How are you guys dropping your powder?

[rogue308]

Just wondering what you guys were doing. I drop the charge to within 2-3 grains on the pan then place on this scale:
Frankford Aresenal digi scale
After that I trickle charge to my desired weight. This is getting tiresome and I know there's better ways to go about it. I need an accurate, fast way to charge. I tried a Lee "perfect powder measure" and that was anything but perfect. I'm not going to drop the coin on a prometheus, and even have a hard time bringing myself to spend $300+ on the RCBS chargemaster/scale combo. If I did break down and get it I can't seem to find any in stock and they don't seem that fast.

What I would really like is a super accurate manual powder thrower. Does one exist? Is my scale accurate enough? I've already dropped over $2k on my reloading setup and am not looking to spend a ton more. What're you guys doing?

 

[ggmanning]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

I run mine with the RCBS chargemaster or drop it with a Harrel's powder measure depending on what I am loading. A good powder measure system will make your life a lot easier if you load much. The RCBS is fast enough to drop the powder...pour in case...start another drop....seat bullet and the next load will be just about ready or done.

 

[MitchAlsup]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

I can drop the notoriously difficult Varget to about 0.3 gr and then trickle up with my Redding 30BR.

 

[9H_Cracka]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

I have one of the best you can buy, an RFD.

I still throw and weigh all charges for 600 and longer.

Varget does not meter that well; RL15 and VV N140 are much better in it. I still check each charge though.

Technique is an issue with all of them, cheap to the most expensive. A slow, smooth, no bumping sweep in both directions will give you the most consistent throws. Call the folks at Sinclair and talk to them about it - they did an extensive study of techniques and measures a few years back that clearly proved the best technique as I described above.

 

[Fuzzball]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

"I drop the charge to within 2-3 grains on the pan then place on this scale:"

Goodness, no wonder you're getting fed up; adjust your measure to drop closer than that. If it drops one a few tenths over occasionally just remove a pinch, drop it in the trickler and keep going.

 

[BCP]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

I use ball powders and throw all my charges.

edit: when using stick powders I set it to where they are just barely under the weight I want and then trickle it up from there. I use an RCBS beam scale. I only do this for target loads, for hunting loads I just throw them.

 

[gunman_7]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

I drop to within a tenth of a grain and then add one kernel of varget until I reach my desired weight. Yea it may take a touch longer, but with the accu-lab 123 my loads are very consistent down to a single kernel.

 

[42769vette]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

like most i drop .2-.5 gr low and trickle from there. there is no way i would trickle 2-3 gr.

 

[Topstrap]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

Like the others I've been dropping to within a couple tenths then trickling in on my beam scale. Just ordered the new Hornady electronic dispenser so am anxious to see how it does. Seemed everyone was out of it but Thirdgeneration supply had 6 of them in stock and also the best price. ($220.39) with $4.95 shipping.

http://store.thirdgenerationshootingsupply.com/browse.cfm/2,4568.html

Hope it's as accurate as they say, after 30 years of trickling and a beam scale it'll be hard to get used to new technology.

Topstrap

 

[High Binder]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

Chargemaster 1500, one of the most expensive but worth it. Your Frankfort scale gets horrible ratings, see below and be warned about their lack of consistency. I had one thinking it would be good for in the truck loading at the range, I took it back right away. See below.

http://www.midwayusa.com/browse/Bro...egoryString=9315***731***9211***&brandId=2124

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

I drop mine heavy, then weigh, pinch out excess directly from the pan, finger/thumb trickle some back until the scale agrees, dump the excess from the pinch into a waiting reservoir, and recharge the case from the pan using a drop tube. On to the next whatever, be it step, or case, or whatnot.

This can be done serially, as part of a progressive multistep handloading sequence, or in parallel, doing each case's charging/weighing in a complete batch.

I use an ancient RCBS digital which takes forever to settle down, but it is what it is.

Greg

 

[Ratbert]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I drop mine heavy, then weigh, pinch out excess directly from the pan, finger/thumb trickle some back until the scale agrees, dump the excess from the pinch into a waiting reservoir, and recharge the case from the pan using a drop tube. On to the next whatever, be it step, or case, or whatnot.

This can be done serially, as part of a progressive multistep handloading sequence, or in parallel, doing each case's charging/weighing in a complete batch.

I use an ancient RCBS digital which takes forever to settle down, but it is what it is.

Greg</div></div>

So THAT'S why you're so old...

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

Eeeeennhhh... Still trying to figure out whether old is a good thing, or a better thing...

 

[Ratbert]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Eeeeennhhh... Still trying to figure out whether old is a good thing, or a better thing...</div></div>

Beats the alternative, I suppose.

 

[USMCj]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

I use a ChargeMaster 1500, 9/10 drops are right on, the 10th one will be .1 grain above, I just pinch a couple of pieces of powder out and its right on.

 

[Unsichtbar]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?


http://www.shootingsoftware.com/smallprojects.htm

If charge master not an option, you can set up a balllance beam scale with powder measure set up to drop straight into pan ( twisted soad straw in drop tube to slow down powder)position a trickler so that it dropsin pan also. Throw short trickel up its an assembly line.

Also use a pan that has a built in funnel and a web cam to view pointer

 

[MitchAlsup]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ratbert</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Eeeeennhhh... Still trying to figure out whether old is a good thing, or a better thing...</div></div>

Beats the alternative, I suppose. </div></div>

That's what I'm talking about!

 

[rero360]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

Another one here for the Chargemaster. I had issues with it over throwing varget but now that the key pad is screwed up I have to trickle up for every charge, its tiresome but still faster than using the balance beam scale. Once I have money flowing in I plan on sending the CM back to get the key pad replaced and then I'll reprogram it again and do the straw trick for better results.

 

[KE5MUJ]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

I have that same digital scale and wasnt happy trickling with it, wasnt sensitive enough.

I use the Lee perfect powder measure and then trickle up using the cheap ole Lee safety scale.

 

[mavrick]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

I used the Frankfort scale and its pretty much useless very erratic.

Dustin

 

[Ratbert]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mavrick</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I used the Frankfort scale and its pretty much useless very erratic.
</div></div>

Yeah, I made the mistake of trying to go cheap when I first started too. The Chargemaster is nice and makes precision loading bearable. I've still come REALLY close to pulling the trigger on a Prometheus a few times, though.

 

[Victor N TN]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

I'm using a Harrell's Premium and throwing a grain or two light. Then I trickle up using a RCBS mechanical beam scale.

 

[former naval person]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

Which is why you do a ladder test and get a non sensitive load.(I.e. a load that is in the proper vibratory NODE) If the rifle will shoot .3 to .5 with a variation of .3 +/- then most ANY powder measure will work. JMHO

 

[Asm1]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

Harrels thrower and I use the scale only to set the thrower charge weight.

I throw RL15,RL17,win748,h4895 shoots way under MOA at test range 567 yards with all my LR guns.
My boy shoots them thrown loads and he wins eather 1st or 2nd every match this year so far..

Did I mention I f. Ing hate scals ?

 

[Garvey]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

I set my RCBS powder measure about .5 gr. below my desired weight and trickle the rest in with the powder pan on the digital scale.

Yesterday I was loading 36.0 gr. of Varget for .22-250. Most powder charges came out under 36.0 gr. or right at it. Some came out .3 gr. over. Then I just have to tap a little bit of powder back into the powder measure hopper, place the pan back on the scale and trickle powder back into it util I get back to where I want to be.

 

[FNARSHOOTER]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

I load 300 RUM I just use a feed scoop! L.O.L. For a 50 BMG a coal shovel.
Scot

 

[427Cobra]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

Get a Prometheus Gen2, 1/3 kernal accurite every 15 seconds!

 

[Ratbert]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: former naval person</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Which is why you do a ladder test and get a non sensitive load.(I.e. a load that is in the proper vibratory NODE) If the rifle will shoot .3 to .5 with a variation of .3 +/- then most ANY powder measure will work. JMHO</div></div>

A ladder test will get you into a position of consistent barrel harmonics and will give good accuracy for 100, 300, even 500 yds but when you're shooting long distance MV spread plays a much bigger part. You may start out with both bullets pointed the same direction and they may pass thru the same hole @ 100 yds but at 1000yds the slower bullet is going to have fallen farther (well @ 100 it has fallen father too, the delta is just so small as to be undetectable.) To get consistent speeds you need a consistent boom.

 

[Brians708]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

My #1 Rule= Drop it like it's hot!

 

[vman]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

At the moment i drop with a uniflow, to within a few 0.1 of a grain off and then trickle the rest in with an RCBS trickler.

I feel comfortable with this method

I would like a chargemaster when the money is available

 

[diGGer]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

Lee Powder scoop

 

[marduk185]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

dump it in with a funnel then stuff a 175smk on top till the 4064 crunches.

 

[GreenMtnRidgeRunner13]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

Just loaded my first ever batch just the way vman describes, but it is a bit time consuming. Tried the Lee scoop and it was off too much to give me any comfort. Doing all of this measuring each load on a balance beam is pretty meticulous, though.

 

[Vindex]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ASM1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Harrels thrower and I use the scale only to set the thrower charge weight.

I throw RL15,RL17,win748,h4895 shoots way under MOA at test range 567 yards with all my LR guns.
My boy shoots them thrown loads and he wins eather 1st or 2nd every match this year so far..

Did I mention I f. Ing hate scals ? </div></div>

+1, with a long drop tube.

 

[Tactical30]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: vman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">At the moment i drop with a uniflow, to within a few 0.1 of a grain off and then trickle the rest in with an RCBS trickler.

I feel comfortable with this method

</div></div>


This is exactly what I do with the same setup.
works well.

 

[hypertex]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

Harrell's Culver Classic and then trickle

 

[1066]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

I use Varget in my 6BR and handweigh every charge - I dump the main charge with a Lee measure to within a couple of grains and then trickle to the exact kernal like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dnVOoGd1bDU

 

[Joe-n-TX]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

Dump it with a Lee scoop then trickle. I've actually gotten pretty quick at it.

 

[former naval person]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

Ratbert is right about needing a consistent boom at distance. However I wonder if some of the other practices...like weighing cases, flash hole uniforming, testing primers/powder consistency, seating depths and other tricks might do more than .1 grains of powder toward gaining that consistent boom.

 

[Captain Moroni]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

I use a Lymann DPS III and like the results I get. It is usualy within 1 tenth as long as you let it warm up first and dont have anything in the room sending out electronic signals like phones and TV/stereo remotes. I have heard that florescent lights can screw them up but I have one right about my reloading bench and cant see any problems.

 

[Powder_Burns]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

Oh I got it, check this out..

Have a guest over, checking out my reloading equipment etc. Walks over to the Lyman DPS III, which has a full hopper of Unique, and lifts the hopper off the base. Thats how you drop powder! Almost a pound of Unique in one second! Fun cleaning that up...

 

[sormi]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

Powder Burns.. My brother would do something like that...

 

[LoneWolfUSMC]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

I use a Lee PPM to drop about .2-.3 low then trickle up. I use a RCBS Rangemaster Scale. Sometimes it gets a little picky, but I think it's just static.

I will probably upgrade to a Chargemaster later this year.

 

[Altimeter1]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

Funny how we spend more time getting the powder charge just right and top the load off with a bullet that can vary up to 2 grains.

I use an early dillon digital scale, and a harrels measure, mostly because the RCBS measure made my arthritic hands hurt.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Altimeter1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Funny how we spend more time getting the powder charge just right and top the load off with a bullet that can vary up to 2 grains.</div></div>

Bingo, give that man a cigar!

This is why I believe in load confirmation when evolving to new component lots, and also why I avoid getting anal about any of the more esoteric handloading techniques.

I think that although some mighty fine accuracy can be achieved, it may often come with a weighty parasitic load of handloading demands. I think that 1/2MOA is nice, but 1MOA is adequate, and a helluva lot simpler to achieve at the loading bench. This being in line with Langelius' Axiom, which states: "Handloading is a necesary evil".

I base my 'Axiom' on a few observations and suspicions.

In competition, I have only seen 1MOA honestly achieved twice in two years at 200yd; and this with optics and supported rifles.

Brass is elastic under firing conditions. IMHO, this means that all that painstakingly achieved shaping and correcting one does with their brass is pretty much undone early on after ignition in the firing cycle, and well before full operating pressures are reached.

A resized case is probably loose in the chamber, by maybe a few thousandths. Between gravity and extractor pressure (and God knows what else, maybe the phases of the Moon...?), it's probably neither centered nor parallel with either the chamber axis or the bore axis, so all that precious concentricity is correlated with..., wait for it..., nothing. Ever wonder why everything measures perfect, yet the firing pin indent is off-center? IMHO, don't worry about it.

I don't disbelieve the value of advanced handloading, nor do I discount the achievements of great accuracy some attain. I just don't subscribe to the 'accuracy at any cost' philosophy. I make allowance for some imperfections on my part, on my rifle's part, and my ammunition's part, and readjust my accuracy requirements to an area of less demand, which I consider more 'practical'.

Plus my strength is as the strength of ten, for my heart is pure...

Greg

 

[Stevemopa]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

I drop the powder a tenth or two low and trickle up on a tuned Redding #2, it is sensitive enough to measure Varget down to the kernel. I found it to be an economical alternative to higher end digital balances, although a digital is probably faster.

A little background, I work in a pharma lab as a technician and measure very small quantities of various powdered chemicals on very high end enclosed balances and realize that digital scales can be finicky if not set up properly. They can be subject to electrical interference and HVAC conditions and need to be perfectly level on a stout(preferably marble)base. We almost never turn them off and calibrate them before each use using high dollar calibrated weights. Also, we never touch a calibration weight with a bare hand as you will leave oil from your fingertips that will distort the weight of the calibration weight and give an inaccurate calibration. While reloading doesn't require dealing with such small quantities, I thought a little insight into what we do in a lab may be helpful to those interested.

If anyone is interested in a tuned balance shoot an email at Scott Gauthier-Parker [[email protected]] he's a good guy and I'm a pleased customer.

Steve

 

[LoneWolfUSMC]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

I don't shoot benchrest rifles, so I don't use benchrest reloading techniques.

I do like to keep my charges within .1 gr. It's not really that difficult.

I do not turn necks or any of that stuff. It's just not needed in any of my rifles.

 

[former naval person]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

Greg...your heart is not pure or you would not be seducing all these young people to believe that good enough is good enough. JMHO FNP

 

[DRAM40A1]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

As of 5-8-10, I cycle an RCBS powder thrower and wait about 7 seconds for a GenII Prometheus to trickle to the desired charge, while I seat a bullet.LOL

 

[okiefired]

Re: How are you guys droppng your powder?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> In competition, I have only seen 1MOA honestly achieved twice in two years at 200yd; and this with optics and supported rifles.
Greg </div></div>

Greg, were you being serious here or did I miss something?

okie