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Biggest change would be barrel profile. The only other big change would be to buy a KRG Bravo chassis for it. That's pretty much it.
The older Howas were indeed tough to get the factory bbl off of. I used to have to ruin brand-new OEM bbls by taking a cut with a parting tool right up against the receiver face to relieve the pressure on the threads - had a few that I was able to turn the bbl loose by hand after taking that cut. But about the time the 1500s started coming off the line with the HACT triggers, the barrels got a lot easier to break loose & remove. Never had problems with the Mini actions, as they were always equipped with the HACT triggers; I've re-barreled four of them for my own use, and it was pretty easy to break the factory bbl loose on them.I prefer the 700 for the simple reason that getting the barrel off a Howa is a royal pain in the rear.
I have a 1500 that's at least 10 years old. Its old enough to be a 308 with a 1 in 12 barrel.The older Howas were indeed tough to get the factory bbl off of. I used to have to ruin brand-new OEM bbls by taking a cut with a parting tool right up against the receiver face to relieve the pressure on the threads - had a few that I was able to turn the bbl loose by hand after taking that cut. But about the time the 1500s started coming off the line with the HACT triggers, the barrels got a lot easier to break loose & remove. Never had problems with the Mini actions, as they were always equipped with the HACT triggers; I've re-barreled four of them for my own use, and it was pretty easy to break the factory bbl loose on them.
Yeah, the KRG bravo is pretty budget friendly. Oryx makes a chassis for it as well.Ahh ok, so not too much weight going to come off it then sounds like. I may look at that chassis though. Mine has the flag which I love and it looks cool, but it's not very camouflaged lol
Used to be the case, not so much anymore in my experience. As of the last 5 years or so, Remington has been harder, and if I'm truing an action and installing a better barrel, I just take a parting tool to the Remingtons.I prefer the 700 for the simple reason that getting the barrel off a Howa is a royal pain in the rear.
ZERO factory 700s in service as sniper weapons = Wrong. Change that to many LTRsI get where you're going with this, but it takes A LOT of work to get a Remington 700 to the point where a police sniper, military sniper, or even just a guy going out on weekends to shoot PRS would trust that rifle completely.
There are ZERO factory Remington 700s in service with the military or with LEO snipers. At best they came out of the Remington custom shop.
Most of the time, you have smiths who keep nothing but the trigger and receiver, true the lugs, front face, threads, slot the receiver, open up the factory mounting holes to 8x40, install an aftermarket recoil lug and cut-rifled barrel, weld the bolt handle on, thread it for a better bolt knob, inlet a high-end stock, and glass bed the thing. That's $3000 - $4000 worth of work right there, and we haven't even talked about installing a bigger extractor or dual ejectors, which is also a popular mod to fix the ejection angle so rounds are not banging off your scope turrets.
In other words, they spend a lot of time and a lot of money building a rifle they could finally deem to be adequate for the job precisely because the factory offered Remington 700 was not up to the task.
I'm not saying that the Howa would be, either. What I am saying is that Howa designed their rifle to have less to correct, and of the rifles out there in the hands of serious people who do serious things with those rifles, not a single one is a factory Remington 700.
The best we can say is that they made a good receiver and that's generous considering the work that is put into to correcting the inconsistencies from the factory.
The downside to fitting DBM to a Howa short action is that you have to mill away part of the projection at the rear of the mag well to allow AICS mags to slide up into the action bottom. It's not hard to do - if you've got a vertical mill. You need to leave this projection protruding out a bit, and make a shallow cut at the bottom just deep enough to engage the top rear of the magazine so pressure on the bottom of the mag won't force it up into the action to the point where it interferes with the bolt.
Everything and anything that you could possibly need, they make it.Howas are a far better action than remingtons…. Especially these days and especially to build on. They just don’t have as many aftermarket goodies as remingtons.
100%. My Howa is somewhere on here. Manners T6A, custom barrel etc. Even their triggers are so good, once reworked there’s no need to change!Everything and anything that you could possibly need, they make it.
I don’t agree with that all the way. Remingtons quality has dropped off, would be a fair statement. The r700 design is great, that’s why others copy it. Howa’s are damn good but you can’t make a blanket statement like that. More snipers use Remington 700s than probably any other rifles in the world. They must have made a couple of good ones. LolHowas are a far better action than remingtons…. Especially these days and especially to build on. They just don’t have as many aftermarket goodies as remingtons.
The r700 design is great, that’s why others copy it.
Rem700 are fantastically engineered, for its original purpose. Trigger fitment and design, external recoil lug, raceways, bolt design, firing pin assembly, etc. Smart.
Over the years they have cheapened it up to the point of literally extinction. It was by no means the best, but the design and price point was brilliant, partly why it took off.
Also why many people clone it and perfected it. Brought the tolerances back and cleaned it up. Side bolt release, integrated pic rails, one piece recoil lug, etc.
That exemplifies my point. Rem700s have gotten to the point of being "lowest common denominator", by making them better in after market options, it's some what complimenting the design.No one copies anything that's more expensive and difficult to make, even if it's demonstrably better.
Me and you have been down this road before. I admit that the howa design is better in many ways. I like the integral recoil, the trigger, and the bolt with Howa’s. There’s nothing wrong with Howa’s at all. However, just because I like those things more doesn’t make them better. They’re different, it’s comparing apples to oranges. With all their problems and short comings the r700 design is used to make some of the most accurate rifles in the world. I believe Remington 700s and Winchester 70s are both cheap ripoffs of the Mauser design and Howa’s look like they might be too.This is true and false at the same time.
