IOR Valdada (still bad?)

[blksno]

Has anyone considered and avoided, or purchased and regretted IOR's tactical line of optics because of the reticles offered?
I know the brand, and Val have had issues in the past, and that may or may not be rectified, but my specific question today is regarding their reticles.

To preface this, I have had and currently have some great glass in my stable, Tangent, Razor II, Razor III, MK5, ATACR and the 5-42 March High Master....BUT
I keep wanting to pull the trigger on some offerings from IOR... most notably

3-25X56 40MM FFP RANGER​

9-36X56 40MM PATRIOT​

5.8-40X56 40MM CRUSADER​

However, their website is poor (wrong photos for the wrong optic description), their info and specs on the reticles they do offer is lack luster, and the pictures and descriptions of the reticles are just down right BAD, or not even shown.

This MP8 Extreme X1 appears to be their pinnacle...but the image associated with it is poor at best when you compare it to the full detail and actual vector display provided by most manufacturers like Nightforce with their MilXT

Anyone care to voice their opinions? I've even gone as far as to contact Valdada and request photos through the optic to get an actual representation of the reticle, but was denied.
I'm to the point where I'm actually designing (finalizing) my own reticle. (i was a designer in college) Since they build them to order anyway...I'm wondering if they would even entertain a custom for me.

Apparently they have a GAP reticle as well...(not even listed on their link of available reticles) but the jpeg they use to showcase it is washed out and hard to read.

The Nightforce Mil-XT for comparison. All reticle details are well displayed on the website...as anyone would expect from a premier manufacturer like NF.

 

[diverdon]

You could always buy one and shoot a few comps and let us know.

 

[deersniper]

To preface this, I have had and currently have some great glass in my stable, Tangent, Razor II, Razor III, MK5, ATACR and the 5-42 March High Master....BUT
I keep wanting to pull the trigger on some offerings from IOR... most notably

Just join the ZCO MPCT3 MasteRace

 

[blksno]

Just join the ZCO MPCT3 MasteRace

The more I see it the less I hate it.

 

[deersniper]

The more I see it the less I hate it.

just get the 3x if you don’t like the Ranging Uterus

Circles are awesome. Makes it easy to quickly distinguish mil lines while not obscuring

 

[blksno]

just get the 3x if you don’t like the Ranging Uterus

Circles are awesome. Makes it easy to quickly distinguish mil lines while not obscuring

 

[W54/XM-388]

Has anyone considered and avoided, or purchased and regretted IOR's tactical line of optics because of the reticles offered?
I know the brand, and Val have had issues in the past, and that may or may not be rectified, but my specific question today is regarding their reticles.

To preface this, I have had and currently have some great glass in my stable, Tangent, Razor II, Razor III, MK5, ATACR and the 5-42 March High Master....BUT
I keep wanting to pull the trigger on some offerings from IOR... most notably

3-25X56 40MM FFP RANGER​

9-36X56 40MM PATRIOT​

5.8-40X56 40MM CRUSADER​

However, their website is poor (wrong photos for the wrong optic description), their info and specs on the reticles they do offer is lack luster, and the pictures and descriptions of the reticles are just down right BAD, or not even shown.

This MP8 Extreme X1 appears to be their pinnacle...but the image associated with it is poor at best when you compare it to the full detail and actual vector display provided by most manufacturers like Nightforce with their MilXT

Anyone care to voice their opinions? I've even gone as far as to contact Valdada and request photos through the optic to get an actual representation of the reticle, but was denied.
I'm to the point where I'm actually designing (finalizing) my own reticle. (i was a designer in college) Since they build them to order anyway...I'm wondering if they would even entertain a custom for me.

Apparently they have a GAP reticle as well...(not even listed on their link of available reticles) but the jpeg they use to showcase it is washed out and hard to read.

The Nightforce Mil-XT for comparison. All reticle details are well displayed on the website...as anyone would expect from a premier manufacturer like NF.

On the off chance you are not one of Val's shills, I'm going to say you have wandered into the really wrong place to be asking about IOR scopes.

