Equipment for the New Reloader

zenbiker

zenbiker

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Minuteman
Nov 15, 2009
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Charlottesville, Virginia
#1
After talking with some Hide members who want to get into reloading, I'd like to start a thread on reloading equipment and how to use it. As usual, this is how I do it, and it's not the only way. My method has evolved to take the best from benchrest loading and streamline it to produce quality field reloads with minimum bench time. These methods take basic reloading techniques and add simple twists to achieve important goals of reloading: brass sized to fit your rifle, consistent primer pockets and flash holes, consistent powder weights to +/- .05 grains, consistent bullet pull and seating depth. To start, here's the list of materials I recommend for the basic starting setup including stock numbers and prices from Midway to get started with the 300 Win Mag:

1)RCBS Rock Chucker Master Kit 646-599 322.99 We're back on with the RockChucker Press

2)Lyman Flash Hole Unifomring Tool 729-748 11.99

3)RCBS Primer Pocket Brush 401-865 13.49

4)Lyman Primer Pocket Uniformer 388-732 16.49

5)Lee Cutter and Lock Stud 476-992 4.99

6)Lee Case Length Gauge/shellholder 695-045 4.99

7)Hornady standard Dial Caliper 822-768 30.49

8)RCBS Precision Mic 302-361 44.99

9)Forster Case Trimmer 614-276 74.99

10)Forster 0.3065" Inside Neck Reamer, custom order from Forster, about $22

11)Imperial Sizing Wax 519-525 7.49

12)Imperial Dry Neck Lube 319-390 5.99

13)Redding Competition Full Length Die set with Micrometer Seating Die. Accept no substitute.

14)Redding Universal Decapping Die 193-108 16.49

15)Lee Powder Measure Kit 943-305 8.29


Optional:
1) Upgrade to electronic powder measures
Lyman 1200 Digital powder scale and dispenser 279-731 280.49

or, electronic scale only:

PACT electronic digital scale, can add electronic dispenser later 707-006 119.99

So there's the equipment you need to get started and load the way I load. Over the next week or so I'll post step by step pics of how I reload. Understand, this is my way; there are other ways. This will get you started with a reasonable compromise between very basic reloading and extremely involved benchrest loading techniques.

Next: starting the process with new brass.
 
#2
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

I think the RCBS electronic powder measure is supposed to be better than the Lyman (see a review on 6mmbr.com) and is the same price now. Just a thought.
 
#7
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

OK, here's the first installment on "How To". I decided to go with video for the sake of clarity. Hope this works:

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#10
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

I think this thread's advice is generally good, but like Greg said, there's no reason not to let others chime in. No threads are ours... they are Frank's. He owns the site and thus he's the only one who says who can and can't post.

And one thing I will say, Greg's established himself, to me anyway, as a credible source, both as a shooter and as a person. Whenever I see a post of his, I usually will read it because I know that there's going to be some great wisdom there. More information is always better.
 
#11
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Cartman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think the RCBS electronic powder measure is supposed to be better than the Lyman (see a review on 6mmbr.com) and is the same price now. Just a thought. </div></div>

Yeah that's what I remember also, one more thing is Midway is good on price for some stuff and ridiculous for others, always shop around. I've recently been looking for Remington 7.5 primers and have found them to range from $27 to $60 per thousand.
 
#12
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

Decent list and good info, but as Greg pointed out it's not all needed, especially for the new reloaded like the title states. New reloaders typically start on a budget, so I'd save some money by eliminating numbers 8, 9 and 10. A couple other items are not have to owns, but they are cheap so $10 won't break the new reloader.

As for the Redding comp dies, they'll make life easier, but don't be fooled into thinking you can't make accurate ammo without them. The $30 Redding dies work as well. I only buy the competition dies now, but I've already spent thousands and bought all the other stuff. If I was starting fresh then I'd just buy the standard dies until I could afford better.

And as the upgrade, I'd recommend the Chargemaster over the Lyman any day.
 
#13
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I load to shoot. I shoot to enjoy the experience of shooting with others.</div></div>

The sport of reloading and the sport of shooting are not necessarily the same.

