Rifle Scopes Hight End AR Hunting Scope

[Nosler243Shooter]

I have ordered a RRA mid-length that will be here in about 2.5 months. I need a quality scope that will be very bright in low light because it will be used for hunting. I have been looking at the Nightforce 2.5-10x32. Will this scope give me the low light performance that I need? What others are available for less than $2000?

 

[CanPopper]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

Trijicon 2.5-10x56 would be hard to beat for low light and price. With low light, you want bigger aperture, good baffling, and good glass.

The Trijicon meets all the above parameters plus it has an illuminated reticle.

 

[prplhaz72]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

If you got that kind of money to spend, I would get a Zeiss Diavari, a Swaro, S&B or Leica.

I have a Swaro Z6 1.7-10x. In low light it is very good. The glass quality makes it very enjoyable to use.

http://swfa.com/Zeiss-15-6x42-Victory-Diavari-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P7722.aspx
http://swfa.com/Zeiss-25-10x50-Victory-Diavari-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P7727.aspx
http://swfa.com/Swarovski-17-10x42-Z6-30mm-Riflescope-P12060.aspx
http://swfa.com/Leica-25-10x42-ER-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P42511.aspx
http://swfa.com/Schmidt-Bender-15-6x42-Zenith-30mm-Riflescope-P4804.aspx

 

[knockemdown]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

One benefit of an AR is that there is no shortage of room for objective clearance with the typical 1.2-1.5" mount height needed for good sight picture. Unlike a hunting bolt rifle, where much over a 44mm objective (IMO) is getting too tall for my liking...

I've got a 56mm NXS on a hunting AR and I like it plenty for those dim/dark coyote stands. Trijicon's 56mm would be a less expensive option...

 

[slm9s]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

At least take a look at a new Leica ER with the #1 reticle. Excellent glass and a nice bold reticle that doesn't take up much of the field of view.

 

[Nosler243Shooter]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

I really need a scope with tactical turrets. I should have mentioned that before. I won't use this feature much for hunting but I love to target shoot. What scope would you recommend?

 

[SFCAnimal]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

Go for the Trijicon 3-9x40 mil dot best bang under 1000 bucks

 

[LibertyOptics]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 243Varminter</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I have been looking at the Nightforce 2.5-10x32. Will this scope give me the low light performance that I need? </div></div>

No

 

[LibertyOptics]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SFC Animal</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Go for the Trijicon 3-9x40 mil dot best bang under 1000 bucks </div></div>

He has $2000 to spend and this scope is under $700. Nice first post, Spankie.

 

[LibertyOptics]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

Here are some options for you.

Trijicon 2.5-10x56
Sightron SIII LR 3.5-10x56 illuminated 4a
IOR 6-24x56
IOR 3.5-18x50
Zeiss Victory Diavari 3-12x56

Leica, Swarovski options too

Scott

 

[SFCAnimal]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

I used the Trijicon 3-9x40 mil dot on deployment it is a great low light carbine scope no reason to spend 2000 bucks use the money you save to buy more ammo because more ammo is the only thing that will make you a better shot

 

[Nosler243Shooter]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

I want low light performance but I don't want the scope to overwhelm the rifle. Here is the link to the rifle I ordered. RRA Mid-Length A4

 

[ranger1183]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

What size target will you be shooting at? What distances are your shots most likely to take place? Are you First Focal Plane savy? Do you need/want an illuminated reticle?

 

[prplhaz72]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

While this one does not have quite the glass quality of my Swaro, I am posting it just so you can see the size on an AR. This is a 1.5-6x42 Burris Euro

The mag range is excellent for a hunting AR IMO. I would seriously consider the Zeiss 1.5-6x or the S&B 1.5-6x I listed before. With the 42mm objectives they keep the exit pupil at 7mm or above no matter what mag you are on. Cannot ask for better for a low light scope.

 

[LibertyOptics]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 243Varminter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I want low light performance but I don't want the scope to overwhelm the rifle. Here is the link to the rifle I ordered. RRA Mid-Length A4 </div></div>

Then take the options originally offered and opt for smaller objective size. Quality of glass and coatings is more important for low light work as the objective size decreases. I'm guessing you'd want a lit reticle for hunting, but maybe not.

