Just .243 handloads, I know, boring.

[Powderburns]

Need ideas. I have a 1:9.25 twist. 22” tube. Lapua brass, CCI 200, 42.3 4350 and 87gr Vmax.

4” group at 300. Not happy. Maybe just spoiled with my 6BR.

Any other recipes or ideas out there based on experience?

 

[spife7980]

So you’ve only tried one load combination?

Maybe try more?

 

[Powderburns]

Exactly the purpose of this thread. I need direction of which component/components to change based on experience from the community.

 

[FredHammer]

I shot 88gr Hammer hunters and 105gr Amax with a 1/7.5T and had really good results with:

H100V
RL17

 

[Potsy]

Not much detail here.
Rifle details? Any loads it likes? Ever shot it at 300 yards before?

Don’t have a dog in the race, but I guess I’m just curious because I was sitting in a blind pondering a cheap .243 just the other day…..

 

[spife7980]

Exactly the purpose of this thread. I need direction of which component/components to change based on experience from the community.

Change your powder weights until you find something that does alright, change your seating depth until you find where it’s best.

We can’t tell you what your gun will like, only your testing can.


Use this for max and min powder guidelines

Reloading Data Center

www.hodgdonreloading.com

Read this to know what to watch out for as you WORK YOUR WAY UP in powder weights.

Understanding Pressure :: Primal Rights, Inc

Reading pressure is a required skill that all shooters must have. Whether you are shooting factory ammunition or your own handloads, you absolutely must be able to detect and interpret pressure signs on your fired brass.

www.primalrights.com

 

[XP1K]

I have a similar tube on my 243AI. Factory remington barrel that has been rechambered, also a 9.25 twist. Finished about 24"

Only thing I've shot through it since the rechamber have been fire forming loads with W760 and an 85gr sierra bthp gameking. Shooting half moa running around 3200. Can't remember the charge, but I can look this evening. Rem 9½ primer.

 

[Powderburns]

I have a similar tube on my 243AI. Factory remington barrel that has been rechambered, also a 9.25 twist. Finished about 24"

Only thing I've shot through it since the rechamber have been fire forming loads with W760 and an 85gr sierra bthp gameking. Shooting half moa running around 3200. Can't remember the charge, but I can look this evening. Rem 9½ primer.

Thanks!!

 

[Powderburns]

Not much detail here.
Rifle details? Any loads it likes? Ever shot it at 300 yards before?

Don’t have a dog in the race, but I guess I’m just curious because I was sitting in a blind pondering a cheap .243 just the other day…..

Factory Savage 10 heavy bedded 22” barrel. I’ve tried 75, 87 Vmax and 95 and 105 Bergers. Never tried any other powder than 4350, Lapua brass and CCI 200.
I’ve played with seating depth in small increments from .020 to touching lands. I never changed more than one thing at a time. I have an EC turner brake on my 6BR which shoots bug holes. Tempted to get one for this 243 also. I’d love to make the 95 Berger work somehow.

 

[Dstoenner]

I don’t own a 243 so i cannot help in that regard. But i do shoot 6x47 Lapua and H4350 and RL16 are the best powders.

My experience also is that berger 90 target are the best bullet in this weight category.

What are your groups at 100?

Also the groups at 300? What was the the height smaller than the width? If so then wind was an issue not your load.


David

 

[Aftermath]

Assuming your powder charge is not showing pressure...
1) seat bullets to just barely touch the lands, load 5 rounds, shoot for group
2)Increase powder charge 0.2 gr. load 5 rounds, shoot for group
3)Repeat until you begin to see pressure signs. once you see pressure signs, stop shooting, pull those bullets, dump the powder and go back down one or 2 steps.
4) Seat bullets 0.002" deeper. Load 5, shoot for groups.
5) Repeat.
Somewhere in there, you will find a seating depth that shoots lights out.
Now it's time to shoot using a chronograph and develop DOPE.

 

[Cascade Hemi]

Factory Savage 10 heavy bedded 22” barrel. I’ve tried 75, 87 Vmax and 95 and 105 Bergers. Never tried any other powder than 4350, Lapua brass and CCI 200.
I’ve played with seating depth in small increments from .020 to touching lands. I never changed more than one thing at a time. I have an EC turner brake on my 6BR which shoots bug holes. Tempted to get one for this 243 also. I’d love to make the 95 Berger work somehow.

Do you have to use the components in your OP? I've had good luck with RL22 and H4831 in 243Win. That's enough twist rate to stabilize up to 105. Savage OEM barrels are dirt cheap, you may as well see how much velocity you can push before you burn the throat out. I'd start with a simple pressure ladder with the 95s and 105s.

 

[XP1K]

Not a 243 but this is the method I used on my dad's 270 yesterday. I was trying to replicate and old load his gun favored 20 years ago but I just gave up and started over.

I picked a charge close to the top and loaded three to book length and shot them. Repeated this until I reached a velocity I was happy with and groups started to open up.

