Planning on a 22" 6.5 Creedmoor with a Heavy Varmint contour and JEC Brake. I'm not familiar with the 6.5 but I noticed that most rifles are 24'" or longer. Does the cartridge like a longer barrel? I'd like this rifle to reach out where my 308 can't (+800 yards). So by going 22", should I consider the loss of velocity, assuming that I'd like to shoot a 140gr bullet? So I guess I'm trying to compare a 22" vs. 24" or 26". Seems like a good topic because some guy like to go with shorter barrels. Or am I over thinking 2 inches?
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First Build, 22" 6.5 Creedmoor. Thoughts?
- Thread starter TygerAR
- Start date
I think some of the top builders use 22. I'm going with 26 for the little extra velocity. I should note that this rifle will only be used on a bench or prone so I'm not worried about the length. If I had plans of using it in tactical matches I would probably go with 22.
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22" is a great length. You can hot rod it a little if you just have to have that particular velocity number. I'm running a 23" barrel with 140 Hybrids and seeing 2830 over a Magneto V2.
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I have a 21.5" barrel on one of mine and it is a hammer. Will be my hunting rig this season. It makes it out to 1200 no problem with 140 Amax. Last time I shot it I had first round (actually first 5 rounds) hit(s) at 1200. It is a pleasure to haul around compared to my 26" barrels. A lot more manageable than my longer barrel rifles once I put my can on it too.
I have a 22" sendero on mine. Shoots great. However, I find myself wanting a little in the velocity department. So next barrel will be 24" just so I don't have to hotrod stuff to get it where I want. But if a 22" and the given velocities and weight of the barrel meet your needs. Go for it.
i would guess you'd lose 100fps-ish if you didnt push the limits of the cartridge. 22" is nice to have and the weight saved over 4" is decent. Although heavy varmint is pretty heavy to begin with.
You can always cut back a longer barrel to 22" if you find it too long but if you find that 22" not giving you the velocity you need then you are stuck. Barrels are different and just because someone is using a 22" and getting good velocity doesn't mean you will. Just something to think about.
Also I ran a 28" barreled 6.5 Creedmoor at tactical/sniper comps for years and my Creedmoor is 26.5" now so don't think you need to have a short barrel to run it in matches. Most shooters shooting and winning those matches have 24+ barrels.
You will not lose anywhere near 100 ft/sec. I have a 22" barrel on my hunting 260 and it was less than 50 ft/sec slower than my 26" match rifle. Go for it. I'm never going over 22" again. Love the balance of a rifle with a shorter barrel more than the insignificant velocity gain.
My 6.5CM were always 26" and benchrest guns. Recently I had a hunting rifle and a tac rifle built with 22" barrels. My 22" tac rifle is almost an exact replica of your build plan and I am extremely pleased with it.
I have found that, like 308, 6.5CM does very well in short barrels. All of my loads go downrange at well over 2700fps out of the 22" barrel, which is plenty enough to make good hits at 1,000 yards. If this isn't a benchrest gun, I say go for the short barrel.
I have found that, like 308, 6.5CM does very well in short barrels. All of my loads go downrange at well over 2700fps out of the 22" barrel, which is plenty enough to make good hits at 1,000 yards. If this isn't a benchrest gun, I say go for the short barrel.
You might want to consider a different contour. Hvy Var. is what it says - HEAVY. The purpose of a 22" barrel is lighter, balanced weight. If you run the barrel stiffness numbers on a 26" Hvy Var. vs a 22" Remington Var., the 22" Remington Var will be stiffer AND a ton lighter. Why? Because barrel length is exponentially more important than contour for stiffness. In other words, the lighter Remington Var offers plenty of stiffness at 22" to shot bug-holes, and therefore saving you a lot of weight over a 22" Hvy Var. The Hvy Var at that length is just a lot of extra weight for little gain.
Also, you might want to check out the 130gr bullet weights. Well-made 130gr's offer BCs very close to the 140gr, while they can be pushed at significantly faster MVs, thus giving you back some of the lost of MV from the longer barrel.
Just two thoughts. Best of luck w/ your build.
Also, you might want to check out the 130gr bullet weights. Well-made 130gr's offer BCs very close to the 140gr, while they can be pushed at significantly faster MVs, thus giving you back some of the lost of MV from the longer barrel.
Just two thoughts. Best of luck w/ your build.
