Dry Fire

[ZeroedForImpact]

Can you cause damage by dry firing your weapon too many times?
Whether it is in a row or just over the years?

I'm beginning to understand that most of my buddies dont know crap about marksmenship/long range shooting! Seeing how most of my questions have been answered by serveral people the same way here on the forums and are completely different than what my buddies claim to be true, I think this is another one of those.

 

[The Mechanic]

Re: Dry Fire

Almost all say it is ok. The only issue I have heard of is firing pin breakage but IMHO you will be OK.
As for rimfire, almost always it is no as damage can occur. If you have any doubt of any kind in your mind just get some cheap snap caps or drill your primer and put in a piece of eraser of delrin.
Dry fire is a very important part of the learning process that is practiced by the BEST of marksmen.

 

[head2h2o]

Re: Dry Fire

I dry fire my centerfire rifles all the time. It will not hurt anything.

 

[ewoaf]

Re: Dry Fire

no

 

[kraigWY]

Re: Dry Fire

Hope not, I've been dryfiring my M1A since 1977, and my Series 70 Gold Cup (Bullseye Pistol) about as long.

So far I havent noticed any damage. Only time I used anything that resembles snap caps, would be in ball and dummy practice.

Except for rim fire, I wouldn't have a gun I couldnt dry fire.

 

[Aubie]

Re: Dry Fire

I have heard it is acceptable to dryfire a modern centerfire weapon.

I have also heard that the Ruger 10/22 (rimfire) is alright to dry fire (actually states it is ok in the manual I believe). This gun gets dry fired every time you finish a magazine since it does not lock the bolt back anyways.

 

[kentactic]

Re: Dry Fire

dry firing is perfectly fine and recommended. kick your friends in the nutts.

 

[daveog]

Re: Dry Fire

Dry firing is about the BEST training you can do. It teaches you trigger control, which is what most people dork up. It's cheap, easy, and you can do it in your living room. Keep dry firing and then go out shoot your idiot friends.

 

[Former0302]

Re: Dry Fire

General rule of thumb is center fire = okay, rimfire = not okay

 

[Niles Coyote]

Re: Dry Fire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: The Mechanic</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If you have any doubt of any kind in your mind just get some cheap snap caps or drill your primer and put in a piece of eraser of delrin.
Dry fire is a very important part of the learning process that is practiced by the BEST of marksmen. </div></div>

Let me add to this since your new and I want you to be clear... dont drill out a live primer... fired cases or new but not loaded cartridges.

 

[Former0302]

Re: Dry Fire

that would be a really, really bad day...

 

[CharlieTN]

Re: Dry Fire

Used to work with an olympic free pistol shooter. He dry fired approximately 10x as much as he live fired.

Pick up some snap caps (I prefer the ones that look totally different than a live round, either red or some other color) and have at it.

Charlie

 

[264shooter]

Re: Dry Fire

This does not answer the question of damage while dry firing,
however it does my dry fire practice more effective.

Thought you might be interested in taking a look at this.


http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2170458#Post2170458

 

[TwoGun]

Re: Dry Fire

There's nothing wrong with dry firing .22lr if the firearm has a firing pin stop (like the 10/22). Firing pin stops have been around for a long long time. Just need to find out if the particular gun your shooting has one.

 

[Meat Hunter]

Re: Dry Fire

I have dry fired every gun I have ever owned and that is a very big number. Only damage I ever did was to a couple 22's years ago. I had them fixed and sold them both. I won't keep any gun that I can't dry fire.

 

[Alaskaman11]

Re: Dry Fire

I guess my coach was all wrong then, we dry-fired the hell out of our 22. They were fine. I dry fire almost every day!

 

[M8541Reaper]

Re: Dry Fire

Dry firing is key for practicing your fundamentals. Everyone is exactly right when they say get some snap caps because now you are not only able to practice your trigger control, but you can safely work in malfunction drills and the various reload drills. Another good thing, speaking of drills, is to have your buddy load your mags for you at the range... But your buddy, while doing this will throw in the occasional snap cap. This will give you the unexpected malfunction and allow u to not anticipate a malfunction so that you may get some true hands on work.

-Mitch
3/2 SSP

 

[JimHanks]

Re: Dry Fire

"99% of the time it is the dope behind the gun...not the dope on the gun."

Never a statement more to the point!!!!!

On topic - dry fire every day. No problems.

 

[FamilyMan]

Re: Dry Fire

Maybe this has been answered and I didn't see it but can you dry fire the savage .17HMR rimfire with out damage?

 

[Intrepid4576]

Re: Dry Fire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jason Hathcock</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I'm beginning to understand that most of my buddies dont know crap about marksmanship /long range shooting! Seeing how most of my questions have been answered by serveral people the same way here on the forums and are completely different than what my buddies claim to be true, I think this is another one of those.

