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Help with AR15 Load
- Thread starter Brux
- Start date
Ball powder for it's ease and consistency going through the powder measure. I stick with bullets weighing 68 or 69 grains because:
1. The bullet doesn't take up powder capacity inside the case.
2. The bullet isn't seated too deeply in the case so it risks either compressing the powder load, or risk having the case mouth ahead
of the bullets full diameter bearing surface.
3. I rarely shoot over 600 meters, and the 68 or 69 grain bullets work fine for me within that distance.
4. As I don't "need" a heavier bullet, there is no reason for me to spend more money buying the more expensive 75 grain bullets.
5. It is easier to find deals on 68 or 69 grain bullets than it is on 75 grain bullets.
The minor additional weight to carry would only be important to a mall ninja, or someone planning on carrying lots of ammo over a very long distance.
1. The bullet doesn't take up powder capacity inside the case.
2. The bullet isn't seated too deeply in the case so it risks either compressing the powder load, or risk having the case mouth ahead
of the bullets full diameter bearing surface.
3. I rarely shoot over 600 meters, and the 68 or 69 grain bullets work fine for me within that distance.
4. As I don't "need" a heavier bullet, there is no reason for me to spend more money buying the more expensive 75 grain bullets.
5. It is easier to find deals on 68 or 69 grain bullets than it is on 75 grain bullets.
The minor additional weight to carry would only be important to a mall ninja, or someone planning on carrying lots of ammo over a very long distance.
For the 69 / 77smk's H322 and Russian primers is dead nuts accurate! If you want a tad more velocity XBR is a real good choice too. Both powders meter good. Varget is good but the short extruded powders are just plain easier to deal with and to me Vargets doesn't offer anything better than the other two. Those are my two main suspects and I don't really like ball powders but I guess you can get Tac to work just fine. Now the 75's... well can't chime in on that. I didn't like my groups so I gave up on them.
24.8 R15, 7-1/2 primer, LC case, 69 SMK, 2.255. An excellent load in my Colt 20" 1-7. The 24.8 load doesn't seem to be particularly primer sensitive.
69Gr SMK, 25.4 Varget, F205m, Win brass.. 2840-ish out of an 18" 1/7 Wylde. Chrono was giving me grief that day.. but dope at 600 was damn near spot on, so its close.
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I used that load of XBR for quite awhile but on a new lot, I started getting pressure signs so I backed off to 23.4 and kind of stayed there. My groups didn't change at all. I haven't tried H4895 so that's nice to know it's been working good!
With the Hornadys, that's more of a tangent shaped round so try and load them to full mag length. They seem to be more jump sensitive and like to be long, but that's just my experience with playing with them and I don't use them anymore.
I love the 77smk's but I've been getting the exact same results with the Nosler 77cc's and they're about $80-$90 cheaper per 1000 so it makes me likey them even more! Plus they frag like a mofo!
Iv'e tested about 4 different powders in my AR with 69 SMK's and my top performing powder has been Benchmark loaded to approx 23.5 gr. Average velocity from my 24" Varmint barrel 2960 fps.
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I actually loaded the 8208xbr to 24.4gr but group size was a hair bigger than the 23.8g load so I backed off. I had zero pressure signs up to 24.6gr.
Oh nice! XBR is my favorite powder right now. It's very temp stable and shoots lights out in any bullet weight - kind of a do all for me! You just have to watch your brass when you're at 23.8 -24+, it has a tendency to turn on you. I don't know if it was a certain lot or what, but I was shooting a butt-ton at 23.8 and all the sudden I was getting blown primers. 23.4 has been awesome and that's been tried in several rifles with great results so I'm just cool right there!
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Did you chrono your loads? What are you getting at 23.4?
23.5 was really accurate but a bit slow. 23.8 is still a bit slow at 2589 and 24.4 is perfect at 2672 but .75-1" at 100. 23.5-23.8 is shooting .40" at 100.
All shot out of a 16" WOA SS Match 1:7 barrel
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Damn I don't remember my chrono results, but I think it had a tad more velocity then what your getting though. That almost sounds kind of slow to what I was getting through a BCM 16ss, with a KAC 16" and BCM 16" cl for check comparison.
Reminds me to get another chrono - the wife decided to park in the garage and run the damn thing over!
Reading around on other forums, XBR seems to have a tendency to be "spiky" at or very near top loads. I have not personally observed this, just goes to show that rifles are different, work up and watch your (br)ass.
I've never played with CCI 400's but I have with 41's. You get a tad more speed with them but your ES and SD's go stupid and they are not worth the price. Let me know how the Fed GM's work, i have a few of them I was going to try for the hell of it. I usually use Rem 7.5's and Russian primers for real low spreads.
