Night Vision Elevated / Unity-type Weapon Mount for SkeetIRx?

[TheHorta]

Anyone know if such a thing exists?

I’m building-out my Ultimate Lightweight Night Rifle — which I shall call “Nightlight.”

It’ll be based on a suppressed (of course) factory Noveske 13.7” SBR.

My primary choice of dedicated thermal weapon optic will be a SkeetIRx, but it can’t be on the standard Wilcox FTS mount, since it sits too low and the rail/suppressor take up the lower 1/3 of Skeet’s display. Aside from the suppressor, the only other things on the front of the rifle will be a SF M640DF 1500-lumen white light on a KAC MLok offset mount and a Unity Hot Buttom for said light. I don’t use i2 NV anymore, so IR is useless/worthless to me and, if I need it, Skeet has an IR laser.

So... I need something like the Unity Fast Aimpoint T2 riser, but specifically for the Skeet.

Are there any options out there?

 

[jeffl838]

Is it a black FTS mount? It's been a while since I've touched one but with a surefire rc2 and a 14.5, my skeetir and utm would both clear the weapon at 1 power. How long is your suppressor? The RC2 added like 5-6 inches from the muzzle if i remember right.

If you have to go with a riser, the only riser I'll use is from PRI (precision reflex). You would think a riser is easy enough to make, but I've had zero issues with a lot of others.

 

[TheGerman]

You lost me at 'I dont use nightvision anymore'.

 

[jeffl838]

Yeah ha living in thermal seems insane to me, but I haven't tried it so I can't knock it.

I've tried one skeet-ir and one 14. Has it's uses but a little narrow and not up my alley.

 

[TheHorta]

Dude if your done with NV sell me your Wilcox raid X

From my cold, dead hands!

@jwramp, please Photoshop a meme of Charlton Heston holding up a RaidX.

 

[SkyScrapin]

For what you're trying to do, the only option I'm aware of is the Wilcox FTS on a Unity. I have one mounted specifically on a Unity Riser... works great in theory, but the eye-relief seems a bit shallow for my liking. In clip-on, it also works great, so long as you're using other Unity height optics.

 

[TheHorta]

You lost me at 'I dont use nightvision anymore'.

It’s because you’ll never be a cool Kraut, like me.

 

[TheHorta]

For what you're trying to do, the only option I'm aware of is the Wilcox FTS on a Unity. I have one mounted specifically on a Unity Riser... works great in theory, but the eye-relief seems a bit shallow for my liking. In clip-on, it also works great, so long as you're using other Unity height optics.

Yeah, I was hoping to have a more elegant, dedicated solution. Chip says Unity has something in the works, but it’s going to be a while before it comes to market. They’re struggling with the same material supply issues many others are facing, and they are so far behind on current order fulfillment that there is relatively little bandwidth remaining for new / niche product development.

 

[jeffl838]

You know what, I did some more thinking, and I never had shadow because I mounted it in front of a day optic, so all the stuff at the muzzle was not in the optic's FOV. That being said, I also used an LA5 at the 12 o clock, which looking back, I don't recall it obstructing anything.

I think a riser or a custom mount is your best bet. Or, if you're gonna have a modlight, you might as well have a day optic - use the skeetir as a clip on for some sort of prism scope.

 

[SkyScrapin]

Yeah, I was hoping to have a more elegant, dedicated solution. Chip says Unity has something in the works, but it’s going to be a while before it comes to market. They’re struggling with the same material supply issues many others are facing, and they are so far behind on current order fulfillment that there is relatively little bandwidth remaining for new / niche product development.

Supply < Demand. They've faced that problem for years now.

 

[CTM1]

Dude, elegance has no place when you are battling the predators of the night. I can assure you they do not care what the rig that kills them looks like as they will never see it. Just do what works and do not worry about the photo ops. Do not be like that Ferrari owner that only rubs it with a soft diaper.
Just go with a Unity riser or LaRue riser and put the Wilcox FTS mount on that.

