Covid-19 had us all fooled, but now we might have finally found its secret.
In the last 3–5 days, a mountain of anecdotal evidence has come out of NYC, Italy, Spain, etc. about COVID-19 and characteristics of…
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Covid-19 had us all fooled, but now we might have finally found its secret.
In the last 3–5 days, a mountain of anecdotal evidence has come out of NYC, Italy, Spain, etc. about COVID-19 and characteristics of…web.archive.org
Covid-19 had us all fooled, but now we might have finally found its secret.
In the last 3–5 days, a mountain of anecdotal evidence has come out of NYC, Italy, Spain, etc. about COVID-19 and characteristics of…web.archive.org
I will say this, if it is ever proven that this was a crisis that was enhanced with hysteria purposely. I think political heads will roll. The people will not react kindly.
I tend to keep out of the Bear Pit for oh so many reasons , but the study referenced above was forwarded to me yesterday by a trusted source, along with a number of anecdotes from ER docs, and I came to roughly the same conclusion as @clcustom1911 (and I have a similar background, having been doing the whole ALS level anatomy/physiology thing since high school too). Granted, this study doesn't seem to have been replicated or peer-reviewed.
The nastiness of the cascade that he so elegantly described above is really nuanced - in Section 5 (found on pages 25/26 of the study mentioned above in the thread) it basically lays out that this virus works in a nuanced fashion to tax multiple systems at a cellular level, and inhibits certain processes (such as the ability for oxygen to bind to hemoglobin) Basically what this means is that as cells require oxygen to function, they also produce waste products.
NORMALLY, the oxygen that cells need to function and maintain a normal pH is provided to them, and then an exchange of waste byproducts back into the blood to be discarded from the human body happens. COVID-19, according to the article, basically doesn't allow enough oxygen to bind to the hemoglobin, so instead of cells getting enough O2, they get a fraction of what they need, which decreases as the virus replicates and creates a larger viral load (eg: a greater instance of the virus in the human body/ infecting more cells). This, in turn, means that the cells, which are still producing waste byproducts of cellular function, cannot sustainably balance their pH, and start to break down, as they are now producing more waste product (toxins) than the relative amount of O2 that they are receiving, and then you start to see multi-system failure - impaired kidney function requiring dialysis being something that has come up in multiple ER anecdotes. It's an unbalanced "ins/outs" issue at its simplest, but on a cellular level playing with the relative hypoxic status of healthy/sick cells.
Think of it like starting a workout where you are running bleachers that face out towards a field. You start running at a that start at a 10:10 ratio (10 up being O2 provided to cells, and 10 back being waste product, generally speaking); the goal of the workout is to spend as little time on the field as possible, but you MUST follow the up:back protocol that your coach dictates, EVEN if it means that you are taking steps back onto the field, and there is hell to pay for every step that you take onto that field. COVID-19 seems to pretty-much alter the above ratio from 10:10 to 9:10 to 8:10 to 5:10 to 3:10 on a biological level.
TLDR is that, given what's written in this article, vents aren't necessarily "the" solution, because it seems that operationally we need to find a way to deliver higher O2 saturation to cells while not inducing barotrauma (hurting someone's lungs), or limit the virus' ability to bind to heme and inhibit O2 binding to hemoglobin. I'm simplifying a lot of this because respiration is really complicated, especially when factoring in the "what ifs" that invariably come when someone might mention pH, respiration rate, compensatory function etc. At a cellular level, it's even more freaking complex. Add in the basics of virology and pharmacology, and you'll begin to realize why medical professionals spend years learning this stuff/countless hours completing continuing education, and the best ones have a total obsession with what they work on.
Again, this is a complete oversimplification in order to respond to this post from my perspective.
That's an excellent read. I'm no doctor, but I've been doing the paramedic and anatomy/physiology thing since I was in high school (2001).
The one thing it missed was when your organs go hypoxic, they start producing their own metabolic byproducts which eventually cause your body's pH to swing acidic, and your blood cells are needed to get oxygen, but they can't because the COVID fucked 'em.... viscous cycle which ends up in something called MODS, Multiple Organ Dysfunction Syndrome and shit starts shutting down. No bueno.
All of that article makes sense.
Is our suffering prolonged because it cant be "Orange Man Right"?
Correct. That's where early/fast detection and testing is vital to a fast moving pathogen.And also, the article makes absolutely perfect sense to start treatment as EARLY AS POSSIBLE. The whole practice behind treatment with active chemical compounds is to beat the pathogen at it's game. I have been hearing from the very few "failed" trials of HCQ+Z-Pak that the regimen had only been administered to those who were already in the advanced stages of acute COVID-19 and organ damage has already set in. Of course the treatment is going to yield very poor results by that stage.![]()
Almost all of the HCQ+ZPak/Doxy combinations that had been used in treating symptomatic COVID in the early stages had been successful.
Is our suffering prolonged because it cant be "Orange Man Right"?
Absolutely...
