I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

F

fracmeister

Private
Minuteman
Nov 15, 2005
39
0
Texas
www.troop1960.com
#1
OK, the only place I could put the safe was the garage. Not my first choice, but well out of site, even form someone standing at the front of the garage. And it is a HEAVY Graffunder bolted down well. But as I live in Houston, humidity is a concern. I have a goldenrod and one of those recharge/plug in when dessicant saturated dehumidifier deals. I think I should get a quality hygrometer to measure humidity though. <span style="font-weight: bold">What is the optimal humidity for storing rifles</span> (no wooden stocks in the bunch) --- any differences for coins as I have a buttload of silver and an earful of gold coins.

TIA as I know you guys have opinions.
 
#2
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

I just bought a new safe as well. I put a 18" de-humidifying rod in it, but was wondering if that was enough (fairly big safe). Also, those rods get HOT, kinda un-nerving so close to that shitty carpet.
 
#3
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

If you don't have to worry about wooden stocks, then zero humidity is optimum. Why not just use the large containers of silica crystals? If you live in a humid area (like Houston), you simply process the containers more often.
 
#5
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I just bought a new safe as well. I put a 18" de-humidifying rod in it, but was wondering if that was enough (fairly big safe). Also, those rods get HOT, kinda un-nerving so close to that shitty carpet. </div></div>

When I was looking to buy a residential safe I spoke with Ft Knox, Liberty, and Champion. All agreed that in humid locations a moisture absorbent should be used. The golden rod works well for maintaining a constant temp (reduces condensation) but the moisture still needs to be removed from the air. Safe retailers sell large descant safe inserts that are rechargeable (baked in your oven). I have used one for years and have never had a single issue with rust.

 
#7
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: One-Eyed Jack</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If you don't have to worry about wooden stocks, then zero humidity is optimum. Why not just use the large containers of silica crystals? If you live in a humid area (like Houston), you simply process the containers more often. </div></div>

http://www.agmcontainer.com/desiccantcity/desiccant_bulkdesiccant.htm
 
#8
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

dmg, check out the link I posted above, that unit has a little window and it changes color telling you it needs to be renewed.
 
#9
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dmg264</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How do you know when the dissicant should be replaced or baked without some kind of meter?

David </div></div>

changes colors.

 
#10
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

I have one of those eva dry deals as well. I am getting a decent hygrometer. Is it really appropos to get very low humidity?

I have glocks, berettas, some (very) old colts and coins as well as rifles with synthetic stocks. I know that for my custom knives I don't want ultra low (<25%) humidity because of thedifferential shrinkage in ivory, mother of pearl, etc.

What humidity level is low enough that rust is unlikely?
 
#11
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

I will throw my 2 cents in.

I had a Goldenrod in my safe when I first bought it and it ruined several guns. I had previously stored them in a steel cabinet with no humidity protection other than a dehumidifier running in the room and never had a problem. One week after receiving my new safe and installing a Goldenrod rust formed on several of my rifles.

My safe has a gasketed door and I am guessing that since the heated air could not escape it became humid in the safe.[My Goldenrod became hot enough that you did not want to hang onto it]

I spoke with a safe company about it and they told me they would never use the Goldenrod, only the dessicant cans/bags.

I threw the Goldenrod away and went with the 750 gram silica gel cannister and have had no problems since [8+ years].

YMMV
 
#12
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

when living in houston (7+ yeqars) I used a 1000 gram silica Gel breathable box and no goldenrod. I never had rust form on any of my firearms. In the desert it doesn't really matter if you have anythign in the safe or not, but I still have my silica gel in there.

JeffVN
 
#13
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

I learned a few years ago to put a few bricks of Charcole in the leg part of a pair of panty hose and throw it in my safes, I've never had any trouble. Also use Barricade wipes before putting weapons away.
 
#14
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

I have a goldenrod in both my safes, but since I like overkill I also have a can of DampRid in there. DampRid is pellets that turn to liquid as they absorb moisture from the air. Pour off the liquid and refill the container.

