Hybrid Target/Hunting Rifle (7WSM or 7 Mag?)

[Cold_Bore_88]

I am trying to spec out a light”er” hunting/target crossover. I am pretty sure I want to go with 7mm. However, I am having a hard time deciding between the 7mm WSM and Remington Magnum.

The WSM is nice because it can be loaded in a short action, reduces weight a bit, similar speeds to 7mm Mag, etc. However, it runs at much higher pressure and requires a highly compressed charge (this may not be an issue if I chose to just use the Hornady ELD-X in either caliber).

Any reason I should stick with the standard Long action cartridge? Using standard AICS mags is nice and there are a lot of off the shelf options for ammo. I rarely see 7 WSM.

Thoughts?

 

[Simia Dei]

Apologies in advance for this tangent. It’s moving away from your two mentioned calibres.

I’m putting together a hybrid competition and hunting rifle. I selected 7SAW as the caliber. .270 is the minimum legal calibre here for a species of deer I hunt (Aus) and I still want to take the rifle to matches. Performance is in the realms of 2800-2900fps with a 162gr ELD with a 26 inch barrel.

You can run the 7SAW in a short action with the 0.45 reamer (mine is being built on a tikka action) and a long action with the longer freebore reamer and still have a low recoiling calibre capable of taking to matches or plink with as well. A lot cheaper to run than a magnum.

However, if the 7PRC becomes a reality, I can see myself getting interested in that. But the 7SAW might fill your requirements.

 

[Cold_Bore_88]

Apologies in advance for this tangent. It’s moving away from your two mentioned calibres.

I’m putting together a hybrid competition and hunting rifle. I selected 7SAW as the caliber. .270 is the minimum legal calibre here for a species of deer I hunt (Aus) and I still want to take the rifle to matches. Performance is in the realms of 2800-2900fps with a 162gr ELD with a 26 inch barrel.

You can run the 7SAW in a short action with the 0.45 reamer (mine is being built on a tikka action) and a long action with the longer freebore reamer and still have a low recoiling calibre capable of taking to matches or plink with as well. A lot cheaper to run than a magnum.

However, if the 7PRC becomes a reality, I can see myself getting interested in that. But the 7SAW might fill your requirements.

No worries. Thanks for responding.

I really want to stick with something I don’t “have” to load for (main reason I don’t go 28 Nosler).

 

[Steelhead]

I have a 7mmWSM and really like it. However, finding ammo has been a pain lately. It seems to have fallen out of favor, which is too bad, because it's a great round. Very accurate, but might have a bit too much recoil for competition use, such as PRS.

Another option would be the 7mm SAUM. Have you looked into that cartridge? Here too, components and ammo maybe scarce, like the WSM, but some claim it is inherently more accurate than the WSM. I haven't played with it, so I don't know.

 

[lawofsavage]

Seems like 6.5 PRC would make a lot of sense in this scenario.

 

[Cold_Bore_88]

I have a 7mmWSM and really like it. However, finding ammo has been a pain lately. It seems to have fallen out of favor, which is too bad, because it's a great round. Very accurate, but might have a bit too much recoil for competition use, such as PRS.

Another option would be the 7mm SAUM. Have you looked into that cartridge? Here too, components and ammo maybe scarce, like the WSM, but some claim it is inherently more accurate than the WSM. I haven't played with it, so I don't know.

I have a 6.5 creed for PRS. This would be a hunting/Long range “range queen”. Haha!

I did look at the SAUM but for the reasons you pointed out, I passed on it.

Who knows. Maybe I will have to reload to get what I want.

 

[mcfred]

I have gone through a few 7mm WSM barrels. They do have a bit of recoil for the PRS style game which is why I don't shoot it anymore, that and it ate barrels (and lots of powder) after 1300-1500 rounds when loaded to max pressure. It's a .3 MOA with a 180 SMKs through a Brux 1:9 twist too.

It's a fine cartridge but the brass availability has made it less appealing. If you stick with the WSM flavor then look at a 7mm/.300 WSM "wildcat" so you can just use readily available 300WSM brass and factory dies to get affordable/appropriate ammo.

Otherwise there's the SAUMs, Rem Mags, 7-08AI, 7x57AI, 284Win and whatever that will drive 162gr bullets at 2900-3100fps. Hard to go wrong with 7mm especially for hunting.

 

[Cold_Bore_88]

I have gone through a few 7mm WSM barrels. They do have a bit of recoil for the PRS style game which is why I don't shoot it anymore, that and it ate barrels (and lots of powder) after 1300-1500 rounds when loaded to max pressure. It's a .3 MOA with a 180 SMKs through a Brux 1:9 twist too.

It's a fine cartridge but the brass availability has made it less appealing. If you stick with the WSM flavor then look at a 7mm/.300 WSM "wildcat" so you can just use readily available 300WSM brass and factory dies to get affordable/appropriate ammo.

Otherwise there's the SAUMs, Rem Mags, 7-08AI, 7x57AI, 284Win and whatever that will drive 162gr bullets at 2900-3100fps. Hard to go wrong with 7mm especially for hunting.