Thanks, Greg, for pointing that out. Like you, reloading is a means to the end for me. I only invest the time necessary to produce a stable, accurate round. I'm not shooting BR and do not have the need to add uber-steps in the process.

Merry Christmas!
 
#14
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1ZNUF</div><div class="ubbcode-body">After talking with some Hide members who want to get into reloading, I'd like to start a thread on reloading equipment and how to use it.</div></div>

Thanks for taking the time to put this project together. Especially the video. I hope this becomes a sticky because it has the potential to rise to that level of service. We'll see how it progresses.

Merry Christmas!
 
#15
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

Amazing to think there is only one "correct" way to reload. Reminds me of when I did a search on how to properly clean a rifle barrel. NOBODY, even top shooters will do it the same way. These forums are a valuable resource that we didn't have until relatively recently and using them cuts down on the learning curve dramatically. Thanks for the input.
 
#16
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

Here's the next little bit in this series. I was a bit perplexed that I am having to break up the process into so many pieces due to YouTube upload limits on size of each video, but maybe it's for the better. Please forgive the videography as I'm not only narrating, performing, acting as key grip, best boy, and WHERE THE HELL IS MY LATTE?
whistle.gif



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#17
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: vinconco</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Amazing to think there is only one "correct" way to reload. Reminds me of when I did a search on how to properly clean a rifle barrel. NOBODY, even top shooters will do it the same way. These forums are a valuable resource that we didn't have until relatively recently and using them cuts down on the learning curve dramatically. Thanks for the input. </div></div>

Thanks, andI hope you don't feel like I'm telling anyone these vids are the only way to go. They're just a guide of one way to reload based on what I've picked and chose nbased on the years of reloading I've done, the experience I've gained from other shooters, and my personal tolerance for what level I'm willing to take each step to. The goal here is to help a new reloader get started along that same path, hopefully to discover all the great options available to themselves, and decide what process they want to adopt. I do think, however, a new reloader benefits greatly from an experienced reloader to personally guide them, and for me it was my father and a former 11 Delta 30 named Vernon Harrison. Failing having those people around, hopefully something like this can serve as a the next best thing.

Regards,

Wes
 
#18
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

Next installment: Setting up the resizing die in the press and a few beginning pointers:

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#20
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

And case length trimming and deburring. Next video will actually be priming,dropping powder, and seating a bullet to produce a loaded round.

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#21
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jasonk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Decent list and good info, but as Greg pointed out it's not all needed, especially for the new reloaded like the title states. New reloaders typically start on a budget, so I'd save some money by eliminating numbers 8, 9 and 10. A couple other items are not have to owns, but they are cheap so $10 won't break the new reloader.

As for the Redding comp dies, they'll make life easier, but don't be fooled into thinking you can't make accurate ammo without them. The $30 Redding dies work as well. I only buy the competition dies now, but I've already spent thousands and bought all the other stuff. If I was starting fresh then I'd just buy the standard dies until I could afford better.

And as the upgrade, I'd recommend the Chargemaster over the Lyman any day. </div></div>

All true, and respect to you and Greg. Comments are more than welcome, but I hope to maintain a coherent process. You are correct about the Redding Dies, but over the life of the dies, the extra cost of the Redding is truly insignificant, and the Reddings are <span style="font-style: italic">my </span> personal preference and have my share of RCBS, Forster, and others; I'm not running out to replace them by any means, but if I had to get a new set of dies, I'd buy Redding. Like BAT Machine says, "Buy the Best and Cry Only Once"...

And to new loaders who may be using this thread as a guide, there are indeed as many ways to reload as there are reloaders, with techniques varying from Greg's Minimalist Approach to some truly mind-bending processes by benchrest shooters afflicted with what can best be described as severe OCD in persons needing to get a life. You may or may not adopt methods from either of these approaches; I'm just trying to present a video reference to get you started in a very enjoyable undertaking. Then you take it where you want.

To sum up, I'm not asking for special considerations from Hide members, I'd like to keep a coherent thread going here. If anyone wants to present a different approach, let's do it on another thread for both our sakes. I'm very open to areas of improvement and would welcome PMs to discuss them rather than run off on rabbit trails in the actual thread. However, if anyone sees anything in one of my vids that you feel is dangerous, pipe right in. It's tricky to do the whole production of such a procedure by oneself, and multitasking may lead me to misspeak or perform an unintendedly risky procedure, and we'll address that right away.

