Precision Rifle Gear Foundation stocks vs Manners TCS?

[Islas82]

So am considering selling one of my TCS or maybe offering it for trade for a foundation, I been doing a bit of digging and am curious as to how they compare. Has anyone used any of their defiance inlets on a tenacity action? Am an impatient person and not sure I want to wait for an order.

Any input in feel and features compared to a TCS? Or which of their models are better suited for PRS type shooting?

Thanks for your help on this!

 

[308pirate]

Solid laminates > Filled fiberglass

 

[Islas82]

Solid laminates > Filled fiberglass

Seems to be the general opinion.

 

[308pirate]

Seems to be the general opinion.

I've had both kinds (plywood laminate and hand laid fiberglass) and much prefer the solid feel during recoil of the wood.

Micarta will feel about the same as plywood laminate and is likely even more durable, which is hard to do.

 

[Islas82]

I've had both kinds (plywood laminate and hand laid fiberglass) and much prefer the solid feel during recoil of the wood.

Micarta will feel about the same as plywood laminate and is likely even more durable, which is hard to do.

Makes sense, I reached out to them see if I can just use a ruckus inlet for my tenacity and just buy one off the shelf at Altus, really wish it came with accessories already like a TCS (BM, arca)

 

[Mordamer]

My advice... Buy a foundation that is in stock from one of the dealers. Keep the Manners while you try out the foundation. Sell the one that isn't your favorite.

Both stocks are top tier. If you can't hit a target with one the other isn't likely to change that.

I have used both and my match rifles all wear micarta.

 

[Islas82]

My advice... Buy a foundation that is in stock from one of the dealers. Keep the Manners while you try out the foundation. Sell the one that isn't your favorite.

Both stocks are top tier. If you can't hit a target with one the other isn't likely to change that.

I have used both and my match rifles all wear micarta.

Copy that, yea just wanting to try something new. Thanks

 

[CK1.0]

I've had a TCS for a good while now and have shot the Foundation's quite a bit: I do think the micarta has a much nicer recoil impulse, but the TCS just works better for me because I can set it up to fit like it was bespoke, and I can play with the balance/weight of it so much easier, which for me I guess, matters more than the recoil impulse. YMMV.

Honestly though, IMHO, either a TCS made out of micarta and/or a Centurion with TCS hardware would probably be the best thing ever...

 

[Islas82]

I've had a TCS for a good while now and have shot the Foundation's quite a bit: I do think the micarta has a much nicer recoil impulse, but the TCS just works better for me because I can set it up to fit like it was bespoke, and I can play with the balance/weight of it so much easier, which for me I guess, matters more than the recoil impulse. YMMV.

Honestly though, IMHO, either a TCS made out of micarta and/or a Centurion with TCS hardware would probably be the best thing ever...

A real unicorn, thanks for your input.

 

[CK1.0]

A real unicorn, thanks for your input.

Who knows? ...maybe there's already somebody out there who's lopped the back of their Foundation off and tried bolting the TCS LOP hardware onto it?

C'mon, a ~$3000 "custom stock" doesn't seem too far off for some of the high-rollers around here lol.

Seriously though, the answer might be "both".

 

[Islas82]

Was just on the phone with foundation 6-8 weeks lead time now. They recommend a going with the tenacity inlet which they do have but don’t source out to retailers at the moment. Bothers me a lil bit that DBM and ARCA are extra tbh.

 

[Rebel Rooster]

I have both a foundation stock and a TCS for impacts, and I, realizing I am in the minority on this thread, actually prefer the TCS more. The foundation is an excellent stock, and it is extremely "dead," which is awesome, but I have a ton more adjustability with the TCS, and I guess that is more important to me. I actually love the TCS and have another on order.

 

[JWG284]

I have a Foundation Centurion inserted for an Impact that I’m not using. I love the TCS though.

 

[Danrobberg]

I have shot both and much prefer the Manners TCS. Foundations are very nice but I just get way more comfortable behind the TCS. You can easily tune it balance however you want and get the lop exact to your fit. I move the TCS better also, the foundations seem almost slippery and like I don’t have great control over it. Manners has a new double dead fill and it really helps absorb the recoil. The sikes clutch is also an awesome upgrade while shooting positional you can wrap your thumb on it and the rifle is dead steady.

