Is upgrading to a Swarovski ATX spotting scope really worth $5,000?

[MJY65]

That's the dilemma I'm facing. I've had a Leupold 12-40x60 for about 20 years. It's the old style with standard (non-HD) glass. When I was at the range the other day, I couldn't see bullet holes any better with that than I could through my Nightforce 5.5-22. I know that there are more uses for a spotter than bullet holes, but that's one that is important to me when working up loads and target shooting.

In looking at the spotting scope market, it seems that the Swarovski ATX is at or near the top of the heap. It should be with a price pushing $4,000. Add the OEM protective jacket and a suitable tripod and the package is close to $5,000. OK, so I sell my Leupold for $500 and the net drops to $4500. That's still a pile of cash.

So tell me. Is this a case of "You get what you pay for", "Buy once, cry once", or is this one way out past the edge of diminishing returns? My alternative is a target cam, which has its limitations, too, but costs less than $1,000.

Advice is appreciated.

 

[The Lawn Ranger]

Look for a used Swaro (non HD). I got mine from a hide member for $1700.00.

Glass is good enough to spot hits (and misses) on steel at a mile.

 

[DetroitRearView]

Lawn Ranger has it right, no reason to spend that kind of $$ for target/steel work.

The only reason I went to the new 95mm Swaro is the great detail for spotting/evaluating game.

A few nights ago our local backyard deer herd was bedded down about 100 yards away in 10" grass. I had the big Swaro set up after the sun went down (cloudy no moon) and I
could not see the deer with the naked eye. I zeroed in on a young fawn at about 80 yards laying in the grass. I could see the fawn's eye lashes and see the hairs on it nose waver with the breeze.


Antler eval at 1500+ yards in unfavorable conditions, yes it is worth it.

Targets, negative.

 

[dave300]

I would agree with you. I have the 65MM HD swaro and it suits my needs just fine. Having said that, I have heard nothing but good things about the vortex razor spotters and think they are in the $800 ish range for the HD version, sounds like that might be worth looking into if I were you. Money back on investment, maybe step up to the swaro world?
Whichever way you go, do yourself a favor and test whatever spotter you use in low light conditions, that is were things become a bunch clearer. It drives me up the wall to hear people say "they aint that much better than mine" as they compare one to another on bright sunny days.
Secondly, your kinda comparing older Leupold glass to newer NF glass which I think is a bit of technology catching up to your comparisons. NF glass is a worthy adversary to most any other glass out there.

Lawn Ranger has it right, no reason to spend that kind of $$ for target/steel work.

The only reason I went to the new 95mm Swaro is the great detail for spotting/evaluating game.

A few nights ago our local backyard deer herd was bedded down about 100 yards away in 10" grass. I had the big Swaro set up after the sun went down (cloudy no moon) and I
could not see the deer with the naked eye. I zeroed in on a young fawn at about 80 yards laying in the grass. I could see the fawn's eye lashes and see the hairs on it nose waver with the breeze.


Antler eval at 1500+ yards in unfavorable conditions, yes it is worth it.

Targets, negative.

 

[MJY65]

Whichever way you go, do yourself a favor and test whatever spotter you use in low light conditions, that is were things become a bunch clearer. It drives me up the wall to hear people say "they aint that much better than mine" as they compare one to another on bright sunny days.

That would certainly be nice, but finding all of the scopes together is enough of a challenge. Most of the time, the evaluation is taking place under fluorescent lights inside a store, not outdoors in low light.

 

[g2gjoe]

The coatings on the glass break down after a while. Some faster than others. If I had money to blow like that, I would get the Swarovski, but I don't. My newest Leopold was about $1100, i've had it for just about two years now, it works great. Maybe you should also consider the vortex razor HD.

 

[Mike]

I have that Swaro and let me tell you it is incredible. By far one of the best spotters I've ever had beaten only by the Leica.

With that being said, I don't think it's anywhere near what you need. There are plenty of other, more economical, options out there that go much easier on your wallet.

 

[Shoottothrill]

Vortex Razor HD will do 95% of what the higher priced ones will do and wallet will thank you. No reason to spend 4k on a spotter. I love mine.

