First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

[Cherns]

Hello everyone,
So I finally have the funds to start my first AR build. I have been waiting a long time to do this, and it will probably still take me a long time to complete, but I just wanted to go ahead and post my progress with this build so that
1.I may document it for anyone else trying to build their first AR
2.If I'm doing something wrong, or perhaps someone has a better idea for me, then they could be kind enough to assist me (I'm not a big newbie, I spend 5 years in the Marines so I've messed around with the M16, but I definitely am VERY far from any kind of expert).
I currently only own a R700 and a Mosin Nagant so this is kind of new territory for me. Opinions, criticism and just good ol' advice are very welcomed. So far all I have is a few parts and I'm still waiting on lots more to come in (but they are backordered) here's what I have so far...

GM-M6 5.56 NATO Fluted 16" barrel 1/7 twist
YHM upper receiver w/ forward assist & ejection port cover
Matech 600m BUIS

This is what I currently have on order, but it isn't shipped yet due to a few items being backordered.

Spikes Tactical BCG phosphate finish
YHM low profile gas block
YHM 4 rail fore arm - mid length
YHM Phantom 5C1 comp/flash suppressor
DPMS mid length gas tube
(the top 3 items are whats holding my order up)

So that's it so far, here's what I'm thinking for the lower and what-not.

YHM stripped lower (to match the upper) or a Spikes stripped lower perhaps
Palmetto State Armory's Gen 2 MOE lower parts kit
and their CTR stock kit also
MI flip up front sight
and of course a charging handle, nothing fancy.

One question I do have is, will I need a stock wrench to install the stock? I already have a DPMS multi-tool on order, will that be all I need?
That's about it for now, any thoughts? Opinions? Advice? I'll post pics of my parts and of the build process as it continues, but like I said, I'm not a rich man, so this may still take me a little while to finish, but hopefully not too long. Thanks everyone for your time.

 

[PowerstrokeOBX]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

what are you using it for?

For what its worth a upgraded trigger is really nice, I picked up Timney for a fair price and love it. The stock trigger was smooth but had a lot of travel and too much pull.

 

[Cherns]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

I'll be using it for fun mainly, haha, maybe for varmint hunting someday. I was thinking about an Aimpoint or perhaps an EOTech. I was looking into a trigger upgrade perhaps, like Spikes battle trigger or RRA 2 stage trigger, in the future.

 

[Cherns]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

Here's some pics of the receiver and barrel.

YHM receiver

Green Mountain barrel

The receiver is nice, no marks or anything, and the finish is good. I didn't find too many reviews/opinions on the barrel but I figured I'd give it a try anyways, so far it looks really nice and isn't to heavy at all. Once this bad boy has been put together, I will definitely post how it performed.

 

[branson1369]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

I have some really good ref. info in a spreadsheet and have been supplying a lot of folks with build components this year along with building my own AR 10 (MA-TEN) and I am happy to share info If you want the spreadsheet send me an e-mail [email protected].

IMHO best trigger upgrade right now is the new Wilson COmbat TTU 3 Gun. Well worth the price and a quality trigger is a must again IMHO

Semper Fi

 

[Cherns]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

E-mail sent! Thank you very much.

 

[Cherns]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

I have a quick question for everyone, how does ordering a stripped lower online work? Do I just go through the motions and order it like a normal part and then they will contact me about where to send it? Or is there more to it? I don't want to accidentally do anything wrong or illegal.

 

[Hawk45]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

Buying a lower stripped or otherwise is just like getting a complete gun.. it has to be sent to a FFL. Have your FFL send a copy of their FFL to the buying dealer. Dealer will send to your FFL where you pickup and fill out the normal paperwork when buying a gun. Uppers can be sent directly to your home.. no FFL or paperwork needed.

 

[branson1369]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

Hawk is dead on. I would suggest you contact your local FFL 1st to see the rate they charge for a transfer. I do them here locally very reasonably ($20/25 with up to 3 items included) but some guys are charging $50 to $75 to transfer. It is not smart for them to do that IMHO. But some are mad about margins going down and that damn internet. I have been wrong before but I think the internet has better than a 50-50 chance of staying and we as FFL's have to figure a way to work with it and our customers.

