Forster Full Length Sizing Die Question

[want2learn]

It's very interesting, a while back i experienced a very similar occurrence.

I spoke with a gentleman at Forster who was wonderful to deal with.

If i recall correctly he asked me to send in several fire formed cases, several new projectiles that i intended to use, my dies as well as the shell holder. I believe they honed and polished the dies and seating stem and slightly shortened the full length sizing die.

It all works great now.

There was a small but very reasonable fee.

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

Dont force it. It doesnt require a lot if things are working correctly. You dont want to break or bend something.

 

[spife7980]

I just go until the handle hits the machines in bump stops, I have always had adequate sizing before my die is physically bottoming out before the press handle does.

If it’s tough to get to that point then I’m inclined to say you don’t have enough or a proper lube on the cases so you’re having to fight that friction and this you’re getting a cam over sensation. Because once that die is bottomed out and stopping the press so that the handle can’t physically go any further you wouldn’t be able to just cam over harder still. So if you have the handle going all the way over, and the die all the way down as far as it will go before the press handle can no longer go down then you need to send it back to forster because that die is too long.

 

[918v]

He would stick the case in the die if that were true.

 

[snbyiggidy1]

It's very interesting, a while back i experienced a very similar occurrence.

I spoke with a gentleman at Forster who was wonderful to deal with.

If i recall correctly he asked me to send in several fire formed cases, several new projectiles that i intended to use, my dies as well as the shell holder. I believe they honed and polished the dies and seating stem and slightly shortened the full length sizing die.

It all works great now.

There was a small but very reasonable fee.

That is what I am thinking at this point. Will see what Forster says tomorrow.

Dont force it. It doesnt require a lot if things are working correctly. You dont want to break or bend something.

It was very easy to operate when set to the instructions from Forster. When I tried to screw the die down further is when it got ridiculously hard to cycle the press so I did stop. My thought was that much effort was not ok and not what the press was designed to do.

 

[Timo Turl]

I’ve had the same problem with Forster dies being out of spec. Send it back. It really does seem to be quite a common occurrence with them.

 

[6brshooter]

chamber is too short? Help me understand this better please. If factory ammo is SAAMI spec and measures as such in my Whidden gauge. What is the acceptable amount of change in shoulder after being fired? It looks like my brass changed about 6 thousandths which I was under the understanding that was good. Meaning a tight or well cut chamber? That if it changed too much that was an indication the chamber was too big? Shouldn’t the sizing die take brass back to SAAMI ? Which it doesn’t change the shoulder measurement at all almost like it doesn’t make contact with the shoulder at all. Again just trying to understand but I don’t see how that translates to too small of a chamber? Hoping to learn.

You assume factory ammo shoulder is saami spec. Alot of times factory ammo and new component brass has a shoulder farther back than spec. Generally speaking, the dimension that is important to a reloader is shoulder length and diameter at case web. If you are bumping shoulder back .001-.002", from fired length, that is plenty. If it is still hard to chamber than look at case web diameter, is it changing from fired to resized?

 

[padom]

At this point I would call and talk to Forster. Seems odd but like I said, shit happens to everyone.

 

[snbyiggidy1]

Spoke with them this morning. They are sending out some of their lube to try. Of that doesn’t change anything then maybe it will be needing cut down. Will know after trying the lube.

 

[snbyiggidy1]

While waiting for the lube to arrive and to try that route. I decided to get out my Lee hand press I use as a stand alone decap press and see if a different press and shell holder might make a difference. Just trying to see if it might be something other than the die. Going to try a friends die too in the Coax to see if that works better. Hoping to narrow down the issue.

 

[snbyiggidy1]

Well after some more testing I am sure it is the die. Tried it in three different presses now with the same result of no shoulder bump back. Used a friends RCBS sizing die tonight on his press and mine and was able to size the brass no problem. On the Coax I was easily able to size the shoulder back .003-.004. So will be contacting Forster again to have them correct the issue. Tested the seater die as well and found it works well with only a slight ring in the bullet with no dimple. Think that can just be polished out of the seater die. Would prefer to stick with the Forster does if I can but we will see how this plays out.
L

 

[snbyiggidy1]

After all the advice and tracking this issue down I think I am going to return these dies and do something else. I am just not satisfied with the sizing die nor the seater which leaves indented rings in the ELD bullets. So will be looking at other options.