 

[TheHorta]

Dude, elegance has no place when you are battling the predators of the night. I can assure you they do not care what the rig that kills them looks like as they will never see it. Just do what works and do not worry about the photo ops. Do not be like that Ferrari owner that only rubs it with a soft diaper.
Just go with a Unity riser or LaRue riser and put the Wilcox FTS mount on that.

Stop! Stop! STOP!!!! Using common sense!

This is the internet. Get a clue!

 

[smellofcordite]

Horta,

Have you thought about doing a KAC skyscraper mount backwards and mounting the skeet in front of the red dot?

 

[TheHorta]

Horta,

Have you thought about doing a KAC skyscraper mount backwards and mounting the skeet in front of the red dot?

I wanted to eliminate a scope/RDS altogether and go straight with the Skeet as my dedicated TWS.

 

[TheHorta]

Screw it. I'm just going with the CRATOS. I rarely pop-off at anything beyond 200 yards.

 

[Mban2]

Yeah, I was hoping to have a more elegant, dedicated solution. Chip says Unity has something in the works, but it’s going to be a while before it comes to market. They’re struggling with the same material supply issues many others are facing, and they are so far behind on current order fulfillment that there is relatively little bandwidth remaining for new / niche product development.

larue has a skeet mount that is fixed. let me check the item number

 

[TheHorta]

larue has a skeet mount that is fixed. let me check the item number

 

[Mban2]

LT811

 

[TheHorta]

I'm familiar with that one. Same effective height as the Wilcox FTS mount + Skeet shoe.

That said, I wonder if there's a way to use the 4-screw hole pattern on that mount and use it with some other LaRue schwag.

Will have to talk to Mark.

 

[Mban2]

I'm familiar with that one. Same effective height as the Wilcox FTS mount + Skeet shoe.

That said, I wonder if there's a way to use the 4-screw hole pattern on that mount and use it with some other LaRue schwag.

Will have to talk to Mark.

good call, if you get any traction, let me know

 

[Hootiewho]

I had this made for the UTMx when I had it. I used a KAC Aimpoint micro base and had an adaptor plate drawn up and machined. It was a much more solid option over the Wilcox. Shims could easily be made to jack it up. Of course the footprint on the UTMX & SKEETIRX are different, but it probably wouldn’t be that difficult to fix that.

HEAT should have that prototype and the drawing FWIW.

 

[Hootiewho]

I'm familiar with that one. Same effective height as the Wilcox FTS mount + Skeet shoe.

That said, I wonder if there's a way to use the 4-screw hole pattern on that mount and use it with some other LaRue schwag.

Will have to talk to Mark.

Any decent machinist should be able to make you a shim plate with that hole pattern in it so you can raise it up to whatever height you want.

 

[TheHorta]

I had this made for the UTMx when I had it. I used a KAC Aimpoint micro base and had an adaptor plate drawn up and machined. It was a much more solid option over the Wilcox. Shims could easily be made to jack it up. Of course the footprint on the UTMX & SKEETIRX are different, but it probably wouldn’t be that difficult to fix that.

HEAT should have that prototype and the drawing FWIW.

View attachment 7392030

Needs to be about 1.5 inches higher for my intended use.

I'll call Roberto.

 

[Hootiewho]

Needs to be about 1.5 inches higher for my intended use.

I'll call Roberto.

With that KAC mount a shim plate could easily be made and all you'd need to do is custom fit the screws. I went with the KAC mount because it was already somewhat modular height wise.

 

[TheHorta]

This is what I’m aiming for, or facsimile thereof:

 

[CTM1]

Hold on here, are my eyes deceiving me or do you now have three SKEETS? If so, I am voting Biden for redistribution.

 

[TheHorta]

Only three... in that photo.

 

[MarinePMI]

An adapter plate would be easy to fabricate. If you lived nearby, I'd say swing by and I'd knock one out in about 40 mins. Less if it didn't need to be dilled and tapped.

That being said, you have how much invested in NV gear, and you don't have a bench mill? You're killing me smalls!