 

[fireEMT5]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

No where near the top of your budget, but don't overlook the SWFA SS 3x9x42 with the new Mil-Quad reticle. While it doesn't have a illuminated reticle, it has the rest.

http://swfa.com/SWFA-SS-3-9x42-Tactical-30mm-Riflescope-P50716.aspx

I had the 3x9 mil dot and it worked great on my AR. I should have the new 3x9 Mil-Quad sometime next week. Me thinks that will make a great scope for target/hunting/or whatever.

http://www.opticstalk.com/extensive-swfass-group-buy-incredible-savings_topic28845.html - This is for the mil-dot model.

If you want to go big, get in on the group buy for the SS 5x20 before midnight tonight - $999.00 This is probably overkill, but value beyond belief if the initial evaluations hold up.

 

[SWFA]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

243Varminter,

A common misconception is that you have to have a scope with a large objective in order for it to perform well in low light, this is not true.

Low light performance is primarily dictated by the quality of the glass and coatings. A scope with a 20mm objective can be just as bright as a scope with a 56mm objective, it will just do it on a lower magnification. The only benefit of a very large objective is the ability to use it on higher magnifications in low light.

I assume since you are building a mid length AR as a hunting rifle and the fact that you inquired about a 2.5-10x32 NF that you don't plan on this being a long range big game set up.

TheOneTwo's suggestions are spot on, I wish this Swarovski was less because it would be perfect.

http://swfa.com/Swarovski-17-10x42-Z6i-30mm-Riflescope-P7604.aspx

The little NF would work and is better than most scopes out there. It's optimum setting for low light would be 4x-5x. We have one on The SampleList right now for $1199. There are also many Swarovskis, Zeiss and a few Leicas on there (priced right) that would work very well.

http://www.samplelist.com/

 

[mgoodrich]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

I have a NF 3-15x56 with 1RR reticle that works well in low light condtions mounted on a RRA predator.

It is a bit heavy, but it works for me. Use it for coyote hunting.

 

[CSTactical]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

I have used the NF 2.5-10x32mm in low light and it has worked very well. I have played with the Swarovski Z3 3-10x42mm BRH and it is very impressive in low light but have not used one on a rifle yet. There are a lot of great scopes out there that will do the job. What it really comes down to is what features DO YOU like such as Reticl, turrets, and a must for you light transmission. Another great scope the works great in low light are the Premier Line.

Mike @ CST

 

[BCP]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

Well, my IOR's seem to have the best low light performance out of the scopes I have. But I think a super sniper 3-9 + bobro mount for 600 would probably do you just fine.

 

[00bullitt]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

I've had a Swarovski Z6i in the 1-6 and 1.7-10. They were the most impressive pieces of glass I have owned in terms of low light performance. I also have a NF 2.5-10x32. And I have no issues in low light. I've used it in low light to the point that if it did not have an illuminated reticle, I could not have taken the shot.

I was very much able to identify the points on the buck that I was about to take. It was on 8x and the deer was 110 yards away against a treeline with about 10 does. It was easily 30-40 minutes after the sun was below the trees and dark enough that I needed a flashlight to see to walk. The scope was able to manage enough light for me to see the animals clearly.

I think alot of folks under estimate the 32mm objective on the Nightforce.

 

[Nosler243Shooter]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

Thanks for all the replies. There are so many scopes to choose from I don't know what to do. I really like that new hunter model from Premier. I has capped turrets but it still would give me a lot of options but I don't know if I need that much scope. Realistically, I probably won't use this rifle out past around 250 yards for hunting deer. I wanted a rifle that would be easier to carry. My 308 weights like 14lbs. I have never owned a FFP scope so I don't know is I would like that either. I really need a max power of 9x-10x. I wanted a Nightforce so bad but it doesn't see like the right choice here. Also I am fairly sure I have never dialed my scope in a hunting situation so as for the turrets I guess I could let that idea go. However, the illumination would be a nice feature for those late evening shots. Does this help narrow things down?

 

[Meat Hunter]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

Whatever you get, the illuminated reticle is a must for low light hunting. I had a Swarovzki Z6 non illuminated that gathered light better than anything I ever used or even saw. The problem was that although I could see the deer in low light I could not see the reticle against a dark background.

