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How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
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Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
My answer is that of all the I have tried and I mean ALL!!!! none stay witing .1 grains. I use the old measure the throw to get close then put it on a Acculab scale for trickling to the last grain of powder.
Bill
My answer is that of all the I have tried and I mean ALL!!!! none stay witing .1 grains. I use the old measure the throw to get close then put it on a Acculab scale for trickling to the last grain of powder.
Bill
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: user</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Or for the utmost in accuracy, does one have to weigh each charge?
Thanks, </div></div>
yes
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: user</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Or for the utmost in accuracy, does one have to weigh each charge?
Thanks, </div></div>
yes
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
Your question is dependent on the powder being used. Spherical powders with a good measure can be metered quite accurately. Outside of short-range BR, stick powders are used and individual weighing is required.
Your question is dependent on the powder being used. Spherical powders with a good measure can be metered quite accurately. Outside of short-range BR, stick powders are used and individual weighing is required.
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
Also has my vote!!!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Captain Kick-Ass</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: user</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Or for the utmost in accuracy, does one have to weigh each charge?
Thanks, </div></div>
yes </div></div>
Also has my vote!!!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Captain Kick-Ass</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: user</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Or for the utmost in accuracy, does one have to weigh each charge?
Thanks, </div></div>
yes </div></div>
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
My Harrell's Premium generally stays within 1/10 of a grain. I use it for benchrest. The only time I weigh charges is when I'm shooting 1,000 yards or working up a load.
Procedure is 90% of use. If you do it right it works better.
My Harrell's Premium generally stays within 1/10 of a grain. I use it for benchrest. The only time I weigh charges is when I'm shooting 1,000 yards or working up a load.
Procedure is 90% of use. If you do it right it works better.
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
Viuctor tried the Harrels and could not get better than .4
could you explain the "procedure" as we are all looking to be accurate .
Thanks Bill
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Victor N TN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My Harrell's Premium generally stays within 1/10 of a grain. I use it for benchrest. The only time I weigh charges is when I'm shooting 1,000 yards or working up a load.
Procedure is 90% of use. If you do it right it works better. </div></div>
Viuctor tried the Harrels and could not get better than .4
could you explain the "procedure" as we are all looking to be accurate .
Thanks Bill
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Victor N TN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My Harrell's Premium generally stays within 1/10 of a grain. I use it for benchrest. The only time I weigh charges is when I'm shooting 1,000 yards or working up a load.
Procedure is 90% of use. If you do it right it works better. </div></div>
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
My Redding 30BR will throw Varget to 0.3g and I trickle from there. I just set it up so that it always throws low and measure every throw. But a: I am not making thousands per batch, b: this is match grade target ammo.
My Redding 30BR will throw Varget to 0.3g and I trickle from there. I just set it up so that it always throws low and measure every throw. But a: I am not making thousands per batch, b: this is match grade target ammo.
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
If you ever find a measure that does what you are seeking one to do, please let all of the shooters in the world know immediately.
Ball will come very close. Maybe even acceptably close. Stick will not. Want an example to see what's going on? Take a small glass and then fill it with toothpicks. Count them. Do it again and again and you'll see different numbers every time. That's what's happening with stick powder in a measure, it goes by a set volume.
If you ever find a measure that does what you are seeking one to do, please let all of the shooters in the world know immediately.
Ball will come very close. Maybe even acceptably close. Stick will not. Want an example to see what's going on? Take a small glass and then fill it with toothpicks. Count them. Do it again and again and you'll see different numbers every time. That's what's happening with stick powder in a measure, it goes by a set volume.
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pogo57</div><div class="ubbcode-body">That's what's happening with stick powder in a measure, it goes by a set volume. </div></div>
+1... All powder measures are based on volume. At least until you get to the more sophisticated electronic ones that measure and dribble to an exact weight setting.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pogo57</div><div class="ubbcode-body">That's what's happening with stick powder in a measure, it goes by a set volume. </div></div>
+1... All powder measures are based on volume. At least until you get to the more sophisticated electronic ones that measure and dribble to an exact weight setting.
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
It really doesn't matter too much to me. I throw under my desired weight and trickle up from there. I weigh every charge. Like someone mentioned in a preivious post I do not make thousands of rounds, only match grade stuff.
It really doesn't matter too much to me. I throw under my desired weight and trickle up from there. I weigh every charge. Like someone mentioned in a preivious post I do not make thousands of rounds, only match grade stuff.
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rijndael</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've been through 4 Chargemasters .... sending them back and waiting is getting a bit old.
I don't regret getting my Harrell powder measure. </div></div>
Harrell's are as good as they come!