 

[LAW-DOG]

My Forster dies bump the shoulders based on

After all the advice and tracking this issue down I think I am going to return these dies and do something else. I am just not satisfied with the sizing die nor the seater which leaves indented rings in the ELD bullets. So will be looking at other options.

Did you get it figured out. You might need a small base die that was meant for semi auto rifles. The Forster dies work great for bolt guns & allow you to barely bump the shoulders. Like most other people have said your headspace can be adjusted by turning your die in. It’s not just headspace that can affect ar chambering issues but body diameter too. I use the Forster die for most bolts & rarely have problems with ar’s. There is one friend I load for & I have to use a Redding small base die for it. Even with both dies using the same .004 bump back the Forster is hard to chamber vs the small base die. The small base die constricts more & further down the brass, but I rarely have to use it. With my Forster I can bump .001-.005, I might be able to do more if I turn the die in further. The Redding small base die bumps .003-.012 depending on how far I turn it in & sizes the body .003-.005 more than the Forster. The Forster is really good, very concentric, & my 1st choice for accuracy. The seater ring issue happened on my Wilson, Redding, & Forster. You can polish or debur the stem & it won’t be a problem but if you are loading compressed then it might still leave a ring. I wouldn’t get rid of the Forster seater, it’s one of the best. Get a hornady headspace gauge & mituyo caliper so you can more accurately adjust your headspace & measure. You can see 1 pic is my fire formed brass 1.624in & the other pic is after I pushed the shoulder back about as much as the Redding small base can do, 1.612

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

After all the advice and tracking this issue down I think I am going to return these dies and do something else. I am just not satisfied with the sizing die nor the seater which leaves indented rings in the ELD bullets. So will be looking at other options.

Like this?

Check your neck tension and or get the right seating stem for the bullets.

For me anything over .003 creates a ring.

 

[LAW-DOG]

Like this?

View attachment 7292164

Check your neck tension and or get the right seating stem for the bullets.

For me anything over .003 creates a ring.

I use the stem that came with the Forster & it doesn’t make any marks on the eld, tmk, or hybrid. I usually debur & polish the stems a little, no matter what stem or brand. When loads are compressed it will make a mark even with lighter neck tension but polishing the stem helps to not make marks too bad. The Forster expander Ball usually gives .002 so it’s pretty good. Sometimes I use an expander mandrel & sometimes I just leave the expander ball in, the Forster sizing dies make concentric ammo either way with consistent neck tightness. The Redding small base die I have also is consistent .002 tightness. Occasionally some semi autos need a small base die but most of the time the Forster works on semis too.

 

[snbyiggidy1]

I agree with you on idea of a small base die. I however decided to take a break from my Valkyrie build. It was having several other issues all at the same time. So I decided to return the Forster dies and sold off the Valkyrie AR parts. Will rebuild it into something different down the road.

I went to work on loading for my 6.5 bolt gun instead. Purchased a set of Redding Master Hunter dies for the 6.5 along with the VLD stem for the competition seater. I also went with a Redding instant indicator for measuring the shoulder and can also confirm bullet seating consistency. Have been very happy with the Redding setup in 6.5. Have recently ordered the same Redding setup for .224 Valkyrie. I am finishing up a bolt gun build for the Valkyrie and will soon be loading for that. Hope the Redding dies are as good as the 6.5 ones I have. I Am very happy with their products. Feel the competition seating die is great and the VLD stem works without leaving a ring.

 

[snbyiggidy1]

Like this?

View attachment 7292164

Check your neck tension and or get the right seating stem for the bullets.

For me anything over .003 creates a ring.

Yes like that. Not as pronounced as yours though. I have not had any issues with .002 neck tension on my 6.5 loads using the Redding competition seater with VLD stem.