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My 24.4 XBR load with CCI 400 primers in 1xLC brass has chrono 2672 ES 5 and SD 2. Really good numbers. Heres a link to my thread trying to copy th3 IMI 77gr OTM Mod 1 load and shows my test results http://www.snipershide.com/shooting/showthread.php?t=272533
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We have kinda hijacked the OP's thread… Oops. We're kinda still on topic 
Padom, are you gonna stick with 23.8 now? Just curious. Im gonna run my first 77SMK OCW tomorrow with XBR 23.4-24.2 w/F205M's. Im running similar barrel to yours, WOA SS 1/7 wylde in 18". I may not push any further if you're seeing the accuracy drop off. My pos chrony is TU tho so I'm gonna just look at accuracy then pick the best ones and try some at 400-600. Im hoping 23.8 gets me 2600 (+ would be nice)
Road_clam I've been running benchmark under Vmax's for several years now with excellent results. Average .5 @3330 with a 53gr out of my 24" Tikka. I think I may try some with 69SMK's as well.
Padom, are you gonna stick with 23.8 now? Just curious. Im gonna run my first 77SMK OCW tomorrow with XBR 23.4-24.2 w/F205M's. Im running similar barrel to yours, WOA SS 1/7 wylde in 18". I may not push any further if you're seeing the accuracy drop off. My pos chrony is TU tho so I'm gonna just look at accuracy then pick the best ones and try some at 400-600. Im hoping 23.8 gets me 2600 (+ would be nice)
Road_clam I've been running benchmark under Vmax's for several years now with excellent results. Average .5 @3330 with a 53gr out of my 24" Tikka. I think I may try some with 69SMK's as well.
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I'm having good luck with 75's and bad luck with 69's. The 75's are longer than 77's and need a powder charge reduction.
I'd say if you're going to order 1000 to split it in half - 500 69rs and 500 77's. That way you can get some load development / time on both. I pretty much stay with the heavies - doesn't limit you to a shorter range. And don't limit yourself to Sierras, the Noslers are just as good and better on pricing. If you shoot a lot, you get roughly 4000 Nosler 77's to 3000 smk's. Between the 69's and 77's the price is close enough to not make a difference. My thoughts anyways.
Really? Damn i just couldn't get them to even group close to even an inch at a 100 for me. Maybe they just hate me or something! When Hornady came out with that yellow tipped zombie round I thought they went gay and just lost all interest in them!
I tend to agree.. Play with both, both are good rounds. I like the load development stage, its fun and challenging. Then later on when you've got a load thats dialed and you're dropping them on targets spot on, its rewarding.
Almost forgot.. its one more excuse to goto the range.. "but honey, I HAVE to go shoot tomorrow, I have all these loads to test….."
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I bought a box to try and am liking them. My rifle likes .2grs less 8208 than with 77's which are .010" shorter in length. When you're up there in pressure, everything starts to become important: bullet length, OAL, case capacity, primer, etc.
They sure do! I remember when I started reloading and on measuring for OAL about every round would be different - just drove me nuts! I finally started measuring from the ogive and pretty much settled down the OCD in me since my measurements will all be the same. I pretty much stick to the same few primers and powders but I also try to not stay married to any one of them either but it's easy to stay in my comfort zone. Now with case capacity, how much actual powder is burnt for maximum efficiency, etc,... Yeah... I hate measuring!
I've had really good luck with the 75 BTHP's and 25.0 grs of Varget, CCI BR4's also basically the same load with 73 gr Bergers. Both shoot great through my 18" 1:8 wylde chambered Rainier barrel. I have to get my powder to settle a bit before I stuff bullets though, I just touch my loading block with one of those little vibratory engraving tools and it all settles really nicely, it's still compressed a bit but settling makes it so I don't deform the bullets trying to cram them in.
I never got the 69 SMK's to shoot as well as the other 2, close but not quite.
I never got the 69 SMK's to shoot as well as the other 2, close but not quite.
I neglected to add this to my earlier post, but another load that works very well in my 1989 Colt AR is a max load of 2000MR with the Hornady 75bthp.
It shoots 1" or less out of my rifle at 100 yds, haven't had time to try it further yet but I expect it to do well.
It shoots 1" or less out of my rifle at 100 yds, haven't had time to try it further yet but I expect it to do well.
I've ran 8208 XBR, Alliant 2000MR, and Ramshot TAC all with good results with 77gr SMK's so I would start with those when working up for other heavy projectiles.
