Rifle Scopes Hendoldt or S&B

[the once-ler]

I am going to bite the bullet and pop for a top tier scope, I am so fed up with all the BS on these cheaper scopes.
Should I get the 6-24x72mm Hensoldt or the 5-25x56 S&B

 

[JRWALLSIII]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

If you want the best get a SB 5x25 MSR. One is for sale in the optics section. Its a great scope. I love mine!!!!

 

[bengates]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

SB. Better reticle choices.

 

[58blackflag]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

Gappa, here is a good read on a hendsolt scope with comparisons to other top tier brands. Lots of great info! May help make your decision easier.
http://demigodllc.com/articles/hensoldt-4-16x56-mm-scope-how-does-it-stack-up/

 

[jbell]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

Get the Bender.

 

[bama110]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

The 72 mm bell will give you the right objective to actually use the 24 power with out losing resolution. I shoot a 4-16x56 and have never wanted for move power. The henny also will not tunnel at any magnification. Just find some
One and look through both let you eye be the judge.

 

[bward]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

If you want to choose between a Hensoldt and a S&B you should be comparing the 4-16x56 FFP Hensoldt with the Schmidt. The Hensoldt will be easier to get behind and keep a good sight picture and the Schmidt will give you more magnification and reticle choices.

 

[the once-ler]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

reitcle choices I could care less about I want clarity, clarity, clarity. I want to look through a scope and go AHHHHHHHHHH. To me a reticle is just a crosshair. I am sooooo pissed with premier right now I feel like smashing them on the ground!

 

[poison123]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

Exactly what are you going to use the scope for?

 

[Rob01]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gappa</div><div class="ubbcode-body">reitcle choices I could care less about </div></div>

Lol if you stay in this sport and use the scope as intended then you will come back and laugh at your statement as well.

Having a good workable reticle is key. Both scopes have great glass. You wont be let down but great glass is only part of the solution of hitting the target. Look at the other features including reticles as you don't want to make the rookies mistake and get on the "great glass" tangent and forget other important parts of the decision.

 

[the once-ler]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

seems like regular mil dot has served me just fine all these years.

 

[poison123]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gappa</div><div class="ubbcode-body">seems like regular mil dot has served me just fine all these years. </div></div>

Just go buy a leupold.

 

[throwback]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

Kahles 624i -- You will be impressed. I am.

Glass = On par with S&B and Henny, if not better than S&B
Terrets = Better than either
Parallax = Better than either
Weight = Better then either
Price = Better than either
Reticle = MIL4 better than standard mildot and P4f, but not quite as good as H2CMR

 

[poison123]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: throwback</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Kahles 624i -- You will be impressed. I am.

Glass = On par with S&B and Henny, if not better than S&B
Terrets = Better than either
Parallax = Better than either
Weight = Better then either
Price = Better than either
Reticle = MIL4 better than standard mildot and P4f, but not quite as good as H2CMR </div></div>

Have you actually spent time behind all 3?

 

[lizzardking308]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: throwback</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Terrets = Better than either
</div></div>

What are "Terrets"??????

 

[jbell]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Poison123</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: throwback</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Kahles 624i -- You will be impressed. I am.

Glass = On par with S&B and Henny, if not better than S&B
Terrets = Better than either
Parallax = Better than either
Weight = Better then either
Price = Better than either
Reticle = MIL4 better than standard mildot and P4f, but not quite as good as H2CMR </div></div>

Have you actually spent time behind all 3? </div></div>

I have, but not much time behind the Kahles yet. I would not go so far as to say the glass is better than the Bender or the Hensoldt, as good sure but not better (but that is a opnion). I will say the Kahles has the bender beat in the eye box, its a bit bigger. Here are some of my thoughts:
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=3453394#Post3453394

 

[Bacarrat]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lizzardking308</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: throwback</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Terrets = Better than either
</div></div>

What are "Terrets"?????? </div></div>

Must be the same thing as Turnets

 

[dmg308]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lizzardking308</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: throwback</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Terrets = Better than either
</div></div>

What are "Terrets"?????? </div></div>

Isn't that the disease that makes you sh$t F%&K Pi*S Son a Bi&^h..........?

 

[bama110]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

I also still perfer std mil dot for my rifles. I do shoot matches and have improved over the years. My finish has never been determined by my reticle. The last k&m match I made a first round hit on the milling stage and a lot of shooters with the reticle of the month did not hit the target at all. This is only my opinion and experience.

 

[MB4810]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gappa</div><div class="ubbcode-body">reitcle choices I could care less about </div></div>

Lol if you stay in this sport and use the scope as intended then you will come back and laugh at your statement as well.

Having a good workable reticle is key. Both scopes have great glass. You wont be let down but great glass is only part of the solution of hitting the target. Look at the other features including reticles as you don't want to make the rookies mistake and get on the "great glass" tangent and forget other important parts of the decision.