Care to elaborate on what happened with the Chargemasters? Don't want to hijack the thread but 4 is a BUNCH! I had one go bad but that was when I dropped a can of powder on the weight table, don't ask. It was promptly replaced under warranty.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rijndael</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've been through 4 Chargemasters .... sending them back and waiting is getting a bit old.
I don't regret getting my Harrell powder measure. </div></div>
Harrell's are as good as they come!
Care to elaborate on what happened with the Chargemasters? Don't want to hijack the thread but 4 is a BUNCH! I had one go bad but that was when I dropped a can of powder on the weight table, don't ask. It was promptly replaced under warranty.
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rijndael</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've been through 4 Chargemasters .... sending them back and waiting is getting a bit old.
I don't regret getting my Harrell powder measure. </div></div>
i have a harrel dispenser sitting in box on my bench. i have not used it yet. i was hoping to use it for my "inside of 600 yards" 308 loads. is it good enough for something like this? what kind of powder do you use and how close of a charge will it hold for you?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rijndael</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've been through 4 Chargemasters .... sending them back and waiting is getting a bit old.
I don't regret getting my Harrell powder measure. </div></div>
i have a harrel dispenser sitting in box on my bench. i have not used it yet. i was hoping to use it for my "inside of 600 yards" 308 loads. is it good enough for something like this? what kind of powder do you use and how close of a charge will it hold for you?
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
I am currently updating my spreadsheet of starting places on my Harrell's powder measure. Anyone that wants it I'll send it to you no charge. It has several different powders on it. If you want it just send me a regular email. I'll put the email address below.
I usually don't have any problem getting +/- .1 grain out of it. That's even using more IMR powders than most. That's good enough for me out to 300 yards. Beyond that I throw light and dribble up to weight.
Trivia fact... The Harrell's throws 1:1 with the Homer Culver conversion Lyman's benchrest measure. I've checked it against 4 others.
[email protected]
I am currently updating my spreadsheet of starting places on my Harrell's powder measure. Anyone that wants it I'll send it to you no charge. It has several different powders on it. If you want it just send me a regular email. I'll put the email address below.
I usually don't have any problem getting +/- .1 grain out of it. That's even using more IMR powders than most. That's good enough for me out to 300 yards. Beyond that I throw light and dribble up to weight.
Trivia fact... The Harrell's throws 1:1 with the Homer Culver conversion Lyman's benchrest measure. I've checked it against 4 others.
[email protected]
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pogo57</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Care to elaborate on what happened with the Chargemasters?</div></div>
1. Very touchy on/off button.
2. A column of keys reported their number +1. If you pushed 2, it would enter a 3 on the display.
3. Unboxed and tested while on the counter, it worked fine. Turned it off and on again, now the beep on startup sounded kind of funny .... sure enough it came up with an error and was dead.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 300sniper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i was hoping to use it for my "inside of 600 yards" 308 loads. is it good enough for something like this? what kind of powder do you use and how close of a charge will it hold for you?</div></div>
Yes, it is just fine for that, but the more important question is can you do it? You need to have a consistent throw.
I use Varget, H4895, and RE17.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pogo57</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Care to elaborate on what happened with the Chargemasters?</div></div>
1. Very touchy on/off button.
2. A column of keys reported their number +1. If you pushed 2, it would enter a 3 on the display.
3. Unboxed and tested while on the counter, it worked fine. Turned it off and on again, now the beep on startup sounded kind of funny .... sure enough it came up with an error and was dead.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 300sniper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i was hoping to use it for my "inside of 600 yards" 308 loads. is it good enough for something like this? what kind of powder do you use and how close of a charge will it hold for you?</div></div>
Yes, it is just fine for that, but the more important question is can you do it? You need to have a consistent throw.
I use Varget, H4895, and RE17.
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
I polished the inside of my dillon 550 powder throw and it made a very noticeable difference with Varget and RL 15. I went from getting almost a grain in variance to about 0.3 at the max; most of the time it was about 0.1 difference. I still weigh each throw for rifle and trickle the rest in though.
I polished the inside of my dillon 550 powder throw and it made a very noticeable difference with Varget and RL 15. I went from getting almost a grain in variance to about 0.3 at the max; most of the time it was about 0.1 difference. I still weigh each throw for rifle and trickle the rest in though.
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: user</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How accurate is your benchrest powder measure? Will it stay within a tenth of a grain time and time again? Does it replace weighing each and every charge? Or for the utmost in accuracy, does one have to weigh each charge?
Thanks, </div></div>
Volumetric powder measures, regardless if you have a Harrell Inprecision, the real Culver, or a $17 Lee Perfect Powder measure or anything else in between, are operator dependent to get the repeatability we all look for.