 

[Bigrederic]

You can ask this question a ton and get a ton of different answers... it is extremely subjective.

I have had more Manners then I can count, I bought my fist Foundation last year and fell in love with it, enough that I am building a second rifle almost identical to the first one.

Saying that still, I am looking at another Manners for a NRL Hunter build due to their lightness.

Having to buy bottom metal and a rail may be inconvenient for some, but for others it allows them to use the rail and BM of their choice.

The moral here is get behind both, shoot both of a barricade or something similar and make up your mind.

 

[Islas82]

You can ask this question a ton and get a ton of different answers... it is extremely subjective.

I have had more Manners then I can count, I bought my fist Foundation last year and fell in love with it, enough that I am building a second rifle almost identical to the first one.

Saying that still, I am looking at another Manners for a NRL Hunter build due to their lightness.

Having to buy bottom metal and a rail may be inconvenient for some, but for others it allows them to use the rail and BM of their choice.

The moral here is get behind both, shoot both of a barricade or something similar and make up your mind.

Great points, a local reached out after seeing this post and offered to let me play with his foundation build, I think I’ll be taking him up on that.

 

[Islas82]

I have shot both and much prefer the Manners TCS. Foundations are very nice but I just get way more comfortable behind the TCS. You can easily tune it balance however you want and get the lop exact to your fit. I move the TCS better also, the foundations seem almost slippery and like I don’t have great control over it. Manners has a new double dead fill and it really helps absorb the recoil. The sikes clutch is also an awesome upgrade while shooting positional you can wrap your thumb on it and the rifle is dead steady.

I agree the weight “tunability” of the TCS is pretty awesome and so is the adjustability of LOP. I have one with a proof competition contour barrel and there’s no balance issues when placing the right weights. I have read and seen people talk about foundations being butt heavy and wonder how that affects balance.

 

[Danrobberg]

I agree the weight “tunability” of the TCS is pretty awesome and so is the adjustability of LOP. I have one with a proof competition contour barrel and there’s no balance issues when placing the right weights. I have read and seen people talk about foundations being butt heavy and wonder how that affects balance.

I always felt like I was going to drop the rifle or that I didn’t have positive control over it while changing positions with the foundation. I never experienced that with my TCS.

I run mine with the steel rail and steel weights on the front and 2 weights On the buttstock. With a 1.25 straight barrel. It’s on the heavier side but the Rifle doesn’t move when it’s fired and when I build a position on a barricade it is dead steady.

I think stocks are the one component that is more personal preference than any other piece of gear. They are all made with quality at that level but what is more comfortable and what feels best to get behind? For me it’s hands down the TCS. I’ve gotten behind just about everything out there and I have zero desire to shoot anything else in a match.

If your stock doesn’t currently have the clutch system I highly recommend talking with Robert or someone else there and have it installed. You will be surprised how often you use it and how stable you can get with it during positional shooting off of some of these crazy props md’s are using nowadays.

 

[Islas82]

I always felt like I was going to drop the rifle or that I didn’t have positive control over it while changing positions with the foundation. I never experienced that with my TCS.

I run mine with the steel rail and steel weights on the front and 2 weights On the buttstock. With a 1.25 straight barrel. It’s on the heavier side but the Rifle doesn’t move when it’s fired and when I build a position on a barricade it is dead steady.

I think stocks are the one component that is more personal preference than any other piece of gear. They are all made with quality at that level but what is more comfortable and what feels best to get behind? For me it’s hands down the TCS. I’ve gotten behind just about everything out there and I have zero desire to shoot anything else in a match.

If your stock doesn’t currently have the clutch system I highly recommend talking with Robert or someone else there and have it installed. You will be surprised how often you use it and how stable you can get with it during positional shooting off of some of these crazy props md’s are using nowadays.