That being said, if you already have TT and March scopes, why would you even be considering anything made by IOR / Val?

Between TT, ZCO, S&B and Vortex as well as a few other high end brands, you would have to be crazy picky to not be able to find a reticle that works for you, out of the dozens of options.

If you have as many scopes as you say you have, have you actually gone out and shot them enough to know you actually would be shooting better with something different for the reticle? Especially under any kind of time or movement pressure, is some slight difference in the lines going to make your shooting better?

That being said, for the money IOR or Val want for their scopes, it seems to be a no brainer to get something from a much better brand.
I'd take the higher end Vortex stuff any day over anything IOR / Val And if you have TT money then WTF would you be slumming it with an IOR / Val scope for, at least stick in the TT / ZCO / S&B or Vortex range and keep your dignity.

 

[blksno]

On the off chance you are not one of Val's shills, I'm going to say you have wandered into the really wrong place to be asking about IOR scopes.

That being said, if you already have TT and March scopes, why would you even be considering anything made by IOR / Val?

Between TT, ZCO, S&B and Vortex as well as a few other high end brands, you would have to be crazy picky to not be able to find a reticle that works for you, out of the dozens of options.

If you have as many scopes as you say you have, have you actually gone out and shot them enough to know you actually would be shooting better with something different for the reticle? Especially under any kind of time or movement pressure, is some slight difference in the lines going to make your shooting better?

That being said, for the money IOR or Val want for their scopes, it seems to be a no brainer to get something from a much better brand.
I'd take the higher end Vortex stuff any day over anything IOR / Val And if you have TT money then WTF would you be slumming it with an IOR / Val scope for, at least stick in the TT / ZCO / S&B or Vortex range and keep your dignity.

To be clear, I don't give two shits as what a collective group of people that haven't experienced something, think about me asking about someelse's.
You personally got beef with a brand, that's fine. Your experience is bad. That's fine. I've been here for years and I've read it all.

Of all the optics I've used, just about everyone has an option I personally feel is nearly perfect.

The TT Gen3XR has a floating dot that's too heavy IMO. The Fine is a nice upgrade but they could have done Ssooooo much better all around. I sold my TT to replace with a FDE in Gen3XRFine...but for essentially a 1500 price increase for no mechanical difference, a new color and a more fine floating dot. I'll wait for more improvement.

With March, the FML-TR1 could be better, but it's what I chose. I'd love to see more options from them.
The MilXT is top for me in the NF line.
The EBR-7d is top for in the Vortex line.
Other than those, I lean strongly toward the H59 from anyone that offers it. If I'd have chosen the H59 in my TT from the start, I'd probably still have it.
I'm sure you see a pattern there.

Not interested in ZCO at the moment because I'm not particularly fond of their reticle. There are things about their design I love and I used aspects in my own...circles is not one of them.
Not interested in Kahles, never liked the SKMR or AMR.

If you're going to say that as of 2022, they (ior) have a slury of mechanical defects, optical issues and poor quality...then that's all I need to know.
That's why you don't use a funeral parlor that uses cheap toilet paper. Cut corners in one place, best bet they cut corners in another.

It won't surprise me, considering the attention they put into the Val website...but that's not what I have read elsewhere from people that currently have them.
Which brings us back full circle.
As someone else suggested...I would probably have been a test mule by now, but I can't get over how shitty their reticle are.

 

[deersniper]

I vote shill

 

[fdkay]

My first decent scope was an IOR 3-18 with the basic MP 8 reticle.
I have always liked that scope, though it doesn't get much use anymore.
I've never had a mechanical issue with it.
Val is an interesting character, sometimes he answers your email, sometimes he doesn’t.
IOR could certainly use a better ambassador here in the states.
They make several models I'm interested in, however, they have gone up in price so much, that I won't deal with the wishy-washy CS from Val.
Especially when there are optics like the Gen iii vortex and the S8 sightron.

