FL bushing sizing die & trimming shit-show...

[CK1.0]

So, still relatively new to bolt-guns and long-range stuff, but have been getting great results thus far... I'm shooting 6mm Creedmoor and had bought 100rds of Hornady Match ammo to start me off and give me my first batch of brass to learn to reload for the rifle with... got a single-stage setup for the rifle stuff.

Everything had been going great, and my loads were turning out pretty sick, yielding around .3" 100yrd groups, under an inch at 300, so I seem to have figured out part of the puzzle anyways... I've never used the expander-ball in my sizing die even once, bushing only and my groups have been telling me I've been doing it right. But, after years of shooting pistols in USPSA/IDPA and loading thousands of pistol rounds on a Dillon I never had to trim shit, so no experience there.

Anyways, my brass had 4 firings on it and was right about at SAAMI max, so it was time for me to figure out how to anneal and trim: the annealing part went fine (blowtorch/power-drill method), trimming not so much lol.

I bought a Lee Deluxe Power Quick Trim setup, quick trim die & trim bit using a drill, thought it would be simpler because it deburrs/chamfers at the same time as it trims.

Steps were: decap, anneal, wet tumble, lube & FL size bushing die (no expander ball), dry tumble (remove lube), trim, prime, powder, seat bullets.

Seating bullets was a total shit-show, over half of the rounds are total shit (obviously not concentric), a couple fubar squashed, none of them really fit the case gauge like as usual for me... pulled the firing pin out of my bolt just to see if they'd even chamber in my gun, and except for the ones that are totally fucked, they do, just with a tight bolt-close.

Guessing the trimming was fucked up because I didn't use an expander ball or an expander mandrel die... is that the answer, have to expand the necks before trimming?
Or, does the Quick Trim just suck ass and I need to buy a better trimming setup?

Thanks.

 

[XLR308]

By your description of what is occurring it sounds like you have over annealed the brass and it's now to soft.
Did you use any kind of Tempilaq to indicate when your brass had reached your target temp ?

 

[TheOfficeT-Rex]

Can we see pictures of the offending reloads?

 

[CK1.0]

By your description of what is occurring it sounds like you have over annealed the brass and it's now to soft.
Did you use any kind of Tempilaq to indicate when your brass had reached your target temp ?

Nope, just counted to "7 Mississippi"... I know, scientific AF.

Can we see pictures of the offending reloads?

Most look semi-normal... 2 that totally buckled:

 

[TxWelder35]

Could have torched the shit out of the brass. How did you determine how long to keep them
In the flame?

But an annealeez if you are looking for a lower cost solution to annealing

 

[TxWelder35]

Nope, just counted to "7 Mississippi"... I know, scientific AF.



Most look semi-normal... 2 that totally buckled:

View attachment 7447682View attachment 7447683View attachment 7447684

Go
Run a piece of brass through your seating die without a bullet and report the results back

 

[CK1.0]

Go
Run a piece of brass through your seating die without a bullet and report the results back

I tried that, nothing changed, brass came out the same as it went in...

 

[TheOfficeT-Rex]

View attachment 7447682

This almost looks like its stripping the jacket off. It appears rough where the bullet meets case mouth. After you trimmed them, did you look at the chamfer? Did it look clean and smooth?

View attachment 7447683

I've seen this before - you forced it. So either too much neck tension, it wasn't centered up properly, or the brass is too soft.
Just send it, that will fireform out.

 

[XLR308]

Nope, just counted to "7 Mississippi"... I know, scientific AF.



Most look semi-normal... 2 that totally buckled:

View attachment 7447682View attachment 7447683View attachment 7447684

By a simple process of elimination your annealing was the only real change in your otherwise successful reloading.
If your brass completely collapsed like that trying to seat a bullet it is way to soft and has been over annealed, take one of those two rounds that collapsed and pull the bullet out and I bet you can squeeze the mouth out of shape with just your fingers.

 

[CK1.0]

This almost looks like its stripping the jacket off. It appears rough where the bullet meets case mouth. After you trimmed them, did you look at the chamfer? Did it look clean and smooth?


I've seen this before - you forced it. So either too much neck tension, it wasn't centered up properly, or the brass is too soft.
Just send it, that will fireform out.