My 6.5CM were always 26" and benchrest guns. Recently I had a hunting rifle and a tac rifle built with 22" barrels. My 22" tac rifle is almost an exact replica of your build plan and I am extremely pleased with it.
I have found that, like 308, 6.5CM does very well in short barrels. All of my loads go downrange at well over 2700fps out of the 22" barrel, which is plenty enough to make good hits at 1,000 yards. If this isn't a benchrest gun, I say go for the short barrel.
Which stock is that?
I have a 28" barrel on my creedmoor and my best accuracy seems to be closer to 2700 fps.
My second in progress is going to be a 24" so go 22 and we can compare.
My second in progress is going to be a 24" so go 22 and we can compare.
J Allen Enterprises . Manufacturer of Precision Rifle Stocks | J. Allen Enterprises, Inc. (JAE)
After waiting 18 months, I'm about to take delivery of a Long Action next month.
Yes, I've been thinking about going with a lighter contour. Thanks for your input.
I'm Happy with that. Looks like the bullet will stay supersonic a little past 1300yd. 2700fps was always my goal.
I have 2 Creeds one in a gas gun with a 20" barrel and one in a bolt with a 16" barrel and both shoot very well out to a K.
In most cases it's 30 fps per inch. If the main goal of the build is long range why not start at 26 or 28 inches? You can always cut it down but you can't add inches later.
My Savage match rig has a 24" 6.5CM and once the 9" can gets screwed on, she is long. Keep that in mind if you ever plan to shoot suppressed.
I went with a 18" bbl for the Tikka build as it would be used for both hunting and matches.
I went with a 18" bbl for the Tikka build as it would be used for both hunting and matches.
i am running 2860 with 140 hybrids out of my 26" bartlein. i have no interest in giving up 100fps or so to have a 22" barrel.
I have a fluted Medium Palma at 22" on my hunting rifle in 26. With optics and bipod, it weighs in right at 10 lbs and balance is perfect. It is a real joy to shoot from field positions and again, less than 50 ft/sec difference from a 26" barrel with the same load.
A 24-26" palma contour will be lighter and better balanced then a 22 HV barrel. If u are going to run suppressed then 22" would be ideal. I don't see the allure of these super short barrels, u basically hamstring hi performance cartridge. Run a longer barrel and ur brass life and throat life will improve quite a bit.
22" is "super short"?
I really don't get the "less than 26" handicaps the cartridge" arguments. Sure you sacrifice velocity, but 1. the same holds true for 308 and 2. unless you are competing, does 100fps really matter that much if a slightly shorter/lighter/more maneuverable rifle is the objective over sheer external ballistics?
18" 6.5 Creedmoor gives 2640 with factory 140s...yup that's way slower than a 26" barrel but ballistically whoops up on most any other caliber from the same (or longer) length barrel. Different jobs require different hammers and all that, but sure seems like a pretty good"multipurpose" option to me...
I really don't get the "less than 26" handicaps the cartridge" arguments. Sure you sacrifice velocity, but 1. the same holds true for 308 and 2. unless you are competing, does 100fps really matter that much if a slightly shorter/lighter/more maneuverable rifle is the objective over sheer external ballistics?
18" 6.5 Creedmoor gives 2640 with factory 140s...yup that's way slower than a 26" barrel but ballistically whoops up on most any other caliber from the same (or longer) length barrel. Different jobs require different hammers and all that, but sure seems like a pretty good"multipurpose" option to me...
My latest, a 22.5 Light Palma 6.5x47. So far my fave all around. I likely will never go heavier again, BTDT. Also, next may be 21-21.5 as I originally planned.
A Light Palma at 22 is a great all around in 6.5, IMHO.
Good luck. Oh, that was a Bartlein - IF it matters.
A Light Palma at 22 is a great all around in 6.5, IMHO.
Good luck. Oh, that was a Bartlein - IF it matters.
Running some numbers using one of the higher BC 6.5 bullets the Berger VLD 140 at 2640 and a Hornady .308 178 BTHP at 2700fps at 1000 the numbers come in 9.3 mils of elevation and 2 mils for 10mph wind VS 10 mils of elevation and 2.5 mils of wind. Wouldn't call that whooping up but a little better. Comparing to my 140 AMAX load at 2930fps which is 7.7 mils and 1.9 mils of wind. If the Berger was going my speed the numbers would be 7.3 mils and 1.7 mils of wind.