 

[matt452326]

I have the crusader f1 in mil with the extreme reticle its on my GA precision hospitaller with the ai ax chasis v2 action and 29in bartlein 338 lapua and i love it the 40mm tube is great the glass is super clear and clean made repeated shots out to a mile hitting an 18in steel plate. Made me get the patriot which is also super clean and bright. The only funny thing is that when you hit right you turn your windage right not left i was told thats how the European scopes work. Reticles are accurate and precise. Mine have been i only can attest to my scopes. Check out darn fine shot you can get the same scope for cheaper val isnt the only game in town.

Matt

 

[Txhillbilly]

I've had a Recon for years and it's one of my favorite scopes. I like the reticle, it tracks perfectly, and I like the glass better than my PMII's. I don't own any ZCO or TT scopes, so I can't compare to those, but the IOR Recon does what I need it to do.

 

[fdkay]

Good video of the reticle here.

 

[blksno]

On the off chance you are not one of Val's shills, I'm going to say you have wandered into the really wrong place to be asking about IOR scopes.

If you have as many scopes as you say you have, have you actually gone out and shot them enough to know you actually would be shooting better with something different for the reticle? Especially under any kind of time or movement pressure, is some slight difference in the lines going to make your shooting better?

Well, since this seems to be a concern here, whenever this comes up. Here's my "shill" card...for whatever it's worth.
Here's what I currently have on the shelf. And most of them are on the shelf, because I wanted to try something that was different than what I currently had. Generally speaking, I don't feel the need to validate my opinion, but work has been slow, and I've been meaning to take some pictures anyway.

March 5-42 High Master and Gen2 Razor with the EBR-7C

5-25 Vudu with H59 and Bushy LRTS

Gen3 Razor with EBR-7D and Mk5 7-35 with H59

and the TT Gen3XR before I sold it. Had high hopes for the Gen3XR Fine...but hard to justify $1000 price bump for the floating dot to be the only difference.

You could always buy one and shoot a few comps and let us know.

Well, that's what I decided to do.
This is NOT by any means, an in-depth review of any kind. It's more of a general, first impression to evaluate things I would like, things I could learn to live, things I could deal with, and things I didn't like.

I was initially suspicious when I could feel the weight of the optic inside the factory IOR box shift fore and aft and when I opened the box, I could see why.

It's rare, albeit unheard of, to have a scope over $1000 to not have some level of foam insert to prevent shifting. This did not.
The caps secured the front and back and surely prevent damage, but the optic itself is simply wrapped in bubble wrap and the included 40mm rings are just hanging out on the end. The ocular end has an extra piece of bubble wrap on the tube and the shade is wrapped in paper, and slid over it. Presumably to reduce the size of the box needed to package everything.
A deal breaker? No...but we're not off to a good start.

Included for the "manual" were these three pages that include the break down of scope specs, directions on how to use the optic and the MIL Reticle...which, on the zoomed in portion, you can't read. A fourth for warranty registration and transfers was not photographed.
A deal breaker? Still no, but not ideal.

First impressions are fairly good. Turret has good clicks, but they are not locking, and they turn very very easy. Too easy IMO, for not locking.
The good impression of the elevation turret is lost by the windage turret. It's bad. Feels like it's made by a completely different company. Soft, mushy and not distinct at all.
Fast focus eye piece does what it's suppose to, but again, it turns very easy, and doesn't lock. If I were to attach scope caps, that may prevent them from getting bumped...maybe.

Illumination is the only feature on the left side, and while I didn't check it for daylight brightness...I'd doubt it. Again, not a deal breaker.
I feel like the majority of high end optic companies that include illumination, have an "off" setting between each of the 11 power settings. This does not.
One major factor that I feel eliminates this from being truly useful in PRS style shooting is the parallax. It works VERY well where it is, and I have heard reports that having it forward on the objective helps with brightness and clarity but it's difficult to reach when your behind the rifle.
Interestingly, there are only about 10°-15° of rotation needed for 100m to infinity, so putting a cat tail up front and on the left side might actually make this work well in centerfire...
BUT the benefit of being able to parallax down to 7m is lost by needing to rotate 300°+ from 7-50m which makes it virtually useless in NRL22. It's just too difficult to manipulate on the clock.

