seen the shop. I had not been to Cheytac but now I've seen pictures.
As my personal impression and opinion only, in comparing the two a stranger to the weapons might use a car comparison where EDM's shop looks like they are making the latest Porsche or Ferrari, whilst Cheytac makes Model T's.
This does not mean one is better than the other regarding quality or function. But if you've seen both shops (remember I've only seen the pictures above of Cheytac), you would know what I mean.
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Cartman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">As a disclaimer, I own a Windrunner.
That said, I have been to EDM and seen the shop. I had not been to Cheytac but now I've seen pictures.
As my personal impression and opinion only, in comparing the two a stranger to the weapons might use a car comparison where EDM's shop looks like they are making the latest Porsche or Ferrari, whilst Cheytac makes Model T's.
This does not mean one is better than the other regarding quality or function. But if you've seen both shops (remember I've only seen the pictures above of Cheytac), you would know what I mean. </div></div>
Sir they do not produce the weapons at that place. </div></div>
I assume you're talking about Cheytac. I do believe you, though that is not the impression given by the poster above who said here's Cheytac's shop, then showing pictures of a lathe, mill, barrels, and completed rifle.
So everyone please disregard my comparison.
Of course that leaves me wondering just what Cheytac does build in their shop. And if Cheytac doesn't build their rifles in their shop, where do they build them, their non-shop? Any pictures as I am now curious?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Cartman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">As a disclaimer, I own a Windrunner.
That said, I have been to EDM and seen the shop. I had not been to Cheytac but now I've seen pictures.
As my personal impression and opinion only, in comparing the two a stranger to the weapons might use a car comparison where EDM's shop looks like they are making the latest Porsche or Ferrari, whilst Cheytac makes Model T's.
This does not mean one is better than the other regarding quality or function. But if you've seen both shops (remember I've only seen the pictures above of Cheytac), you would know what I mean. </div></div>
Sir they do not produce the weapons at that place. </div></div>
I assume you're talking about Cheytac. I do believe you, though that is not the impression given by the poster above who said here's Cheytac's shop, then showing pictures of a lathe, mill, barrels, and completed rifle.
So everyone please disregard my comparison.
Of course that leaves me wondering just what Cheytac does build in their shop. And if Cheytac doesn't build their rifles in their shop, where do they build them, their non-shop? Any pictures as I am now curious?
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
It pretty much comes down to ....Who builds a better gun. The EDM windrunner is made from quality tool steel and all the components fit perfectly. I can't speak for the M200/never seen the gun in person. Lets just say both guns are built to the same specs.... I just bought my windrunner 2 weeks ago nib for 6200. The cheapest I have seen a m200 sell for is 11,200. I just couldn't spend 5000 more for a handguard and extended bipod.
It pretty much comes down to ....Who builds a better gun. The EDM windrunner is made from quality tool steel and all the components fit perfectly. I can't speak for the M200/never seen the gun in person. Lets just say both guns are built to the same specs.... I just bought my windrunner 2 weeks ago nib for 6200. The cheapest I have seen a m200 sell for is 11,200. I just couldn't spend 5000 more for a handguard and extended bipod.
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
Definition of a lucky person?
Choosing between EITHER a Cheytac or an EDM ARMS!
In the meantime, EDM has two facilities:
EDM Wire cutting is done at Affordable EDM Redlands, CA.
Built in 1999, this 9,000 square foot facility has three (3) Charmilles 440s, two (2) Charmilles HD 20s, two (2) Charmilles ZNC 20s, three (3) Mitsubishi 90 Cs, three (3) HAAS Lathes, three (3) HAAS Mills.
http://affordableedm.com/links.html
http://02bfe1c.netsolhost.com/mfg.htm
The second facility is another manufacturing assembly area. Again, close to 10,000 square feet for that one. This is where most people go to see their rifles constructed. Wait until the end of this video and you'll see the other rifles.
http://02bfe1c.netsolhost.com/products.htm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7krVeWs3LQ0
Bill, just completed 17 rifles yesterday (.50, .338, .408) and I am expecting pics to come through tomorrow.