 

[Aubie]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SWFA</div><div class="ubbcode-body">243Varminter,

A common misconception is that you have to have a scope with a large objective in order for it to perform well in low light, this is not true.

Low light performance is primarily dictated by the quality of the glass and coatings. A scope with a 20mm objective can be just as bright as a scope with a 56mm objective, it will just do it on a lower magnification. The only benefit of a very large objective is the ability to use it on higher magnifications in low light.

I assume since you are building a mid length AR as a hunting rifle and the fact that you inquired about a 2.5-10x32 NF that you don't plan on this being a long range big game set up.

TheOneTwo's suggestions are spot on, I wish this Swarovski was less because it would be perfect.

http://swfa.com/Swarovski-17-10x42-Z6i-30mm-Riflescope-P7604.aspx

The little NF would work and is better than most scopes out there. It's optimum setting for low light would be 4x-5x. We have one on The SampleList right now for $1199. There are also many Swarovskis, Zeiss and a few Leicas on there (priced right) that would work very well.

http://www.samplelist.com/
</div></div>

Spot on advice. If you want to do some quantitative analysis of light transmission just calculate exit pupils for each scope. Divide the objective size by the magnification. Anything over 7mm or so is wasted (average size of a human pupil).

So a 2.5-10x32 NF has an exit pupil of 32/2.5 of 13mm at 2.5x and 32/10 or 3.2 mm at max power. So you can see that even if you put a 100mm objective on a scope, it would not make the image any brighter at lower powers.

Here's an easy demonstration of that:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GBS0KVxBmRA

 

[5RWill]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

S&B short dot, NF 2.5-10x32mm,USO 1.8-10x37mm, and leupy would be my choices. I went with a leupold mark 4 M2 2.5-8x36mm, partly due to being impatient and would have to had waited two more weeks to get the money for another USO, although it would've been great. I'm not at all disappointed with my Leupold, as my first mark 4 i'm impressed. Is it quite as clear as my USO or Zeiss conquest? No but it is still very clear. The biggest surprise is the amount of light gathered in low light conditions, its alot better than i thought it would being a 37mm objective. In all honesty it beats my fathers vari X III 4.5-14x50mm, in both clarity and low light performance IMO. As i said I'm impressed. If you can get your hands on some at a range or store and see what you like best, they're all very good.

 

[edwin907]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

Blackops, my experience mirrors yours.
My MR/T 3-9X36 is equal in low light to my Vari-X III 4.5-14X50 at similar powers, despite the much larger objective of the cheaper scope. It's all about the glass, for sure.
The better the glass, the higher the resolution and the less need for more magnification.
I'm another fan of the USO 1.8-10X37.
Awesome scope!

 

[Nosler243Shooter]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

The Trijicon Accupoint is about half of what I was going to pay but there sure have been a lot of talk in favor of this scope. The exit pupil is higher than the little Nightforce I was originally looking at. The 3-9x40 would probably do everything that I would ever need it to do and save me a lot of money. What do you guys think?

 

[TorF]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

Keep it simple on an auto: This Zeiss Varipoint day and night red dot works like an Aimpoint with exellent low light performance. This is the fastest scope in use in any mag-setting and a nobrainer for Aimpoint users. It can also be retrofitted with a lockable target turret:

http://swfa.com/Zeiss-25-10x50-Victory-Varipoint-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P7732.aspx

A more compact version is the 1.5-6x42 Varipoint. It's a pity Zeiss stopped making the 2.5-10x42 Varipoint.

The Zeiss Diavari/Varipoint has better low light resolution than the Swaro Z6 in direct comparison.

 

[ccoker]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 243Varminter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The Trijicon Accupoint is about half of what I was going to pay but there sure have been a lot of talk in favor of this scope. The exit pupil is higher than the little Nightforce I was originally looking at. The 3-9x40 would probably do everything that I would ever need it to do and save me a lot of money. What do you guys think? </div></div>

hard to argue against one frankly
I like the green dot / mildot

 

[Nosler243Shooter]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

Would a lower power Vortex PST work well for low light hunting?

 

[prplhaz72]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

If you want to stay cheaper now, you will not find a scope better for low light hunting than a Trijicon. They have good glass and the illumination is fantastic. A Vortex will have nothing on a Trijicon.