 

[TheHorta]

An adapter plate would be easy to fabricate. If you lived nearby, I'd say swing by and I'd knock one out in about 40 mins. Less if it didn't need to be dilled and tapped.

That being said, you have how much invested in NV gear, and you don't have a bench mill? You're killing me smalls!

I’ve been looking at small mills in the $3-5K range. I’ve never done any machining, so I’m not entirely sure what I’m looking at.

 

[MarinePMI]

I’ve been looking at small mills in the $3-5K range. I’ve never done any machining, so I’m not entirely sure what I’m looking at.

These aren't in stock right now, but I've worked on a lot of bench top mills, and for it's size this is one of the better ones for a beginner.

HiTorque Benchtop Milling Machine | Bench Mill

Get extra features in our popular HiTorque benchtop milling machine with this deluxe model. The premium bench mill includes a wider table and 7" tablet display.

littlemachineshop.com

Stout and rigid as hell for it's size. Takes R-8 collets (pretty much standard for large machines), a decent sized table and has variable speed for dialing it into what you need, without having to stop and change gears until you get that particular speed you need (because we all know "speeds & feeds" are recommendations that vary with the quality of the metal and the type of tooling being used). We used this same type of mill for the kids at the local FIRST robotics club/team, so it's taken it's share of abuse/misuse, and continues to work well (once the kids learn how to lay out and set up properly). You could do a lot worse.

Order the clamping kit and vise with it (save yourself the headache of ordering it separately).

Grab some 3/8" or 1/2" end mills and start making some chips. MSC will be your friend. (There's a lot of YouTube videos out there if you don't have someone to help show you the ropes.)

Remember, the cost of the mill is the small cost. Tooling is where you'll end up dropping a lot of coin over time (rotary tables, dividing heads, collet blocks, parallels, machinist squares, calipers, machinist rulers, lay out dye...it goes on and on).

 

[liaisons]

LT811

I'd be interested if you know of one for sale.

 

[TheHorta]

These aren't in stock right now, but I've worked on a lot of bench top mills, and for it's size this is one of the better ones for a beginner.

HiTorque Benchtop Milling Machine | Bench Mill

Get extra features in our popular HiTorque benchtop milling machine with this deluxe model. The premium bench mill includes a wider table and 7" tablet display.

littlemachineshop.com

Stout and rigid as hell for it's size. Takes R-8 collets (pretty much standard for large machines), a decent sized table and has variable speed for dialing it into what you need, without having to stop and change gears until you get that particular speed you need (because we all know "speeds & feeds" are recommendations that vary with the quality of the metal and the type of tooling being used). We used this same type of mill for the kids at the local FIRST robotics club/team, so it's taken it's share of abuse/misuse, and continues to work well (once the kids learn how to lay out and set up properly). You could do a lot worse.

Order the clamping kit and vise with it (save yourself the headache of ordering it separately).

Grab some 3/8" or 1/2" end mills and start making some chips. MSC will be your friend. (There's a lot of YouTube videos out there if you don't have someone to help show you the ropes.)

Remember, the cost of the mill is the small cost. Tooling is where you'll end up dropping a lot of coin over time (rotary tables, dividing heads, collet blocks, parallels, machinist squares, calipers, machinist rulers, lay out dye...it goes on and on).

I’ve been looking at this:

Yes/No? Worse/Better? Junk?

PM-30MV VERTICAL BENCH TYPE MILLING MACHINE w/3-AXIS DRO AND STAND FREE SHIPPING | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for PM-30MV VERTICAL BENCH TYPE MILLING MACHINE w/3-AXIS DRO AND STAND FREE SHIPPING at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

 

[MarinePMI]

Mechanically, it's the same machine (based off the SEIG SX.2 base model), but with a larger table and a wired DRO (vs. The BT one that the LMS one has via a tablet).