Definition of a lucky person?
Choosing between EITHER a Cheytac or an EDM ARMS!
In the meantime, EDM has two facilities:
EDM Wire cutting is done at Affordable EDM Redlands, CA.
Built in 1999, this 9,000 square foot facility has three (3) Charmilles 440s, two (2) Charmilles HD 20s, two (2) Charmilles ZNC 20s, three (3) Mitsubishi 90 Cs, three (3) HAAS Lathes, three (3) HAAS Mills.
http://affordableedm.com/links.html
http://02bfe1c.netsolhost.com/mfg.htm
The second facility is another manufacturing assembly area. Again, close to 10,000 square feet for that one. This is where most people go to see their rifles constructed. Wait until the end of this video and you'll see the other rifles.
http://02bfe1c.netsolhost.com/products.htm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7krVeWs3LQ0
Bill, just completed 17 rifles yesterday (.50, .338, .408) and I am expecting pics to come through tomorrow.
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Cartman</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Cartman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">As a disclaimer, I own a Windrunner.
That said, I have been to EDM and seen the shop. I had not been to Cheytac but now I've seen pictures.
As my personal impression and opinion only, in comparing the two a stranger to the weapons might use a car comparison where EDM's shop looks like they are making the latest Porsche or Ferrari, whilst Cheytac makes Model T's.
This does not mean one is better than the other regarding quality or function. But if you've seen both shops (remember I've only seen the pictures above of Cheytac), you would know what I mean. </div></div>
Sir they do not produce the weapons at that place. </div></div>
I assume you're talking about Cheytac. I do believe you, though that is not the impression given by the poster above who said here's Cheytac's shop, then showing pictures of a lathe, mill, barrels, and completed rifle.
So everyone please disregard my comparison.
Of course that leaves me wondering just what Cheytac does build in their shop. And if Cheytac doesn't build their rifles in their shop, where do they build them, their non-shop? Any pictures as I am now curious?
</div></div>
No they dont build them there. They do assembly work there but Lawton makes there barrel actions for the M-310, M-350, and there LER rifles. They have a different company making the actions for the M-200 and Lawton makes the barrels on them. Hope this clears things up.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Cartman</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Cartman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">As a disclaimer, I own a Windrunner.
That said, I have been to EDM and seen the shop. I had not been to Cheytac but now I've seen pictures.
As my personal impression and opinion only, in comparing the two a stranger to the weapons might use a car comparison where EDM's shop looks like they are making the latest Porsche or Ferrari, whilst Cheytac makes Model T's.
This does not mean one is better than the other regarding quality or function. But if you've seen both shops (remember I've only seen the pictures above of Cheytac), you would know what I mean. </div></div>
Sir they do not produce the weapons at that place. </div></div>
I assume you're talking about Cheytac. I do believe you, though that is not the impression given by the poster above who said here's Cheytac's shop, then showing pictures of a lathe, mill, barrels, and completed rifle.
So everyone please disregard my comparison.
Of course that leaves me wondering just what Cheytac does build in their shop. And if Cheytac doesn't build their rifles in their shop, where do they build them, their non-shop? Any pictures as I am now curious?
</div></div>
No they dont build them there. They do assembly work there but Lawton makes there barrel actions for the M-310, M-350, and there LER rifles. They have a different company making the actions for the M-200 and Lawton makes the barrels on them. Hope this clears things up.
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
So Cheytac doesn't make their guns -- someone else makes them and they assemble them?
Thanks for the clarification and why the two "shops" looked so different. This also may explain why they cost so much more, but I'm just guessing.
I've seen EDM's Plum Ln. location in Redlands with all the machines. This was a few years ago and looking back I don't think they yet had the assembly location elsewhere that RollingThunder mentions.