 

[NoName2010]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

Just buy your lower from a local FFL/Seller. By the time you pay the FFL to receive the lower for you, and he charges you for his time, you aren't saving anything by buying the lower online.

Buy the rest of the parts from reputable sellers online, and you can have them shipped directly to you. Beware of small online sellers, you may end up with junk parts, or get your credit card number stolen.

 

[branson1369]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

I am not usually one to respond back to negative generalities but the above comment warrants one IMHO. As a small FFL that sells a fair amount of guns, parts and accessories on line I think most folks find they receive better pricing, quality parts and a huge commitment to customer service. If the local brick and mortar store front was such a good deal and competent at providing service, the quality shops like mine would not exist and not get the positive comments we regularly receive. They would want you to believe the comments above so you continue to pay pre-internet markups.

Most all of the folks on the Hide that do group buys are small business like myself and we value our customers and our reputations. I cannot speak to folks on other yahoo forums but on the Hide you are dealing with real shooters and in my experience quality folks.

Just my perspective and 2 cents

 

[Matt.Cross]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: branson1369</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am not usually one to respond back to negative generalities but the above comment warrants one IMHO. As a small FFL that sells a fair amount of guns, parts and accessories on line I think most folks find they receive better pricing, quality parts and a huge commitment to customer service. If the local brick and mortar store front was such a good deal and competent at providing service, the quality shops like mine would not exist and not get the positive comments we regularly receive. They would want you to believe the comments above so you continue to pay pre-internet markups.

Most all of the folks on the Hide that do group buys are small business like myself and we value our customers and our reputations. I cannot speak to folks on other yahoo forums but on the Hide you are dealing with real shooters and in my experience quality folks.

Just my perspective and 2 cents</div></div>

+ 1 on that. As it turns out, Dave and I met and did business over the internet. I'd have never guessed that he is a local FFL dealer, but as it turns out, that's exactly what he is. There is tremendous potential for savings and an excellent customer experience when you deal with an online vendor in person, cheating yourself of that is simply poor judgement.

 

[Cherns]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Matt.Cross</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: branson1369</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am not usually one to respond back to negative generalities but the above comment warrants one IMHO. As a small FFL that sells a fair amount of guns, parts and accessories on line I think most folks find they receive better pricing, quality parts and a huge commitment to customer service. If the local brick and mortar store front was such a good deal and competent at providing service, the quality shops like mine would not exist and not get the positive comments we regularly receive. They would want you to believe the comments above so you continue to pay pre-internet markups.

Most all of the folks on the Hide that do group buys are small business like myself and we value our customers and our reputations. I cannot speak to folks on other yahoo forums but on the Hide you are dealing with real shooters and in my experience quality folks.

Just my perspective and 2 cents</div></div>

+ 1 on that. As it turns out, Dave and I met and did business over the internet. I'd have never guessed that he is a local FFL dealer, but as it turns out, that's exactly what he is. There is tremendous potential for savings and an excellent customer experience when you deal with an online vendor in person, cheating yourself of that is simply poor judgement. </div></div>

After all the shopping around I have been doing, I would have to agree as well. I have seen some pretty good deals from these "small time" online vendors and I appreciate what they are doing by not only trying to give you a good deal and make some money, but also by competing with the more major dealers out there, and I have to agree that their customer service is extremely superb, thats why I have no problems dealing with them. Granted though that there might be some "scummy" dealers out there, but you can usually tell them apart, due to their reviews and what-not, and hopefully they are far and few in between

.
On that note, I just ordered a Spikes Tactical lower receiver and I should hopefully be receiving it by the end of the week! Again, I really appreciate all the helpful advice from everyone here, thanks guys.

 

[Redmanss]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

Your use of having fun with it I fully understand (close range, hammer pairs, etc), but it sounds like you still want some good versatility out of it. As for the optics though, I'd look at the SWFA SS 1-4x before a Aimpoint or EOTech. Best of both worlds.....

