Ever happen to you?

[TommyD11730]

So, I have this Remington 700P in 308. Nice shooting rifle. However I guess I wanted to be one of the cool kids and start lusting for a detachable mag. The bottom metal as provided by HS Precision (rifle came in a HS stock ) is crazy $$$ IMO. I already have a MDT XRS on another rifle so I figure what the heck put the Remy in one too. Nice and redundant.
I had already worked up a mag length round that shot well in the rifle while in the HS. So, XRS shows up, I swap the action over and off to the range I go.
Right out of the case the rifles POI is a good 1inch low at 100y. The groups... not good. I would say double what the rifle normally shot.
I ran 20 rounds through the chronograph and didn't see any unusual FPS or spread.
So, my question is when going from one aluminum backbone stock to the other, do I need to workup an entire new load?

As a point of comparison when moving my 12FV to the XRS I had no such issues.

Thanks guys

 

[TurdFerguson]

So, I have this Remington 700P in 308. Nice shooting rifle. However I guess I wanted to be one of the cool kids and start lusting for a detachable mag. The bottom metal as provided by HS Precision (rifle came in a HS stock ) is crazy $$$ IMO. I already have a MDT XRS on another rifle so I figure what the heck put the Remy in one too. Nice and redundant.
I had already worked up a mag length round that shot well in the rifle while in the HS. So, XRS shows up, I swap the action over and off to the range I go.
Right out of the case the rifles POI is a good 1inch low at 100y. The groups... not good. I would say double what the rifle normally shot.
I ran 20 rounds through the chronograph and didn't see any unusual FPS or spread.
So, my question is when going from one aluminum backbone stock to the other, do I need to workup an entire new load?

As a point of comparison when moving my 12FV to the XRS I had no such issues.

Thanks guys

I had similar issues moving from an HS to a MPA chassis. I tried everything and ended up skim bedding the chassis. The recoil lug was floating until I bedded it. Fixed the problem but was a pain in the ass. Hopefully you don't have too, have you contacted MDT? They might have better suggestions.

 

[Hobo Hilton]

If the bottom metal (magazine) or the mounting bolts are taking the recoil rather than the recoil lug taking the recoil... That could possibly be the issue.

 

[TommyD11730]

I had similar issues moving from an HS to a MPA chassis. I tried everything and ended up skim bedding the chassis. The recoil lug was floating until I bedded it. Fixed the problem but was a pain in the ass. Hopefully you don't have too, have you contacted MDT? They might have better suggestions.

No Sir, only shot it today. I was wondering if it was common that you would need to work up a new load.
Oh, great user name by the way!

 

[Tokay444]

Everything that touches the system affects the system. Think of your system as a musical instrument and that makes more sense.

 

[TommyD11730]

Everything that touches the system affects the system. Think of your system as a musical instrument and that makes more sense.

I couldn't agree more. Maybe I got lucky on the other rifle.

 

[ShtrRdy]

I recently had to do this when moving my 300 WM barreled action from an HS Precision stock over to a previously bedded AG Composite stock. I basically had to start from the beginning with load development. I'm glad I did. It's shooting really well now.

 

[diggler1833]

Do you use a torque wrench on your action bolts?

Could be that your torque wass way different if you're just wrenching on it. Could be that your recoil lug isn't flush against the chassis. Could be that your action bolts are putting a bad load on your action after contacting the stock/bottom metal (I know there's a better term, but it is midnight and I'm under the weather).

My very first attempt at a precision rifle was an old Savage 10FP with plastic stock. It shot well, but I put it in a B&C to improve ergonomics. Groups opened way up with everythingi tried in it...ended up going back to the cheap plastic stock.

Couple years later I started pillar/skim bedding everything and using a torque wrench. Maybe I am lucky, but I've swapped barreled actions in many H-S, McMillan, and Manners stocks, and I've yet to have that happen again.

 

[huntnh]

I had the same problem moving a barred action to a chassis. Really had to play with the torque settings and make sure the recoil lug was seated properly. Eventually got it to work

 

[supercorndogs]

Most of the problems mentioned in this thread, are problems often caused by an action with a hump in it. When you tighten both action screws, it bends the action on the aluminum block or chassis. Most of the time, you can bed the tang and take care of the problem.

 

[TommyD11730]

Do you use a torque wrench on your action bolts?