I hope this thread is considered a resource to the Hide, and thanks to all for their support and recommendations to help new reloaders.


Regards and Respect,

Wes
 
#22
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1ZNUF</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If anyone wants to present a different approach, let's do it on another thread for both our sakes. </div></div>

Good luck with that.
 
#26
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 30caluser</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thanks Wes!

Will you make videos all the way through load development with range time? </div></div>

Crap. I'm just realizing what a monster I created here. I guess the answer is potentially, yes. Let me try to get across a hopefully coherent method of basic loading first before going into advanced concpets like measuring chamber OAL, bullet jump, chronographing, etc.

Wes
 
#27
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

When starting know what your getting into , I love to load my own and will always enjoy reloading BUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I have easily $3,000 in all of the measures , trimmers, powder , primers, casings, tumpblers, vibrators, scales, priming units etc.

Its great and rewarding but EXPENSIVE to do it right !!!!!!!!!
 
#28
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Bill Stoffels</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When starting know what your getting into , I love to load my own and will always enjoy reloading BUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I have easily $3,000 in all of the measures , trimmers, powder , primers, casings, tumpblers, vibrators, scales, priming units etc.

Its great and rewarding but EXPENSIVE to do it right !!!!!!!!! </div></div>

Yes and no. I think all of us who have been at this for any significant period of time have at similar amounts invested, and probably a lot of new reloaders will eventually do the same. You don't need to spend that much to ge started and load well, and I hope not to turn off potential new reloaders with the notion that they will need to spend their kid's college funds on reloading equipment. So, Bill is right, you can spend buckets of dough on some pretty neat shiz for reloading, but not all up front. What I've listed will get you started in good shape.

Except for Greg, the McGuyver of reloading, who just nees a piece of spent brass, chewing gum, and a multitool to roll match grade ammo.
laugh.gif
 
#30
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1ZNUF</div><div class="ubbcode-body">1)RCBS Rock Chucker Master Kit <span style="font-weight: bold">ALERT: I am no longer recommending this press unless you can buy a used <span style="font-style: italic">Rock Chucker 2 press</span></span>.<span style="font-weight: bold"> It was brought to my attention that these presses (Rock Chucker 5) are now being fabricated in China and there are incidents of the press failing. I will post pics later. </span> </div></div>
My best information is that the current RCBS press is the Rockchucker IV(4). Has something more recent been announced? I can't find it on RCBS's website.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For now, I will solicit recommendations for new presses. </div></div>
I guess the Forster, Dillon and Lee guys will be along presently.
Who's up for the Sinclair or Harrell?
 
#31
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

I agree the newer RC presses aren't worth looking at. I have an RCII and bought a new one(RCIV) for a second press on the bench and ended up getting rid of it. The new presses are poor performers in my opinion. My old one is still running strong with no problems. If you want one of the good old presses now is the time to get them. Seen alot here and there on ebay and gunbroker. Also, see them at gun shows from time to time.
 
#32
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

I wish I had this when I started reloading, heck having the internet would have been nice too
grin.gif

Thanks for putting this together. I'll be passing it on to my son and his buddy.
 
#33
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

OK, we're back on with the Rock Chucker Press as my recommendation. Here is what made me pause:

Press2.jpg


This is a catastrophic failure, to be sure, but this is not a RockChucker press. <span style="font-style: italic"><span style="font-weight: bold">This</span></span> is:

rockchucker.jpg


Note the differences in the obviously more robust design and construction that I and many others have come to know and love. The broken press is probably a Chinese knockoff. I've never seen an RCBS press fail in this manner. Plus, true RCBS presses carry a lifetime warranty; if you don't believe me, get it right from the horse's mouth:

<a href="https://shop.rcbs.com/WebConnect/MainServlet?
storeId=webconnect&catalogId=webconnect&langId=en_US&action=ProductDisplay&screenlabel=index&productId=2854&route=C04J148https://shop.rcbs.com/WebConnect/MainServlet?storeId=webconnect&catalogId=webconnect&langId=en_US&action=ProductDisplay&screenlabel=index&productId=2854&route=C04J148" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">RCBS Products Rock Chucker Master Kit</a>

So, buy true RCBS and sleep easy; beware of knockoffs. Onward we go.



