From what I have researched it is my understanding that these are just a coating and I understand there is nothing really “magical” about them. I have read that ease of cleaning is well, easier but my main question is what is the difference in the Ion Bond vs the Nickel Boron? I couldn’t find much information on the Ion Bond. I am wanting something above basic phosphate bcg and with so many out here I have found one in Ion Bond and several in the Nickel Boron. Have never ran any of these just basic milspec bcg. Thanks for any insight on this.
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Ion Bond vs Nickel Boron
- Thread starter BamaBrad
- Start date
I believe Ion Bond is a DLC (diamond like coating) with some pretty cool properties.
I've used parkerized, nitrided, hard chromed and nickel boron coated BCGs.
Beside the parkerized BCGs, all of the others are pretty similar in how they run and clean up. But I use oil and Fail Zero's claim was that their nickel boron could run dry.
I don't think Ion Bond would be a whole lot better than nitride or nickel boron and I probably wouldn't run it dry so I don't think it would do much for me.
I have thought about trying a DLC coated knife blade where I think the advantages might show up in use but it's not something I'm rushing out to spend money on.
I've used parkerized, nitrided, hard chromed and nickel boron coated BCGs.
Beside the parkerized BCGs, all of the others are pretty similar in how they run and clean up. But I use oil and Fail Zero's claim was that their nickel boron could run dry.
I don't think Ion Bond would be a whole lot better than nitride or nickel boron and I probably wouldn't run it dry so I don't think it would do much for me.
I have thought about trying a DLC coated knife blade where I think the advantages might show up in use but it's not something I'm rushing out to spend money on.
Ionbond/DLC is a coating/heat treat of sorts. It’s usually applied and uses heat to bond it to the surface of which it’s being applied. It’s only a few microns thick and does not effect clearances.
DLC is also pourous and claims to retain oil in it once lubricated.
I prefer DLC over most coatings because it still offers an increase in Rockwell hardness, it’s slick, and wears well. I would put it at the top of the list.
DLC is also pourous and claims to retain oil in it once lubricated.
I prefer DLC over most coatings because it still offers an increase in Rockwell hardness, it’s slick, and wears well. I would put it at the top of the list.
I try to spend a little extra to upgrade my guns.
The first nitrided BCG I bought was a JP LR308 style and that was during Obamamania when it was only about a $50 upgrade over a parkerized DPMS which was much harder to find.
Since then I've done the same, a few bucks here and there (usually less than $20 extra) to get nitride or nickel boron because it's nice to clean them with just a little solvent and a wipe with a rag.
DLC sounds like a great coating but nitride and nickel boron are so nice, I wonder how much better it could be.
Ion Bond does not seem like an inexpensive upgrade so I won't be trying it until I have a very good reason or I find a coated BCG really cheap.
I doubt Ion Bond is some type of miracle cure because there is nothing wrong with nitride and there is nothing wrong with parkerized beside the fact that they get kind of grungy after 2-300 rounds.
The first nitrided BCG I bought was a JP LR308 style and that was during Obamamania when it was only about a $50 upgrade over a parkerized DPMS which was much harder to find.
Since then I've done the same, a few bucks here and there (usually less than $20 extra) to get nitride or nickel boron because it's nice to clean them with just a little solvent and a wipe with a rag.
DLC sounds like a great coating but nitride and nickel boron are so nice, I wonder how much better it could be.
Ion Bond does not seem like an inexpensive upgrade so I won't be trying it until I have a very good reason or I find a coated BCG really cheap.
I doubt Ion Bond is some type of miracle cure because there is nothing wrong with nitride and there is nothing wrong with parkerized beside the fact that they get kind of grungy after 2-300 rounds.
Nitride is a a treatment, that is all. The black color is a byproduct and it wears very quickly, by the he metal is still treated. It does offer some benefits as to corrosion and harness but is not considered a coating. Ion bond is a coating and wears extremely well. It increases Rockwell harndess as well and offers a lubricious properties.
It’s not a miracle coating but that fact that it bonds to the metal without creating clearance issues, is where it becomes superior.
It’s my preferred choice for BCG’s, actions, and small internal parts.
The fact that nitride is a treatment is what makes it good. The nitride atoms diffuse through the steel surface to make the surface of the part a hard shell. It doesn't wear off quickly because it becomes a part of the steel. It also is done without creating clearance issues.
Nickel boron is a plating that feels slick as snot. You might be able to chip it or wear it off but mine are holding up fine.
Hard chrome doesn't feel as slick as nickel boron but it's holding up fine too. Hard chrome probably is slicker than nitride but the difference isn't huge.