I have two TCS stocks and unfortunately neither have the clutch, mostly because both stocks were lucky finds, one at Altus and the other one from the manners store and not custom ordered, but it is a very interesting feature and from what I have heard really works.

 

[Islas82]

So do you guys think that aside from the ejection port not matching up and maybe issues with some bolt handle angles you can sit any 700 clone on a foundation stock? Curtis, lone peak and impact seem to have straight handles like my tenacity, wonder if I can get away with that.

 

[Rebel Rooster]

not to completely derail this thread, but has anyone sent their TCS back into Manners to have the clutch put it? I really want one, but I also don't want to be without my watch chassis for too long.

 

[tenringx]

I have two TCS stocks and unfortunately neither have the clutch, mostly because both stocks were lucky finds, one at Altus and the other one from the manners store and not custom ordered, but it is a very interesting feature and from what I have heard really works.

Send it back in to manners- they can put one in for you and is typically a pretty fast turnaround for the stocks they do work on. I have a TCS in there for a rail right now too

 

[Rebel Rooster]

Send it back in to manners- they can put one in for you and is typically a pretty fast turnaround for the stocks they do work on. I have a TCS in there for a rail right now too

thanks man. If it's not a long turnaround, I think I will! I can throw my barreled action into a foundation while I wait, so no real big issue. Ok sorry guys; back to your previous programming.

 

[Islas82]

thanks man. If it's not a long turnaround, I think I will! I can throw my barreled action into a foundation while I wait, so no real big issue. Ok sorry guys; back to your previous programming.

Nah man great question I was thinking the same thing.

 

[Rebel Rooster]

Turnaround on getting a sikes rail added to your tcs is 1-3 weeks and 100 bucks. I emailed this morning. Not bad at all.

 

[NiteQwill]

Get the one that fits you.

I've owned both. I sold the TCS, a T4A, and T4.

I now have 4 Foundation Stocks. I did not like the feel, grip angle, or recoil impulse of the Manners.

 

[Islas82]

Get the one that fits you.

I've owned both. I sold the TCS, a T4A, and T4.

I now have 4 Foundation Stocks. I did not like the feel, grip angle, or recoil impulse of the Manners.

I would still keep one of my TCS, I really like the adjustability and look of it. But do want to try the foundation. The thing holding me back right now is what I want I can’t find and am a real lazy POS to wait 8-10 weeks lol. There’s a vendor here on the hide that has a black centurion with a deviant inlet but since I have a tenacity I don’t know if there’ll be a lot of fitting issues. Spoke to foundation and they said that the earliest they could get a black one for a tenacity would be august.

 

[NiteQwill]

Yea, Foundation only does the Black color on a quarterly (or more) timeline.

If you have any fitting issues, just ask JK. Most of the time he can change the inlet to accommodate your action.

 

[Islas82]

Yea, Foundation only does the Black color on a quarterly (or more) timeline.

If you have any fitting issues, just ask JK. Most of the time he can change the inlet to accommodate your action.

Have you had experience with the Genesis 2 and centurion? I know most people like the closer to the trigger grip of the centurion but am coming from manners and that grip is pretty far and I have no issues with it.

 

[NiteQwill]

Have you had experience with the Genesis 2 and centurion? I know most people like the closer to the trigger grip of the centurion but am coming from manners and that grip is pretty far and I have no issues with it.

I prefer the Centurion because of the vertical grip. Same goes on my Revelation. The closer grip allows easier shots in confined spaces in my experience. And it's a little bit more comfortable.

 

[Islas82]

Ok pulled the trigger on a centurion from @DR&M got lucky and got a black one which is what I was looking for. Probably won’t be able to try it out until next week.

It’s a Deviant inlet so am taking a chance at fitment issues with my tenacity (likely bolt angle) but as far as foot print and recoil lug fit it should be fine.

 

[Mordamer]

Ok pulled the trigger on a centurion from @DR&M got lucky and got a black one which is what I was looking for. Probably won’t be able to try it out until next week.

It’s a Deviant inlet so am taking a chance at fitment issues with my tenacity (likely bolt angle) but as far as foot print and recoil lug fit it should be fine.