 
#34
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

The broken press is an RCBS <span style="font-style: italic">Partner</span>. It has an aluminum frame. There is no word on the locale of its current production, but it has been around since long before RCBS started out-sourcing some of its manufacturing.

The second press is a Rockchucker II(2). It has been out of production for a number of years and was a U.S.-made product.

The Rockchucker IV(4), the current product, is still inferior to the previously produced press.

The press that will become your champion will be of cast-iron construction, being either the Lee Cast Classic, the cheapest CI press, or the Forster Co-Ax, the most expensive CI press.

Some of us, however, use Redding.

Since we want a champion, perhaps we should consider the CH4D product that carries that name. It will be a proud contender. Massive.

Old Western Scrounger once offered the <span style="font-style: italic">Rock Crusher</span>, an excellent press for the really big ones. No standoffs in its makeup. Someone recently reported that it's available still from CH4D, possibly the producer of the original. I wonder if the rumor can be confirmed?
 
#35
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Winchester 69</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The broken press is an RCBS <span style="font-style: italic">Partner</span>. It has an aluminum frame. There is no word on the locale of its current production, but it has been around since long before RCBS started out-sourcing some of its manufacturing.

The second press is a Rockchucker II(2). It has been out of production for a number of years and was a U.S.-made product.

The Rockchucker IV(4), the current product, is still inferior to the previously produced press.

The press that will become your champion will be of cast-iron construction, being either the Lee Cast Classic, the cheapest CI press, or the Forster Co-Ax, the most expensive CI press.

Some of us, however, use Redding.

Since we want a champion, perhaps we should consider the CH4D product that carries that name. It will be a proud contender. Massive.

Old Western Scrounger once offered the <span style="font-style: italic">Rock Crusher</span>, an excellent press for the really big ones. No standoffs in its makeup. Someone recently reported that it's available still from CH4D, possibly the producer of the original. I wonder if the rumor can be confirmed? </div></div>

The pics I've seen of the new RockChucker look like the older models. What is it that is not as good? Nothing surpises me at this point about anything, but the RockChucker Master Package is a fairly priced starting point for the new reloader as well as having progressive loading capabilites (I have the progressive attachement and like it). Thanks too for that great rundown on the presses; I had forgotten about CH4D, I just got a set of dies from them.

Thanks,

Wes

P.S. I'm noticing a lot of RockChucker Model II Preses (the old ones) for sale on eBay right now.
 
#36
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

The newer Rockchucker, besides having a taller window, has an ambidextrous handle; the primer-catcher is also different. The shortcoming of the new presses is poor fit of the ram to the bore.

IMO, the press you're looking for is the Redding <span style="font-style: italic">Big Boss II</span>. It has a large, O-style frame for magnum-length cartridges, an excellent primer disposal system (a feature shared with the Co-Ax and other Redding presses), and high quality. I personally prefer Redding's smaller press (if anyone cares) for short cartridges (less work). Those who prefer a Co-Ax are certainly free to procure that one. Similarly, a <span style="font-style: italic">Champion</span> or <span style="font-style: italic">Rock Crusher</span> could also be in someone's future.

The shortcoming of most kits is that they aren't bargains if you start looking at the cumulative cost of their components. The one exception has been the Rockchucker kit. However, considering that the powder measure has little utility (unless you're loading handgun) and the quality of the new press, I don't see it that way anymore. Another twist is that the ChargeMaster Combo is working really well these days, giving it high utility for rifle loading. With it, the beam scale is superfluous. Then you take the handful of doodads that is thrown in that will be replaced with decent tools and substitute products, and you're ahead of the game just buying by the piece. Therefore, I don't recommend kits. Any of them.

That's the way <span style="font-style: italic">I</span> see things.
 
#39
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Nik</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Putting my 1st purchase list together...