DLC might have a higher surface hardness but I bet the case isn't as thick.
When the difference between a nitride finish and DLC effects the operation of a gun, you would probably have solid reasons why one or the other won't work. In this case all of them work so I fail to see why anyone should pay more than a small premium to try Ion Bond but if you like spending money, be my guest.
One company that uses Ion Bond a lot is American Rifle Company. They coat their Mausingfield action but their new Nucleus is nitrided. It's certainly a cost saving measure but the reason why the Mausingfield isn't nitrided is probably that Ted was worried about the process effecting the heat treat of the action. Since the Mausingfield is their premium action, I bet they will stick with Ion Bond to differentiate it but I bet Ted would have nitrided it if he knew then what he knows now.
I have quite a few different finishes on
bcg 's. Nickel boron is a little easier to clean than phosphate. Nitride seems about the same as nickel boron as far as cleaning and smoothness. Nickel boron does vary between manufacturers as far as slickness and clean up in my experience. My wmd bolt is easier to clean than my fail zero's. I have a DLC coated F1 bcg that is absolutely amazing. It runs like it's on ball bearings and the carbon wipes off with a paper towel. I have about 2000 reds through it and there isnt a single wear mark. If money is no object, DLC is the shit, but the others work just fine.
bcg 's. Nickel boron is a little easier to clean than phosphate. Nitride seems about the same as nickel boron as far as cleaning and smoothness. Nickel boron does vary between manufacturers as far as slickness and clean up in my experience. My wmd bolt is easier to clean than my fail zero's. I have a DLC coated F1 bcg that is absolutely amazing. It runs like it's on ball bearings and the carbon wipes off with a paper towel. I have about 2000 reds through it and there isnt a single wear mark. If money is no object, DLC is the shit, but the others work just fine.
wow. And, I thought opinions on scopes was tough here.
They are all good. DLC = Ionbonding, and is superior. In fact, when drilling through a barrel to attach a gas block, it is so hard, you can break a drill.
If you want the best BCG, DLC is the way to go. But, I have inspected pretty average bolt carriers and seldom found a failure in 10k rounds. Bolts, a little different, but still, the number of bolt failures in 3k rounds is remote.
Some of this is how many angels can dance on the head of a pin. How good is great. Are you plinking, or does your life depend upon it? Anything other than the latter, an $85 BCG will do you fine for many years.
They are all good. DLC = Ionbonding, and is superior. In fact, when drilling through a barrel to attach a gas block, it is so hard, you can break a drill.
If you want the best BCG, DLC is the way to go. But, I have inspected pretty average bolt carriers and seldom found a failure in 10k rounds. Bolts, a little different, but still, the number of bolt failures in 3k rounds is remote.
Some of this is how many angels can dance on the head of a pin. How good is great. Are you plinking, or does your life depend upon it? Anything other than the latter, an $85 BCG will do you fine for many years.
Nickel boron will wear, which is not necessarily a bad thing. I bought my wmd in 2013 during the craze. I've since put 10k+ through it on a DMR rifle. It is the smoothest cycling carrier I have by far.
The bearing surfaces have obvious wear on them and the rest of the carrier has stained to near black now. But it runs very smoothly.
The bearing surfaces have obvious wear on them and the rest of the carrier has stained to near black now. But it runs very smoothly.
There are certain applications where both work great, and where both work horrible(DLC vs Nitride).
DLC is applied at roughly 200 degrees celcius, and as such, won't affect most heat treated steels. Nitride on the other hand, is done at 530 degrees celcius, and will destroy most heat treats in common steels used in the industry.
Let's take a 9310 bolt for example and look at what will happen to it using each method.
DLC-The case hardening and core hardness will remain fully intact. You will be adding a very thin coating of an amorphous carbon that not only repairs itself to some extent, but holds onto oil quite well. It is extremely hard, just short of the hardness of diamonds, but it is extremely thin. This coating works great in all tribological environments, such as it would be used in a bolt carrier. The caveat with this coating is that it is purely a line of sight coating so it won't necessarily get into all of the bores perfectly. Due to it's amorphous structure, it is also quite good at corrosion protection where the coating is. Adhesion of this is also extremely tough and will never chip. However, due to the thin nature of it, it can be cut through and removed. In a normal use situation, this would never happen. This coating can be used on most any conductive metal.