You can stabilize most of them by polishing the inside, installing funnels inside the powder hopper to maintain constant head pressure in the powder cavity, or any other tricks people come up with, you still have to operate that thing with constant maneuver. If you are on the upstroke to charge, keep up with how long do you stay there before go on the downstroke. Make sure you maintain the speed of the handle operation on both strokes. If you tap the handle or do not tap in either stroke, do the same thing, do whatever suits your fancy to get the charge consistency.
If you were to scratch your ass with your right hand in between charging operations, to give the powder settling time in the cavity, scratch your ass with your right hand, not the left, every time you are in between charging cases. smile... just do the same thing every time
Cheers.....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: user</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How accurate is your benchrest powder measure? Will it stay within a tenth of a grain time and time again? Does it replace weighing each and every charge? Or for the utmost in accuracy, does one have to weigh each charge?
Thanks, </div></div>
Volumetric powder measures, regardless if you have a Harrell Inprecision, the real Culver, or a $17 Lee Perfect Powder measure or anything else in between, are operator dependent to get the repeatability we all look for.
You can stabilize most of them by polishing the inside, installing funnels inside the powder hopper to maintain constant head pressure in the powder cavity, or any other tricks people come up with, you still have to operate that thing with constant maneuver. If you are on the upstroke to charge, keep up with how long do you stay there before go on the downstroke. Make sure you maintain the speed of the handle operation on both strokes. If you tap the handle or do not tap in either stroke, do the same thing, do whatever suits your fancy to get the charge consistency.
If you were to scratch your ass with your right hand in between charging operations, to give the powder settling time in the cavity, scratch your ass with your right hand, not the left, every time you are in between charging cases. smile... just do the same thing every time
Cheers.....
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
[/quote]
If you were to scratch your ass with your right hand in between charging operations, to give the powder settling time in the cavity, scratch your ass with your right hand, not the left, every time you are in between charging cases. smile... just do the same thing every time
Cheers..... [/quote]
Agreed.
Accuracy is consistency and you can't have either without the other. Do the same thing every time on every round.
[/quote]
If you were to scratch your ass with your right hand in between charging operations, to give the powder settling time in the cavity, scratch your ass with your right hand, not the left, every time you are in between charging cases. smile... just do the same thing every time
Cheers..... [/quote]
Agreed.
Accuracy is consistency and you can't have either without the other. Do the same thing every time on every round.
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
I had a Harrell's and for most fast to medium stick "rifle" powders it would drop within 0.1gr and usually +/- 0.05gr. A few years ago, I ran some experiments with my Harrell's and Redding #3BR. The ball powders, which I tend to use, were a waste of time for me to weigh in a Harrell's as they were incredibly consistent. I ran statistics on comparing ball powders and several stick powders. A $6000 lab scale was used to weigh the charges. Good technique, powder, and engineering make for good charging.
Conclusions: 1) Not all stick powders, despite the outward appearance, meter the same. 2) An old Redding is almost as good with many powders and equally good with ball powders. 3) Harrell's do not meter flake powders with any level of consistency at all.
I had a Harrell's and for most fast to medium stick "rifle" powders it would drop within 0.1gr and usually +/- 0.05gr. A few years ago, I ran some experiments with my Harrell's and Redding #3BR. The ball powders, which I tend to use, were a waste of time for me to weigh in a Harrell's as they were incredibly consistent. I ran statistics on comparing ball powders and several stick powders. A $6000 lab scale was used to weigh the charges. Good technique, powder, and engineering make for good charging.
Conclusions: 1) Not all stick powders, despite the outward appearance, meter the same. 2) An old Redding is almost as good with many powders and equally good with ball powders. 3) Harrell's do not meter flake powders with any level of consistency at all.
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
Using TAC the powder thrower on my Dillon 650 stays within a tenth of a grain. I loaded about 500 rounds today and it was dead on. I measure about every 30 rounds and it never sways. I may be getting lucky and having inconsistent throws between the 30 but it's not likely.
Using TAC the powder thrower on my Dillon 650 stays within a tenth of a grain. I loaded about 500 rounds today and it was dead on. I measure about every 30 rounds and it never sways. I may be getting lucky and having inconsistent throws between the 30 but it's not likely.
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
I use a Forster-Bonanza powder dispencer. I rigged it up with á stepper motor, reamed the inside of the powder chamber, turned a new chamber insert to 0,001mm tolerance, that insert and the metering chamber were connected to a digital mirometer for volumemetric adjustments. Took the unit apart again and grinded and smoothed out the mating surfaces, spring loaded the central joint to kepp it pushing against the unit at a constant force 6,6 kg´s, added a mini pin bearing for less friction, made a much larger unmetered powder hold..........
.....and after all that it holds to about 1 or 2 tenths of a grain contantly. That is before it was put into a sealed cabinet with temperature and pressure held at a constand temp............. then it was 1 tenth of a grain . But that could have been the electronic scale misreading...