Idk, I might just have to chock this one up as a learning experience and a reason to buy some new brass guys ...

I'm just sad and pissed at myself for not just hitting the brakes when I knew something was fucked up, wasting 100 primers is damn shame these days! Not to mention, powder and bullets...

 

[CK1.0]

By a simple process of elimination your annealing was the only real change in your otherwise successful reloading.
If your brass completely collapsed like that trying to seat a bullet it is way to soft and has been over annealed, take one of those two rounds that collapsed and pull the bullet out and I bet you can squeeze the mouth out of shape with just your fingers.

Ok.

So do you think I'd otherwise be fine without using a expander-ball/expander-mandrel if I hadn't annealed the brass into oblivion..?

Do you think these are even probably safe to fire, or should I just pull 'em?

 

[XLR308]

Idk, I might just have to chock this one up as a learning experience and a reason to buy some new brass guys ...

I'm just sad and pissed at myself for not just hitting the brakes when I knew something was fucked up, wasting 100 primers is damn shame these days! Not to mention, powder and bullets...

No real waste except for the brass, just pull the bullets, dump and save the powder and decap and salvage the primers.

 

[CK1.0]

No real waste except for the brass, just pull the bullets, dump and save the powder and decap and salvage the primers.

Cool.

I've never decapped live primers before, sounds sketchy/interesting... any tips (besides eye/ear pro lol)..?

 

[TheOfficeT-Rex]

Do you think these are even probably safe to fire, or should I just pull 'em?

To be clear, I was joking, don't fire the squished ones. The others, if they chamber freely, should fire just fine - BUT - depending on how soft you got the case head when you torched them, you may see some case failures. To be safe, pull them all.

I don't decap live primers. They make me nervous.

 

[XLR308]

Cool.

I've never decapped live primers before, sounds sketchy/interesting... any tips (besides eye/ear pro lol)..?

I have decapped quite a few live primers over the years and there is no issues doing it unless you are going John Force on the press handle I wouldn't worry yourself.
And yes take neccesary precautions with PPE no need to put on your EOD bomb suit.

 

[CK1.0]

To be clear, I was joking, don't fire the squished ones. The others, if they chamber freely, should fire just fine - BUT - depending on how soft you got the case head when you torched them, you may see some case failures. To be safe, pull them all.

I don't decap live primers. They make me nervous.

LOL I got the joke, I wasn't going to fire them, now the others.....

I'm just going to pull them all, and take the loss of brass and primers as paying my dumbass-tax.

I'm really just more interested in knowing for the future: besides NOT annealing the brass to death, can I still trim without using any type of expander?

 

[nightman89]

You can decap live primers. Just go slow and you'll be fine. I've done it several times.

 

[XLR308]

LOL I got the joke, I wasn't going to fire them, now the others.....

I'm just going to pull them all, and take the loss of brass and primers as paying my dumbass-tax.

I'm really just more interested in knowing for the future: besides NOT annealing the brass to death, can I still trim without using any type of expander?

The pilot on your trimmer should be a close fit to your case interior dimension but not tight.
Check the fit of your trimmer pilot prior to running an expander mandrel through your sized cases.
If it fits without having to be forced in use it prior to the expanding operation.

 

[TxWelder35]

LOL I got the joke, I wasn't going to fire them, now the others.....

I'm just going to pull them all, and take the loss of brass and primers as paying my dumbass-tax.

I'm really just more interested in knowing for the future: besides NOT annealing the brass to death, can I still trim without using any type of expander?

I’ve never ran an expander on my bolt gun brass. Bushings only and it’s been annealed and trimmed plenty of times.

Using the WFT to trim, then deburr/chamfer separately

 

[CK1.0]

Well, off to pull some bullets...

Seems when it comes to annealing brass, I'll need a better plan than just winging it

Thanks for the help guys!

 

[TheOfficeT-Rex]

Seems when it comes to annealing brass, I'll need a better plan than just winging it

Most people with a torch method use tempilaq 750 on the case necks to gauge how long to leave it in the flame. You can get it from amazon or brownells.

 

[straightshooter1]

Nope, just counted to "7 Mississippi"... I know, scientific AF.