Couple questions on 1ZNUF's main list:

1) Items 5 and 9, redundant or am I misunderstanding their use?
2) What's the primer pocket tool being shown in vid 1?

Nik </div></div>

Not sure about 1) as I have a Giraud trimmer, but a great primer pocket tool is the Sinclair with adapter for a drill.
 
#40
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Nik</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Putting my 1st purchase list together...

Couple questions on 1ZNUF's main list:

1) Items 5 and 9, redundant or am I misunderstanding their use?
2) What's the primer pocket tool being shown in vid 1?

Nik </div></div>

Items 5 and 9 are both case trimmers. #5, the Lee case cutter and locking stud, is very quick and efficient at trimming case lenght after sizing, and if you're on a tight budget to start, works great. I usually just use the locking stud to hold the case in a drill when I polish, anneal, clean up the flash hole, chamfer, and debur. I included the Forster unit to show how to ream the inside of the neck for uniform bullet pull. So yes, in a way, they are redundant.

The primer pocket uniforming tool is from Ken Markle of K&M Tooling, who makes some very nice precision tooling for advanced reloading. I substituted the Lyman tool as it is cheaper and readily available from Midway.


Hope that helps,

Wes
 
#41
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

Great videos, wish thread was named reloading tutorial. then the need to discuss over tools and equipment would be void and i would be viewing the next part of the series

Big thanks for the posted videos!!!!
 
#42
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

What gives you that opinion? I'd like to hear some more about why you think its the best single stage made.
For me, and this is an opinion, the snap-in, snap-out die changing concept is useless and more of a hinderance to me than an advantage. One may argue that screwing a die down with threads is time consuming and may lead to inconsistant indexing of the die body in the press, but in all seriousness I may spend four or five seconds screwing and unscrewing dies from my press. They stay screwed in for hours or days at a time while I go through my reloading operations. So, there is no real time saving benefit there. The disadvantage I see, is that with the snap-in, snap-out die changing system I can no longer use my 7/8" flat washers to shim the seater die above the press to clear the crimp groove. I could unscrew the locking ring, adjust the die so it does not crimp, and do all my seating operations; remove the die from the press, readjust the locking ring to crimping depth, and continue with my work...but it seems a bit time consuming. I'll probably get a Redding Big Boss II for my next single stage..
 
#43
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

WOW so much good info. ive only been loading for 2 years but when I started I bought the rcbs master kit, and a lyman electronic powder thrower. A friend who loads alot of one hole ammo, showed me the basics and told me just to follow the rcbs manual. I did just that untill i felt pretty good about my process. then I started reading threads on here and talking to people about neck turning, trimming and some of the more indepth processes. My humble advise take it slow and have fun.
 
#44
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

Winchester 69 said:
Old Western Scrounger once offered the <span style="font-style: italic">Rock Crusher</span>, an excellent press for the really big ones. No standoffs in its makeup. Someone recently reported that it's available still from CH4D, possibly the producer of the original. I wonder if the rumor can be confirmed?


I talked to the folks at CH4D today. They do sell the Rock Crusher. They have an aggreement to sell it for the Old Western Scrounger. They also made some modifications to it and the shipping weight is 112lbs. I think he said it was $1200 without dies. They don't list it on their website and I couldn't find a picture of it. But, they do have it. Cheers.
Click to expand...
 
#45
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

My personal opinion is to get the RCBS Rock Chucker Supreme kit and go from there.

When I started out, my wife bought me a Rock Chucker Supreme press and it took me quite a while to put everything together that I needed and I bet I spent a butt load more money doing it.

The one thing I can't possible speak enough about is the
RCBS trim mate case prep center... Holy Moly what a time saver. I love that thing. Well worth the money IMHO.
 
#46
Re: Equipment for the New Reloader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: CrystalVue</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I talked to the folks at CH4D today. They do sell the Rock Crusher. They have an aggreement to sell it for the Old Western Scrounger. They also made some modifications to it, and the shipping weight is 112lbs. I think he said it was $1200 without dies. They don't list it on their website, and I couldn't find a picture of it. But, they do have it. Cheers. </div></div>
NEAT! If you want an accurate, BIG press, this should be the one. NO STANDOFFS!

THANK YOU.
 
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