Could be that your torque wass way different if you're just wrenching on it. Could be that your recoil lug isn't flush against the chassis. Could be that your action bolts are putting a bad load on your action after contacting the stock/bottom metal (I know there's a better term, but it is midnight and I'm under the weather).

My very first attempt at a precision rifle was an old Savage 10FP with plastic stock. It shot well, but I put it in a B&C to improve ergonomics. Groups opened way up with everythingi tried in it...ended up going back to the cheap plastic stock.

Couple years later I started pillar/skim bedding everything and using a torque wrench. Maybe I am lucky, but I've swapped barreled actions in many H-S, McMillan, and Manners stocks, and I've yet to have that happen again.

Yes, torqued with inch pound wrench to MDT''s spec.

 

[fdkay]

Most of the problems mentioned in this thread, are problems often caused by an action with a hump in it. When you tighten both action screws, it bends the action on the aluminum block or chassis. Most of the time, you can bed the tang and take care of the problem.

I have a 700 stainless action that, at one time, resided in an XLR chassis. It was equipped with a Shilen trigger, which I liked very much. I ended up with trigger issues, someone went to adjust the trigger for me, which did not resolve the issue (the trigger is also, now, really out of adjustment).
Trigger was replaced with a Jewel, we ended up bedding the action in the chassis.
I remain convinced that my action was likely being bent into conformity with the chassis, affecting the trigger.
It also shot much better after the bedding.
I believe this was a remington issue, not an XLR issue.

 

[supercorndogs]

I have had a few Remington actions with this problem. On all the ones I had, when I would tighten the front action screw, you could see the rear tang lift away from the stock. Then when moving to the back, you could see and feel it pull the tang down until it made contact, then snug up. Rather than bedding mini chassis stocks. I put them in regular stocks, installed pillars and bedded them. All shot great that way. All would make two three groups an inch apart before that. I never had any trigger problems, but I could see how if it was bad enough, or the hump was in just the wrong place, could put things in a bind.

 

[Defender32]

I noticed a similar instance years ago when I swapped an 700 ACC-SD into a McRee Chassis. I loosened both action screws up and stood the chassis on the but pad. bounced it down a couple of times and then alternated in torquing down the screws. I started with the front and went in 5 in lb increments all the way to 65. I never had another issue or understood why it worked but it did.

I now have a 223 in an XLR and did it similar but started at 20 and went tighter in the marked graduations on the fix it stick multi torque limiter. My load from the Bell & Carlson stock was same POI for 5 rounds once it was done.

 

[wpeach1912]

I noticed a similar instance years ago when I swapped an 700 ACC-SD into a McRee Chassis. I loosened both action screws up and stood the chassis on the but pad. bounced it down a couple of times and then alternated in torquing down the screws. I started with the front and went in 5 in lb increments all the way to 65. I never had another issue or understood why it worked but it did.

I now have a 223 in an XLR and did it similar but started at 20 and went tighter in the marked graduations on the fix it stick multi torque limiter. My load from the Bell & Carlson stock was same POI for 5 rounds once it was done.

I’ve heard a of a similar process too. Savage recommends doing that with their accustocks. Worked well on the savage that I have with an accustock

 

[TommyD11730]

Spoke to the nice folks at MDT. They said the XRS has no compatability issues with aftermarket triggers. They suggested working up a new load and trying again.
So, I reseated the action in the chassis. Rechecked the rail and rings torque.
Made up some ammo. Just a ladder style with 8 different loads.
I'll have at it again. This time I'll bring my torque wrench so I can mess with the stock worst case.

 

[TommyD11730]

I'll be honest with you guys, had say the groups DOUBLED in size I might buy Harmonics. However 2+ inch groups from a rifle that shoots .5 inch groups??? Don't buy it.

My bet is in the seating, but what do I know. Guess I'll find out soon enough though...

 

[TommyD11730]

Just a brief post update. Had the rifle back out today. Had 9 loads to run through it hoping it would like one of them.
Have to mention all I did was reseat the action in the chassis. Oh, and retorque the optics, rail, rings etc.
First load right out of the Sierra manual. 2.80" / 42.2 grains of 4064.

She's back.

The other 8 loads were decent too. Shot an avg .77" group today. That's about what it shot on avg in the HS Precision stock.

What went wrong last time? Not a clue. Will I still skim coat the action.. maybe.

Have a great day guys.

 

[ShtrRdy]

Thanks for the update. Glad to hear something made a favorable difference.