Force Gauge for conventional press

[layback04]

My google search hasn’t found anything besides software programs to show the force it takes to seat a bullet in a conventional press like a rock chucker.

I am trying to rack my brain on a way to measure the force similar to the way the K & M arbor press measures force, except on a rock chucker.

$200 isn’t bad to just buy the arbor press but then I have a piece of equipment that I have to buy seater dies for and so far I am not sold that it can produce more concentric ammo. Plus I don’t personally know anybody that currently uses an arbor press for reloading, especially in the prs style of shooting.

Looking for thoughts and opinions, maybe I’m over complicating things and should quit drinking kool-aid.

 

[Milo 2.5]

My google search hasn’t found anything besides software programs to show the force it takes to seat a bullet in a conventional press like a rock chucker.

I am trying to rack my brain on a way to measure the force similar to the way the K & M arbor press measures force, except on a rock chucker.

$200 isn’t bad to just buy the arbor press but then I have a piece of equipment that I have to buy seater dies for and so far I am not sold that it can produce more concentric ammo. Plus I don’t personally know anybody that currently uses an arbor press for reloading, especially in the prs style of shooting.

Looking for thoughts and opinions, maybe I’m over complicating things and should quit drinking kool-aid.

First, do you have concentricity issues, or what makes you think you do? Can you find a way to measure it(need a decent one)?
I think there have been many attempts at retrofitting a gauge to "O" style presses with minimal success.
Sipping a little kool-aid isn't always bad. Just say you buy this system, and you notice inconsistencies that you never knew existed, how far down the rabbit hole are you willing to go to correct things? Maybe now you want to neck turn, maybe you need an AMP annealing machine.
What are you seeing downrange that indicates what you are doing is wrong? Maybe corrections elsewhere will yield gains.
2 weeks ago today, I ordered the K&M with standard force pack, and Wilson dies for 6XC and 6 Dasher. I seated 25 bullets for my Dasher, I know my sample size was miniscule, but I can say this, it did not tell me anything I did not know. I run more neck tension than most, it showed that aspect, but I had about the same feeling seating with a coax press. realizing the coax produces way more leverage.
I sold the system last Wednesday, it was not going to improve my operation.
One more thing, if you are one to sit down and load 250rds for a match, if using an inline seater, allow 3 extra hours to seat your bullets, it's a PIA.

 

[memilanuk]

If IIRC, the people behind the Pressure Trace system used to make a separate strain/force gage that could be used for measuring seating force... I think it fit in the ram / shell-holder area somehow. I don't think it's been on the market for at least 10-15 years, though. Probably way ahead of its time as far as the number of people who would be interested in that sort of thing, then vs. now.

But @Milo 2.5 is also correct in that sometimes more info is not always useful, as it can lead you off on some tangents that may not be entirely useful. They might be *extremely* interesting, if you're into the how/why/data side of things, but from a 'make ammo / get out and shoot' perspective, not terribly productive.

I have a K&M arbor press, various dies to go with it, and a hydraulic seater base for it. It's came in handy a time or three for diagnosing problems with issues in the case necks / bullet seating... but honestly I could already 'feel' something was hinky. The hydro seater just help quantify 'how bad' it was.

 

[memilanuk]

More recently... I had a pretty sweet load worked up for my primary FTR rig... won the WA and OR state LR matches, and put in a decent showing @ MT. Loaded the ammo for Nationals, on my 550 same as I had been all summer... but I 'felt' some rounds seat differently. I hadn't changed anything that I was aware of in my loading process, so like a dumb-a$$ I kept going. More importantly, I didn't set those specific rounds aside in a separate box. I sure as heck "found" them the hard way on target in Raton I managed to bang out one gold medal on a shitty wind relay, but the rest of the match... was disappointing at best, as I was fighting both the conditions and vertical on target that should not have been there. Now I get to pull down the remaining rounds, fiddle with the necks, and re-assemble them on the hydro seater to try and figure out just where things went sideways..

 

[Milo 2.5]

More recently... I had a pretty sweet load worked up for my primary FTR rig... won the WA and OR state LR matches, and put in a decent showing @ MT. Loaded the ammo for Nationals, on my 550 same as I had been all summer... but I 'felt' some rounds seat differently. I hadn't changed anything that I was aware of in my loading process, so like a dumb-a$$ I kept going. More importantly, I didn't set those specific rounds aside in a separate box. I sure as heck "found" them the hard way on target in Raton I managed to bang out one gold medal on a shitty wind relay, but the rest of the match... was disappointing at best, as I was fighting both the conditions and vertical on target that should not have been there. Now I get to pull down the remaining rounds, fiddle with the necks, and re-assemble them on the hydro seater to try and figure out just where things went sideways..

Wow, some testament on the ability to feel on a 550. I've always been able to cull oddballs on my presses, and today it's a coax.
I feel with my method, 94-95% of my necks fall within the range I want them, with a full 3% that feel sloppy, and 1-2% that seat way hard. It is easy to set 5-6 rds in an ammo box to shoot up close. If I feel 10% of my cases are not right, I'll opt for a hard anneal and step down a bushing size for the next firing, most of the time it works.

Reading gets a guy in trouble I think, on accurate shooter guys who use this system do fantastic, but what you don't read is that only 100 pcs of brass were put into service for a rifle. And 5-10 cases were culled first off.
I think that some people believe that no matter what treatments they do with brass, anneal, set tension with a mandrel, etc.. that all their brass is the same, far from reality.
For my shooting, steel, even though I strive for waterline at distance, if one dips or crawls up, I'm not out much. So culling at the speed I reload at works if one pays attention.