Just file clearance and color it with a sharpie.

 

[Islas82]

Just file clearance and color it with a sharpie.

I really wanted to put my cadex R7 in one but foundation said that cadex actions have “certain features” that make them not work with their inlets, wonder what those are. The cadex is sitting on a r700 TCS right now with no issues.

 

[Islas82]

Ok, just got the stock in today. Much prettier in person, you can really see and feel the quality.

Anyway the tenacity dropped in with zero issues, it lines perfectly with port cutouts and there no rubbing or issues with the bolt handle either. So thats that if anyone else had similar questions.

Like it a lot so far, next range session I will get the feel for it. Thanks everyone for their input on this.

 

[Rebel Rooster]

That looks awesome. Beautiful stock! So it looks like to me that the deviant must have just a tad bit more sweep than the tenacity, but it didn't affect anything, which is great!

 

[Islas82]

That looks awesome. Beautiful stock! So it looks like to me that the deviant must have just a tad bit more sweep than the tenacity, but it didn't affect anything, which is great!

Yea, I mean if you look closely you can see the angle on the cut but yea it runs smoothly. The tenacity is straight.

 

[Rebel Rooster]

Yea, I mean if you look closely you can see the angle on the cut but yea it runs smoothly. The tenacity is straight.

yeah, it looks really good!

 

[B-P-UU]

If you later decide you want the functionality of the manners clutch, JK will punch as many QD stud holes as you'd like. Good choice btw.

 

[Mudflap621]

If you later decide you want the functionality of the manners clutch, JK will punch as many QD stud holes as you'd like. Good choice btw.

I just got a chubby

 

[NiteQwill]

If you later decide you want the functionality of the manners clutch, JK will punch as many QD stud holes as you'd like. Good choice btw.

Where did you get the cheek pad? I'm currently using a Wiebad.

 

[B-P-UU]

Where did you get the cheek pad? I'm currently using a Wiebad.

Cheek Pads For Rifles, Shotguns & Other Long Guns | God'A Grip

God'A Grip Cheek Pads enhances accuracy, comfort and consistency with rifles, shotguns and other long guns. There are currently 6 models to choose.

godagrip.com

This one specifically works well on both foundation and manners:

Cheek Pad for Hi-Point Carbine Stocks - HP-1 3-1/2” W x 4-1/4”L x 5/16” thick

Very comfortable and look clean installed.

 

[Islas82]

If you later decide you want the functionality of the manners clutch, JK will punch as many QD stud holes as you'd like. Good choice btw.

This made my day.

 

[Islas82]

There it is…

 

[NiteQwill]

Very, very nice setup. I like that foundation sticker there.

 

[Rebel Rooster]

If you later decide you want the functionality of the manners clutch, JK will punch as many QD stud holes as you'd like. Good choice btw.

who does this? Nvm, John Kyle? I am wanting clutch put into a Manners TCS after the fact, but I don't want to send it back to manners to do it, just because I don't want to be without for a ton of time. I wonder if this is something a good gunsmith could do as well? It's just sling qd holes, right?

 

[TheOE800]

who does this? Nvm, John Kyle? I am wanting clutch put into a Manners TCS after the fact, but I don't want to send it back to manners to do it, just because I don't want to be without for a ton of time. I wonder if this is something a good gunsmith could do as well? It's just sling qd holes, right?

In essence, yes, it’s just QD cups.

 

[Rebel Rooster]

In essence, yes, it’s just QD cups.

yeah, I could almost do it myself; I just wouldn't want to fuck it up lol.

 

[Islas82]

Where did you get the cheek pad? I'm currently using a Wiebad.

Where did you get that hex pattern skateboard tape?

 

[NiteQwill]

Where did you get that hex pattern skateboard tape?

Amazon

 

[Rebel Rooster]

Where did you get that hex pattern skateboard tape?

I think it's this https://www.amazon.com/gp/buy/mfa/h...weblab=RCX_CHECKOUT_TURBO_DESKTOP_PRIME_87783 I just bought some too. That's some good stuff!