Getting overheated

[Txshooter3]

I shot a midrange (300) F Class match yesterday. 30 rds in 30 minutes.
They use 2 targets of 15 each.
1st target was sub moa, score 150, 7x.
I did notice the last couple shots hitting at 6 o'clock in the 10 ring.
2nd target, shots 16 - 30, were were dropping lower & lower as the barrel got hotter & hotter. By shot #30 I was holding in the middle of the 9 ring and dropping into the 10 ring. I lost a total of 5 points from low shots dropping into the 9 ring. So I ended with a 295/300, 11x. It was good enough to win the match, but I'm confident a perfect score is possible had I figured it out sooner.

I did use all my 30 minutes, so I don't know how I could have slowed down any.

So is there something I need to learn, or is just knowing what my rifle does the best I can do?

 

[Txshooter3]

Sorry, I forgot the details:
Savage #12 action, 223Rem, Schillen 1" bull barrel 28" 1/7 twist.
Load is 24.5 AA2460 & Berger 70gr VLD.

 

[Supersubes]

Any other conditions that could’ve caused it? Lighting, mirage, very dirty bore? 30 .223 rounds in 30 minutes with a 1 inch barrel. Seems like pretty light duty to me. Congrats on the match win!

 

[Txshooter3]

9am, perfect conditions. No mirage, no wind, clean bore. 30 in 30 is enough to get it fairly hot.
I am assuming that a hot barrel is causing it, because noting else changed during the relay. I checked everything for torque too. Only barrel temp changed, so ???
My only thought is to run a battery operated fan on it to try and keep it cooler. Thoughts?

 

[Travis224]

I'd almost bet your barrel isn't perfectly concentric to the bore. I had a Shilen select that was enough out of true that it vibrated the whole lathe when it was spinning. Sometimes, they just are that way. If so, just know that you need to compensate or rebarrel it. Fyi, I had the same thing with a carbon barrel but I was running a suppressor on it so when it got hot, it drooped.

 

[acudaowner]

could be I have not shot 30 in a row but assume it would get rather hot . without being able to take a break and use a air mattress pump I would also think maybe you could carry a towel and wrap it on the out side of the barrel and wet it . it could provide you a quick temp fix trying to keep the towel as close to the action as you could . best of luck what ever you end up doing if you do try something send pics and inform back on how well or badly it worked .

 

[Txshooter3]

Talking to another shooter at the match, he said he had the same issue with a Schillen. He replaced it with a Krieger and it fixed it. I really hate to do that because of the expense.
Thought of the wet rag idea but felt that would not cool things evenly, possibly making it worse.
I'm going to try the fan idea first as it's only $10. Just don't know if it will be enough.

 

[hafejd30]

When barrels heat up they return to their “happy spot”. Many barrels are machined then bent to correct them. When you see these premium air gauged barrels they are barrels that are near perfectly straight before they are finished. (I believe this is correct at least)

Barrels tend to walk as they heat up. So it helps to know you particular barrel and how it reacts to heat. When you heat up you can run into issues like you have. I’ve even seen some speed up to the point of blowing up bullets mid air which can be another effect of heat

Some use the fans in fclass (1,000 yd) that I shoot

I run a 284. A guy I shoot with runs a custom 284 caliber he designed. Smoking hot running 3300-3400 FPS with 180 beger .284’s. He shot back to back (40 rounds for score plus sighters) and torched 6” of throat on the barrel. That barrel was in its first match. He carry’s 5 guns to choose from so no big deal to him

- To answer your question, No the fan will not be enough to cool the barrel in that amount of time. If you have some time between strings then yes. But to use it during this 30/30 string it will not help a bit and cost you precious time

Learn the barrel. Or replace it

 

[Hobo Hilton]

Curious........ How did your competitors targets look ? Anything similar to yours ?

 

[Txshooter3]

He carry’s 5 guns to choose from so no big to him

IMHO, some people have more money than sense. I'm the opposite.