Most look semi-normal... 2 that totally buckled:

View attachment 7447682View attachment 7447684

I'm seeing a chamfer on the outside rather than on in inside. Is that right? If so, then it's not surprise to me that you're squishing necks like that, particularly if the necks are too tight (having a lot of neck tension). and/or the necks are over annealed.

Chamfer should be on the inside and just a little deburring on the outside.

 

[NiteQwill]

Use a metronome to anneal brass after establishing your count with Tempilaq. Counting in your head or out loud is not the BEST way to do it.

Free metronome app on Google Play or App Store.

All roads lead to a Giraud/Henderson trimmer, btw.

 

[CK1.0]

Well, pulled the bullets, thankfully I saw a youtube video a couple weeks ago from Erik Cortina where he shared using a shell-holder in place of the stupid collet thingy in the bullet puller, probably saved me a good 30mins or so

Got back most of my powder and all of my primers too without injury lol. The bullets on the other hand... some are fine to reuse, a bunch are garbage now, oh well.

Basically, I think I learned that I utterly failed during my first attempt at annealing, I won't make the same mistake again hopefully.

The other thing is: I've decided I'm going to try something different as far as trimming too, because even while I was trimming I was thinking "Wow, this Lee thing has got to be too good to be true..." as far as trimming/deburring/chamfering all at the same time for like $30... I think if it was actually legit and that easy, everyone would be using one already. And I noticed during pulling the bullets that a lot of them probably weren't messed up due to the bad-anneal-job, but were shitty due to the cases not really being properly deburred so the bullets were getting hung up during the seating process... So like usual, there's no free lunch: the Lee jobber does indeed trim/deburr/chamfer all at the time for cheap, it just kinda sucks at all 3 of those things while it's doing it.

Shittiest thing about the whole ordeal is that my powder drops for this batch were more perfect than I've ever had the patience to manage before, and I know maybe half of the rounds were probably fine to shoot. Still, not worth the risk of fucking up my gun, or worse, having to say hi to the nurses at the local urgent care

 

[NiteQwill]

It's all a learning experience. Eventually, a lot of us that learned quality reloading equipment has come a long way and improved our lives dramatically (Autotrickler, AMP, IDOD, Giraud, etc.). It's worth looking at (heck, you do own a Dillon!).

We have all been down that road. A good bullet puller is a Hornady Cam bullet puller. It doesn't leave marks and is super easy to use without hammering a traditional pullet buller.

 

[straightshooter1]

Got back most of my powder and all of my primers too without injury lol. The bullets on the other hand... some are fine to reuse, a bunch are garbage now, oh well.

Basically, I think I learned that I utterly failed during my first attempt at annealing, I won't make the same mistake again hopefully.

The other thing is: I've decided I'm going to try something different as far as trimming too, because even while I was trimming I was thinking "Wow, this Lee thing has got to be too good to be true..." as far as trimming/deburring/chamfering all at the same time for like $30... I think if it was actually legit and that easy, everyone would be using one already. And I noticed during pulling the bullets that a lot of them probably weren't messed up due to the bad-anneal-job, but were shitty due to the cases not really being properly deburred so the bullets were getting hung up during the seating process... So like usual, there's no free lunch: the Lee jobber does indeed trim/deburr/chamfer all at the time for cheap, it just kinda sucks at all 3 of those things while it's doing it.

Shittiest thing about the whole ordeal is that my powder drops for this batch were more perfect than I've ever had the patience to manage before, and I know maybe half of the rounds were probably fine to shoot. Still, not worth the risk of fucking up my gun, or worse, having to say hi to the nurses at the local urgent care

From your description of the bullets you pulled that "are garbage now", I'm convinced that the issues is not so much your annealing. It's the trimming/deburring/chamfering that's being done. Like I mentioned above, you shouldn't be seeing chamfering on the outside of the neck like I see in your pictures. It should be on the inside and there should be very little seen on the outside where it's just a little bit of deburring. So, sounds to me like something very wrong with your 3 way trimming tool.

 

[CK1.0]

From your description of the bullets you pulled that "are garbage now", I'm convinced that the issues is not so much your annealing. It's the trimming/deburring/chamfering that's being done. Like I mentioned above, you shouldn't be sing chamfering on the outside of the neck like I see in your pictures. It should be on the inside and there should be very little seen on the outside where it's just a little bit of deburring. So, sounds to me like something very wrong with your 3 way trimming tool.