 

[delixe]

Vortex Razor HD will do 95% of what the higher priced ones will do and wallet will thank you. No reason to spend 4k on a spotter. I love mine.

This.
Also, CameraLand has demo units for $250 off street price.
Vortex - Camera Land NY

 

[EuroOptic Ltd.]

MJY - don't forget about the Meopta S2 - these have reviewed incredibly well and I have personally seen bullet holes in paper at 1K using them:

Meopta Spotting Scopes On Sale

That said, I actually own the 95mm swaro and it really seems to be the only thing that beats the S2 - they are amazing, but obviously not necessary for everyone. These guys ranked the S2 directly behind the 95mm Swaro, then everything else behind that. THey only reviewed those with 80mm obj. and above.

Head to Head Review: Best Spotting Scopes of 2013 - Petersen's Hunting

Jason

 

[Chris@InterstateGuns]

That's the dilemma I'm facing. I've had a Leupold 12-40x60 for about 20 years. It's the old style with standard (non-HD) glass. When I was at the range the other day, I couldn't see bullet holes any better with that than I could through my Nightforce 5.5-22. I know that there are more uses for a spotter than bullet holes, but that's one that is important to me when working up loads and target shooting.

In looking at the spotting scope market, it seems that the Swarovski ATX is at or near the top of the heap. It should be with a price pushing $4,000. Add the OEM protective jacket and a suitable tripod and the package is close to $5,000. OK, so I sell my Leupold for $500 and the net drops to $4500. That's still a pile of cash.

So tell me. Is this a case of "You get what you pay for", "Buy once, cry once", or is this one way out past the edge of diminishing returns? My alternative is a target cam, which has its limitations, too, but costs less than $1,000.

Advice is appreciated.

Meopta Spotting Scopes have been some of our best selling spotters.The new Meopta 80mm Meopro Spotter is a really nice piece. Customer came in two days ago looking at the Razor. We had just received the new Meopro and was curious to see how it stacked up against the Razor because it is in the same price point. The customer left with the Meopta.

The only feature the Razor had was the ability to get a reticled eye piece but the customer wasn't ever going to use that application. Optically, he was blown away with the Meopta.

The Swarovski "x" series spotters are the ones to beat in a non-tactical spotter. The modular design really opens up the possibilities for design elements that weren't possible before. Opticaly its the best I've seen and we deal with them all. If you really want the "x" series spotter, be sure to check out our Swarivski "x" series complete outfits for a good deal on ready to go packages. I wouldn't worry about a stay on case to be honest with you. The armor on Swarovski Spotters is very thick. After years of abuse mine still looks brand new.

 

[tylerw02]

I couldn't justify that much money for a spotter. I'd want something more affordable and with a good reticle. Yeah, Swaro glass is pretty damn awesome, but not THAT awesome.

 

[hammerfest05]

I have a pentax 65 mm hd with a fixed eyepiece and really like it. Depends what kind of target but I can see holes at several hundred yards.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

 

[jasonk]

Vortex Razor HD will do 95% of what the higher priced ones will do and wallet will thank you. No reason to spend 4k on a spotter. I love mine.

^^^ What he said. I've not played with the $5000 Swaro, but even $5000 doesn't eliminate stuff like mirage and other glassing issues.

I'd rather have a Razor HD demo + the reticle eyepiece for spotting, add the target cam for the real long range stuff when needed, AND have about $3000 left to blow on other cool stuff.

 

[Opticsspecialist]

having spent some time with the Swarovski, it's an expensive scope but you pay for quality. optically it's better than any other spotter i've gotten behind, and you have the flexability to go from a large scope with a 95mm objective to a much smaller scope with a 65mm objective without having to buy a completely new scope. the controls on the swarovski are better that any other spotter, because both the magnification and the focus wheel are in the center of the scope, allowing you to seamlessly transition to one or the other, most scopes have the magnification on the eye piece and the focus wheel somewhere in the center of the scope or as a small wheel of some kind.
while better glass doesn't eliminate mirage, it certainly helps you cope with it, and there is a ton of glass in a spotting scope, so i usually recommend getting the best optic you can, as you are looking through a ton of glass.
in the long run it all depends on what your doing, but I will tell you, having one spotting scope with awesome glass that can transition from a 95mm to a 65mm is a handy pet to have. you can go from range to sheep hunt in 10 seconds, as far as the spotter is concerned.