You can get Damprid at Container store and I bought a case of it online when I had my safes in the garage. Still have half the case from years ago. Good stuff.
 
#15
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: reo1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I learned a few years ago to put a few bricks of Charcole in the leg part of a pair of panty hose and throw it in my safes, I've never had any trouble. Also use Barricade wipes before putting weapons away. </div></div>
That is a great idea! I may try this
 
#17
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lrplinker</div><div class="ubbcode-body">OK, the only place I could put the safe was the garage. Not my first choice, but well out of site, even form someone standing at the front of the garage. And it is a HEAVY Graffunder bolted down well. But as I live in Houston, humidity is a concern. I have a goldenrod and one of those recharge/plug in when dessicant saturated dehumidifier deals. I think I should get a quality hygrometer to measure humidity though. <span style="font-weight: bold">What is the optimal humidity for storing rifles</span> (no wooden stocks in the bunch) --- any differences for coins as I have a buttload of silver and an earful of gold coins.

TIA as I know you guys have opinions. </div></div>

Excellent thread as my wife stated that we needed to get a safe for the garage just yesterday.
 
#20
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Bill Stoffels</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Silica is the way to go
large bags of it </div></div>

+1,my wife used to work at a high end shoe store large 1# bags came in cases of shoes.1 bag in my safe at a time was perfect,no problems with moisture what so ever.
You could proably go to a local shoe store and get all you wanted.They just throw them away anyway.
 
#22
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

I run a dehumidifier and have another set up if its really humid. Only need to run them in the spring/summer months and not necessarily all the time. If I run the A/C unit, I dont need them. I use a meter to that keeps tabs on the humidity level....when i get over 60%, I run one, if I get around 70%, I turn on both till things get back to normal, which is below 60%. Here in NC, its hard to get below 50%, but anything below 60% should be fine.

John
 
#23
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

Here's my 2 cents....

Goldenrod....never been impressed by them, like stated above it warms the safe but how does the moisture get out? It doesn't!

Damprid....Hell NO! I've seen where guys have bumped them over and spilled that liquid. The liquid that collects in the tray is corrosive, not so good for guns!

I'd either get the Eva Dry mentioned above, get a couple or more, have some recharging while others are protecting. Or Cabelas has some good ones in a canister that you just recharge in the oven, but same deal on how the system works.
 
#24
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

for a smaller pistol safe i save all the little silica bags from every purchases and throw them in behind the foam. i've never had a rust problem
 
#26
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SniperCJ</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have a goldenrod in both my safes, but since I like overkill I also have a can of DampRid in there. DampRid is pellets that turn to liquid as they absorb moisture from the air. Pour off the liquid and refill the container.</div></div>

This is what I use in Florida, land of liquid sunshine.
 
#27
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

I have a new larger safe coming, so this is a concern of mine too. But the humidity isn't as much of a problem in ND as it is in TX.

Silica is a good bet. A few years ago living in Kansas I learned something pretty interesting. I owned a couple of motorcycles, Harleys. At that time new HD were shipped in crates to the dealers. They were wrapped in plastic. And in each one of those crates was at least one big ol bag of silica gel. I used to get em for free from the HD guy I delt with. So if you have a dealer nearby you might want to check and see if they still get em I remember em being in a fabric bag of some sort, and pretty large, maybe 2 or 3 pounds or more.
 
#30
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

Golden rods or similar work fine in RSCs like Fort Knox, Liberty, Cannon and the like because they have a considerable gap between the door and frame which provides air flow. A Graffunder is relatively air tight and thus does not allow that heated air to exchange with outside air, basically turning your safe into a greenhouse. Additionally, an electric appliance introduced into the interior of your safe requires penetration of the fire barrier for the electrical cord. Whether or not this substantially reduces the effectiveness of said barrier is up for debate but if I'm paying several thousand dollars for a fire resistant container you won't find me poking holes in it.

Silica dessicant, changed out on a schedule consistent with your locale, where the unit is stored, etc., is the way to go.

Absorb the moisture then get rid of it.
wink.gif
 
#31
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

Bullfrog moisture absorber and cheap as well but I don't battle humidity like you just the politicions.
 