Yep.

There's no doubt I probably cooked more than a few with the torch, but after pulling them, I'm not so sure I over did it on the whole lot of them and honestly believe the trimming-stage is what really fucked up most of them, or at least a combination of the two.
I think if I had trimmed with a better trimmer, then deburred/chamfered them properly, I would've at least ended up with a decent amount of rounds I'd have felt confident about sending downrange with little worry.

“Experience is something you don't get until just after you need it.” – Steven Wright.

 

[Carlos Danger]

I torch / drill anneal and the "count" varies depending on various factors. Hot how hot the flame, where in the flame you hold it, rotational speed, brass manufacturer. I try to replicate distance, flame, and speed each time. As a safeguard I do a count until I just begin to see orange. Once I establish that, I have my count....but I still watch the color.

I use a hornady trimmer and then chamfer inside and out of the neck. I pay a little more attention to the inner chamfer. My annealing may not be "scientific" but barring one or two incidents it seems to work well.

 

[straightshooter1]

Yep.

There's no doubt I probably cooked more than a few with the torch, but after pulling them, I'm not so sure I over did it on the whole lot of them and honestly believe the trimming-stage is what really fucked up most of them, or at least a combination of the two.
I think if I had trimmed with a better trimmer, then deburred/chamfered them properly, I would've at least ended up with a decent amount of rounds I'd have felt confident about sending downrange with little worry.

“Experience is something you don't get until just after you need it.” – Steven Wright.

If you compare what your cases look like to those in the YouTube video for the Lee Precision's Deluxe Power Quick Trim, you can see the difference (fast forward to 2:01 or 2:24):



BTW: after taking a very close look at this tool now, I don't like it's design nor the materials it's made of. There are other 3 way trimming tools better designed to give good results ( yeah, some of them are pricey). Unfortunately, in this case, you got what you paid for.

I use a Giraud Tri-Way Trimmer for my .308 and it works great. And since I only reload for it, having just the one works for me and well worth it.

 

[CK1.0]

If you compare what your cases look like to those in the YouTube video for the Lee Precision's Deluxe Power Quick Trim, you can see the difference (fast forward to 2:01 or 2:24):



BTW: after taking a very close look at this tool now, I don't like it's design nor the materials it's made of. There are other 3 way trimming tools better designed to give good results ( yeah, some of them are pricey). Unfortunately, in this case, you got what you paid for.

I use a Giraud Tri-Way Trimmer for my .308 and it works great. And since I only reload for it, having just the one works for me and well worth it.

Ya know what’s strange is: I couldn’t get mine to work like that or really like anything like 4 other videos showing the powered Quick Trim in operation... Mine wasn’t really trimming shit unless I used some elbow grease and pushed my drill down to make it cut/trim....

I’m starting to think maybe I was doing something wrong in how I was using it (even though I was following the directions as stated)?

I found a comment where a guy said “if it’s only making the chamfer larger but not really cutting, then you have to adjust the die down further”, but I had the die contacting the shell plate, so it couldn’t go down any further.... I’m going to have to take a longer look at the thing again in order to see if I’m missing something..?

Weird.

 

[straightshooter1]

Ya know what’s strange is: I couldn’t get mine to work like that or really like anything like 4 other videos showing the powered Quick Trim in operation... Mine wasn’t really trimming shit unless I used some elbow grease and pushed my drill down to make it cut/trim....

Your really shouldn't have to use some elbow grease like that, if you've got a good tool that's working properly. A good 3-way cutting tool shouldn't take much effort to trim a soft material like brass.

I’m starting to think maybe I was doing something wrong in how I was using it (even though I was following the directions as stated)?

No. . . I don't think it was you doing anything wrong. I really feel it's the tool design AND that you've got one that probably doesn't even pass the quality control standards set it. You've just got a bad tool.

I found a comment where a guy said “if it’s only making the chamfer larger but not really cutting, then you have to adjust the die down further”, but I had the die contacting the shell plate, so it couldn’t go down any further.... I’m going to have to take a longer look at the thing again in order to see if I’m missing something..?