</div></div>


+1 ^^^ when a wise man speak listen and learn

 

[onyx1357]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

I would stick with the S&B for sure I like the way they do business

 

[the once-ler]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

damnit this is a hard decision

 

[ctmyers67]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

+1 for s&b, very impressed with their product, and customer service is top notch

 

[poison123]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

Honestly its not a hard decision between 6-24x72mm Hensoldt or the 5-25x56 S&B.


Its the S&B all day long, that Henny is HUGE!

 

[victorz]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

They are both good scopes. 72mm hensoldt is kind of too big, unless you don't want to use spotting scopes. OR you can wait for the new Hensoldt 3-26x56. Personally, I have two hensoldts, the reason I don't have s&b is be becasue Hensoldt is much shorter than s&b.

take a look The new Hensoldlt 3-26x56

 

[Diablo]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dmg308</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lizzardking308</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: throwback</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Terrets = Better than either
</div></div>

What are "Terrets"?????? </div></div>

Isn't that the disease that makes you sh$t F%&K Pi*S Son a Bi&^h..........? </div></div>

Think it's a Syndrome, not actually a disease......means that you can't take penicillin for it.

 

[Jig Stick]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Poison123</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gappa</div><div class="ubbcode-body">seems like regular mil dot has served me just fine all these years. </div></div>

Just go buy a leupold. </div></div>

what he said

 

[Unsichtbar]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jbell</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Poison123</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: throwback</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Kahles 624i -- You will be impressed. I am.

Glass = On par with S&B and Henny, if not better than S&B
Terrets = Better than either
Parallax = Better than either
Weight = Better then either
Price = Better than either
Reticle = MIL4 better than standard mildot and P4f, but not quite as good as H2CMR </div></div>

Have you actually spent time behind all 3? </div></div>

I have, but not much time behind the Kahles yet. I would not go so far as to say the glass is better than the Bender or the Hensoldt, as good sure but not better (but that is a opnion). I will say the Kahles has the bender beat in the eye box, its a bit bigger. Here are some of my thoughts:
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=3453394#Post3453394 </div></div>


I have been shooting S&B since 1980s and have several, also have had others PH 5-25 and Hensoldt. I still have the S&Bs however I have been using the Kahles 624i I am really impressed. IMO is better in many ways to the S&B as others are pointing out ( the glass is equal to Bender or the Hensoldt, subjective observation) I might be going to replace my other S&Bs except for my MK2 S&B, I like the that much.

 

[the once-ler]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

wow these are hard decisions to make, that new hensoldt looks amazing but so does the Kahles. which S&B should I get? what's with the CW and CCW turrets?

 

[bward]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gappa</div><div class="ubbcode-body">wow these are hard decisions to make, that new hensoldt looks amazing but so does the Kahles. which S&B should I get? what's with the CW and CCW turrets?</div></div>
Clockwise and Counter Clock Wise. I think between the reticles don't matter comment and whats CW and CCW I would get some time behind some of these scopes actually shooting them before plopping down over 3 grand.

 

[the once-ler]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

when will the new zeiss be available?

 

[poison123]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gappa</div><div class="ubbcode-body">when will the new zeiss be available? </div></div>

I doubt it'll be out till mid next year.

 

[bengates]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gappa</div><div class="ubbcode-body">when will the new zeiss be available?</div></div>

Some time in early 2016 . . . maybe late 2015.

 

[Jinta]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

Have both. Go S&B.

 

[the once-ler]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

which one do you think I should get? of course the 5-25 but there are so many and I really dont understand all the different specs?
I'm putting it on an out of the box Rem 700 SPS.. I have a 20moa one piece seekins and also a 0 moa two piece base

 

[AED146]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

who ever said the Kahls is cheaper, there the same price or just about poor reticle choices as well Buy the SB,,, for 3 hundred more buy a scope that has been tested around forever.

 

[cox308]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gappa</div><div class="ubbcode-body">which one do you think I should get? of course the 5-25 but there are so many and I really dont understand all the different specs?
I'm putting it on an out of the box Rem 700 SPS.. I have a 20moa one piece seekins and also a 0 moa two piece base </div></div>

LMFAO! So you're going going to put a $3500-4000 scope on a $600 factory out of the box Fucking SPS?? ....……I'd say go with that 2 piece base...may also want to consider a CounterSniper scope...

 

[the once-ler]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

dude I had an out of the box 700 LTR with a Leupold 4.5-14x50mm that would do 1/4" and even a few one hole groups so don't go knocking out of the box Remingtons. I did hand lap the barrel though. I am a firm believer your accuracy comes 90% from your optic.

 

[jbell]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

Gappa, as you know you are on the right track. The best rifle ever made with a shit scope on it will give you shit results even with G David Tubb pulling the trigger. Buy the scope you want coughBENDERcough and then if need be upgrade the rifle later.

 

[oldfatguy]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

"LMFAO! So you're going going to put a $3500-4000 scope on a $600 factory out of the box Fucking SPS?? ....……I'd say go with that 2 piece base...may also want to consider a CounterSniper scope... "

Yes some people will put a $3600 scope on a $600 rifle, I didn't. My 5R cost all of $1,000 and it wears the PMII 5-25x56 very well in Badger rings on a Badger base thank you.