 

[Steel head]

It’s a buttoned barrel and maybe the de-stressing operation didn’t quite get to a happy place.

I’ve had a few Shilens and never had that issue but if I was a contender in a competition I’d hedge my bets with a cut barrel as they don’t introduce the stresses into barrels like buttoned and hammer forged.

 

[Txshooter3]

Curious........ How did your competitors targets look ? Anything similar to yours ?

Not really. A couple of the Open class guys had tight groups, but none of the TR guys that saw had anything near MOA. Looked more like a shotgun.

 

[hafejd30]

IMHO, some people have more money than sense. I'm the opposite.

He owns a custom gun shop and sponsors the team i shoot for. A premium barrel costs him $300 plus his time. No wait involved. Also this was an unknown learning experience for us. Nobody expected to have to shoot back to back. If that was the case we’d have swapped to another rifle as the heat was still very present after the first string

 

[Supersubes]

9am, perfect conditions. No mirage, no wind, clean bore. 30 in 30 is enough to get it fairly hot.
I am assuming that a hot barrel is causing it, because noting else changed during the relay. I checked everything for torque too. Only barrel temp changed, so ???
My only thought is to run a battery operated fan on it to try and keep it cooler. Thoughts?

Can you hang onto the barrel afterwards?

Either way, it shouldn't wander.

 

[hlee]

10 shots in 90 sec doesn’t cause a “PRS” barrel to wander sufficiently to miss a 1 moa target…

 

[Txshooter3]

Can you hang onto the barrel afterwards?

Either way, it shouldn't wander.

Nope

 

[19Scout77]

30 shots in 30 is slow and far from sufficient to heat up a 223 to any appreciable degree.

 

[Txshooter3]

30 shots in 30 is slow and far from sufficient to heat up a 223 to any appreciable degree.

Sorry, but I have to disagree.
I've duplicated the situation while doing some load testing. After 15 rds it started dropping again.

 

[19Scout77]

You can disagree all you want. You’d still be wrong. Put a thermometer on it and report back.

 

[Txshooter3]

You can disagree all you want. You’d still be wrong. Put a thermometer on it and report back.

Very funny.
You do realize this is a bolt gun, right?
Since you seem to be so cocksure, maybe you can explain what's happening?

 

[djarecke]

I don’t understand that large of a dispersion in your group. I shot about 50 rounds through my bolt 223 in approximately 10 minutes and the rifle still shot predictably at 500 yards. If you’re seeing that much dispersion, something must be greatly amiss especially if you’re seeing it at 300 yards.

 

[Supersubes]

Very funny.
You do realize this is a bolt gun, right?
Since you seem to be so cocksure, maybe you can explain what's happening?

All he’s saying is that’s not much heat. Whether its a stressed barrel that wanders with what little heat is there, or you have some other issue, is anyone’s guess. You already have a data point with your fellow competitors, it will be up to you to figure this out. Its my opinion that you should be able to fire double that number of rounds in 30 mins and not see an appreciable shift.

 

[Elite_KG]

30 shots in 30 min does not seem like a lot of heat for a heavier profile or CF barrel. The barrel shouldn’t experience a POI shift at that rate. I would be really curious to know the barrel temp after 10/20/30 minutes shooting 1 shot per min. I may even measure mine next time I shoot.

I feel like many shoot that rate or faster during load development.

Shooting 5 shots consecutively and back shooting in about 5 min seems about normal.

I would agree if you are truly getting a POI shift from that rate of fire then the barrel has an issue (assuming ni other causes associated with the rifle).

Now if we were talking about a large magnum rifle (300 WM, 7mm Mag, 300 RUM, 300 Norma, 30 Nosler, 6 SAUM, etc) then I could see that barrel being pretty warm at 1 shot per minute. The actual temp at which you experience the shift would be more telling.

Whats the rule of thumb? ~130-140F is about the temp you can barely hold your hand on a surface?….I don’t recall for sure, bit it’s around there.