Weird.

Yeah, I'd take a very close look at all the parts and how they work together to see if there's anything evident that can be adjusted so that it doesn't take much effort to get the proper cuts. If not, and you want to stick with this design, you might consider returning this one and get another to see if it'll do what it's intended to do. Then, if it doesn't, time to move on to a different 3 way tool. . . maybe something like the RCBS Trim Pro 3-Way Cutter, if you have a way to use it???

 

[CK1.0]

Holy shit!

So after fucking around with the Lee Deluxe Power Quick Trim and the specific Quick Trim Die (6mm Creedmoor in this/my case) for another hour, looking at all kinds of possibilities, I finally think I figured out why it fucked up my brass:

The cutting bit has a piece on the tip that has to be pushed/compressed up/in to the body of the bit in order for the trimming /cutting head to engage the case and cut (the part that gets compressed handles the deburr/chamfer as the case engages/disengages the cutter, well that's how it's supposed to go anyway)...

There is a spacer/collar that slides on the bit assembly that is supposed to act like a "hard-stop" to prevent one from trimming passed SAAMI minimum length, the instructions say to use this spacer with cartridges longer than 1.25" (so I used the spacer).

SAAMI max for my 6mm Creedmoor case is 1.920" and that's about where my brass was at before I started, SAAMI minimum is 1.900" (so that's where I wanted to end up in order to not have to trim again until after 3-4 more loadings/firings).

Well, turns out the "hard-stop" when using the spacer isn't at 1.900", it's at more like 1.915" or so, BUT, if you keep the drill running thinking you're trimming further and just have a little more trimming to do (maybe add a little elbow grease to hurry it up), you're actually not doing shit because the cutter isn't really engaged anymore, but the debar/chamfer blade IS. So it just continues to "tread water" while the deburr/chamfer gets larger and eventually eats away at the case until you show 1.900". A totally fucked 1.900".

When I was dicking around, I removed the spacer/collar and found I could get the cutter to actually engage and take the case down to 1.88" easily before it hard-stopped at the case-neck hole in the die body.

Turns out if I had just stopped/gave up at 1.915ish" or wherever the spacer stopped/bottomed out, the cases would've probably have come out fine, but I didn't know, and the instructions said it should stop at 1.900", so I tried to roll with it and wrecked 100 pieces of brass finding out.

I'm pretty pissed.

Notice the case on the left where I "stood on it" for a bit (not nearly as long as I had with the other cases I did earlier, but still) without the cutting head engaged (but continuing to debar/chamfer), and on the right, how it looks when I stopped even though I wasn't at the shorter length I was after. Also shows the bit and the spacer/collar:

 

[straightshooter1]

Holy shit!

So after fucking around with the Lee Deluxe Power Quick Trim and the specific Quick Trim Die (6mm Creedmoor in this/my case) for another hour, looking at all kinds of possibilities, I finally think I figured out why it fucked up my brass:

The cutting bit has a piece on the tip that has to be pushed/compressed up/in to the body of the bit in order for the trimming /cutting head to engage the case and cut (the part that gets compressed handles the deburr/chamfer as the case engages/disengages the cutter, well that's how it's supposed to go anyway)...

There is a spacer/collar that slides on the bit assembly that is supposed to act like a "hard-stop" to prevent one from trimming passed SAAMI minimum length, the instructions say to use this spacer with cartridges longer than 1.25" (so I used the spacer).

SAAMI max for my 6mm Creedmoor case is 1.920" and that's about where my brass was at before I started, SAAMI minimum is 1.900" (so that's where I wanted to end up in order to not have to trim again until after 3-4 more loadings/firings).

Well, turns out the "hard-stop" when using the spacer isn't at 1.900", it's at more like 1.915" or so, BUT, if you keep the drill running thinking you're trimming further and just have a little more trimming to do (maybe add a little elbow grease to hurry it up), you're actually not doing shit because the cutter isn't really engaged anymore, but the debar/chamfer blade IS. So it just continues to "tread water" while the deburr/chamfer gets larger and eventually eats away at the case until you show 1.900". A totally fucked 1.900".

