Is benchsource the best flame annealer?

[Jmccracken1214]

Wanting a new annealer and can’t bring myself to spend the $ on an AMp and have read some iffy stories on Annie and it taking 4-6 months to get them...

So I’m giving into the idea of going back to a flame annealer. Is the benchmark the better of the choice in that field or should I just order the Annie for about the same money?

 

[orkan]

Yes, Bench Source is the best flame annealer.

Don't forget a swirl flame torch for it: https://amzn.to/3zhRwLj

Then you can drop back to 1 torch instead of two, and run a remote bottle with hose. Much better setup.

 

[proff49]

I use 2 "standard" torches (with a grill tank) to reduce the time a little. What is the benefit of the swirl torch.

 

[orkan]

I use 2 "standard" torches (with a grill tank) to reduce the time a little. What is the benefit of the swirl torch.

From the Bernzomatic website:
Also known as Turbo, Tornado or Vortex Flame. A pencil or general purpose flame has a primary and secondary flame, just like a candle. The swirl flame holder acts like a tornado, creating a vortex to mix the primary and secondary flames together. This does two things; it creates a smaller and tighter flame, therefore producing a higher heat concentration on the work piece, and secondly, the gas that is wasted in the secondary flame is now mixed into the primary flame so it more efficiently uses fuel. This flame is good for most applications except when a very low heat intensity is required.

As the graphic indicates, and as I said previously... it allows you to drop back to 1 torch, rather than 2, because the swirl flame is more efficiently burning hotter and uniformly heating the brass all over, rather than in a single pencil point. This results in a more uniform overall control of the annealing temps and times.

One swirl flame torch is faster and more uniform than two pencil torches.

Secondary benefits are self evident. 1 bottle instead of 2. Less overall physical space taken up. Easier time adapting to 20lb bottle due to the hose and valve setup on the torch I linked above. Less work when setting up the torch on the unit, as you only have 1 flame to position, rather than two... so it's faster to setup for multiple cartridges.

 

[Jmccracken1214]

Thanks for the torch link, if I end up with a bench source over the Annie, I’ll def. Pick one up

 

[straightshooter1]

+1 on the swirl flame torch. It works well for me on my old Annealeez.

 

[Oryx]

The biggest drawback to the Bench source is the case capacity and constant reloading. For small jobs, no biggie. For large jobs, no bueno .... unless you enjoy standing there feeding it, waiting, feeing, waiting, feeding ....etc.

Other than that I love it

 

[Jmccracken1214]

The biggest drawback to the Bench source is the case capacity and constant reloading. For small jobs, no biggie. For large jobs, no bueno .... unless you enjoy standing there feeding it, waiting, feeing, waiting, feeding ....etc.

Other than that I love it

I thought of that also, comparing to the annealeez I used to run.
In all honesty, I’ll probably end up with the Annie, and build a cheap table with trap door for my brass. Seems like the most consistent way, without spending $1695 on the amp and shell holders

 

[supercorndogs]

I like my Giruad. Fill the hopper and let it go.

 

[Baddog 0302]

Found this The UGLY Anneal er, inserts for most all cases, and Amazon free shipping, Alum wheels, only thing missing is the digital rpm,speed monitor , seams like it gets good reviews

 

[hafejd30]

I love my benchsource. I just run dual torches. I do want an AMP. But just because I want it. Not because I’m unhappy with my bench source

 

[Dough300]

For ease of use the AMP is the one, no matter the price...
Slickest thing ever...

 

[Jmccracken1214]

I remembered that Ill need new tires for my truck this year, and tires prices are stupid right now....

Damn, might have to go back to the annealeez for a while.

 

[acudaowner]

if it's the one you want to buy and use sure go with it it's the best maybe lol

 

[rmfield]

The Bench Source annealer has been great for me for quite a few years. Two regular pencil torches fed off BBQ type bottle. Local propane place made up the tubing for two torches. I've got a swirl type torch I use for Cu plumbing, but I don't think that kind of torch would give me the kind of control I want annealing brass - too much heat makes the timing much more critical. Typically, I set up for 3.5 - 4.5 seconds in the flames of the two pencil torches and am very happy with the results. I could set the torches to go faster, but I don't want to. I do 400 cases in 30 minutes or so + 10 minutes of set-up and that's just fine.