Setting the Zero and Zero Stop is simple enough. Very similar to the old Leupold Mk6 where the ring itself is free to spin. Downside is that it still takes 3 screws to loosen in order to freely rotate the bottom ring.
ALSO, as you can see, the paint in the elevation turret was smeared, presumably at the factory when the engraving was done, and it was never fixed.

The secondary point of impact indicator is an interesting idea that would benifit from using the same 1.5m key that the zero and zero stop set screws use. The flat screw that it currently has is just a dumb choice. Ideally, especially for PRS style shooting...a locking throw lever that could be flipped to release, and closed to engage the secondary point would have been ideal.
Example on a PRS stage where you need 2.3 mil for target one, and 5.1 mil for target 2 doesn't make much sense to dig out a separate tool to set when it would be different 20 minutes later at stage 2....but if it was on a quick set throw lever. It could be set on the fly.
I don't remember if the zero was between the hashes when I took it out of the box, I don't think it was. I am fairly sure that after I zeroed it, i just didn't have it perfectly lined up when I locked the ring down.

 

[Baron23]

If they can't maintain a decent website with the normal pertinent info, why do you think they will make a decent scope. Seriously, mate.

Carry on.

 

[blksno]

Andy lastly...the reticle. The reason for the post.
Is it usable? Yes.
The hash marks are a little longer than I'm used to (1 Mil, 1/2 Mil and 1/4 Mil from what I can tell), but at least they are not overly heavy. I really have no idea how thick the lines are. I can't find any information on them.
The floating center dot appears to be 0.1 Mil which is WAY to big IMO. It's still usable but the additional dots at 1.5 and 3 mil on the windage are better....but I don't have any idea what they are either.
They are listed on the picture but I can't read them.

Does it have elements that are good? Yes.
The additional floating dots are much more refined, and the opened space on the main cross bar help to provide references while opening up the spacing...allowing it to appear less cluttered. It has far less information than most christmas tree reticles, which is a pro and a con...depending on whos looking. If you've never used one...and find something like the H59 or Tremor to be overwhelming...then this may be better for you. It's not for me.

Is it useful for what I need it for?
No.
For a little over 10 years now, I've been using a mil hash, christmas tree that is based on a .2 mil system. In fact, I'm not really aware of any others that are not.
My brain instinctively looks at this and snaps to assume the floating dots are at .5 mil, which clearly they are not.
Additionally, when my brain assumes the dots are at .5 mil...it also assumes the 2 mil hash is actually 1 mil and the dot is just in the wrong place. I think it's 2 fold. Partially because I'm used to seeing hashes at .2 and used to seeing dots at .5
Weird, but that's the way my brain reads it. Again, I think if you were a NEW shooter, with NOT EXPERIENCE using .2 mil grid systems...this may work for you.

 

[blksno]

If they can't maintain a decent website with the normal pertinent info, why do you think they will make a decent scope. Seriously, mate.

Carry on.

I'm not an expert on this, so feel free to enlighten me.

The Valdada website is trash...I agree. But he's the importer, not the manufacturer. Correct?
IOR București website has potential, but I don't speak or read Romanian and their website isn't made for Americans when they have Valdada as an importer. That is the fault of Valdada. Not IOR persay.

If IOR is making something good, and Valdada is putting it in their own shitty packaging...that's on Valdada.
It really makes me wonder about how they are made, packaged and delivered in Europe.