The 700 design is brilliant in terms of ease of manufacture. That's it. There's nothing else great about it. A round bottom is not ideal. A flat one is. The extractor is a thin sheetmetal clip, not a claw made from wrought or forged steel. The bolt handle falls off unless the brazing is done perfectly. The lug can get misaligned during barrel installation, something that cannot happen with a Howa, or Winchester, or Mauser.
Because the 700 was cheaper than the Model 70 it took off in sales. Once sales reach some tipping point, aftermarket companies take notice and latch on. Not because the 700 has some superior qualities inherent in its design, but because a shit ton of them were sold because they are cheaper than the competition. Now that the aftermarket is 700-centric, any new entry into the aftermarket has to start there and many stay there.
It's the same thing that happened with the Glock 17...........
With all their problems and short comings the r700 design is used to make some of the most accurate rifles in the world.
Most of them don’t have problems and work great throughout their lifetime. It’s not uncommon to see 40,50, or 60year old Remingtons shooting 1/2 moa groups. Those old 700 actions are everywhere and make great shooting rifles. The short comings I was referring to were in management not in the rifles. IMO the recoil lug isn’t as sturdy as the Howa’s but it’s better than others, like Tikka. I prefer to use Remington actions when building a rifle unless I’m using a custom action. If you can’t do your own machine work it less expensive to buy a custom action.AFTER those problems and shortcomings are fixed. Problems and shortcoming that are mostly absent from Howa rifles.
Here’s pics of a couple of examples I just grabbed off gunbroker of the sort of guns that come to mind when I think about Remington 700s. Both rifles are over 50 years old. Man if those aren’t beautiful rifles I don’t know what is. Remington was a giant and made some the nicest firearms ever made. Remington is the reason shooting was so inexpensive and now that they’re gone the others don’t have to compete against their low prices. The days of cheap ammo and cheap equipment are gone and will probably never return. Before these shortages are over we’re all gonna miss Remington.Most of them don’t have problems and work great throughout their lifetime. It’s not uncommon to see 40,50, or 60year old Remingtons shooting 1/2 moa groups. Those old 700 actions are everywhere and make great shooting rifles. The short comings I was referring to were in management not in the rifles. IMO the recoil lug isn’t as sturdy as the Howa’s but it’s better than others, like Tikka. I prefer to use Remington actions when building a rifle unless I’m using a custom action. If you can’t do your own machine work it less expensive to buy a custom action.
308pirate is actually the person that opened my eyes to Howa’s, not an easy task either. I’m a 40+ year Remington owner and all around Remington whore. Pirate knows this and that’s why he’s busting my balls. Howa’s are built the way a gun should be made. The machine work is unbelievable, and I don’t know how they make a profit. I had overlooked their quality for years and missed out on awesome rifles just because they were foreign made and inexpensive.
There’s good reasons to buy either, they each have their pluses and minuses. It really depends on what the person is trying to do.
Here’s pics of a couple of examples I just grabbed off gunbroker of the sort of guns that come to mind when I think about Remington 700s. Both rifles are over 50 years old. Man if those aren’t beautiful rifles I don’t know what is. Remington was a giant and made some the nicest firearms ever made. Remington is the reason shooting was so inexpensive and now that they’re gone the others don’t have to compete against their low prices. The days of cheap ammo and cheap equipment are gone and will probably never return. Before these shortages are over we’re all gonna miss Remington.
and the fact that I've yet to see anyone come out with more sturdy metal mags to replace the somewhat flimsy plastic mags for the Mini actions.
Go pick up a 60 year old Model 70, hell or even one ten years old........
Yup...AKA Winchester Model 70
Fair call. Your right. Jeez this thread took off. I have rifles built off both actions and love them both. The Japanese have been making Howas for a very long time and have their process squared away….hence the affordable price. CheersI don’t agree with that all the way. Remingtons quality has dropped off, would be a fair statement. The r700 design is great, that’s why others copy it. Howa’s are damn good but you can’t make a blanket statement like that. More snipers use Remington 700s than probably any other rifles in the world. They must have made a couple of good ones. Lol
I love the pre 64 model 70s and the model 70s action is similar to the howa action. however I got turned against the model 70s way way back in the day with a post 64 model 70. The Damn screws in the stock that touch the barrel and mess with the harmonics cause me problems. The damn rifle was lucky to shoot 2 moa on a good day.Go pick up a 60 year old Model 70, hell or even one ten years old........
I like Howa’s they’re damn good rifles but no one action is the best for everyone all of the time. It’s all relative.Fair call. Your right. Jeez this thread took off. I have rifles built off both actions and love them both. The Japanese have been making Howas for a very long time and have their process squared away….hence the affordable price. Cheers
I agree with you. It looks like mr. Winchester, mr. Remington and mr. Howa all borrowed from mr. MauserI posted something about Howa vs Rem vs M70 back in 2011
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Gunsmithing - Rebarreling Howa 1500
I've heard a few folks say that removing the stock barrel on a Howa is a serious pain. I've got an opportunity to pick-up a very clean 1500 for a good price. I'm most interested in using it as a foundation for a humble custom build. First item would be a new barrel chambered in 223 AI. I'm very...www.snipershide.com
Love the camo pattern on the couch!I love my 1992 m70...
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The other is an FN SPR and the chassis rifle a howa1500...
No kid r700 is NOT better and it was used by agencies only because Remington sold them CHEAP af to them lmao, and your question makes me laugh so bad lolI have both and like I said my howa shoots sub moa groups in a shitty plastic stock and has a better trigger. I also said he would be happy with either. However I just believe between a r700 police barreled action and a Howa barreled action the Remington is better. I wonder how many Howa’s are in combat or are used by police snipers? I’m okay with being the only one on this thread that prefer Remington.
No kid r700 is NOT better and it was used by agencies only because Remington sold them CHEAP af to them lmao, and your question makes me laugh so bad lol