 

[BFGDC]

Found this The UGLY Anneal er, inserts for most all cases, and Amazon free shipping, Alum wheels, only thing missing is the digital rpm,speed monitor , seams like it gets good reviews

Ugly is an excellent machine. Also check out Burstfire

 

[Yondering]

Aluminum heats up really fast, and transfers heat really well. I don't want aluminum wheels on my annealer for that reason; I'm trying to keep the case head cool, not heat it up in a hot wheel and generate differences between case #1 and case #400 in a batch.

 

[BFGDC]

Valid point. Sort of.

On Ugly it’s metal on metal. Aluminum with Diamond dust on top of nickel plating from what I can tell.

Burstfire the brass never touches the aluminum wheel. No heat conductivity there.

 

[orkan]

The biggest drawback to the Bench source is the case capacity and constant reloading. For small jobs, no biggie. For large jobs, no bueno .... unless you enjoy standing there feeding it, waiting, feeing, waiting, feeding ....etc.

Other than that I love it

Case Feeder.

 

[DeathBeforeDismount]

If you can afford it nothing comes close to the AMP. After dicking with various flame annealers over the years, its night and day.

People who can afford a $600 primer seater can afford a $1600 Annealer.

 

[Oryx]

Case Feeder.

please post a link to a case feeder for the bench source ... I have never seen one

 

[orkan]

please post a link to a case feeder for the bench source ... I have never seen one

Bench source doesn't sell a case feeder for it. Virtually any case feeder can be adapted to it.

 

[6.5SH]

Really not too much to adapting one:

Dillon XL-650 – Case Feeder Adapter Kit | SASSYBrass

 

[Jmccracken1214]

Doesn’t seem worth it to me to get that. I don’t anneal my 223 range brass, and usually only annealing 100-200 cases at a time anyways. Shouldn’t take long on the BS to do it by hand

 

[cat-mechanic]

Ugly is an excellent machine. Also check out Burstfire

I looked at Burstfire. He says in his video that if you use the big 20 pound propane bottles, it could rupture the hose. If he is cheaping out on the hose so much that he is worried about it rupturing, then how cheap is he making the machine?

Also, looks like Burstfire is having shipping issues, They are all stuck on a boat because of the strikes at the docks. So they are made in china or somewhere else.

At least Annealeaz is US made. I am unsure of where the Ugly annealer is made.

 

[BFGDC]

I looked at Burstfire. He says in his video that if you use the big 20 pound propane bottles, it could rupture the hose. If he is cheaping out on the hose so much that he is worried about it rupturing, then how cheap is he making the machine?

Also, looks like Burstfire is having shipping issues, They are all stuck on a boat because of the strikes at the docks. So they are made in china or somewhere else.

At least Annealeaz is US made. I am unsure of where the Ugly annealer is made.

Those hoses are rated 350 psi. More than the 100-200 psi a 20lb ya m produces. likely just a liability issue. I personally use a regulator regardless.

Burstfire is made in Taiwan. Ugly is made in China. And ya Annealeez is “made in us”, but using 100% budget grade parts. At least my V2 was.

Not a reference to any of the vendors. But, personally, I rather have a product assembled by skilled workers and using quality parts, vs a chop shop in the US. A quick call / email into them should get you the answer for someone looking for a new annealer.

 

[Yondering]

I’m still of the opinion, from my own experience, that those who struggle with an Annealeez would also struggle with changing their oil.

There are people who can work with their hands, and people who can’t. Personally I don’t take advice on things like this from those who can’t.

 

[BFGDC]

I’m still of the opinion, from my own experience, that those who struggle with an Annealeez would also struggle with changing their oil.

There are people who can work with their hands, and people who can’t. Personally I don’t take advice on things like this from those who can’t.

Kind of agree here. Lol. They all work, really well, if you simply follow the instructions, and exercise some common sense.