 

[fdkay]

Andy lastly...the reticle. The reason for the post.
Is it usable? Yes.
The hash marks are a little longer than I'm used to (1 Mil, 1/2 Mil and 1/4 Mil from what I can tell), but at least they are not overly heavy. I really have no idea how thick the lines are. I can't find any information on them.
The floating center dot appears to be 0.1 Mil which is WAY to big IMO. It's still usable but the additional dots at 1.5 and 3 mil on the windage are better....but I don't have any idea what they are either.
They are listed on the picture but I can't read them.
View attachment 7897158

Does it have elements that are good? Yes.
The additional floating dots are much more refined, and the opened space on the main cross bar help to provide references while opening up the spacing...allowing it to appear less cluttered. It has far less information than most christmas tree reticles, which is a pro and a con...depending on whos looking. If you've never used one...and find something like the H59 or Tremor to be overwhelming...then this may be better for you. It's not for me.

Is it useful for what I need it for?
No.
For a little over 10 years now, I've been using a mil hash, christmas tree that is based on a .2 mil system. In fact, I'm not really aware of any others that are not.
My brain instinctively looks at this and snaps to assume the floating dots are at .5 mil, which clearly they are not.
Additionally, when my brain assumes the dots are at .5 mil...it also assumes the 2 mil hash is actually 1 mil and the dot is just in the wrong place. I think it's 2 fold. Partially because I'm used to seeing hashes at .2 and used to seeing dots at .5
Weird, but that's the way my brain reads it. Again, I think if you were a NEW shooter, with NOT EXPERIENCE using .2 mil grid systems...this may work for you.

View attachment 7897173
View attachment 7897174
View attachment 7897175

I found that replacing the oring on the windage turret with one with a slightly smaller cross section, plus lubricating with silicone lube improves the feel. You are correct, I have a different model that is over ten years old and the windage does feel completely different than the elevation.
Harbor freight sells o ring kits

 

[hlee]

By the OPs own admission in the first post, the IOR website exhibits many hallmarks of a scam website. Picture that don’t match descriptions, etc. Do they take Zelle or Bitcoin? Sorry, a seller that can’t accurately describe their products is a hard pass.

 

[blksno]

By the OPs own admission in the first post, the IOR website exhibits many hallmarks of a scam website. Picture that don’t match descriptions, etc. Do they take Zelle or Bitcoin? Sorry, a seller that can’t accurately describe their products is a hard pass.

Let's be sure and differentiate the Valdada website is trash.

The IOR website is not. At least not from what I can tell without understanding Romanian.

 

[markwente]

Has anyone considered and avoided, or purchased and regretted IOR's tactical line of optics because of the reticles offered?
I know the brand, and Val have had issues in the past, and that may or may not be rectified, but my specific question today is regarding their reticles.

To preface this, I have had and currently have some great glass in my stable, Tangent, Razor II, Razor III, MK5, ATACR and the 5-42 March High Master....BUT
I keep wanting to pull the trigger on some offerings from IOR... most notably

3-25X56 40MM FFP RANGER​

9-36X56 40MM PATRIOT​

5.8-40X56 40MM CRUSADER​

However, their website is poor (wrong photos for the wrong optic description), their info and specs on the reticles they do offer is lack luster, and the pictures and descriptions of the reticles are just down right BAD, or not even shown.

This MP8 Extreme X1 appears to be their pinnacle...but the image associated with it is poor at best when you compare it to the full detail and actual vector display provided by most manufacturers like Nightforce with their MilXT

Anyone care to voice their opinions? I've even gone as far as to contact Valdada and request photos through the optic to get an actual representation of the reticle, but was denied.
I'm to the point where I'm actually designing (finalizing) my own reticle. (i was a designer in college) Since they build them to order anyway...I'm wondering if they would even entertain a custom for me.

Apparently they have a GAP reticle as well...(not even listed on their link of available reticles) but the jpeg they use to showcase it is washed out and hard to read.

The Nightforce Mil-XT for comparison. All reticle details are well displayed on the website...as anyone would expect from a premier manufacturer like NF.

C-Bass I don't know if you have pulled the trigger on this scope or not but they have updated alot of things. For example Midway USA and Optics Planet have old adjustment values of 1/4 moa clicks when they are all 1/8 moa clicks now. The reticle is thinner than the old scopes and really pop when you get the ocular adjustment dialed in. I purchased their 10x60 model i can go on about subtle differences that i think beat some of the other brands mentioned. If you want to know more message me. Every now and then i goto Rapid City to shoot the 1,600 yd range. Are you around there?