</div></div>

ive noticed this in relation to the people in my life also - a guy i work with has been hunting / shooting for 20+ years and i just started...but i started by reading on this forum - weve already disagreed on so much he just blatantly says i have 20+ years experience your wrong go away and crap like that lol....its kind of sad to me

my cousin owns a gun shop and has for 15 years .... he knows practically nothing and it just astounds me

this site has helped me learn the very limited / little bit i do know correctly and not some bs crap that is worthless and wasteful

 

[LRI]

Re: Dry Fire

Regarding rimfires:

CERTAIN rimfire actions are designed to be dry fired. The Anschutz 52 and 20 series actions being two that come to mind.

Feinwerkbau's, Bleikkers, Grunigs, Hammerli's, SeeHubber's, and Walthers are also designed like this.

I don't profess to know every 22 out there. Just the ones I've built/serviced/sold.

If the striker protrudes past the forward most face of the bolt, don't pull the trigger without a fired case in the chamber and/or a snap cap. If you do it will more than likely ding the breech and this will almost certainly kill accuracy to some degree. It'll wipe a big ol fat groove right down the driving band of the bullet.

There's no cardinal rules here. It depends on the design of the fire control.

Brownells sells an iron for fixing this. Costs about $25 bucks.

Beyond that, snap away.

Hope this helps.

 

[Mr Silverman]

Re: Dry Fire

The ayes have it. +1 for dryfiring. Army training tells you to do it with your M4 during concurrent training at ranges. Put a washer/dime/whatever on your barrel and dont knock it off with your trigger pull/squeeze. Its a quality training method.

Snap caps if you are scared....

 

[Intrepid4576]

Re: Dry Fire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Giles.S.Silverman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The ayes have it. +1 for dryfiring. Army training tells you to do it with your M4 during concurrent training at ranges. Put a washer/dime/whatever on your barrel and dont knock it off with your trigger pull/squeeze. Its a quality training method.

Snap caps if you are scared.... </div></div>

very neat idea ill give that a try - i have noticed myself moving the rifle due to trigger pull...still new still have alot to learn this should help

 

[fairdebtlawyer]

Re: Dry Fire

The only problem I've ever had with dryfiring was my Walther GSP .22. I broke 2 firing pins, one during a match. Guess it means something that the pin hits that hard steel breech pretty hard if no nice soft brass slows it down. I don't think they make GSP parts anymore and they aren't cheap to start with, so now I put a fired case in and change it every 10 clicks or so.

No issues with any of my centerfire guns. Even if there were, 1911 and AR (my two primary platforms) firing pins are cheap, abundant, and changed in under two minutes. Way cheaper than shooting 100% live ammo.

 

[adrenalinelife]

Re: Dry Fire

A bit strong on the nutting eh?

I guess they would get the point after that.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kentactic</div><div class="ubbcode-body">dry firing is perfectly fine and recommended. kick your friends in the nutts. </div></div>

 

[Irish Sitka]

Re: Dry Fire

Why would anyone dry fire a gun?
When I am putting my rifle away I hold the trigger down and close the bolt which takes the spring off the trigger.
Cannot see a need to be dry firing the gun.

 

[Lowlight]

Re: Dry Fire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pronsaios</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Why would anyone dry fire a gun?
When I am putting my rifle away I hold the trigger down and close the bolt which takes the spring off the trigger.
Cannot see a need to be dry firing the gun.
</div></div>

It is a training method used to teach the shooter how to properly press the trigger to the rear without having recoil.

Read a bit about the best shooters in the world and you will see their dry fire practice consists of at least 10 to 1 dry fires for every live round they shoot. There is no excellence in shooting without dry practice.

 

[timelinex]

Re: Dry Fire

When I try dry firing, it really doesn't do much. I've tried the nickel/dime method and I've tried zooming in to a small target. There is no movement in the the crosshairs or any movement from the dime/nickels. Even when I purposely pull the trigger to the side instead of straight back!

The only thing ive came up with is that I'm doing this on carpet, could it be that the carpet is absorbing the motion?

 

[Sterling Shooter]

Re: Dry Fire

Keep in mind, dry firing exposes shooter errors which are not as easily discerned from live fire exercises; plus, it is a means to recognize and enforce smooth trigger control and follow-through. With follow-through, maintaining focus on the sight, it is possible to call the shot; and, calling the shot allows for meaningful shooter/target analysis. The process is all about developing a consistent relationship between shooter, gun, and ground from the time a sight/target relationship is established to the time recoil has ceased. And, although the dime on the barrel trick might help a well meaning observer understand whether or not there was any movement of the rifle while the shooter executed the two firing tasks, the shooter needs to be focused on the sight. Also, a good coach will not need to be looking at anything being being balanced on a barrel either, instead, the highly qualified coach will simply ask the shooter," how did that shot look". What ever the shooter's reply, the coach will understand what recommendations to make to the shooter if any correction is needed.