#32
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: USMCj</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If its a big safe, I would put 4 of these in there. I say 4 so you dont have to renew them often.

http://www.amazon.com/Eva-dry-EDV-E-500-...7126&sr=8-1 </div></div>


I followed your advice and purchased 4 of those and a wireless humidity-ometer (whatever they're actually called). My safe is staying at about 40-45% relative humidity. Outside humidity is around 70%.
 
#34
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

I agree with the above posts in regards to using some form of desiccant(usually silica). There are numerous companies and websites that can assist you in finding and ordering the correct amount for your particular size safe.
 
#35
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

Well I am new here and this is my first post. I have no idea if there is a forum I should post a hello to first, as is the case with so many other forums. In any case, I have had both the rod and the silica. IMO, the silica is the way to go. Its cheep, reusable, and does not produce heat. The rod I got from bass pro and the one I got from Brownells both produce heat. The heat is an issue because I also store ammo in my safe. A lot of ammo, and other things
smile.gif
so the heat does not go well with them. It does not get hot enough to cause the rounds to go off or damage my guns but its heat none the less. I normally reconstitute the silica ever 3 months or so and all is well. BTW my safe is in my basement so humidity is an issue but the silica does the job. Just do not leave the door to the safe open for any long period of time or the silica will need to be reconstituted sooner. Hope this helps
 
#36
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

One other source for the silica gel crystals is a Hobby type store that sells supplies for the flower fancier...they sell the stuff in big containers to dry flower...they bury the flower in the silica to preserve it. Pretty cheap stuff. JMHO
 
#37
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

I dont know what to do. I have one of those 22 gun safes from redhead/bass pro. Its a decent safe but rust has been an issue. I have 1 of those canster silica things that u put in the oven to reheat. They are suposed to turn blue when done but they never do...... Most are white or a shade of pink.... Should i just look for new silica gel to fill it?


PS I live on the water in maryland so Humidity is serious business around here.
 
#39
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

Dehumdification in a safe.....

First off, you will need a good (small) digital temp/hygrometer to know what is going on (min/max function.) I couldn't find the tiny one I bought on line for you, but this one is ok. http://www.focalprice.com/Indoor_Max_Min_Digital_Thermometer_with_Hygrometer_White_HE173W_10335.html

Whatever you do, by watching the actual values, you can get to the truth about humidity in safes. Your target is pretty much anything less than 45% humidity at room temp.

Golden rod = Now think about it a bit. It might have value, but not by itself. It was designed for clothing closets, not safes. Safe come in only two flavors:

Sealed - Here we find that with heat you are putting all the humidity in the safe into suspension, making sure that inside your safe is like a day on the delta. Not Good. For those of you that are about to suggest (like the Goldenrod advert) that it heats up your safe so that moisture stays in suspension..think delta.

Unsealed - Here we find that with heat, the hot air goes out the top (heat rises) and, yep cold moist air from outside comes in the bottom. A perfect cycle of exchanging whatever the humidity is outside your safe back into your safe. Eddy builds the finest ship models in the world, people pay 6 figures for a model of their super yachts. He has been paid to build a $10k case and keep the models in perfect shape...on a ship! Tried Goldenrod...once...nope. http://www.yachtmodels.com/

So what does one do if they want to keep the contents of a safe perfect for decades?

1. Nothing goes in without being cleaned and dry.
2. Try not to open your safe on monsoon days.
3. No leather, no cloth, nothing porous that can hold moisture goes in. That includes paper (dry paper in a plastic bag).
4. Metal gets properly oiled. Wood gets properly oiled. Leather that has to go in (slings?) get oiled.
5. All actions open if possible.
6. Rechargeable cannisters of desiccant the more the merrier. I use a 300 gram unit, but I couldn't find a link for you. A few years ago you could get the monster big cannisters. I haven't seen them in a while or I'd post a link. Try and avoid the paper box kind (see note).

http://www.desiccantsonline.com/index.php?_a=viewProd&productId=323

Your going to recharge them every time they turn the littlest bit pink. After you take them out of the over, let them cool to the touch and then into the vault they go. Why? Well, be cause as they are cooling they are, right! They are pulling cold air in and hot air out the top...just like a Goldenrod. Wet room and a good 20% is lost in the cooling.