 

[blksno]

C-Bass I don't know if you have pulled the trigger on this scope or not but they have updated alot of things. For example Midway USA and Optics Planet have old adjustment values of 1/4 moa clicks when they are all 1/8 moa clicks now. The reticle is thinner than the old scopes and really pop when you get the ocular adjustment dialed in. I purchased their 10x60 model i can go on about subtle differences that i think beat some of the other brands mentioned. If you want to know more message me. Every now and then i goto Rapid City to shoot the 1,600 yd range. Are you around there?

You must not have noticed the post I made a few up the page, showing what I bought, the likes, and overwhelming dislikes.
To be honest, there wasn't really much positive.

 

[Rancid Coolaid]

My first decent scope was an IOR 3-18 with the basic MP 8 reticle.
I have always liked that scope, though it doesn't get much use anymore.
I've never had a mechanical issue with it.
Val is an interesting character, sometimes he answers your email, sometimes he doesn’t.
IOR could certainly use a better ambassador here in the states.
They make several models I'm interested in, however, they have gone up in price so much, that I won't deal with the wishy-washy CS from Val.
Especially when there are optics like the Gen iii vortex and the S8 sightron.

I was a proud owner of the gen1 SH-edition 3-18. They don't get much use (and even less love) because they LITERALLY ALL BROKE. I have never, before or since IOR Valdata, seen a scope come out with an almost perfect 100% failure rate. That, to me, makes IOR a truly deserved "why bother" conversation.

That said, the original MP-8 is among my favorite reticles of all time. If it were in a decent scope, I'd have a few of said scope.

 

[fdkay]

I was a proud owner of the gen1 SH-edition 3-18. They don't get much use (and even less love) because they LITERALLY ALL BROKE. I have never, before or since IOR Valdata, seen a scope come out with an almost perfect 100% failure rate. That, to me, makes IOR a truly deserved "why bother" conversation.

That said, the original MP-8 is among my favorite reticles of all time. If it were in a decent scope, I'd have a few of said scope.

The gen 4 scopes were pretty reliable.
I loved the reticle and the glass.
I wouldn't recommend them to anyone on this side of the pond. In Europe, where they could be serviced, if required, they are a more viable option.

 

[3GunApprentice]

I own a IOR Valdada Recon 4-28x50 with the MP-8 Xtreme X1 illuminated center dot reticle. It does everything that I have asked from it. I have no experience with the warranty service as I have had no need.

 

[acudaowner]

love mine

 

[DeathBeforeDismount]

This thread is like asking if I should stick my dick in the garbage disposal.

Everyone with an IQ above Room Temp says No.

OP says, Hold my beer.

Look at the CA on the glass. How much was this piece of shit again?

 

[flashpointACAT]

I answer from Barcelona, I own a Minox ZP5 5-25, it uses MR4 reticle, I love flotant central point. I own to Zeiss, NF and last one I bought: IOR 3-25X with Mp8 reticle. First of all, Ior reticle has a too big central point. At 15X or above is useless.
The optic quality is good, but don t has the value +2k€, turrets has a cheap tactil and doesnt look tought. Mine already properly works, but I m in doubt about the future...
Ior is a cheap mechanical turret mounted on a tube whith actually Schott glasses...but Schott has different types of glass and different qualiites too. IOR don t uses Fluorite Schott glass...like a Zeiss LRS S5.
Let me advice you: NEVER spend money on a IOR, very bad reticle , the best is the optical area, but isnt at level of Minox ZP5 by far.

I read opinions on forums like this. I didn t take advices and experience´s community. And here I am and mine regrets.

The legend is true.

 

[flashpointACAT]

And I want add, youtuber Cyclops is a payed opinion. Rumania isnt a piece of European technology...

 

[redneckbmxer24]

I thought it was going to be the ghost of phillip reviving this thread when I saw it.