Hey guys, I've got some parts going out for DLC coatings. This got me thinking about the possibility of coating the I.D. of a barrel with DLC or perhaps even TiN. Has anyone ever played with doing this or done such a thing?
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Gunsmithing DLC or TiN coating on barrel's I.D.?
- Thread starter High Binder
- Start date
Re: DLC or TiN coating on barrel's I.D.?
When IonBond first came about they advertised that they were not able to deposit it down a bore effectively based on the close confines. As for TiN...I have no clue. You can call Ryan Flynn at the following link. He used to be the resident gunsmith at Ionbond.
Link
Josh
When IonBond first came about they advertised that they were not able to deposit it down a bore effectively based on the close confines. As for TiN...I have no clue. You can call Ryan Flynn at the following link. He used to be the resident gunsmith at Ionbond.
Link
Josh
Re: DLC or TiN coating on barrel's I.D.?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MinorDamage</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When IonBond first came about they advertised that they were not able to deposit it down a bore effectively based on the close confines. As for TiN...I have no clue. You can call Ryan Flynn at the following link. He used to be the resident gunsmith at Ionbond.
Link
Josh </div></div>
Yeah, I think it would be harder with TiN but being that DLC is applied via vapor I was thinking it may be a little easier as it could perhaps be vacuumed through the bore.
I tried the link http://www.acgwllc.com but I can't gt it to load.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MinorDamage</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When IonBond first came about they advertised that they were not able to deposit it down a bore effectively based on the close confines. As for TiN...I have no clue. You can call Ryan Flynn at the following link. He used to be the resident gunsmith at Ionbond.
Link
Josh </div></div>
Yeah, I think it would be harder with TiN but being that DLC is applied via vapor I was thinking it may be a little easier as it could perhaps be vacuumed through the bore.
I tried the link http://www.acgwllc.com but I can't gt it to load.
Re: DLC or TiN coating on barrel's I.D.?
Hmmm...loads just fine for me. It did take awhile. Here is the contact info:
Ryan Flynn
Phone: (336) 699-2708
Email: [email protected]
Josh
Hmmm...loads just fine for me. It did take awhile. Here is the contact info:
Ryan Flynn
Phone: (336) 699-2708
Email: [email protected]
Josh
Re: DLC or TiN coating on barrel's I.D.?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MinorDamage</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hmmm...loads just fine for me. It did take awhile. Here is the contact info:
Ryan Flynn
Phone: (336) 699-2708
Email: [email protected]
Josh </div></div>
Awesome, thanks!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MinorDamage</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hmmm...loads just fine for me. It did take awhile. Here is the contact info:
Ryan Flynn
Phone: (336) 699-2708
Email: [email protected]
Josh </div></div>
Awesome, thanks!
Re: DLC or TiN coating on barrel's I.D.?
@ HighBender - I just went through this as I had my Surgeon 591 and Krieger Ion Bonded. I was paranoid about the ion bond touching the bore since the rifle already shot so well and they assured me that the ion bond only entered the bore at the very entrance of the bore and was wiped away after the first few shots.
Just out of curiosity, why would you want the inside of your bore coated? Rust prevention? Lower coefficient of drag???
@ HighBender - I just went through this as I had my Surgeon 591 and Krieger Ion Bonded. I was paranoid about the ion bond touching the bore since the rifle already shot so well and they assured me that the ion bond only entered the bore at the very entrance of the bore and was wiped away after the first few shots.
Just out of curiosity, why would you want the inside of your bore coated? Rust prevention? Lower coefficient of drag???
Re: DLC or TiN coating on barrel's I.D.?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SOCAL</div><div class="ubbcode-body">@ HighBender - I just went through this as I had my Surgeon 591 and Krieger Ion Bonded. I was paranoid about the ion bond touching the bore since the rifle already shot so well and they assured me that the ion bond only entered the bore at the very entrance of the bore and was wiped away after the first few shots.
Just out of curiosity, why would you want the inside of your bore coated? Rust prevention? Lower coefficient of drag??? </div></div>
Interesting. SOCAL, I was just toying with the idea in my head thinking more about the longevity (life) of the barrel than any other factor such as lowering the drag. Seems to me that it would have the same or probably much better effect on barrel life and cleaning as say using molly or HBN coated bullets. I've got a handful of engine parts going out for DLC coatings and it just got me thinking about how DLC coating the ID of the barrel would effect the rifle as a whole.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SOCAL</div><div class="ubbcode-body">@ HighBender - I just went through this as I had my Surgeon 591 and Krieger Ion Bonded. I was paranoid about the ion bond touching the bore since the rifle already shot so well and they assured me that the ion bond only entered the bore at the very entrance of the bore and was wiped away after the first few shots.