I use a Forster-Bonanza powder dispencer. I rigged it up with á stepper motor, reamed the inside of the powder chamber, turned a new chamber insert to 0,001mm tolerance, that insert and the metering chamber were connected to a digital mirometer for volumemetric adjustments. Took the unit apart again and grinded and smoothed out the mating surfaces, spring loaded the central joint to kepp it pushing against the unit at a constant force 6,6 kg´s, added a mini pin bearing for less friction, made a much larger unmetered powder hold..........
.....and after all that it holds to about 1 or 2 tenths of a grain contantly. That is before it was put into a sealed cabinet with temperature and pressure held at a constand temp............. then it was 1 tenth of a grain . But that could have been the electronic scale misreading...
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Captain Kick-Ass</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[/quote]
just do the same thing every time
</div></div>
Agreed.
Accuracy is consistency and you can't have either without the other. Do the same thing every time on every round. [/quote]
+1...
I can't agree with that statement more. Every little time you make the slightest difference it will change the outcome.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Captain Kick-Ass</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[/quote]
just do the same thing every time
</div></div>
Agreed.
Accuracy is consistency and you can't have either without the other. Do the same thing every time on every round. [/quote]
+1...
I can't agree with that statement more. Every little time you make the slightest difference it will change the outcome.
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
Some stick powders (like RL 17) are inconsistent in length and that may also result in greater variation when using volumetric throwers.
My volumetric thrower is pretty precise and accurate. Someone attached it to a box with a green light. I think it throws to single kernal accuracy.
Some stick powders (like RL 17) are inconsistent in length and that may also result in greater variation when using volumetric throwers.
My volumetric thrower is pretty precise and accurate. Someone attached it to a box with a green light. I think it throws to single kernal accuracy.
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
I measure from an acculab vic 123 scale so
.02 grains!!!!!
I measure from an acculab vic 123 scale so
.02 grains!!!!!
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
I just got done writing down the charge weights from 30 throws of Varget using my Lee "Perfect Powder Measure". My target drop was 25.5gr. The results are....
25.3gr; 2
25.4gr; 7
25.5gr; 8
25.6gr; 7
25.7gr; 5
25.8gr; 1
Imagining I had done a good OCW test (which I haven't) I could probably use it to throw my charges without weighing them. I do however, prefer to weigh each and every charge for precision ammo. For my 55gr FMJ bullets in .223, I just set the thrower, weigh the first half dozen throws, and go to town from there.
Agreed with the above that consistency is the key when throwing powder charges. I have noticed with my Lee measure that I MUST keep it at least 2/3 full or my charge weights vary futher than what is posted above. I could probably install a baffle, but c'mon....its a $17 powder thrower.
**editted to add**
I'll also let readers know that the Lee thrower sucks with ball powders. I haven't done any throw accuracy tests so it may do fine in that department, but due to its all plastic construction it leaks like a sonofagun. Sure, one can tighten up the assembly, but that makes it a pain in da azz to manipulate the thrower handle.
I just got done writing down the charge weights from 30 throws of Varget using my Lee "Perfect Powder Measure". My target drop was 25.5gr. The results are....
25.3gr; 2
25.4gr; 7
25.5gr; 8
25.6gr; 7
25.7gr; 5
25.8gr; 1
Imagining I had done a good OCW test (which I haven't) I could probably use it to throw my charges without weighing them. I do however, prefer to weigh each and every charge for precision ammo. For my 55gr FMJ bullets in .223, I just set the thrower, weigh the first half dozen throws, and go to town from there.
Agreed with the above that consistency is the key when throwing powder charges. I have noticed with my Lee measure that I MUST keep it at least 2/3 full or my charge weights vary futher than what is posted above. I could probably install a baffle, but c'mon....its a $17 powder thrower.
**editted to add**
I'll also let readers know that the Lee thrower sucks with ball powders. I haven't done any throw accuracy tests so it may do fine in that department, but due to its all plastic construction it leaks like a sonofagun. Sure, one can tighten up the assembly, but that makes it a pain in da azz to manipulate the thrower handle.
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sawgunner2001</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I just got done writing down the charge weights from 30 throws </div></div>
What are the results for the other 7.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sawgunner2001</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I just got done writing down the charge weights from 30 throws </div></div>
What are the results for the other 7.
Re: How accurate is your benchrest powder measure?
Fixed incorrect data entry on my last post. Luckily I still had the sheet I wrote the data on still sitting under my keyboard. Sorry, its been a long couple weeks.
Fixed incorrect data entry on my last post. Luckily I still had the sheet I wrote the data on still sitting under my keyboard. Sorry, its been a long couple weeks.