Yes people should buy what they want and need for their purpose but they should go in eyes open and know what they are getting in the end especially when spending hard earned money on a build.
Yes people should buy what they want and need for their purpose but they should go in eyes open and know what they are getting in the end especially when spending hard earned money on a build.
Not exactly apples-to-apples; how realistic is 2700fps with a 178 from a 18" barrel or even a 22" barrel?
Sure it is. My 20" .308 gets 2725fps with Varget. 22" is closer to 2750. I used 2700 to drop that a little.
Sure it handicaps them, if a rd can go 2850 out of a 26" barrel or 2640 from an 18" isn't that handicapped. I'd say so, it lost 200 fps. My point was to get a reasonable contour with some length for performance, as opposed to a short truck axle that will weight more. Sorry it wasn't clear for u boiler. My other point is that some guys that run short barrels will eventually hot em up to get that lost velocity. That's fine and good but don't expect ur throat or brass life to be good. Kinda like people that try to get interweb velocities and then complain when primer pockets are gone in 2-4 firings.
Rob could you post your load data for 2930fps? Not trying to call you out, just curious.
Fwiw I have a 22" barrel and get 2715fps with 42g h4350. I went up to 43ish and started to get heavy bolt lift.
I'm completely happy at 2715. Using shooter for 1k it calls for 9 mils up and 2 mils for 10mph wind. Keeps me supersonic to 1400+.
I don't mind giving up a tenth of a mil wind that I probably can't hold and definitely can't call.
Fwiw I have a 22" barrel and get 2715fps with 42g h4350. I went up to 43ish and started to get heavy bolt lift.
I'm completely happy at 2715. Using shooter for 1k it calls for 9 mils up and 2 mils for 10mph wind. Keeps me supersonic to 1400+.
I don't mind giving up a tenth of a mil wind that I probably can't hold and definitely can't call.
Sure. 43.5grns of H4350. Nobody should start there obviously as it might not be safe in their rifle. Work up as usual when finding a load.
Criterion 26" 43.0gr h4350 140amax ran 5 loads between 2885 and 2900. Inputed 2875 in Shooter and gets me first round hits at 800. Far as I've taken it out so far. I wish I'd have gone with 22" after seeing that. Rifle is way long suppressed.
I'm running 43.2 of H4350 .020 off the lands with 140 Hybrid and Fed 210M primer. It gives me an average of 2830 from a 23" Melonited Bartlien barrel.
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I believe Hide Member Bohem is running a very similar charge in his 6.5CM that is 22.5" ... he is getting around 2830 w/ the 140gr Amax.
I have a GAP 6.5 Creedmoor and I am running the 140Amax, basically duplicating the factory load, I get 2800 fps out of it and it will shoot sub .5 moa...I am sure it can do even better with someone better shooting it. I also wanted a little shorter barrel and I run a 30P-1 on it a lot. In december I was in Nevada shooting 1227 yards without a problem.
I spoke to George, Lowlight and others via email trying to decide on length, the consensus is 20" or more and you won't have any issues. My rifle with AI AX stock, S&B 5-25 and 22" Gap # 7 barrel weights in at 18 lbs. If I went to an even longer barrel I might have hit the 20 lb range which is way to heavy for what I want to do.
I am actually going to have GAP build another rifle in 6.5 Creedmoor for me but this time with a 20" # 7 profile barrel and Manners folder, I want a more compact and light weight rifle when portable is more important.
Fact is I get to shoot out past 600 only a few times a year and a 20" will easily reach 1000 yards so smaller and lighter is better. If you only care about smallest groups or really long range then go with a 26-28" barrel. If over 1000 yards is your priority there are better calibers for that distance.
Just my 2 cents
I spoke to George, Lowlight and others via email trying to decide on length, the consensus is 20" or more and you won't have any issues. My rifle with AI AX stock, S&B 5-25 and 22" Gap # 7 barrel weights in at 18 lbs. If I went to an even longer barrel I might have hit the 20 lb range which is way to heavy for what I want to do.
I am actually going to have GAP build another rifle in 6.5 Creedmoor for me but this time with a 20" # 7 profile barrel and Manners folder, I want a more compact and light weight rifle when portable is more important.
Fact is I get to shoot out past 600 only a few times a year and a 20" will easily reach 1000 yards so smaller and lighter is better. If you only care about smallest groups or really long range then go with a 26-28" barrel. If over 1000 yards is your priority there are better calibers for that distance.
Just my 2 cents
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