S/F

 

[silver78]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

As someone who is just a customer of firearms and not a seller, I see small sellers of firearms and related parts like this.

Small sellers have a greater chance of being more extreme in the value of their deals. Many small sellers (the honest ones) often provide quality products at lower prices than the big guys. However, there are some small sellers who are less then ethical and they sell poor quality parts which are a bad value at any price for the buyer. If you choose the small seller route for your parts - be educated. Know your seller. If you just search the internet and buy crap from the seller who offers the lowest price you may be ripped off - and it's partly your fault for not doing your homework.

While I do buy some of my parts and firearms from the big guys (Midway, Natchez, Buds, Cabelas and even WalMart), I often buy things from the smaller shops that populate the internet. How do I find the good ones? I read - a lot - on boards like this one. If you know what you are looking for and who to deal with the small sellers offer great value. The one thing you can get from an honest small seller that is not available from the big guys is service and advice.

 

[Cherns]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Redmanss</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Your use of having fun with it I fully understand (close range, hammer pairs, etc), but it sounds like you still want some good versatility out of it. As for the optics though, I'd look at the SWFA SS 1-4x before a Aimpoint or EOTech. Best of both worlds.....

S/F </div></div>

All right, you caught me

yeah, not only would I like to use it to "mess" around with but I would also like to get some precision from it as well. I was considering a magnifier for any red dot I might get, but lately I have been looking into the low power scopes like the Nikon Monarch African, Burris Tac30/XTR, Millet DMS, Vortex PST, and of course the SWFA. The only thing is that I also want to be able to take the scope off quickly so that I can use the iron sights if I ever needed/wanted to. So my questions are, do they make a quick release mount for these type of scopes? Which mount would be ideal for these scopes? How easy is target acquisition with a scope like this? And which ones do you guys think would be good, since I only mentioned a few and I'm sure you all know of more out there, and ones perhaps with a better reticule? Thanks again!

 

[prplhaz72]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

Kit #3, it comes with a quick detach mount that lets you take it off in a second. And it returns to zero every time.
http://www.opticstalk.com/extensive-swfass-group-buy-incredible-savings_topic28845.html

I have two of them and really like them. I have shot and made hits out to 860 yards with mine on my AR. And its as fast as an aimpoint up close.

Out of the ones you mentioned the SS 1-4x is the best, hands down.

 

[litotes15]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

Cherns, dpms multi tool should work great for stock assembly and work great on:Install and Disassemble Free Float Tubes
Install and Disassemble Barrel nut
Install and Disassemble Compensator
Install and Disassemble Barrel Extension Tube
Install and Disassemble Carbine Stocks
1/2" Drive for Socket

Can't go wrong with spikes tactical!!! Great product and awesome customer service. Sounds to me like your well on your way and on the right path... One thing to think about adding depending on the amount your thinking about shooting is a gas piston conversion. Direct impingement is slowly dying out and for good reason. It gives you the rely of Ak with all the perks of Ar platform....JMHO

 

[Cherns]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: litotes15</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Cherns, dpms multi tool should work great for stock assembly and work great on:Install and Disassemble Free Float Tubes
Install and Disassemble Barrel nut
Install and Disassemble Compensator
Install and Disassemble Barrel Extension Tube
Install and Disassemble Carbine Stocks
1/2" Drive for Socket

Can't go wrong with spikes tactical!!! Great product and awesome customer service. Sounds to me like your well on your way and on the right path... One thing to think about adding depending on the amount your thinking about shooting is a gas piston conversion. Direct impingement is slowly dying out and for good reason. It gives you the rely of Ak with all the perks of Ar platform....JMHO
</div></div>

Excellent! Thanks for the info on multi-tool. Yeah, I have heard/read many good things about Spikes' products and customer service and I like their logo too, haha. As far as the piston system, while I do plan to shoot it a good amount, is a piston system really worth it? I have read that it's kind of "a solution to a non-existent problem", which to me means that AR's have always been DI and worked just fine as long as you clean and maintain them well. Don't get me wrong, I agree that the piston system seems like it would make the life of the AR much longer and make cleaning much easier and less frequent, but the cost of a piston conversion is what makes me not really want one. I don't mind cleaning my rifle right after shooting it, heck I did it all the time in the Marines, and for hours sometimes! (Damn armorers wanting spotless rifles! hahaha) What are some decently priced, and good, piston systems? Any ones I should take a look at?