Thanks for the info. I wasn’t considering the 280 AI but now I am. I like the Rem Mag but don’t like the idea of a belted Magnum. I have read that they headspace off the belt. Thus they tend to be less accurate.

Lots do Rem Mag options out there though.

 

[Steelhead]

I have a 6.5 creed for PRS. This would be a hunting/Long range “range queen”. Haha!

I did look at the SAUM but for the reasons you pointed out, I passed on it.

Who knows. Maybe I will have to reload to get what I want.

Like lawofSavage said, maybe a 6.5 PRS would be a good option. Especially since you have a 6.5 Creedmoor. Would make things a bit simpler for you with only 6.5 bullets.

 

[mcfred]

If OP chooses to reload despite preferring commercially available ammo, then even the belted magnum accuracy/headspacing 'issue' need not apply; you can choose to headspace off the shoulder instead of the belt and bask in the 7RM's widespread use.

The 280 AI will do anything the other options will do, just not from a magazine in a short action. In a pinch regular .280 should still headspace fine in an AI chamber though accuracy/velocity may suffer some.

 

[Cold_Bore_88]

If OP chooses to reload despite preferring commercially available ammo, then even the belted magnum accuracy/headspacing 'issue' need not apply; you can choose to headspace off the shoulder instead of the belt and bask in the 7RM's widespread use.

The 280 AI will do anything the other options will do, just not from a magazine in a short action. In a pinch regular .280 should still headspace fine in an AI chamber though accuracy/velocity may suffer some.

This. Just have the gunsmith cut chamber as such.

 

[jcann]

I've shot both the 7wsm and 7mm mag. I currently hunt with a wsm. I constantly get ~2950fps with the 180gr Berger and H1000 powder (65.8grs). I've pushed it to a little over 3000fps with the 180gr as well. I was able to score brass from Copper Creek several months ago. GAP built my rifle and it has been an outstanding hunting firearm.



ps You can also set a 7mm mag to headspace off the shoulder. A belted magnum is not a problem to reload.

 

[Gooldylocks]

However, if the 7PRC becomes a reality, I can see myself getting interested in that. But the 7SAW might fill your requirements.

I was thinking about this some the other day, and I came to the conclusion that it seems unlikely for hornady to release the "7 PRC", because I'm certain Gunwerks has some rights to that design, which Hornady makes for them already. Now if only you could buy 7 LRM from more than just Gunwerks, that would be awesome. But as we sit right now that seems unlikely to me.

I still really really want an LRM.

 

[OLD308]

Hummm
I have a 22” light barrel 7mm Rem Mag with a break that is an outstanding spot and stalk rifle. 168 classic hunter Berger puts then down. Available ammo is easy to find everywhere. I also have a 7mm08 18” barrel running 140 grain hunters and accubond that’s my go to since the Mag is over kill for most everything. I’ve never felt under guned at a local match running either. Even with the break the mag bucks more. Hope this helps.

 

[308220]

I just came here to see how many people would suggest the guy build a 6.5...sure enough, I found some. From mouse to moose, it does it all!

 

[lawofsavage]

I just came here to see how many people would suggest the guy build a 6.5...sure enough, I found some. From mouse to moose, it does it all!

Cool man. I wish I could entertain myself that easily.

One of my hunting rifles is a 7RM but the dude is saying he would prefer a short action with decent options for factory ammo ...

 

[Cold_Bore_88]

Cool man. I wish I could entertain myself that easily.

One of my hunting rifles is a 7RM but the dude is saying he would prefer a short action with decent options for factory ammo ...

I would long Action if 7RM offers some advantages (AI mags, less pressure, etc.). But your right, I want something with factory ammo availability.

If I was planning to only reload, I would go 28 Nosler in a heartbeat.

 

[lawofsavage]

I’ve had really good luck with the 162 grain ELD-X Hornady factory ammo in 7RM. For something you’re not competing with, I personally don’t have any problem at all with a long action or running the long action mags.

Imo, it’s sort of splitting hairs between the 6.5 PRC and 7RM with factory Hornady eld-x ammo at least (143 vs 162 grain) but I don’t have moose or elk where I live ? and I’m a sucker for finding an excuse to buy a new gun in a new caliber ?‍.

 

[Cold_Bore_88]

I’ve had really good luck with the 162 grain ELD-X Hornady factory ammo in 7RM. For something you’re not competing with, I personally don’t have any problem at all with a long action or running the long action mags.

Imo, it’s sort of splitting hairs between the 6.5 PRC and 7RM with factory Hornady eld-x ammo at least (143 vs 162 grain) but I don’t have moose or elk where I live ? and I’m a sucker for finding an excuse to buy a new gun in a new caliber ?‍.

This is the truth. Hahaha! I always need an excuse for a new gun.

I considered the 6.5 PRC but I would like a little more mass (that 165-180 gr range). While you “can” kill an elk with a 6.5, I prefer to have more mass and less wind drift (queue the 6.5” elk hunters who think I am an idiot).

 

[Steelhead]

(queue the 6.5” elk hunters who think I am an idiot).

I think all of Europe just laughed.