 

[HPLLC]

Re: Dry Fire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sterling Shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Keep in mind, dry firing is a means to calling shots; and, calling shots allows for meaningful shooter/target analysis. The big idea is to build a position and get trigger control which produces zero dispersion. </div></div>

Great advice.

 

[clmayfield]

Re: Dry Fire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: timelinex</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> There is no movement in the the crosshairs or any movement from the dime/nickels. Even when I purposely pull the trigger to the side instead of straight back!
</div></div>

You aren't just assessing movement. It is good that you are cognizant of what your finger is doing to the trigger when you are pulling back. Too much or too little trigger may not cause your crosshairs to move off target when you dry fire, but add recoil and all of the vibrations that occur during live fire, and these little differences will make a difference on target.

The point is to be aware of all parts of your position as you pull the trigger. It will also give you greater awareness of the force needed to pull the trigger. You can focus on the consistency from shot to shot. Get up and then get in position again. Is your shoulder exerting more pressure than it was before on the butt stock? Are you pulling the rifle in with more force? Are you straight behind the rifle? Is the pressure that your cheek weld is exerting the same? Is your eye relief the same?

Go through the checklist every time. And after you pull the trigger, stand up and then get in position again. Just pulling the trigger a hundred times without breaking position is OK for learning your trigger, but that is all you are focusing on. By breaking position and then building it again, you can make mental notes of inconsistencies.

The big deficiency of dry fire is that it will nto teach you how to manage recoil well. You can work on dry fire all you want and practice follow through... you can build good habits here. But when it comes to managing recoil, the only way to do that (that I know of) is live fire.

But dry fire is cheap and it allows you to focus on elements of your position without worrying about recoil.

 

[Jethro3898]

Re: Dry Fire

I have a question for you guys:
I have a semi-auto (DPMS). Is it "okay" to dry fire a semi? If so, do I have to have a snap cap in?

I always thought it might be a pain to dry fire this gun being that it is a semi and not a bolt gun....charging handle and all. Is there a "trick" or is it just going to be the nature of the beast?

Thanks for any responses...I'm learning.

 

[Killer Spade 13]

Re: Dry Fire

I'll use and empty brass when I'm dryfiring to absorb the kinetic energy from the firing pin.

I'd much rather transfer that energy into a spent brass than the tip of my firing pin.

Just my take on things.

"An ounce of prevention, . . . ", and all that happy horse poop.

I don't hurt nothing, so I do it.

 

[Victor N TN]

Re: Dry Fire

I dry fire a lot. But I always keep a case with a fired primer in the chamber when I do.

 

[HPLLC]

Re: Dry Fire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Victor N TN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I dry fire a lot. But I always keep a case with a fired primer in the chamber when I do. </div></div>

A snap cap would be a good idea. Most military guns were designed to be dry fired.

I once put a fired case into a P17 enfield and the bolt locked up. It had to go to a gunsmith to extract the case, and the extractor was ruined in the process. That is the only time I ever put a fired case into a rifle, so I can't say whether that's a freak accident or something that might happen.

 

[T.Mihm]

Re: Dry Fire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Griffin Armament</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I once put a fired case into a P17 enfield and the bolt locked up. It had to go to a gunsmith to extract the case, and the extractor was ruined in the process. That is the only time I ever put a fired case into a rifle, so I can't say whether that's a freak accident or something that might happen. </div></div>

Probably a freak thing, although if the fired case was from a different rifle and the chambers were on way opposite sides of the size scale, I could see issues. I run every case through the action while I'm reloading to make sure I don't need to bump the shoulders back (EDIT)and haven't had one be stuck bad enough to not come out without a light tap with a cleaning rod. YMMV.

-Travis

 

[aaron burks]

Re: Dry Fire

Yes make sure the empty case came from that rifle.

 

[J-ROD]

Re: Dry Fire

Centerfires, I've always dry fired. Rimfires, it depends...my Ruger Mark III pistol has a pin to stop the firing pin but I don't trust it or the tolerances of the overall assembly to not dent up my chamber opening and ruining the gun so I always use #4 or #6 (I believe) plastic drywall inserts to dry fire rimfires. The fit perfectly and even eject like a spent shell.

On another note, I have been dry firing my 308 a bunch here recently and it's amazing how even without a shell in it, I can still feel myself tense up in anticipation for the boom/recoil. I am convinced it should be an essential part of my practice.

 

[BadDudes4Hire]

Re: Dry Fire

This is an ongoing debate. Most well known experts say that dry fire is not going to compromise the structural integrity of the rifle. But in small caliber rimfires, the f. pin is small enough that it could damage the pin. I tend to agree. But for some reason I always use snap caps. Just always have. I do know that there have been some instances where dry fire has chipped the firing pin retaining pin in semi autos.

If you dont believe in dry firing your rifle, chances are that you will never be a really good shot, or that you have already set your scope to compensate for that weird drift your shot makes to the right.