 

[prplhaz72]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

I have went well over 1000 rounds with my 1 AR without cleaning it, and never had a malfunction. About half of that was wolf ammo too.

I have also looked into the piston systems pretty heavily. From my research the best bolt on system is the Adams Arms. I just cannot justify the near $300 price tag for it though. Especially when I just don't have any issues with the DI stuff.

 

[branson1369]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

The piston IMHO throws off the front end balance, Plus I have no issues with DI either

 

[litotes15]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

Cherns, Adams Arms was the exact manufacturer I was going to recommend. Conversion kit runs $250 or complete upper w/ crome moly 1:7 16" including bolt and T handle.. Great upper!!! Brownells also has kit for $150. Only brought It up as option.. Defiantly not telling you it's a must have, just a nice extra. Alot of guys say stick to DI cause it's not broke and if has worked for you all this time then stick to your guns...I have personally done one,was spoiled,and won't turn back. Good luck with the rest of your build.

 

[litotes15]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

Fast forward to the 2:00 mark. It is about 8 mags in at this point... Direct impingement...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJZFJaGycR8&feature=youtube_gdata_player

 

[Cherns]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: litotes15</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Fast forward to the 2:00 mark. It is about 8 mags in at this point... Direct impingement...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJZFJaGycR8&feature=youtube_gdata_player </div></div>

HOLY HELL! That was pretty gnarly. At least even though it caught fire, it still kept going, hahaha. He must have put over 1000rds through that bad boy in those 5 minutes.

 

[litotes15]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

I have another video somewhere have to dig a bit, but another DI vs piston driven theme. It involves getting water in barrel. Gas piston fires like normal and DI literally explodes. The bolt grenades the entire upper receiver!!The guy has on a blast suit.

 

[litotes15]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

Ok I found it. Please watch entire video, but the big bang goes down at 00:51. Let me know what you think. Nice comparison of DI vs piston driven.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjMH94PuT_I&feature=youtube_gdata_player

 

[Cherns]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: litotes15</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ok I found it. Please watch entire video, but the big bang goes down at 00:51. Let me know what you think. Nice comparison of DI vs piston driven.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjMH94PuT_I&feature=youtube_gdata_player </div></div>

Geez man! What are trying to do, "scare me straight" or something, haha. That was some pretty impressive shit by the HK... and the Colt! I am going to give the piston system a bit more consideration before completely ruling it out. I mean, I know I probably won't be putting over 1000rds through my AR on full auto, or be submerging it in water and then trying to fire it right away, but I see where your coming from (and who knows maybe one day I might be doing something like that, hahaha). Thanks for all your input and for the sweet/crazy vids!

 

[litotes15]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

No problem man enjoy!!!! Hope they provided a little more insite.

 

[USACS]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

If you fancy a piston system, do not buy a bolt-on system. A piston system is not native to the AR platform. It was specifically designed to run DI. When you add in a system, you need an integrated system that was built around the piston setup. A Barret, POF or LWRCi, for example. Of the problems typically experienced by piston ARs, those have the fewest instances of problems. On the other hand, bolt-on systems like CMMG and Adams are more prone to the problems associated with piston systems (heavily related to bolt carrier tilt and the piston impact on the top of the bolt).

There is a significant amount of info indicating the reliability of the DI system. I have several ARs that have been extremely reliable. Every AR I've built for a customer or coworker has been extremely reliable. The key is to use quality components and not cheap out or try gimmicks that unproven. The key is also to use quality lubrication. I have seen more problems arise from the use of CLP than I have from legitimate mechanical issues (magazine-related issues excluded). FWIW, get yourself some Slip2000 EWL, as well as their Carbon Killer and 725 Cleaner/Degreaser. It'll make your life easier.