Just out of curiosity, why would you want the inside of your bore coated? Rust prevention? Lower coefficient of drag??? </div></div>
Interesting. SOCAL, I was just toying with the idea in my head thinking more about the longevity (life) of the barrel than any other factor such as lowering the drag. Seems to me that it would have the same or probably much better effect on barrel life and cleaning as say using molly or HBN coated bullets. I've got a handful of engine parts going out for DLC coatings and it just got me thinking about how DLC coating the ID of the barrel would effect the rifle as a whole.
Re: DLC or TiN coating on barrel's I.D.?
Unfortunately the ionbond is not able to get down into the bore of a rifle barrel. Interestingly I had a .38 special barrel come back all ionbonded. It will get down a little, but not enough to be beneficial to bore wear.
Unfortunately the ionbond is not able to get down into the bore of a rifle barrel. Interestingly I had a .38 special barrel come back all ionbonded. It will get down a little, but not enough to be beneficial to bore wear.
I am a Manufacturing Engineer for a company that manufactures barrels from Ø.50 cal to Ø120mm. I am currently investigating the possibility of TiAlN coating the ID of a Ø25mm barrel. We are researching the possibility of changing the finish bore condition from Chromium VI or Nitride. Every coating provider has told me that the PVD process is a gas method and cannot be accurately applied to the ID of anything. When this process becomes viable, this will replace all other methods of wear resistance in barrel bores. I am speaking with a prominate coating company president tomorrow to discuss this in depth. I will post the results.
I used to do a great deal of coating work through MMI in Sand Diego. As mentioned, the vapor deposition process has a hard time with uniform film coverage on a deep ID part.
A traditional small caliber rifle barrel would be a virtual nightmare for this process. The OD however is no problem.
We once did a batch of barrels for some secret squirrels. Submerged a CM barrel (plugged bore) for year "somewhere" in Coronado. Came back 12mos later and scraped the biology off the outside, screwed it onto a receiver and went for broke.
Hammered. 96c Rockwell is a thing to behold!
C.
A traditional small caliber rifle barrel would be a virtual nightmare for this process. The OD however is no problem.
We once did a batch of barrels for some secret squirrels. Submerged a CM barrel (plugged bore) for year "somewhere" in Coronado. Came back 12mos later and scraped the biology off the outside, screwed it onto a receiver and went for broke.
Hammered. 96c Rockwell is a thing to behold!
C.
I used to do a great deal of coating work through MMI in Sand Diego. As mentioned, the vapor deposition process has a hard time with uniform film coverage on a deep ID part.
A traditional small caliber rifle barrel would be a virtual nightmare for this process. The OD however is no problem.
We once did a batch of barrels for some secret squirrels. Submerged a CM barrel (plugged bore) for year "somewhere" in Coronado. Came back 12mos later and scraped the biology off the outside, screwed it onto a receiver and went for broke.
Hammered. 96c Rockwell is a thing to behold!
C.
Just like seasoning a block. old timers would do this with engine blocks for race cars. Machine the block except for the finish hone on all bearing surfaces and cylinder walls then dig a hole toss the block in and retrieve next spring as a "seasoned" block effectively surface hardens the entire thing. crafty old fuckers.
Since we're off if the weeds talking about seasoning stuff:
To start a high performance engine build, I'll take a 200k mile, 40 year old engine block that's been overheated a dozen times over a new-in-the-crate block any day...assuming I'll be fully machining it, of course.
Could you have the barrel salt bath nitrited than ion bond after the fact? That way the bore is coated for long life and the outside has ion bore.
I used to do a great deal of coating work through MMI in Sand Diego. As mentioned, the vapor deposition process has a hard time with uniform film coverage on a deep ID part.
A traditional small caliber rifle barrel would be a virtual nightmare for this process. The OD however is no problem.
We once did a batch of barrels for some secret squirrels. Submerged a CM barrel (plugged bore) for year "somewhere" in Coronado. Came back 12mos later and scraped the biology off the outside, screwed it onto a receiver and went for broke.
Hammered. 96c Rockwell is a thing to behold!
C.
Somewhere as in under water?
You could, but I don't know why you would.
The melonite finish looks nice and has great corrosion resistance. Ion Bond is expensive.
Doesn't seem like a great idea to invest so much money on a consumable item like a barrel.
I was thinking along those lines and was wonder why the op wouldn't just go with sbn? I assumed perhaps the op liked the cosmetics of the two coatings mentioned?
Hyperbolic Parabola Is the best thing to play with on bearing surface design. When u get the radius just right u can increase your bullet b.c. by a decent amount. I machined .284 bullets at 200gr with 1.25 G7 B.C. Theres a reason why the Ram jet is so fast which is a one piece engine with the correct parabola for thrust efficiency . Also Try a lined barrel with at least .05 per side of DLC coating and use gain twist and use a percentage of inconel 718 in barrel material.
Hi,
WTF is a percentage of inconel 718 in barrel material?
Please advise as to where you are getting that "blended" alloy from?
Please post pictures of your projectile.