So Cheytac doesn't make their guns -- someone else makes them and they assemble them?
Thanks for the clarification and why the two "shops" looked so different. This also may explain why they cost so much more, but I'm just guessing.
I've seen EDM's Plum Ln. location in Redlands with all the machines. This was a few years ago and looking back I don't think they yet had the assembly location elsewhere that RollingThunder mentions.
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
Yes they assemble them and do the final fine tuning to the rifles there. They have several others places but i dont know where or what exactly they do. I just make the stuff.....
By the way does GA make there own stuff? No the buy the parts and assemble it.... hmmmmmm
Yes they assemble them and do the final fine tuning to the rifles there. They have several others places but i dont know where or what exactly they do. I just make the stuff.....
By the way does GA make there own stuff? No the buy the parts and assemble it.... hmmmmmm
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yes they assemble them and do the final fine tuning to the rifles there. They have several others places but i dont know where or what exactly they do. I just make the stuff.....
By the way does GA make there stuff?
</div></div>
Why so defensive?
And why drag GAP into it?
GAP puts this right on their website when you click on a rifle:
Remington 700 action
McMillan M40A1 stock
Bartlein stainless 5R barrel
I've been to Cheytac's site and they list the rifle as one of their products and I, personally, didn't see where they say they don't make the receiver. GAP makes it pretty clear, in contrast.
Since I've been to EDM and have a fair idea what parts they make, and since I heard that EDM no longer makes Cheytac's guns, and hearing that Cheytac now made their guns, I assumed that Cheytac made their own guns.
Given that assumption, I thought the state of EDM and Cheytac's shops varied wildly.
Now I know why -- EDM makes a lot of the parts, like the receiver, and Cheytac contracts that out.
So what?
I do think the "shops" are night and day in comparison. You seem to suggest Cheytac has others, though I'm not sure if you mean other companies have other shops that Cheytac contracts out to.
Regardless, I don't understand why you would get defensive for Cheytac with this coming to light.
I don't get your apparent beef, and don't have a problem with Cheytac doing things the way they do them, but I do think other people are probably interested in this information and am glad I now know.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yes they assemble them and do the final fine tuning to the rifles there. They have several others places but i dont know where or what exactly they do. I just make the stuff.....
By the way does GA make there stuff?
</div></div>
Why so defensive?
And why drag GAP into it?
GAP puts this right on their website when you click on a rifle:
Remington 700 action
McMillan M40A1 stock
Bartlein stainless 5R barrel
I've been to Cheytac's site and they list the rifle as one of their products and I, personally, didn't see where they say they don't make the receiver. GAP makes it pretty clear, in contrast.
Since I've been to EDM and have a fair idea what parts they make, and since I heard that EDM no longer makes Cheytac's guns, and hearing that Cheytac now made their guns, I assumed that Cheytac made their own guns.
Given that assumption, I thought the state of EDM and Cheytac's shops varied wildly.
Now I know why -- EDM makes a lot of the parts, like the receiver, and Cheytac contracts that out.
So what?
I do think the "shops" are night and day in comparison. You seem to suggest Cheytac has others, though I'm not sure if you mean other companies have other shops that Cheytac contracts out to.
Regardless, I don't understand why you would get defensive for Cheytac with this coming to light.
I don't get your apparent beef, and don't have a problem with Cheytac doing things the way they do them, but I do think other people are probably interested in this information and am glad I now know.
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What is it about these two companys that sparks so much nay-say?
So more to the point of this thread. If you put a EDM next to a M-200 which one would out perform? It dont mean a shit who has the bigger shop, its the quality of the work thats done. Now that I have said that im done with this thread. </div></div>
Wow dude, you need to relax. I don't even know what is getting you so hyped up about this. In my earlier thread I specifically stated I wasn't commenting on quality or performance -- only that the shops are different.
Since you've stated Cheytac doesn't make the parts, that would explain a lot about the difference right?