But except some are made “almost” idiot proof.

 

[DeathBeforeDismount]

I’m still of the opinion, from my own experience, that those who struggle with an Annealeez would also struggle with changing their oil.

There are people who can work with their hands, and people who can’t. Personally I don’t take advice on things like this from those who can’t.

Retarded statement.

There are piece of shit annealers made of pot metal plastic gears and Chinese parts.

Some of us have littrly taken the machine completely apart, multiple times, have rebuilt parts that broke or failed due to shitty design and material choice and spend a ton of money and time to try and make it serviceable.

It Still Jams becuase its a piece of shit with a terirblle design using erector set parts.

Then there are ones made to actually last a lifetime that require no dicking around with.

I'm still of the opinion that anyone who thinks the Annealeez is a good machine is an ignorant retard who does not have the experience to even see the issues. Or they somehow got lucky, the moons alligned and they got one of the few machines that works without the issues most have.

There would not be a huge market and tons of posts all over the internet about how to fix or remedy issues with this machine, if it was not a piece of shit.

How many people who spend $1K+ more on an AMP have said they regret it and wish they would have kept their pot metal machine? Zero.

 

[Yondering]

Retarded statement.

There are piece of shit annealers made of pot metal plastic gears and Chinese parts.

Some of us have littrly taken the machine completely apart, multiple times, have rebuilt parts that broke or failed due to shitty design and material choice and spend a ton of money and time to try and make it serviceable.

It Still Jams becuase its a piece of shit with a terirblle design using erector set parts.

Then there are ones made to actually last a lifetime that require no dicking around with.

I'm still of the opinion that anyone who thinks the Annealeez is a good machine is an ignorant retard who does not have the experience to even see the issues. Or they somehow got lucky, the moons alligned and they got one of the few machines that works without the issues most have.

There would not be a huge market and tons of posts all over the internet about how to fix or remedy issues with this machine, if it was not a piece of shit.

How many people who spend $1K+ more on an AMP have said they regret it and wish they would have kept their pot metal machine? Zero.

Lol. The people able to get something to work well without any fuss are not the retards.

Like I said, some people would screw up an oil change too. There are a lot of them, and they almost universally consider themselves smarter than everyone else.

Also, you seem to have no idea what “pot metal” means.

 

[DeathBeforeDismount]

Lol. The people able to get something to work well without any fuss are not the retards.

Like I said, some people would screw up an oil change too. There are a lot of them, and they almost universally consider themselves smarter than everyone else.

Also, you seem to have no idea what “pot metal” means.

You don't know what you don't you and you have no idea what anyone else's IQ or mechanical abilities. Your own ignorance is showing.

Oh I didn't realize I was talking to a Materials Scientist, Thin Gauge Questionable sourced steel alloy, most likely hot rolled recycled material from China. So thin that when doing a long run, the machine warps. Not even welded, but pop riveted together because its too thin to weld for someone who only has the skills to make a machine this shitty.

I probably have more pieces of brass annealed on this machine than you plus any other 5 idiots on here. That is why I know most of you are full of shit, as EVERY SINGLE PERSON I know who has one of these, not some random on the net, but actual people who I know use them and guys I compete and shoot with, have had the same issues. Most sell it and buy a benchsource or an AMP instead of wasting time and money trying to unfuck something that cannot be unfucked due to design and materials choice.

ETA: I see you are in Washington Too. Please feel free to come out to any of the matches and I can bring the machine. You can show me what an Idiot I am and what I am doing wrong. We would be privileged to have your expertise and superior intellect show us what we can't figure out. I will even pay for your hotel room.

 

[Yondering]

Oh I didn't realize I was talking to a Materials Scientist, Thin Gauge Questionable sourced steel alloy, most likely hot rolled recycled material from China. So thin that when doing a long run, the machine warps. Not even welded, but pop riveted together because its too thin to weld for someone who only has the skills to make a machine this shitty.

Nope. Try again. You really don’t know anything about metals do you?

You’re doing a great job proving my point though.