 

[koshkin]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

Based on what you are looking for, I think you are on the right track with a scope that has an objective lens of 40mm or thereabouts.

The 3-9x40 Trijicon is a good option.

Generally, Leupold VX-6 2-12x42 with illuminated reticle would probably be a near ideal scope for your application, but I am not sure it is out already.

Swaro Z6 1.7-10x42 is a superb option, but the illuminated version is a bit outside your budget. For low light, a well executed illuminated reticle is a pretty good thing to have.

While it is not mentioned too often, if I were you, I would also glance at Burris SixX 2-12x40 or 2-12x50. Both are pretty competent designs available with or without an illuminated reticle for $1000 - $1200.

ILya

 

[Opticsspecialist]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

depending on the game, and range, i second those 2.5-10 nightforce recommendations.thats a great option. personally i've been hunting one of these on an ar and i really like it, granted i have it on a 20 inch upper, but still some good food for thought

http://www.sportoptics.com/swarovski-z5-rifle-scope-3-18x44-bt-plex.aspx

or if you like a ballistic reticle, this scope works pretty well

http://www.sportoptics.com/swarovski-z5-rifle-scope-3-18x44-59766.aspx

i'd pit the swarovski z5 scopes against a lot of 30mm tube scopes on the market, the optics make a huge difference in lower light

 

[Nosler243Shooter]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

Between the Trijicon 3-9x40 and the Nightforce 2.5-10x32 which going to give me the best low light performance? I assume that the NF will have better glass so I thought that it might give me and edge but it might not? Here is a link to a low light calculator I found. Low-Light Performance Calculator

 

[koshkin]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 243Varminter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Between the Trijicon 3-9x40 and the Nightforce 2.5-10x32 which going to give me the best low light performance? I assume that the NF will have better glass so I thought that it might give me and edge but it might not? Here is a link to a low light calculator I found. Low-Light Performance Calculator </div></div>

Between these two, I think Trijicon will have a slight edge in low light.

ILya

 

[koshkin]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

Oh, as far the calculator you found goes, I recall when the guy who made showed up on OT a few years ago.

We had some lively discussions about this.

Bottom line (and in my opinion, of course), the calculator, while nicely programmed is thoroughly useless and does not give you anything that you could not comfortably tell by simply looking at the exit pupil of the scopes in question.

There are simply not enough inputs there and we would not know what to enter anyway. GIGO.

ILya

 

[Nosler243Shooter]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

That is kind of what I was thinking on the calculator but I wasn't sure.

 

[prplhaz72]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

The NF and the Trijicon have very similar glass. The reason the NF costs more is because it has a few more bells and whistles. As far as durability goes, that would be a toss up as well. Trijicon makes some very tough scopes.

So since optically they will be similar, the larger objective of the Trijicon will put more light to your eye (exit pupil) at a higher mag. Plus the illumination of the Trijicon will smoke the NF.

 

[prplhaz72]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

Another question for you that has not really been asked. When you say low light, what exactly do you mean? Are you talking just in the morns and evenings during legal big game hunting times? Or you are talking real low light, meaning possible night time hunting?

If it is just legal time big game hunting, an illuminated reticle is not necessarily a must have. A decent bold reticle will offer all you need. I have never had a ill reticle for big game hunting and never not been able to take a shot because I could not see the reticle.

If you are hunting at near dark or in the dark the illumination would be a much more needed feature.

 

[Nosler243Shooter]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

I would be using this scope mostly for hunting deer during legal hunting hours. Sometimes I might use it for shooting a varmint during late evening or even after dark. I have also been looking at the 1-4x but I don't know if it will be enough magnification for me to shoot maybe 200 yards or if it will let enough light in but size wise it seems like the perfect AR scope. TheOneTwo, do you own an Accupoint?

 

[prplhaz72]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

I used to. I had the 1-4x Accupoint, they are very good scopes. I traded it for a SWFA SS 1-4x which I think are a little better.

Even on 4x the 1-4x accupoint will have a 6mm exit pupil. That is usable. But the 3-9x will have similar brightness around 7x which will make that 200 yard shot a little easier.