You have to decide your needed size/table, and weigh that against the rigidity of the column, as well as the finish. PM machines have a good reputation for value versus cost, but can be a bit rough on the finish. The LMS ones are pretty well finished, with added minor details that make using it easier (their quill stops, magnetic tool holders, little shit like that). Either will work for what you want, it just depends on how much you intend to use it, for what, and how precise you need it to be (without shimming or tramming things). The LMS ones I've seen in use, were in biomed and drone manufacturer's facilities. I'll let that speak for itself.

The gunsmithing forum is probably better place for this discussion, as there are people there with way more experience than me. I just screw around with my lathe and mill, and fab test fixtures and antenna adapter mounts for work. Since I work in R&D, having the right machines to fab or mod stuff really comes in handy, but I'm not a machinist or tool & die guy by training. I just shade tree gunsmith, and play around, making chips when I can (and it isn't too hot in the garage).

 

[TheGerman]

It’s because you’ll never be a cool Kraut, like me.

Youre only half kraut so therefore can only be 50% cool, at most.

AT MOST.

 

[jeffl838]

Crazy question, but on the tangent of living in a thermal world - does anyone know if the mh25 can see swir lasers? I know there's a swir mawl. Should be cheaper for current mawl owners (probably not) since you'll just need to swap heads.

 

[TheHorta]

Crazy question, but on the tangent of living in a thermal world - does anyone know if the mh25 can see swir lasers? I know there's a swir mawl. Should be cheaper for current mawl owners (probably not) since you'll just need to swap heads.

No. LWIR devices cannot “see” light emitted from SWIR devices — lasers, illuminators, strobes, etc.

 

[gthirteen]

So Larue Tactical has a product that would fit thread pattern on a SKEETIR-X, but doesn't make it anymore?

I can see that it would be a niche product, but shit, he has plenty of aluminum and machines to cut it. Charge $400 and I'd still buy one.

 

[jeffl838]

No. LWIR devices cannot “see” light emitted from SWIR devices — lasers, illuminators, strobes, etc.

I know some sensors pick up more out-of-band stuff than others. Even the faintest detection might be useful. I'm pessimistic on it too though. Almost certain it couldn't.

 

[deersniper]

Is it a black FTS mount? It's been a while since I've touched one but with a surefire rc2 and a 14.5, my skeetir and utm would both clear the weapon at 1 power. How long is your suppressor? The RC2 added like 5-6 inches from the muzzle if i remember right.

If you have to go with a riser, the only riser I'll use is from PRI (precision reflex). You would think a riser is easy enough to make, but I've had zero issues with a lot of others.

What issues have you had with other risers ?

 

[deersniper]

I had this made for the UTMx when I had it. I used a KAC Aimpoint micro base and had an adaptor plate drawn up and machined. It was a much more solid option over the Wilcox. Shims could easily be made to jack it up. Of course the footprint on the UTMX & SKEETIRX are different, but it probably wouldn’t be that difficult to fix that.

HEAT should have that prototype and the drawing FWIW.

View attachment 7392030

Is this for sale?

 

[jeffl838]

What issues have you had with other risers ?

Zero issues. Groups opening up.

Ie. Slap on riser. group is 2 moa. Take off riser. Group is 1 moa.

I did mount the riser forward in the pic slots to account for recoil driving the gun to the rear.

 

[deersniper]

What brands ? quick detach ?

 

[jeffl838]

The PRI QD seems to hold well for me. I had issues with YHM, Leupold mk6, larue QD and these risers I had in our arms room (army, not PRI).

GG&G looks a lot like PRI, I wonder if they're the same.

 

[TheHorta]

Youre only half kraut so therefore can only be 50% cool, at most.

AT MOST.

The cool half is the drunk Irish half.

So my general life principle is: OCD, but I’ll worry about it later.

 

[deersniper]

I had this made for the UTMx when I had it. I used a KAC Aimpoint micro base and had an adaptor plate drawn up and machined. It was a much more solid option over the Wilcox. Shims could easily be made to jack it up. Of course the footprint on the UTMX & SKEETIRX are different, but it probably wouldn’t be that difficult to fix that.

HEAT should have that prototype and the drawing FWIW.

View attachment 7392030

Want to sell that mount ?