Also, if you plan on getting the YHM Phantom 5C1 comp/flash suppressor, understand that it is a flash suppressor. Calling it a "comp" is overly generous. I have run one similar on an SPR, and it works decently for flash reduction, but recoil management is not tangible. It's a good start, but there are comps out there that would serve your purposes better. I'm a huge fan of BattleComp and SureFire brakes. If you want something more affordable, a gem of a dual-role brake/flash hider that few know about is the RainierArms XTC ($57).

 

[Cherns]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: USACS</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If you fancy a piston system, do not buy a bolt-on system. A piston system is not native to the AR platform. It was specifically designed to run DI. When you add in a system, you need an integrated system that was built around the piston setup. A Barret, POF or LWRCi, for example. Of the problems typically experienced by piston ARs, those have the fewest instances of problems. On the other hand, bolt-on systems like CMMG and Adams are more prone to the problems associated with piston systems (heavily related to bolt carrier tilt and the piston impact on the top of the bolt).

There is a significant amount of info indicating the reliability of the DI system. I have several ARs that have been extremely reliable. Every AR I've built for a customer or coworker has been extremely reliable. The key is to use quality components and not cheap out or try gimmicks that unproven. The key is also to use quality lubrication. I have seen more problems arise from the use of CLP than I have from legitimate mechanical issues (magazine-related issues excluded). FWIW, get yourself some Slip2000 EWL, as well as their Carbon Killer and 725 Cleaner/Degreaser. It'll make your life easier.

Also, if you plan on getting the YHM Phantom 5C1 comp/flash suppressor, understand that it is a flash suppressor. Calling it a "comp" is overly generous. I have run one similar on an SPR, and it works decently for flash reduction, but recoil management is not tangible. It's a good start, but there are comps out there that would serve your purposes better. I'm a huge fan of BattleComp and SureFire brakes. If you want something more affordable, a gem of a dual-role brake/flash hider that few know about is the RainierArms XTC ($57).
</div></div>

Thank you so much for the words of wisdom, I certainly appreciate your input, especially since you build rifles for people. As for the RainierArms XTC, that is a fine looking brake/flash hider, I am adding it to my parts list for sure haha. I'm not necessarily trying to build a "cheap" rifle, just not an "expensive" one, one day yeah maybe I'll be able to afford something super nice, but for now I'm happy with something just nice, so also if anybody else has any "upgrades" they think I could/should make to my parts list, please feel free to educate me a little, I enjoy it! Thank you again everyone for everything, I am learning so much from this thread and forum, I hope to pass on my knowledge one day as well

 

[Cherns]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

Just got my lower in and I was wondering what you all thought about Mako's magwell grip? I tend to hold my rifle by the magazine well already and I was wondering if this would be worth the investment or if it is just a "waste" of money?

 

[hk dave]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

Build looks good... looks like you have the necessities covered.

 

[litotes15]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

here are some issues that have been brought up on the mako magwell grip: 1. beta mags will no longer work, too big.
2. p mags will stick/not drop free without some modification
3. disclamer on package and web site that some lowers(spikes being one of them...bummer) will need to be modified with dremel tool to fit.
Positive: 1. allows for faster mag insertion due to flared opening
2.some say more comfortable shooting position

so I guess its a personal preference on how you hold and shoot the best. good luck on the rest of your build.

 

[Cherns]

Re: First AR/AR-build ever (opinions/advice welcomed!)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: litotes15</div><div class="ubbcode-body">here are some issues that have been brought up on the mako magwell grip: 1. beta mags will no longer work, too big.
2. p mags will stick/not drop free without some modification
3. disclamer on package and web site that some lowers(spikes being one of them...bummer) will need to be modified with dremel tool to fit.
Positive: 1. allows for faster mag insertion due to flared opening
2.some say more comfortable shooting position

so I guess its a personal preference on how you hold and shoot the best. good luck on the rest of your build. </div></div>

Dang, what a shame, haha. Thanks for the info, I'm glad I asked before making a decision.