That's it man, just information, no need to get tied in knots over it or think anyone is attacking anyone else.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What is it about these two companys that sparks so much nay-say?
So more to the point of this thread. If you put a EDM next to a M-200 which one would out perform? It dont mean a shit who has the bigger shop, its the quality of the work thats done. Now that I have said that im done with this thread. </div></div>
Wow dude, you need to relax. I don't even know what is getting you so hyped up about this. In my earlier thread I specifically stated I wasn't commenting on quality or performance -- only that the shops are different.
Since you've stated Cheytac doesn't make the parts, that would explain a lot about the difference right?
That's it man, just information, no need to get tied in knots over it or think anyone is attacking anyone else.
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
I am for burying the EDM, Cheytac hatchet, and I don't mean in anyones back. That does NOTHING for the industry
I am for burying the EDM, Cheytac hatchet, and I don't mean in anyones back. That does NOTHING for the industry
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Me to. If you really want to know the difference then lets get a few together of each kind and compair. I myself know what the M-200 is capable of and I think its the better weapon. I know it cant say a whole lot seeing's how I help build the barrels. But then again I might know better..... </div></div>
Well now that you've said that, it is kind of like rolling a hand grenade in the room and walking away. How about some details? I'm not married to either platform and would love to know what makes the M200 the better weapon. Obviously you've gotten a few together of each kind and compared, so why not share your findings and details?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Me to. If you really want to know the difference then lets get a few together of each kind and compair. I myself know what the M-200 is capable of and I think its the better weapon. I know it cant say a whole lot seeing's how I help build the barrels. But then again I might know better..... </div></div>
Well now that you've said that, it is kind of like rolling a hand grenade in the room and walking away. How about some details? I'm not married to either platform and would love to know what makes the M200 the better weapon. Obviously you've gotten a few together of each kind and compared, so why not share your findings and details?
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
For one it comes down to overall performance, the M-200 kicks ass. Next the M-200 is sold as a weapons system and the training they offer is some of the best. The ABC program which has been proven with doppler radar is very accurate. When it comes down to it the price doesnt mean much when your getting that kind of performance.
For one it comes down to overall performance, the M-200 kicks ass. Next the M-200 is sold as a weapons system and the training they offer is some of the best. The ABC program which has been proven with doppler radar is very accurate. When it comes down to it the price doesnt mean much when your getting that kind of performance.
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For one it comes down to overall performance, the M-200 kicks ass. Next the M-200 is sold as a weapons system and the training they offer is some of the best. The ABC program which has been proven with doppler radar is very accurate. When it comes down to it the price doesnt mean much when your getting that kind of performance. </div></div>
I think I for one would need the Cheytac Ballistics Computer, Krestrel, and training with them to get the most out of the round and rifle. So you're not saying the M200 rifle alone is better made, or are you?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For one it comes down to overall performance, the M-200 kicks ass. Next the M-200 is sold as a weapons system and the training they offer is some of the best. The ABC program which has been proven with doppler radar is very accurate. When it comes down to it the price doesnt mean much when your getting that kind of performance. </div></div>
I think I for one would need the Cheytac Ballistics Computer, Krestrel, and training with them to get the most out of the round and rifle. So you're not saying the M200 rifle alone is better made, or are you?
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
Cartman, If you have a .50DTC considering you live in Kalifornia like me, (I also own a M96 in .50DTC) it is like comparing apples to oranges with the M200 and a M96 given the difference between .50 and .408. Also the controlled spin design is patented to Cheytac so EDM can not use it. Controlled spin really starts to work as you get close to transonic. The ABC program is also top rate although if I understand the projo's are limited. I would say this is not just a Ford vs. Chevy but more like Chevy vs. GMC. It would be great if Cheytac would ramp up production and chill out on the price, but that is their thing, they can ask $50,000 and sure as shit someone will buy it but they miss out on a whole business opportunity.