Note = Place the cannister 3-4" away from everything metal and on its own plastic plate. Ever see desiccant on metal? Like super salt! I am not a fan of the paper box with the bag desiccant, inside is a bag that is tied with a string. If that stuff gets out...bad news. Also, if you have bought a new (or a used) fireproof safe, they are moisture magnets at first. The material that makes them fireproof absorbs water big time! In fact, many think that putting guns into a fireproof safe is a mistakes as the "steaming" that will follow very high heat (thats how it works) is very destructive for both wood and metal. In any event, you will find it will take a good number of drying cycles to clear a fireproof safe. It can take months. When done your cannister will last a good six months without needing a charge. New fireproof safe = wet safe. Obviosly less of a problem in the desert.

You will be rewarded with no rust for as long as you do your part.
 
#40
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

Good place for silica is harbor freight $4.99 for a two pound bag. Its blue and turns pink when it needs to be recharged.
 
#41
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

what about the DRI stuff that comes in plastic tubs from Loews and home depot. It says once the stuff drips down in the bottom of the pail simply throw it away.
 
#42
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

I have a golden rod and 6 dual packs of Desi (brownells number 083-053-106 they call it the six dual) I am gone from home for 3 months at a time. Wife checks them as time goes, they have been in there since X-mas, have cooked them in April and july this year.

40 gun safe, in my garage which is not the best spot, but the damn thing wont fit in our house (rented) am in the process of purchasing a house and one of the big deals I looked for in the house was a place to put my weapons with no worries,
 
#43
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

Purchased the Eva-Dry(s) from Amazon, thanks for the advice! Hard at work, and takes little space. The renew by plugging into an outlet seems easiest as well.

BTW, Eva-Dry has it's own website but, go figure, Amazon's prices are less expensive. I could not find a store that carries them.
 
#44
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

What are or aren't you guys using as for corrosion protection on your weapons that rust is such an issue?
Not that I'm exactly the poster child for it but PMS does work [preventative maintaince, not the other type].

Lots of good agents out there for keeping rust where you don't want it, & yeah I know about corrosion as I've worked on or in the water for several decades. There are a few tricks, but aint none of it rocket science.

As to the gold, likely corrosion wont be much of an issue. It's too far up the galvanic scale. Silver on the other hand is another story. But still once you get any metal good & clean, & then can seal out the air & moisture...
 
#45
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

I worked on aircraft in a former lifetime. One of which was a Jetstream 31. It had a silica packed canister on each side window of the pilot and co-pilot to defog their side window. The silica was blue color when dry, and when abosorded with water, turned white or clear.

Every night on post-flight, we'd removed the silica from the cannisters and bake the moisture out at 300F in an oven, or even in a microwave. Then re-use, re-install for the next day. FAA approved.

No need to shit-can the silica.

djd
 
#46
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

I just use the silica gel kitty litter in a sock. Put one in a bottom corner of the safe and top corner of the safe. Outside of the safe I run Dri-Z-Air water traps. Instead of buying the DriZAir brand pellets, just get some Prestone Driveway heat and use that. (Calcium Chloride)
 
#47
Re: I got a new safe! Now a humidity question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: djd</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I worked on aircraft in a former lifetime. One of which was a Jetstream 31. It had a silica packed canister on each side window of the pilot and co-pilot to defog their side window. The silica was blue color when dry, and when abosorded with water, turned white or clear.

Every night on post-flight, we'd removed the silica from the cannisters and bake the moisture out at 300F in an oven, or even in a microwave. Then re-use, re-install for the next day. FAA approved.

No need to shit-can the silica.

djd </div></div>

Had a dessicant inspection window in the HUD on a military aircraft I once worked on. Same color indication when the dessicant got wet. When it turned pink, just sprinkle it out on a paper plate and give it a minute or two in the microwave and it was good as new.
 
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