When I was dicking around, I removed the spacer/collar and found I could get the cutter to actually engage and take the case down to 1.88" easily before it hard-stopped at the case-neck hole in the die body.

Turns out if I had just stopped/gave up at 1.915ish" or wherever the spacer stopped/bottomed out, the cases would've probably have come out fine, but I didn't know, and the instructions said it should stop at 1.900", so I tried to roll with it and wrecked 100 pieces of brass finding out.

I'm pretty pissed.

Notice the case on the left where I "stood on it" for a bit (not nearly as long as I had with the other cases I did earlier, but still) without the cutting head engaged (but continuing to debar/chamfer), and on the right, how it looks when I stopped even though I wasn't at the shorter length I was after. Also shows the bit and the spacer/collar:

View attachment 7448022

Well, I feel there's some good news . . . in that that brass seems to be salvageable. Since the cartridge length increases after firing and resizing, I'd think you could get your brass to where you want it . . . eventually.

To start, I'd take this brass and just do another chamfering with a tool that just does chamfering so there's not other changes in the case and that seating shouldn't be such an issue. I'd even reuse the messed up bullets for cold bore shots or some siting or even running them through a chrono to record some load data.

Am glad you figured it out. Hopefully, that'll be the last of your issues with reloading. Good luck.


BTW: I don't know how you handle the issue of shavings falling into the case, but I've never liked the idea of have any trimmer "on top" where shavings can make their way into the case and then I have to do a procedure to make sure there's none of that in any of my cases. This is the primary thing that makes me not like its design.

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

Well, off to pull some bullets...

Seems when it comes to annealing brass, I'll need a better plan than just winging it

Thanks for the help guys!

I use the drill, socket, and map gas. I do it in the dark and stop when it glows. About 4 seconds. Never had a problem over annealing.

So on the smashed cases is it a good guess that the case mouth bit into the jacket enough on seating that your down stroke smashed the case instead of pushing the bullet farther into it?

 

[Snuby642]

I'm expanding the neck to -004 before trimming and having better luck with the trimmer.

I then run it to -.002 in a mandrell.

That being said I'm not happy with thier trimmer.

The only Lee product I have not loved it's worthless on short brass that still needs debur and champher.

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

I'm expanding the neck to -004 before trimming and having better luck with the trimmer.

I then run it to -.002 in a mandrell.

That being said I'm not happy with thier trimmer.

The only Lee product I have not loved it's worthless on short brass that still needs debur and champher.

I'm leaning toward a shoulder based trimmer because my Forster 3 way has the same issue on short cases.

 

[XLR308]

I've never had an issue with a Lyman universal Chuck or my RCBS trimmer when cases are precisely sized and then trimmed.
I still after almost 30 years of reloading chamfer and debur by hand and guess what it still works and I don't have to dick around with inconsistent results.

 

[Snuby642]

Its a pita to measure hundreds of rounds of 223 range brass to find 10-20% need trimmed, and the rest need debur / champher.

I'm with @2aBaCa and think a lyman case trimmer that indexes off the shoulder datum is in the order box.
By feel will know if cutting or not and when done.

The lyman case debur and champher tool is fast and we have a little mod to run it more comfortably.

If my son doesn't want to try and patent it I'll show it to the hide.

 

[CK1.0]

I think I'm going to go with either the Frankford Arsenal Platinum Series Case Prep and Trim Center - looks like it could be the "easy button" for fast trim/prep, trimmer indexes off the shoulder, forward compatible with different calibers, no switching tools or anything (just grab a case from one akro bin, bam bam bam, toss it in another bin, next)...

Or, the ubiquitous Little Crow WFT (thinking a WFT2 to be forward compatible for if/when changing calibers) and their Deburring/Chamfering Tools & hex adapter to run them off a drill... seems more likely to last and be more robust than the Frankford all-in-one box, but also means switching bits and running through the brass 3 times which is slower (vs one pass, no switching whatsoever)...

IDK? but probably going with one of those options... leaning towards the Frankford all-in-one box because any/all case prep is my least favorite part of reloading...

 

[XLR308]

How did the easy button work out for you the last time ?
Best to learn what works and why it works then you can apply those skills with experience but maybe I'm just old fashioned.
I hope the next widget works for you and the power doesn't go out and limit internet searches.
For fucks sake what happened to this country.