OFG

 

[Cologgi]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cox380</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gappa</div><div class="ubbcode-body">which one do you think I should get? of course the 5-25 but there are so many and I really dont understand all the different specs?
I'm putting it on an out of the box Rem 700 SPS.. I have a 20moa one piece seekins and also a 0 moa two piece base </div></div>

LMFAO! So you're going going to put a $3500-4000 scope on a $600 factory out of the box Fucking SPS?? ....……I'd say go with that 2 piece base...may also want to consider a CounterSniper scope...

</div></div>

The difference between a $600 rifle and a $5000 dollar surgeon is marginal in real life (1/2" at 100). The difference between a $600 scope and a $3500 S&B is night and day in my opinion. I have 2 S&B's and I believe they were worth every penny. I have owned 3 total and they seem to actually go up in value instead of down. Try buying a $600 leupold, keeping it a year, and then selling it for more than what you paid.

I've got a Surgeon and a Gap with an S&B on each, but I still value the function of the scope more than the rifle

Get the nice scope and then upgrade the rifle later, if ever.

 

[BobD]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

I'm sorry, I have to ask this as well...
You are looking at some serious high investment glass here... why not matte it to a rifle of a similar calibur? I'm not calling the 700 a slouch by any means it just seems disproportionate. If you're really obtaining sub 1/4" without even swapping your trigger... sounds like you could really shine with some more heavy equipment.
I don't mean to judge and I completely understand the want for having the glass your looking at. Are you going for the "get the glass that lasts forever now" and upgrade the rest later? Also, what don't you like about Premier?

Good luck with which ever you pick... I don't think either one will disappoint you. (Objective size on Hend .. sounds a bit excessive though)

 

[ChrisF]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B


I would give serious consideration to the newer Hensoldts , ie the 4-16x56 & the 3.5-26x56 that use the newer knobs ala the same as the 3.5-26x56 model , also with the newer reticle etc

 

[oldfatguy]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

"I'm sorry, I have to ask this as well...
You are looking at some serious high investment glass here... "

You are correct. S&B scopes are serious high investment glass. Given reasonable care they will at the least hold their value, if not appreciate. Fact is the cost of ownership for my S&B scopes is less then that of the MK 4 on the Remmy SPS-T in the safe. Not going to put money into the stock market today, and how much interest are CD's paying now?

Makes sense to invest in high end scopes and the S&Bs are a pure joy to get behind.

OFG

 

[the once-ler]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

I have had TWO BRAND NEW defective Premier Light Tactical scopes come in. The first one had water or oil droplets all on the inside lenses and the illumination didn't work. I sent that one to Paul Lange and Trevor at ATI sent me another BRAND NEW ONE, after TWO yes 2 rounds of .223 from my AR15 it has a black fleck right under the reticle on the inside of the scope. I called Paul and he told me to hit it with a phone book!!!!!! to try an knock it off.
Needless to say Trevor called me back and is trying to arrange another new scope.
Shit you pay full retail of $2350 for a scope it better be PERFECT!!!!!

 

[the once-ler]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

So my new SCHMIDT is OTW baby!!!!

http://www.schmidtundbender.de/en/products/police-and-military-forces/5-25x56-pm-iilpmtclt.html

I mean really how freaking much $$$$$$$$ do you have to spend to get a nice scope these days!
I used to be a Leupold man and to to me they were very nice, glass was good and they tracked and worked very well. But just getting back into shooting and the two REPLACEMENT Leupolds SUCKED ass! The first one had a canted reticle and the replacement had such bad Chromatic Aberration and flare I couldn't stand it. IMHO Leupys glass used to be very nice and my dad still has an older one that looks nice but seems like these "bottom shelf" bottom feeders are in it for the money so if they can get a POS to sell by using their old reputation they are on the way out the door, the competition these days is fierce for our hard earned cash and the one that don't keep their reputations up they won't last long111

 

[Rancid Coolaid]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

When it comes to buying screwed up optics, God seems to hate you. I have 2 Premiers and both have been perfect: you have 2 Premiers and both have had issues.

Good luck with the S&B, nice glass, nice scope.

And my OT offer stands: I'll take that piece of shit LT off your hands for $100. Cash money!


<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gappa</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am a firm believer your accuracy comes 90% from your optic. </div></div>

That has not been my experience; then again, none of your experiences have been similar to mine, so maybe it's just me.

 

[oldfatguy]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

"So my new SCHMIDT is OTW baby!!!!"

So which reticle are you getting?

"I mean really how freaking much $$$$$$$$ do you have to spend to get a nice scope these days!"

The scope you have linked is a bit better then "nice". I look at it as an investment. S&B scopes hold their value so aside from the up front $$$$$ your life cycle cost will be very low, or non exsistant.


OFG

 

[the once-ler]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

I am getting the P4 FEIN

 

[Rob01]

Re: Hendoldt or S&B

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: oldfatguy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
So which reticle are you getting?

</div></div>
Probably just a P3. He doesn't need those fancy reticles.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gappa</div><div class="ubbcode-body">seems like regular mil dot has served me just fine all these years.</div></div>