 

[jackh]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

what did you decide on?

i havent seen anyone mention any IOR scopes. the 2.5-10 ffp mil/mil seems like it would fit your needs and in your budget. i have read that the glass is excellent in these scopes as well. the reticle is good and it has illumination.

 

[cuffm4615]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LibertyOptics</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Here are some options for you.

Trijicon 2.5-10x56
Sightron SIII LR 3.5-10x56 illuminated 4a
IOR 6-24x56
IOR 3.5-18x50
Zeiss Victory Diavari 3-12x56

Leica, Swarovski options too

Scott
</div></div>

My vote would be the IOR 3.5-18x50. Excellent glass, illuminated ret., plus FFP (ideal for an AR platform). Everything in this scope screams "AR". Plus they look very tacticool on AR's.

 

[thewileyone]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LibertyOptics</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SFC Animal</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Go for the Trijicon 3-9x40 mil dot best bang under 1000 bucks </div></div>

He has $2000 to spend and this scope is under $700. Nice first post, Spankie.</div></div>

LMFAO!!! Liberty that is just an awesome post. Still catching my breath from LMFAO!!!

 

[thewileyone]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

243 Varminter,

As I read the posts, it seems that you have gone from a $2k scope now to leaning towards a $1k scope. You have also indicated that you will be hunting and do not plan on shooting anything over 250 yds. My opinion is that you really do not need any more than a 3-9 x 42 scope. As indicated above, there are definitely some awesome optics out there and what you will want for premier lowlight visibility is an optic that has one of these newer ocular coatings. Illumination is totally your call. I have not really noticed you leaning one way or another. Zeiss, Swaro, Trijicon, Leica, Kahles and NF are all very good scopes. Kahles was not listed above but they make some great optics also. My recommendation is to see if there is any possible way for you to go somewhere and look thru some of these optics for yourself. I have no experience with Sightron or IOR and therefore will not open my mouth just to insert my foot.

I have shot at low light conditions with Zeiss, Swaro, Kahles and Leica. I have looked thru NF and Trijicon, the only trij that I have shot at low light is an ACOG and it works well. I did not like how heavy the NF scopes are for a hunting rifle that I would be packing around alot. I am leaning towards a Trijicon Accupoint for an up coming purchase but have not decided, my hunting partner has one and I like it. My budget is a lot less than $2k though.

I completely agree with Scott at LibertyOptics and SWFA's opinions. They are right on. If you went and asked the 5 people that you think are "experts" in the field what their advice is on your situation, I would expect at least 3 different answers due to personal preference and experience.

 

[Nosler243Shooter]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

I was originally going to spend around 2000.00 on a scope but after some of the responses and an evaluation of my real needs I may not need to spend that much. My eyesight is not what it used to be and I now have to wear glasses so I do need somewhere around 9 or 10x so I can zoom in on deer I am thinking about shooting. I will definitely go and look at my options before I buy. This will be the most by far I have ever spent on a scope but I wanted something nice for my new rifle. Right now I am leaning towards the Trijicon Accupoint but I will look though one before I make my decision.

 

[VKC]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

Trijicon accupoints are nice. Take a look at Nightforce 2.5-10x32 or 3.5-15x50, premier light tactical and hunter too.

 

[skinney_7]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

my brother in law has a trijicon accupoint glass is good, after he looked through my NXS's he is selling and in the market for NF, IMHO take a long hard look @ the NightForce NXS 3.5-15X56, they have a variety of reticles and the scopes are top notch.

 

[ryodlsl]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

The Accupoints have a good choice of reticles and dot color. I have a green dot on mine which I think stands out more and I prefer to the red or amber.

However, my dedicated coyote rig has a 2-12x Z6i. Better optics, magnification range and illumination control. Also has a bigger field of view, especially at low power, which can make a difference if you are shooting at a moving target. Discounted models available on The Samplelist as mentioned on previous post

 

[CSTactical]

Re: Hight End AR Hunting Scope

The Trijicon Accupoint for the for the price are really nice. I really like the Swarovski for a hunting scope. Other really nice scope for an AR would be the Nightforce 2.5-10x32mm and the Premier Light Tactical or Hunter.

Here is a video we did on the Swarovski.
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Mike @ CST