 

[CK1.0]

How did the easy button work out for you the last time ?
Best to learn what works and why it works then you can apply those skills with experience but maybe I'm just old fashioned.
I hope the next widget works for you and the power doesn't go out and limit internet searches.
For fucks sake what happened to this country.

Hahahaha, nice one

I know that less is more a lot of the time, but we're not cavemen dude lol.

Shooting is supposed to be the hobby, not reloading, so if I can make it quicker/easier without having to go broke, I will. I'm still using a single-stage, dropping powder manually, wet tumbling to clean and dry tumbling again to remove lube, I even decap first instead of sizing/decapping at the same time sometimes, give a guy a break

This rifle shit is hard, I'm still used to just cleaning a boatload of brass, throwing it in the Dillon and having a 1000rds an hour later...

 

[Snuby642]

Past 100 cases at a time my arthritic hands start to hurt and sometimes swell.

Anything I can get to help with brass is good.

I load for my family so it ads up.

 

[XLR308]

Hahahaha, nice one

I know that less is more a lot of the time, but we're not cavemen dude lol.

Shooting is supposed to be the hobby, not reloading, so if I can make it quicker/easier without having to go broke, I will. I'm still using a single-stage, dropping powder manually, wet tumbling to clean and dry tumbling again to remove lube, I even decap first instead of sizing/decapping at the same time sometimes, give a guy a break

This rifle shit is hard, I'm still used to just cleaning a boatload of brass, throwing it in the Dillon and having a 1000rds an hour later...

I think you missed my point, shooting is a hobby for me as well but I learned to prep my brass by hand and still mostly do it all by hand and know what a proper trim and chamfer looks and feels like.
I leaned to do all of that by reading and comprehension from books before I had internet or the ability to ask a vast library of more experienced people what I was doing wrong.
Information and technology is power but only if you use it to your advantage.

 

[CK1.0]

10-4, I get you. I appreciate your sentiment.

I want to do things the right way too, and I’m still learning... but I’m also about saving some time where/when I can is all. Best tool for the job isn’t always the fastest for sure...

 

[XLR308]

10-4, I get you. I appreciate your sentiment.

I want to do things the right way too, and I’m still learning... but I’m also about saving some time where/when I can is all. Best tool for the job isn’t always the fastest for sure...

Same here and still definately learning.

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

Look at the Trim-it 2. Its like the WFT only has a 3-way cutter and micrometer adjustment.

 

[straightshooter1]

Look at the Trim-it 2. Its like the WFT only has a 3-way cutter and micrometer adjustment.

+1 on the Trim-It 2

The cutting head is like the Giraud Tri-Way Trimer and like the Tri-Way does a great job fast (once you've got it set up, which is always the key with tools like this). And, unlike the Tri-Way, the Trim-it 2 has interchangeable dies for different calibers.

TRIM-IT II W/ 2 CALIBER DIES | blackwidow

Trim-It II 3 WAY CASE TRIMMER 2 Caliber Dies Included

www.blackwidowshooters.com

 

[CK1.0]

Look at the Trim-it 2. Its like the WFT only has a 3-way cutter and micrometer adjustment.

+1 on the Trim-It 2

The cutting head is like the Giraud Tri-Way Trimer and like the Tri-Way does a great job fast (once you've got it set up, which is always the key with tools like this). And, unlike the Tri-Way, the Trim-it 2 has interchangeable dies for different calibers.

TRIM-IT II W/ 2 CALIBER DIES | blackwidow

Trim-It II 3 WAY CASE TRIMMER 2 Caliber Dies Included

www.blackwidowshooters.com

Honestly, looks a lot like the same idea as the Lee thingy, just done and built correctly (instead of just trying to hit a price-point).

Might have to look into that....

 

[Precision Underground]

Something looks really weird here. What seater are you using? Is it crimping while seating?

 

[Precision Underground]

Honestly, looks a lot like the same idea as the Lee thingy, just done and built correctly (instead of just trying to hit a price-point).

Might have to look into that....

I trimmed thousands of cases with the Lee set up when I first started loading. It works fine and actually leaves a great edge when used correctly. I don’t think that’s your problem.