And I believe this article has exposed yet another insidious side of the anti-Trump fanatics. There had been a few "failed" trials of hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin that were specifically "documented" by the mainstream media in order to discredit President Trump's claims, and the claims of the doctors who HAD reported success using that particular treatment regimen... Turns out, those "failed" trials involved giving the combination only to the patients who were already in the late stages of advanced COVID-19... Stages at which no medication will do any benefit.![]()
Think about syphilis. The spirochete organism that causes syphilis is EASILY killed by a single injection of penicillin. However, once syphilis has advanced to the neurological stages, it cannot be cured or treated. Therefore, if somebody wanted to "discredit" the use of penicillin in treating syphilis, all they have to do is to run a "trial" in which penicillin is only used on late stage sufferers of the disease, thus intentionally creating the "poor" results that they desire.![]()
Another reason why the liberal/"progressive left" IS the real enemy of the progress of civilization in this day and age. Just like how the Ottoman Turks had been to Christendom from the 1300's to the 1700's.
I find it interesting the Michigan Democrat state politician that was failing, prevented from getting a hydro/Zpac by the governors edict, yet when she demanded it, was feeling better in two hours.
Heard this morning our problem with this treatment if it goes mainstream is that India controls the supply of ZPac and they are refusing to export right now.
Our supply may not be sufficient.
Who needs domestic production?
I have seen this posted in multiple places. The author admits to not being a doctor and provides no additional information that would qualify him/her as an authority on this topic. I would be quite skeptical of this information until it is confirmed by multiple authorities on the subject.
Thank, brother. Was a Corpsman. Loved taking care of my Marines. Learned a lot and did fun, and not-so-fun, things and stuff in assorted countries.Bacterial and viral infections are the equivalent of comparing apples (bacteria) to a wingnut (viruses)... but sometimes you can find them in the same room. In instances of COVID-19 there have anecdotal reports from ER docs that there is nearly a 50% cohabitation of certain bacterial infections alongside the presence of COVID-19. In certain cases of infection, it's basically a strong correlation that if you have one type of bacterial infection, you're going also going to pop for COVID-19 in the near future (if you haven't already), because of how viruses infect/replicate/disperse.
Again, like @clcustom1911 said, early/aggressive detection/treatment of a presumptive issue typically yields great results, and if it doesn't, then there's the medical equivalent of DOPE to problem solve off of (tests, drug reactions, vitals etc.). This is a pretty time/resource intensive process; once we start seeing volume, adequately getting positive results becomes more difficult, and not only more difficult, but more logistically tasking. We have the brainpower to fight this virus and win - we need the mindset and leadership attributes that many of us so readily espouse to be applied in a time of need - that time of need is RIGHT NOW, actually, it was over two months ago. Sounds like @clcustom1911 was (or is) a hell of a Corpsman who could hold his own and teach/show all of us a thing or two about decisive leadership under stress.
Because this seems to have swung super political, I'm out at this point. I'm in the solutions game and frankly don't care who is righter-or wronger when someone with too much time on their hands tries to turn this crisis into a political pissing match at the expense of the American population. In the end, if they have a solution that saves lives, particularly American ones at this point. I don't have time for finger pointing and political lack of leadership on any side. I do have time for freedom and liberty-loving people wherever they may be, and graceful performance under stress-wherever it may be found.
Let's as an American population writ-large stop pointing the finger and being petty, and get work done.
wrong, they r shipping to us as we speak.I find it interesting the Michigan Democrat state politician that was failing, prevented from getting a hydro/Zpac by the governors edict, yet when she demanded it, was feeling better in two hours.
Heard this morning our problem with this treatment if it goes mainstream is that India controls the supply of ZPac and they are refusing to export right now.
Our supply may not be sufficient.
Who needs domestic production?
wrong, they r shipping to us as we speak.
All anecdotal.
DING DINGBasically cyanide poisoning... Without the actual cyanide.
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All Info - H.R.748 - 116th Congress (2019-2020): CARES Act
All Info for H.R.748 - 116th Congress (2019-2020): CARES Actwww.congress.gov
That's an excellent read. I'm no doctor, but I've been doing the paramedic and anatomy/physiology thing since I was in high school (2001).
The one thing it missed was when your organs go hypoxic, they start producing their own metabolic byproducts which eventually cause your body's pH to swing acidic, and your blood cells are needed to get oxygen, but they can't because the COVID fucked 'em.... viscous cycle which ends up in something called MODS, Multiple Organ Dysfunction Syndrome and shit starts shutting down. No bueno.
All of that article makes sense.
Not only does high pressure likely harm lungs, but it also puts pressure against the heart, causing reduced cardiac output... not a good thing when your system is being taxed trying to circulate more blood than normal combating a virus, and amped up metabolic processes.![]()
NYC doctor says high ventilator settings damage coronavirus patients’ lungs
A Brooklyn doctor is warning that critically ill coronavirus patients are being inadvertently harmed by the very same breathing machines being used to keep them alive. In a video posted on YouTube,…nypost.com
Not only does high pressure likely harm lungs, but it also puts pressure against the heart, causing reduced cardiac output... not a good thing when your system is being taxed trying to circulate more blood than normal combating a virus, and amped up metabolic processes.
Its give and take. Risk v benefit. I'm not a respiratory therapist or doctor, just a paramedic that likes to shootAnd if it stresses the heart, and the highest reported comorbiditie at 54% (todays AL stat), is cardiovascular disease, what does that reasonably support ?
To uneducated me, it seems like adding to the risk or speeding up the process to cardiac failure.
Your educated thought ?
I don't know if this info has been already posted and i apologize if it has, found it interesting. I think China is in deep shit with this. A lot of reading
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