 

[knuckleballz]

Euro optic has a sale on tikkas. I finally broke down and bought a forrest 7mm rem mag for 508$ with 10$ shipping. Guys are pushing 3000fps with the 180eldm and h1000 or re26. That's a .7 bc bullet. The 9.5 twist is not ideal but it is working fine with this bullet and powders. I will shoot mine with the factory barrel to see how it shoots. You have the factory mag limitation with the tikka of 3.35 inches. You can add an aftermarket bottom metal and use AI mags to get 3.60 inches. It is a good price for a magnum action that can be rebarreled to a short magnum as well.

 

[knuckleballz]

It is a 7lb rifle with the walnut stock. A bedded carbon stock would drop a pound. Put an 8 twist proof barrel on and grab your choice of off the shelf ammo.

 

[knuckleballz]

The Green Mountain long action tikka bottom metal takes the AI mags to allow 3.60 inches. They are 199$

 

[Cold_Bore_88]

Euro optic has a sale on tikkas. I finally broke down and bought a forrest 7mm rem mag for 508$ with 10$ shipping. Guys are pushing 3000fps with the 180eldm and h1000 or re26. That's a .7 bc bullet. The 9.5 twist is not ideal but it is working fine with this bullet and powders. I will shoot mine with the factory barrel to see how it shoots. You have the factory mag limitation with the tikka of 3.35 inches. You can add an aftermarket bottom metal and use AI mags to get 3.60 inches. It is a good price for a magnum action that can be rebarreled to a short magnum as well.

I think I am going to do a DTA with proof research barrel (should keep rifle around 8 lbs)

 

[10ring1]

7mmRM. My vote. Wsm ammo is tough to find. 7 RM is a long action but IMO, the best all around caliber on the planet

 

[Cold_Bore_88]

If OP chooses to reload despite preferring commercially available ammo, then even the belted magnum accuracy/headspacing 'issue' need not apply; you can choose to headspace off the shoulder instead of the belt and bask in the 7RM's widespread use.

The 280 AI will do anything the other options will do, just not from a magazine in a short action. In a pinch regular .280 should still headspace fine in an AI chamber though accuracy/velocity may suffer some.

I saw they do make long action mags for standard bolt face calibers. Might be a good direction.

 

[WeiserBucks]

I think I am going to do a DTA with proof research barrel (should keep rifle around 8 lbs)

There's now way a DTA with a C.F. barrel is anywhere near 8 lbs .

 

[Covertnoob5]

There's now way a DTA with a C.F. barrel is anywhere near 8 lbs .

Yea not a chance, my DTA with a heavy fluted 6.5 Saum barrel is about 14.5lbs. The heavy fluting is almost equal to what the CF barrel would weigh. You’ll be VERY lucky to get 13lbs. But you’ll probably still be around 14

 

[Cold_Bore_88]

Yea not a chance, my DTA with a heavy fluted 6.5 Saum barrel is about 14.5lbs. The heavy fluting is almost equal to what the CF barrel would weigh. You’ll be VERY lucky to get 13lbs. But you’ll probably still be around 14

Is that with a scope? I am talking rifle only.

According to their website the 22” .308 SRS with heavy contour barrel is right at 10 lbs or so.

 

[Covertnoob5]

Is that with a scope? I am talking rifle only.

According to their website the 22” .308 SRS with heavy contour barrel is right at 10 lbs or so.

Yea with scope, but I’m not running a 6lb scope. NF ATACR.
I can weight my covert chassis tonight for you. If you could get an SRS that light the CF barrels would be a lot more popular.
You really only save about 1lb going CF. Reason is, the giant shank that the barrel has to have to index to the chassis is still steel. No way around that and that’s the heaviest part.

 

[Covertnoob5]

Just weighed it real quick, Covert chassis with bolt only, weighs 6lbs 5.3 oz
16” 308 factory barrel alone is 3.97lbs
That’s 10.5lbs total. I’d venture to guess a 22” CF barrel is about the same as a 16” steel barrel.

 

[Covertnoob5]

Here you go, 25” proof barrel and you can deconstruct the rest.

 

[Cold_Bore_88]

Here you go, 25” proof barrel and you can deconstruct the rest.
View attachment 6939735

Thanks man! So the rifle is roughly 11lbs (3 lbs worth of scope and mount)?

How does the Proof shoot?

 

[Covertnoob5]

Thanks man! So the rifle is roughly 11lbs (3 lbs worth of scope and mount)?

How does the Proof shoot?

Not my rifle, but from what I’ve seen they shoot great. Bugholes for sure.
Yea I’d put it at about 11lbs. Not sure what scope you plan on running?

 

[jetmd]

Cold_Bore_88,

Ultimately the choice is yours but keep in mind the first question I would ask:

Are you planning to reload or shoot factory only ammo?

I have been shooting my 7wsm since 2003. Do I love it YES!

Would I recommend it for someone who reloads HELL NO!

If you only plan to shoot factory ammo go for it.

Before I make a move to a new cartridge the first order of business is to purchase 1K pieces of virgin brass
or 1K rds of factory ammo.

After that the rest is easy.

7wsm brass availability is Poor on a good day.

JMHO.

Good Luck!