 

[ultrarunner7]

Had a Swaro and Zeiss. Got my Kowa... Sold the Swaro and Zeiss and love the Kowa. There is a reason bird watchers prefer them as well as photographers. To me and the photographers Ive spoken with extensively, the Kowas are clearer from edge to edge where the Swaro and Zeisses arent. Its hard to tell but if you compare all three side to side like have, I can see the difference. Also, in the Army I went to a few courses to use these $40,000 camera kits. They all had Kowas in the them. Ive taken photographs through the Swaro and Kowa and you can see the difference... Kowa is better IMO.

 

[clmayfield]

How far are you trying to see bullet holes? For 500+ yards, you are better off buying a target cam. Inside of that, spotters are great. The target cam is a lot cheaper than a good spotter, but for closer distance, there is not near the setup involved with a spotter. And yes, a Kowa Prominar will do everything the Swaro will do for less.

 

[clmayfield]

https://www.rokslide.com/2012-01-09-05-09-42/optics/261-swarovski-atx85-kowa-884

New ATX has arrived for BINOMANIA: some photos - BirdForum

Is the Kowa better? Is the Swaro better? Depends on who you ask. But you can get the Kowa with eyepiece for $2500. Kowa Spotting Scope 88mm Straight Prominar with 25 60x Wide Zoom Eyepiece 879110008844 | eBay

Is the Swaro $1500 better than the Kowa? Not for spying bullet holes.

 

[Opticsspecialist]

just to add to what i said earlier, the kowa is more comparable to the Swarovski ATS or STS spotting scopes. I'd also like to take a moment to illustrate why I always recommend a prospective buyer put eyes behind the optic they want. as we can see in this thread, there are kowa guys, vortex, meopta, swarovski, the zeiss, leica, and everyone else will be along shortly i'm sure. some guys like blonds, some redheads, brunettes, etc. the point i'm making is different eyes see and perceive things differently, and people have preferences. whatever you decide to get, get behind it and spend a little time there, even if you end up buying it and returning it. you'll be happier in the long run.

 

[clmayfield]

just to add to what i said earlier, the kowa is more comparable to the Swarovski ATS or STS spotting scopes. I'd also like to take a moment to illustrate why I always recommend a prospective buyer put eyes behind the optic they want. as we can see in this thread, there are kowa guys, vortex, meopta, swarovski, the zeiss, leica, and everyone else will be along shortly i'm sure. some guys like blonds, some redheads, brunettes, etc. the point i'm making is different eyes see and perceive things differently, and people have preferences. whatever you decide to get, get behind it and spend a little time there, even if you end up buying it and returning it. you'll be happier in the long run.

Are there guys who like money and don't like money? Because I am in the "like money" camp.

 

[mastermason6]

Kowa......

 

[matemike]

I got into an ATX 65 for $2700. I bought the ocular piece from BHphoto's used stock and the objective from a LRH forum member. Both pieces were 9++ used condition. Hell, I'd even say they were 10's. Wife already had a nice fluid head tripod for her SLR camera, so I'm in business. I did not have a spotter to part with so it was all cash straight out of my hand. Fortunately, 8 miles away we have a state park which is an alligator, bird, owl, deer, hogs, and critter sanctuary. And there is a sky dive park literally right down the road from our house, so we like to watch sky divers jumping out of the plane two miles up on clear days. We'll get good use out of this spotting system. I also have opportunities to hunt with it in interior Alaska for moose and caribou as well as New Mexico for elk. Glad I went with the 65mm objective because it will be packed around a lot. It fits into a Swarovski XL bino case which was only $70. I could easily see them charging $150-$200 for anything that has their name on it. Someday I may spring for the 95mm objective and the SLR camera adapter, but all that is and extra $2500. I'm set for now though. For 500+ yard shots at the range, I don't think I'll be using it for that role. That's why I bring a "pit pig" to text with back and forth, even send photos back via text if I'm shooting at the 1,000 yard range. It's your own choice, it's great glass. But I don't think it's justifiable to play a solo role as you have presumed it may do. Keep in mind, although it's less than $1,000, a long range camera system IS a solo role.