Cartman, If you have a .50DTC considering you live in Kalifornia like me, (I also own a M96 in .50DTC) it is like comparing apples to oranges with the M200 and a M96 given the difference between .50 and .408. Also the controlled spin design is patented to Cheytac so EDM can not use it. Controlled spin really starts to work as you get close to transonic. The ABC program is also top rate although if I understand the projo's are limited. I would say this is not just a Ford vs. Chevy but more like Chevy vs. GMC. It would be great if Cheytac would ramp up production and chill out on the price, but that is their thing, they can ask $50,000 and sure as shit someone will buy it but they miss out on a whole business opportunity.
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Cartman</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For one it comes down to overall performance, the M-200 kicks ass. Next the M-200 is sold as a weapons system and the training they offer is some of the best. The ABC program which has been proven with doppler radar is very accurate. When it comes down to it the price doesnt mean much when your getting that kind of performance. </div></div>
I think I for one would need the Cheytac Ballistics Computer, Krestrel, and training with them to get the most out of the round and rifle. So you're not saying the M200 rifle alone is better made, or are you?
</div></div>
Yes the system in a whole will function better. But....
Putting it simply enough... Yes. They stand behind the product 100% just like us. Its gonna shoot like a dream or it we be replaced.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Cartman</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For one it comes down to overall performance, the M-200 kicks ass. Next the M-200 is sold as a weapons system and the training they offer is some of the best. The ABC program which has been proven with doppler radar is very accurate. When it comes down to it the price doesnt mean much when your getting that kind of performance. </div></div>
I think I for one would need the Cheytac Ballistics Computer, Krestrel, and training with them to get the most out of the round and rifle. So you're not saying the M200 rifle alone is better made, or are you?
Yes the system in a whole will function better. But....
Putting it simply enough... Yes. They stand behind the product 100% just like us. Its gonna shoot like a dream or it we be replaced.
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
A .338LM is good to a mile and a little farther if you're really skilled. It's a better choice for the majority of shooters, in my opinion. If you want to shoot accurately past 2000 yards then call Lawton and have a .375 Cheytac (aka .375/408) rifle built for far less than a Windrunner or M200.
If you really want the cool guns, call Bill Richie and have him build you an XM04 or call Cheytac and order an M200 - you'll have to wait quite a while for both, but they are fantastic guns. Actually, now that I think of it, EDM is having a special on XM04s, essentially $1000 off the retail price. Yes, Lawton makes the barrels for Cheytac and this is an important distinction as they are widely regarded as the experts in making barrels for ELR solids.
A .338LM is good to a mile and a little farther if you're really skilled. It's a better choice for the majority of shooters, in my opinion. If you want to shoot accurately past 2000 yards then call Lawton and have a .375 Cheytac (aka .375/408) rifle built for far less than a Windrunner or M200.
If you really want the cool guns, call Bill Richie and have him build you an XM04 or call Cheytac and order an M200 - you'll have to wait quite a while for both, but they are fantastic guns. Actually, now that I think of it, EDM is having a special on XM04s, essentially $1000 off the retail price. Yes, Lawton makes the barrels for Cheytac and this is an important distinction as they are widely regarded as the experts in making barrels for ELR solids.
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
Mechanic, I have a 50BMG not the DTC and will eventually add a barrel in .408 or .375 CT.
Mechanic, I have a 50BMG not the DTC and will eventually add a barrel in .408 or .375 CT.
Re: Difference between Cheytac M200/EDM XM?
Finally got some EDM assembly facility shots.
EDM's assebly area is 9,000 sq/ft. Their EDM machining facility (one of CA largest firearm manufacturing facilities) is another 9,000.
Check out the base of the magazine in the 4th photo.
Assembly:
Finally got some EDM assembly facility shots.
EDM's assebly area is 9,000 sq/ft. Their EDM machining facility (one of CA largest firearm manufacturing facilities) is another 9,000.
Check out the base of the magazine in the 4th photo.
Assembly:
