How good can you shoot CCI SV?

[SanPatHogger]

It seems to me that CCI SV is the highest end of cheap bulk and the beginning of what could be considered target and match ammo.
It is cheap and plentiful. My CZ seems to shoot it pretty good. Tonight I shot a bunch of 5 shot groups, had a few where 4 shots were a cluster and then that one damned flyer... But then I got that one group. It may be my best ever.
I would like to see what others can do with the same ammo at the same distance. CCI SV 50 yards.
Here's mine. 3 pictures of the same group.

 

[mikeshaw2]

all depends on your rifle.

The BMR shot it fairly well. The CZ doesn't like it nearly as much.

M

 

[sawman556]

I've had good results with CCI SV in my B14R. Occasional flyers are certain, but it's cheap and good for practice.

 

[FuhQ]

My Christensen Arms Ranger 22 loves the CCI SV ammo.

3 shot groups, but pretty damn good.

100 yards



This was a group at 200 yards… I didn’t have a measuring device, so I scaled using my knife, then measured my knife at home.

 

[turbo_bird]

This is the best I ever managed with it in my 10/22 target model. 5 shots at 50 yards. The rifle is all Ruger parts, but worked on a bit. I cut the barrel down to 18.5" and recrowned it, squared up the bolt face and set headspace to I think around .043", bedded with aluminum tape, free floated the barrel, homebrew trigger job including adjustable sear engagement and disconnector reset, and ditched the trigger reset spring and plunger for a different style of spring inside the trigger housing that has way less friction than the plunger setup.

And this target was shot with my Norinco NS522. All that I had done to it at the time was touch up the crown and a trigger job, not bad for a $250 rifle.

Kristian

 

[justin amateur]

Groups indicate similar trajectories for a number of shots.
If you want to learn about cartridge quality, try a one dot - one shot target.
Groups hide problems as they drift up/down/left/right with mv and wind shifts.
The center of the group shifts relative to point of aim.
One dot-one shot targets, or shooting for score, will show just how many strays actually happen.
Side note...the repeated change of rifle position does not increase spread.
I compared 50 shot target aggregate sizes for 10 five shot groups
to 50 shots on a Grid and each time the Grid aggregate was smaller,
using 22lr from the same brick each time.

Results will vary depending on your luck with the CCI assembly line lottery.
Some batches are decent, many have problems with hefty mv spread
as well as visible bullet damage and sloppy assembly.
Odd strays will occur due to damaged bullet heels, visible in the factory tour video.

CCI SV is hunting and plinking ammo.
Intended to average 2 moa for 5 shots at 100 yards according to Cody at CCI.
Average. Sometimes better, sometimes worse.
You can get a half inch group followed by a 3.5 inch group.
Still a 2 moa average.

Try some groups, then try a Grid.
Compare the results and target aggregates.

 

[SanPatHogger]

It's really hard to shoot a tight group with sloppy ammo, I totally get that. Out of 70 or so rounds last night that was my third group and it is the only one without a flier. But it is a damn good group for SV. I'm just wanting to see what others can do with it.
5 shots at 50 yards with CCI SV. If you shoot enough of it you should be able to get something worth bragging about.

 

[grauhanen]

Every inexpensive .22LR ammo can have random acts of accuracy. CCI SV is like that. Better ammos will shoot well more predictably.

 

[justin amateur]

No argument SPH.
When you get a run of above average cartridges from CCI, good things happen.
CCI SV is much like Crackerjacks, there's a surprise in every box.
Some of the surprises are better than others.

 

[Jmccracken1214]

It seems to me that CCI SV is the highest end of cheap bulk and the beginning of what could be considered target and match ammo.
It is cheap and plentiful. My CZ seems to shoot it pretty good. Tonight I shot a bunch of 5 shot groups, had a few where 4 shots were a cluster and then that one damned flyer... But then I got that one group. It may be my best ever.
I would like to see what others can do with the same ammo at the same distance. CCI SV 50 yards.
Here's mine. 3 pictures of the same group.

View attachment 7977469
View attachment 7977470

View attachment 7977472

My t1x will shoot 10 shot groups that look like your 5 with SV. Every now and then I’ll get a flyer that opens it up by .25-.5” but for cheap ammo… it shoots amazing. The SK match that I have shoots exactly the same, but I’ve yet to have a flyer with it

 

[Hecouldgoalltheway]

It shot ok through my bergara, but sk pistol shoots groups that are half the size. I get less flyers, (not zero, but less). I'm sure there are rifles out there that shoot it just fine, but the little group I've shot with was pretty good and the difference between middle of the pack and top of the pile is usually indistinguishable to the human eye and must be settled with calipers. It doesn't seem consistent enough to get you to the top.

 

[Near miss]

Its been a while since I last shot CCI for groups. Mainly just plinking.
But here is a one board for the council to wonder on.

Here is the average mean radius for CCI SV at 50m for me, the last group was just 2 groups, so bad data.

My CCI lot has been surprisingly good in terms of MV
Here is sample of 50 shots:

 

[Frankr]

Paging Nakoa1 and his beyer barrels. I swear he has some groups from his beyer ar15/22lr with beyer barrels that shoot insane itty bitty groups

 

[obx22]

Shot these two 10 shot groups back to back a few weeks ago, bipod and rear bag. Rifle was my home built (hand fitted oversized parts) AMT wearing an 18” Green Mountain barrel, targets at 50m.

 

[sjmpcc022]

I don't have any 5 shot pics, but I will take some. I've walked my B14R out to 225yds so far, using only CCIsv and Norma Tac. I am getting way better results than I expected with it, just from what I read on here about it.

I have targets all set up and ready to shoot groups at 50yds with about 8 or so different flavors of ammo, just haven't had a chance to get that done yet. This is one pic I have , the plate is 6X6 and the distance is 185yds. I used both CCI sv and Norma Tac. If I remember correctly, I fired 8 rounds, missing one.

 

[DeathBeforeDismount]

Cherry picking groups is not even close to an accurate representation. You can find the worst ammo and get lucky with a 5 shot cloverleaf.

Its the worst groups that you shoot that tells you how good the ammo is.

At .10CPR, its overpriced and underpeforming compared to .14-20CPR SK, Ely, Wolf and RWS.

 

[sjmpcc022]

I'm not cherry picking anything, it's just one pic I had and one example of a group I shot.
If you read my whole post, I stated I had targets ready to test a bunch of different ammo, just haven't had a chance to yet.
Perhaps you were one who said CCI sv is shit past 75 or 100 yards, many did? If you were or weren't, no matter. It will shoot a nice group at 185, at least out of my rifle on one day. The next day could be a different story?

FYI.................... the last bunch of CCI sv I bought was 3.99 a box. My math says .08 per round, not a dime.
I got the Norma Tac for the same .08 per round!

Cherry picking groups is not even close to an accurate representation. You can find the worst ammo and get lucky with a 5 shot cloverleaf.

Its the worst groups that you shoot that tells you how good the ammo is.

At .10CPR, its overpriced and underpeforming compared to .14-20CPR SK, Ely, Wolf and RWS.

 

[Colt45guy]

This was CCI SV at 25 yards out of my B14R. It's a clean 25/25 (and if we're counting 3x on each sighter at the bottom, it scores 39/25) The game is that if the bullet cuts the black into the center (.020") it's a 'tack driven'. I had a couple that barely made it.

Switched out to SK Standard + and started shooting at .15" diamonds--same 25 yards but even the one miss would have been easily inside the .20" 'tack'

 

[308pirate]

all depends on your rifle

+1

That's why this thread and all like it are worthless. There is nothing actionable that one can learn out of them.

 

[justin amateur]

all depends on your rifle.


I'm gonna disagree.

It doesn't depend on y'er rifle when dealing with cartridge quality.
There is no "find the brand y'er rifle likes".
Why do I say that? No rifle can fix crap ammo. Not one.
If you think a rifle can "like" poorly made cartridges, y'er an optimist.
Rifles aren't magic, capable of tightening loose crimps, sloppy seating,
changing the chemistry or amount of primer/powder or repairing bullets
that were damaged on the manufacture/assembly lines. Fact.
A great rifle doesn't add to the cartridge problems, but it can't fix problems.
A crap rifle already has problems that adds to those of the cartridges.
My rifle "likes" is based on the few cartridges in the brick that aren't beat to snot
and had similar muzzle velocities. That ain't brand related, that's cartridge related.
The assembly lines can't get it wrong all the time.


I have the remains of a case of CCI SV purchased a decade ago.
It may be the worst case of 22lr I ever purchased.
It has mv spread in excess of 120 fps per box, chipped, dented, scratched bullets,
uneven seating depths and angles, asymmetric drive bands and even worse,
bullet material compressed down over the crimp and on to the brass.
I keep a couple boxes in my kit to freak out youngsters at the local range.
Someone claims great results because their rifle likes CCI SV, I ask for proof
and offer to provide the ammo to show me how much their rifle "likes" it.
It's fun to watch a youngster lose their mind when the rifle starts spitting wild strays
and you can hear the mv differences, hot and weak, causing a annoying amount of vertical spread.
It ain't the label the rifles prefer, it's the quality of the cartridges in the box that determines results.

 

[mikeshaw2]

+1

That's why this thread and all like it are worthless. There is nothing actionable that one can learn out of them.

sorta

you can see who's trying something new.

May work. May not. ALWAYS depends on what your specific rifle likes. Rimfires are persnickety

M

 

[mikeshaw2]

all depends on your rifle.


I'm gonna disagree.

It doesn't depend on y'er rifle when dealing with cartridge quality.
There is no "find the brand y'er rifle likes".
Why do I say that? No rifle can fix crap ammo. Not one.
If you think a rifle can "like" poorly made cartridges, y'er an optimist.
Rifles aren't magic, capable of tightening loose crimps, sloppy seating,
changing the chemistry or amount of primer/powder or repairing bullets
that were damaged on the manufacture/assembly lines. Fact.
A great rifle doesn't add to the cartridge problems, but it can't fix problems.
A crap rifle already has problems that adds to those of the cartridges.
My rifle "likes" is based on the few cartridges in the brick that aren't beat to snot
and had similar muzzle velocities. That ain't brand related, that's cartridge related.
The assembly lines can't get it wrong all the time.

feel free to disagree, but I tried 13 different ammo types/brands in my BMR to figure out what the rifle liked

Some were obviously better shooting than others. We're not talking about junk ammo, we're talking about Lapua, SK, and Eley along with TAC22 and CCI std velocity

So you need to find out what your rifle likes because rimfires are persnickety

M

 

[DeathBeforeDismount]

25 yards? Jesus anything is going to make bugholes at that distance. Show your 100 and 150 yard groups before we can take you seriously.

 

[justin amateur]

Mike, still disagreeing.

My rifles like well made cartridges with a minimum of factory defects and tight muzzle velocities.
As to trying a few brands, at last look I had tested every flavor of 17wsm, 17hmr, 17hm2, 22wmr
and 22lr rimfire ammo available to purchase in the US. I'm easily entertained.
50 shots at a time at a single aimpoint across a chronograph to document results and mv spread.
I've had great results and crap results, even from supposedly the best ammo made.
Not due to rifle or conditions or shooter error....all on cartridge quality.


Pic of the problems of the crap case of CCI SV.
Can you identify all the defects?

 

[vinniedelpino]

Fuck your science.

I had a single case of mini mags that held MOA to 50y in a cheap mkii. Various offerings from SK, Wolf, Eley and Lapua couldn't touch it. Other lots of mini mags couldn't touch it either. Hand to God.

Rimfire can only partially be explained with science. The rest is shrouded in mystery. Like the origins of the universe, or what goes on in the female mind.

 

[justin amateur]

I had a single case of mini mags that held MOA to 50y in a cheap mkii.

Yep, I've seen Australian made Winchester Power Points do as well as the best of Eley, Lapua and RWS.
Does that mean the current offerings from Winchester, CCI or Federal will produce as well? Not even close.
Quality determines results, not the label on the box. Want to try a box from my crap case of CCI SV?
If'n y'er rifle likes CCI, it should be able to hold sub-moa all day long, even with mv spread and beat up cartridges, right?

It's only magic, if'n ya' don't understand the science, right?

 

[mikeshaw2]

I had a single case of mini mags that held MOA to 50y in a cheap mkii.

Yep, I've seen Australian made Winchester Power Points do as well as the best of Eley, Lapua and RWS.
Does that mean the current offerings from Winchester, CCI or Federal will produce as well? Not even close.
Quality determines results, not the label on the box. Want to try a box from my crap case of CCI SV?
If'n y'er rifle likes CCI, it should be able to hold sub-moa all day long, even with mv spread and beat up cartridges, right?

...and I keep pointing out that quality doesn't always equal results. Not saying it doesn't help, but if your rifle doesn't like that particular round, no amount of quality will make it shoot better.

Eley sucked out loud out of my rifle. Center X shot really well. I've heard from other guys with BMRs that their rifles love Eley and hate Center X.

M

 

[Near miss]

Fuck your science.

I had a single case of mini mags that held MOA to 50y in a cheap mkii. Various offerings from SK, Wolf, Eley and Lapua couldn't touch it. Other lots of mini mags couldn't touch it either. Hand to God.

Rimfire can only partially be explained with science. The rest is shrouded in mystery. Like the origins of the universe, or what goes on in the female mind.

Yeah... single case. You should have just stopped typing right there.

I have had name brand that could not keep on paper at 100m and my latest cci SV lot that has quite good track record farther out (5 rnd groups at 100, 150 and 200m 4/5 hits within 1moa)
Do I expect 4/5 to be within 1moa? No.
Would I use it for serious shooting? No.
Would I say the next lot will do the same? Certainly no.
Have I witnessed bad lots do inredibly when switched to another firearm? Yes.
Does that mean there is a working firearm for each crap lot produced? Sorry, no.

 

[Near miss]

...and I keep pointing out that quality doesn't always equal results. Not saying it doesn't help, but if your rifle doesn't like that particular round, no amount of quality will make it shoot better.

Eley sucked out loud out of my rifle. Center X shot really well. I've heard from other guys with BMRs that their rifles love Eley and hate Center X.

M

There is truth in this as you should inquire and test which brands suit your firearm the best.
But just testing 3 lots per brand might not really show you anything concise about what brand your rifle favours.

Also, a well shooting lot generally shoots better on average from multiple guns. So they are objectively better.

 

[justin amateur]

I hear ya' Mike, but the difference is in how we define quality.
To many the fact it has Eley or Lapua or RWS on the label means quality.
To me, that's just the name of the manufacturer.
I define quality as based on the similarity of muzzle velocities
and the uniformity of components and assembly during manufacture.
If there's mv differences you get vertical spread. Right?
If the bullets are deformed, damaged, improperly assembled they sling strays. Correct?
Quality determines results, not labels.

I can stick some of my crap CCI SV in an empty box of Midas+, will that make them shoot better?

 

[sawman556]

View attachment 7978218

This was CCI SV at 25 yards out of my B14R. It's a clean 25/25 (and if we're counting 3x on each sighter at the bottom, it scores 39/25) The game is that if the bullet cuts the black into the center (.020") it's a 'tack driven'. I had a couple that barely made it.

Switched out to SK Standard + and started shooting at .15" diamonds--same 25 yards but even the one miss would have been easily inside the .20" 'tack'View attachment 7978221

Where can I get these targets? Nice shooting, BTW!

 

[sawman556]

Someone claims great results because their rifle likes CCI SV, I ask for proof
and offer to provide the ammo to show me how much their rifle "likes" it.
It's fun to watch a youngster lose their mind when the rifle starts spitting wild strays...

That's cold! I like it!

 

[justin amateur]

It's cold as heck and funny at the time Sawman.
I'm not totally heartless though.
After the shock sets in, I have them compare my CCI SV to theirs.
The inspection of the different cartridges and the visible differences is educational.
All of a sudden the light goes on and those odd strays they get now make sense.
It ain't always the rifle or shooter or wind....those cartridge problems can cause serious irritation.

 

[Colt45guy]

Where can I get these targets? Nice shooting, BTW!

I downloaded the circle dots from Arfcom. I made the diamonds during a really boring work meeting. PM me your email and I'll send you the PDFs....but you have to understand that 25 yards isn't challenging to some of this group, and you have to shoot at 100+ to be taken seriously.

 

[Smallcalshooter]

So your saying that Lapua sk eley don't know how to turn out better quality ammo than some others. They just get lucky from time to time.hm I'm going to have to think about that one.

 

[hlee]

Was at a 22lr “PRS style” event a few years ago and shooting pretty well. I think I shot high score that day. Anyway, the father of another shooter was there and after one stage he asked me about my ammo.

“Hey, what kinda bullets you shootin? Never seen that blue box.”

“Oh, yeah. It’s Center X.”

“Never heard of it. But lemme tell yuh. The most akerate bullet ever made is Remington Golden Bullet…”

“Ok boomer.” (In my head)

Why relate this? Because if you don’t know, you don’t know. Everyone says “oh yeah, my gun is sub moa with CCI SV.” Or, “man, ‘green tag’ is the best 22 ammo going.” But, when push comes to shove, high scores are being shot with Tenex, Center X, Midas, and the like. CCI is fine for what it is, but it’s not “match quality” ammo. I take my boys out to the 22lr steel range and they can burn as much of it as I can buy. But, if I’m going to a match looking to win, I’m not wasting the match fee and gas on CCI anything.

 

[justin amateur]

The manufacturing process of rimfire ammunition has so many things going on that can affect results,
even the cartridges from the best production lines can have intervals on the assembly line
where less than satisfactory cartridges can slip past quality control and end up in consumers hands.
It's the assembly line lottery, some batches are much better than others.
We pays our money, we takes our chances, every time we make a purchase.

 

[MarkCZ]

A group of my friends get together most Fridays. We setup steel like our long range match for new shooters. My go to ammo is SK Long Range or Eley Club, but I can't shoot up my good ammo, just playing around. We shoot low end ammo a lot, just to see how it will shoot at long range. Some shoots better than you would think.

The cheaper ammo like, CCI SV, Norma Tac 22, etc. will not shoot like higher end ammo, but can shoot good enough to hit targets out to 400yds. They will have a more vertical, but can make hits. One guy's CZ will shoot Fed Auto match lights out.
You never know until you try it. I tried some Eley Contact last week, it shoot very well out to 300yds.

 

[TimK]

I bought a case of it several years ago. Must have gotten a "good" lot. It shoots into 1/2" or so at 50y in my daughter's Savage. My Vudoo and my Lilja barreled 40X repeater hate it. In fact, it's so poor in those two rifles it's not really useful even for practice. It starts to fall apart past 100 in the Savage, I suppose the SD is high. I put it over the chrono at one point, but that was a couple years ago and I didn't record the SD or extreme spread.

 

[acudaowner]

not sure about the sv's but we got the cci standard and the mini mag out to 400 so far I personally like the sk red box better still wanna try those cci velocitor 22lrs still stuck on seeing anything past 400 yards . hopping this target cam thing will help a bit .

 

[Appalachian]

I found a lot of SK Semi-Auto that shoots great for the price point. I’m going back today to buy the remaining bricks. This is how it shot in my new Bergara B14R, Five shots at Fifty yards.

This is how it really shoots. These are rounds 6-106 through my new rifle.

 

[SanPatHogger]

Thats a hell of a group.

 

[hlee]

The aggregate group wouldn’t be all that impressive. The zero appears to be wandering.

 

[obx22]

all depends on your rifle.


I'm gonna disagree.

It doesn't depend on y'er rifle when dealing with cartridge quality.
There is no "find the brand y'er rifle likes".
Why do I say that? No rifle can fix crap ammo. Not one.
If you think a rifle can "like" poorly made cartridges, y'er an optimist.
Rifles aren't magic, capable of tightening loose crimps, sloppy seating,
changing the chemistry or amount of primer/powder or repairing bullets
that were damaged on the manufacture/assembly lines. Fact.
A great rifle doesn't add to the cartridge problems, but it can't fix problems.
A crap rifle already has problems that adds to those of the cartridges.
My rifle "likes" is based on the few cartridges in the brick that aren't beat to snot
and had similar muzzle velocities. That ain't brand related, that's cartridge related.
The assembly lines can't get it wrong all the time.


I have the remains of a case of CCI SV purchased a decade ago.
It may be the worst case of 22lr I ever purchased.
It has mv spread in excess of 120 fps per box, chipped, dented, scratched bullets,
uneven seating depths and angles, asymmetric drive bands and even worse,
bullet material compressed down over the crimp and on to the brass.
I keep a couple boxes in my kit to freak out youngsters at the local range.
Someone claims great results because their rifle likes CCI SV, I ask for proof
and offer to provide the ammo to show me how much their rifle "likes" it.
It's fun to watch a youngster lose their mind when the rifle starts spitting wild strays
and you can hear the mv differences, hot and weak, causing a annoying amount of vertical spread.
It ain't the label the rifles prefer, it's the quality of the cartridges in the box that determines results.