Edited To Add...
Go ahead and link this to the legendary thread, lol
www.snipershide.com
Sincerely,
Theis
WTF is a percentage of inconel 718 in barrel material?
Please advise as to where you are getting that "blended" alloy from?
Please post pictures of your projectile.
Edited To Add...
Go ahead and link this to the legendary thread, lol
Hi.
Hi , I live in valpo indiana. Kind of sucks no far ranges around here unless knowing someone with land for it. Jasper polaski has i believe a 200 or 250yd range , Kingsburry a 100 . I am surprised i have not got into guns in a serious manner yet. I have like 25k in rc toys i no longer use, i...
www.snipershide.com
Sincerely,
Theis
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im about to get a new barrel spun for my AXMC
2 questions.
how can I get some of you bullets?
where can I get that barrel material or finished barrel?
I’ll buy both Monday morning..always willing to try something out of the box
thanks
Brian
Hi,
He was on SH Saturday but for some reason he may not have seen the request to purchase his projectiles and barrel information, lol.
Sincerely,
Theis
Take my money!!!!!! I will be the elr king!!!!
Forget 2 miles and a short-lived barrel my rifle will do 5 miles and no throat erosion!!
Just kidding but I am genuinely curious?
Forget 2 miles and a short-lived barrel my rifle will do 5 miles and no throat erosion!!
Just kidding but I am genuinely curious?
Hey guys, thanks for the response's . Im just trying to give people hope that may have not been tapped yet. I am not a bullet maker and i can't see why one would not try different Parabola's on the bearing surface. Barnes put's groves on there bullets and that for sure isn't helping B.C. Even though i am a Machinist , due to working in a steel mill as one i can't just start machining bullets. But someone needs to try Parabolic radius theory on bullets by now? And also proper depth of dlc coating on a barrel by now. Shit why not carbide lined i.d. even with nitride coating. Some machinist inserts are tough as nails like seco duratomic TP 1500 MR5 chip breaker. U can rough 1200 surface ft. a min. with them bastards. Seco though hmmmm has to be a way we can rough machine at higher surface speeds. Well since about 2005 they figured out how to.
So, to be clear.....
Did you or did you not create a bullet that no other company on the planet has been able to make?
And if you did create said bullet, you are choosing to not make an insane amount of money on it? I promise if your claim is true, I can find someone that will put you in front of a machine tomorrow to make them and you won’t have to worry about the steel mill.
So basically you have no education and no working experiece of aerodynamics, fluid flow theory, bullet manufacturing, metallurgy, physical vapor deposition, barrel making, heat treatment or anything else.
You just sling some cool sounding words and some irrelevant references to machining inserts and think that brings credibility?
EL OH EL
And oh yea, nitriding isn't a coating in case you were wondering.
Hi,
Hey wait a minute...
I thought you already manufactured and proved your bullet design...Now you cannot just make bullets????
I have a Swiss screw machine and can have bullets to the market in 4 hours.
Also...so have you or have you not made the bimetal alloy barrel you referenced in your original replies??
Sincerely,
Theis
Hey wait a minute...
I thought you already manufactured and proved your bullet design...Now you cannot just make bullets????
I have a Swiss screw machine and can have bullets to the market in 4 hours.
Also...so have you or have you not made the bimetal alloy barrel you referenced in your original replies??
Sincerely,
Theis
Exactly which is why Nitriding wont wear off in a barrel if properly done. Just like someone properly making a carbide lined barrel . Barrel's are still on old school level besides structured barrel's. If micro machining is possible then having a barrel lined with carbide whether its in the i.d. only and not the chamber i.d. or what. That has to be possible to try and check off the list. Clearly it would take a big manufacturer to try due to money they have. With surface that hard that is why i mention gain twist because it will start out with less initial stress on rifling which hard crack-able material would perhaps benefit from. I'm pretty sure adding inconel one of the strongest metals yet tough to machine but perhaps easy to machine with proper tech would also perhaps benefit barrel life. Brass vs 416 stainless or Brass vs inconel hmmmmm pretty tough decision lol. Don't have to be a genius to figure that one out. A low volume barrel maker probably don't have the will or correct setup to even try to make a barrel out of very strong material though. This is why i speak of big company. Most big companies the engineers are afraid of trying new shit like this due to job risks. Lot of engineers have cheated their way through college.
I will gladly fly to your location. If we can validate this I have a fat stack of cash to hand you along with a contract to buy all prototypes and rights to concept and materials. If you are unable to validate all of this I will be billing you for costs and time.
Deal?
That shit was funny. But the guy in that video could come up with better ideas that someone has than a shoe flying for his comedy. Lot of comedians are actually low iq due to drugs. If i said hey i came up with a flying barrel guys. I doubt i would of got people interested from what there responses show. Again someone tell me that brass will wear out inconel or nitride , or dlc, or carbide faster than stainless or carbon steel LMAO.