Nitride/H&M/QPQ- If this is done on a case hardened 9310 bolt, not only will the case hardening be destroy, but the core hardness will drop as well. This is due to the extreme temperature used during the salt bath process. The nitrided surface is significantly more hard, but 7 times thinner than a standard case hardened bolt. The surface conversion process actually does add a little bit of dimension to all surfaces, but not enough to generally affect anything negatively. This is also not a line of sight process so all surfaces are "coated". It's corrosion resistance is phenominal, and even better when oiled. This can be a great "coating" if used on the correct materials, but can destroy the incorrect materials.
DLC is applied at roughly 200 degrees celcius, and as such, won't affect most heat treated steels. Nitride on the other hand, is done at 530 degrees celcius, and will destroy most heat treats in common steels used in the industry.
Let's take a 9310 bolt for example and look at what will happen to it using each method.
DLC-The case hardening and core hardness will remain fully intact. You will be adding a very thin coating of an amorphous carbon that not only repairs itself to some extent, but holds onto oil quite well. It is extremely hard, just short of the hardness of diamonds, but it is extremely thin. This coating works great in all tribological environments, such as it would be used in a bolt carrier. The caveat with this coating is that it is purely a line of sight coating so it won't necessarily get into all of the bores perfectly. Due to it's amorphous structure, it is also quite good at corrosion protection where the coating is. Adhesion of this is also extremely tough and will never chip. However, due to the thin nature of it, it can be cut through and removed. In a normal use situation, this would never happen. This coating can be used on most any conductive metal.
Nitride/H&M/QPQ- If this is done on a case hardened 9310 bolt, not only will the case hardening be destroy, but the core hardness will drop as well. This is due to the extreme temperature used during the salt bath process. The nitrided surface is significantly more hard, but 7 times thinner than a standard case hardened bolt. The surface conversion process actually does add a little bit of dimension to all surfaces, but not enough to generally affect anything negatively. This is also not a line of sight process so all surfaces are "coated". It's corrosion resistance is phenominal, and even better when oiled. This can be a great "coating" if used on the correct materials, but can destroy the incorrect materials.
I took advantage of some Memorial Day sales to piece together a new upper.
I couldn't find exactly the BCG I needed because it is a 6.8 SPC wildcat but I was able to find a deal on a Nickel Boron LWRC bolt and then I went looking for a BCG to buy so I would just have a spare 5.56 bolt (never a bad thing).
I went to my go-to BCG source WC Armory to try to find a cheap Toolcraft BCG, hopefully in Nickel Boron. What I found there was that unlike previous visits, both Nickel Boron and Ion Bond BCGs were on sale and although the Ion Bond had a higher retail price, it's $99.99 sale price was actually $5 lower than the Nickel Boron BCG. I seem to recall that Nickel Boron was out of stock too.
There was SBN (Salt Bath Nitride) for $70 but I figured that $30 was not too much of a premium and I should check out Ion Bond.
It just arrived today.
First impression, it feels slick but not entirely smooth, kind of like a new Teflon coated frying pan with a little tooth to it.
In contrast, my SBN BCG from Toolcraft feels slick and smooth, like it was given a high polish. If their SBN process is a QPQ nitro carburizing, the P explains the smooth surface. It had a light coating of oil which may explain the slick feeling.
Nickel boron feels slick and smooth, even when dry.
Maybe that slick but not super smooth surface retains oil or something?
I'm sure it will work just fine, I'm not sure I'll notice any difference but I'll have to try and see.
I couldn't find exactly the BCG I needed because it is a 6.8 SPC wildcat but I was able to find a deal on a Nickel Boron LWRC bolt and then I went looking for a BCG to buy so I would just have a spare 5.56 bolt (never a bad thing).
I went to my go-to BCG source WC Armory to try to find a cheap Toolcraft BCG, hopefully in Nickel Boron. What I found there was that unlike previous visits, both Nickel Boron and Ion Bond BCGs were on sale and although the Ion Bond had a higher retail price, it's $99.99 sale price was actually $5 lower than the Nickel Boron BCG. I seem to recall that Nickel Boron was out of stock too.
There was SBN (Salt Bath Nitride) for $70 but I figured that $30 was not too much of a premium and I should check out Ion Bond.
It just arrived today.
First impression, it feels slick but not entirely smooth, kind of like a new Teflon coated frying pan with a little tooth to it.
In contrast, my SBN BCG from Toolcraft feels slick and smooth, like it was given a high polish. If their SBN process is a QPQ nitro carburizing, the P explains the smooth surface. It had a light coating of oil which may explain the slick feeling.
Nickel boron feels slick and smooth, even when dry.
Maybe that slick but not super smooth surface retains oil or something?
I'm sure it will work just fine, I'm not sure I'll notice any difference but I'll have to try and see.