“There is no "find the brand y'er rifle likes".
Why do I say that? No rifle can fix crap ammo. Not one.”

Justin,
that’s a heavy statement, and it sits in contrast to how I’ve lived my shooting life. I’ve spent oodles of time and money going through gun after gun seeking rifles that shoot exceedingly well no matter what crap I happen to have on hand to feed ‘em. We’ve all had or fired a gun that wrung a heck of a lot out of a broad spectrum of ammo collections, a perfect storm of barrel/action/stock/and sight that only seemed limited by the shooter’s abilities.
I guess I’m still looking for the perfect witches brew, the ground breaking invention that will take accuracy farther. Machines continue to improve, and we have some of the most consistent barrels ever produced- manufactured right not, today.
The best manner in which the barrel and action are secured (in rimfire) remains to be nailed down. Pin strikes, location, shape, and depth/force seem to be inconclusive as the 12:00 Chisel point still seems to be the darling of mfgs. For well over 6 decades tuners have come and gone in vogue. Perhaps the next leap could come in materials used?

 

[justin amateur]

I agree obx, it goes against what all those internet rimfire gurus claim.

Yet, do you disagree with the following...

1) Velocity differences cause vertical spread.

2) Bullet asymmetry causes variations in trajectories.

3) Sloppy seating and variations in crimp cause strays.

4) Bullet damage to the heel during manufacture causes strays.

5) Visibly damaged cartridges, fresh out of the box, indicate poor handling on the factory assembly line.


Any and all of those problems can't be fixed by a rifle supposedly having a preference for a brand.
You may like a brand due to cost and it's effectiveness for your purpose,
but a poorly made cartridge is going to wander off no matter what label is on the box.

My rifle "likes" is an opinion based on half remembered results produced at close range,
due to a few random acts of accuracy, not actual testing or witnessed competition over long term.

No rifle can fix crap ammo. None.
Results downrange are due to the uniformity of velocity and bullet shape/balance.
So y'er rifle likes CCI SV....are you sure? I have a couple bricks left that says y'er wrong.

 

[grauhanen]

No rifle can fix crap ammo. None.

This is fact. No rifle, whatever its make, can outshoot the ammo its given.

 

[littlesister]

I found a lot of SK Semi-Auto that shoots great for the price point. I’m going back today to buy the remaining bricks. This is how it shot in my new Bergara B14R, Five shots at Fifty yards.View attachment 7994100This is how it really shoots. These are rounds 6-106 through my new rifle.View attachment 7994101

One good group out of 20! Why would you want to buy more of it? For 50 yd groups it doesn't look that good to me. It has vertical & horizonal spread and flyers. Thats why I don't waste my money and time on crap ammo. What is it good for? You can't tune with it. You can't practice shooting techniques with it and you surely don't want to use it in competition due to its lack of consistency. You never know if it's you the gun or the ammo! It does work for steel challenge where sub moa accuracy is not necessary .and for making beer cans jump around.

 

[hlee]

One good group out of 20! Why would you want to buy more of it? For 50 yd groups it doesn't look that good to me. It has vertical & horizonal spread and flyers. Thats why I don't waste my money and time on crap ammo. What is it good for? You can't tune with it. You can't practice shooting techniques with it and you surely don't want to use it in competition due to its lack of consistency. You never know if it's you the gun or the ammo! It does work for steel challenge where sub moa accuracy is not necessary .and for making beer cans jump around.

It is fine for giving to the kids to go bang largish steel targets. It is also perfectly adequate “hunting” ammo. And, I haven’t found an aluminum can that can dodge it.

 

[Kahrhart63]

My guns seem to shoot the Norma tac 22 better. And it is cheaper yet

 

[littlesister]

My guns seem to shoot the Norma tac 22 better. And it is cheaper yet

It is fine for giving to the kids to go bang largish steel targets. It is also perfectly adequate “hunting” ammo. And, I haven’t found an aluminum can that can dodge it.

It really depends on what you're doing with your gun. Looking back at years of shooting, I know I've shot a lot more tin cans than I'll ever shoot paper targets!