I picked the second fastest load as it had the best sd/es and it was the best looking group as far as how it appeared on target. Loaded it .006" longer. Groups opened up further. Loaded it .006" shorter and bingo. .525" group. Loaded three more .006" shorter than the last, now .012 shorter than book, and shot a 2" group. I stayed with .006 under book.

Accuracy nodes are said to come in .006" intervals. I've done this with several rifles and they have tuned out pretty quick. At a certain point if I'm going for all I can get I'll start going in .003" increments.

In this case, it's a pencil barreled 270 so I'm happy with a half minute.

 

[Powderburns]

Do you have to use the components in your OP? I've had good luck with RL22 and H4831 in 243Win. That's enough twist rate to stabilize up to 105. Savage OEM barrels are dirt cheap, you may as well see how much velocity you can push before you burn the throat out. I'd start with a simple pressure ladder with the 95s and 105s.

I don’t have to stick with those components. It’s just that I have an awful lot of them. I would be willing to try something else if somebody could tell me did they for sure work before I spend the money.

 

[Powderburns]

Assuming your powder charge is not showing pressure...
1) seat bullets to just barely touch the lands, load 5 rounds, shoot for group
2)Increase powder charge 0.2 gr. load 5 rounds, shoot for group
3)Repeat until you begin to see pressure signs. once you see pressure signs, stop shooting, pull those bullets, dump the powder and go back down one or 2 steps.
4) Seat bullets 0.002" deeper. Load 5, shoot for groups.
5) Repeat.
Somewhere in there, you will find a seating depth that shoots lights out.
Now it's time to shoot using a chronograph and develop DOPE.

I like this method I will give it a try

 

[Garvey]

Change your powder weights until you find something that does alright, change your seating depth until you find where it’s best.

We can’t tell you what your gun will like, only your testing can.


Use this for max and min powder guidelines

Reloading Data Center

www.hodgdonreloading.com

Read this to know what to watch out for as you WORK YOUR WAY UP in powder weights.

Understanding Pressure :: Primal Rights, Inc

Reading pressure is a required skill that all shooters must have. Whether you are shooting factory ammunition or your own handloads, you absolutely must be able to detect and interpret pressure signs on your fired brass.

www.primalrights.com

Exactly this.

I have performed load development for hundreds of rifles. Of course, there are component combinations that are repeats. But each rifle must be treated as an individual. Learn the relationship to the lands, sent your bullet accordingly, then begin testing charges.

I have data on a large number of .300 Win Mag rifles. Nosler virgin, Fed-215, H-1000, and a 200 gr ELD-X. The best shooting load in each rifle varies over the span of 5.0 gr of powder.

What shoots great in rifle "A" looks mediocre in rifle "B", and looks terrible in rifle "C".

Some tolerated a very, very high powder charge, and shot safely. Others were showing pressure very early in testing.

Final CBTO is never the same from one rifle to the next.

 

[FredHammer]

Assuming your powder charge is not showing pressure...
1) seat bullets to just barely touch the lands, load 5 rounds, shoot for group
2)Increase powder charge 0.2 gr. load 5 rounds, shoot for group
3)Repeat until you begin to see pressure signs. once you see pressure signs, stop shooting, pull those bullets, dump the powder and go back down one or 2 steps.
4) Seat bullets 0.002" deeper. Load 5, shoot for groups.
5) Repeat.
Somewhere in there, you will find a seating depth that shoots lights out.
Now it's time to shoot using a chronograph and develop DOPE.

I've been load developing like this for quite some time with larger changes. I found if I was seated at/near the lands & started to pressure out before desired velocity, backing off .020 would give me a fresh start to lower the pressure and increase some powder thus velocity.

 

[hero's machine]

How's the br shoot the vmax at 300? They aren't the slickest pills around. How much of the group is horizontal dispersion?

 

[Powderburns]

Exactly this.

I have performed load development for hundreds of rifles. Of course, there are component combinations that are repeats. But each rifle must be treated as an individual. Learn the relationship to the lands, sent your bullet accordingly, then begin testing charges.

I have data on a large number of .300 Win Mag rifles. Nosler virgin, Fed-215, H-1000, and a 200 gr ELD-X. The best shooting load in each rifle varies over the span of 5.0 gr of powder.

What shoots great in rifle "A" looks mediocre in rifle "B", and looks terrible in rifle "C".

Some tolerated a very, very high powder charge, and shot safely. Others were showing pressure very early in testing.

Final CBTO is never the same from one rifle to the next.

Thanks

 

[Powderburns]

How's the br shoot the vmax at 300? They aren't the slickest pills around. How much of the group is horizontal dispersion?

I don’t shoot vmax in the Br. I use 105 Berger VLDs. My BR is a 1:8 twist.

 

[Powderburns]

I have a similar tube on my 243AI. Factory remington barrel that has been rechambered, also a 9.25 twist. Finished about 24"

Only thing I've shot through it since the rechamber have been fire forming loads with W760 and an 85gr sierra bthp gameking. Shooting half moa running around 3200. Can't remember the charge, but I can look this evening. Rem 9½ primer.

What are your results past 200yrds?

 

[Powderburns]

I don’t own a 243 so i cannot help in that regard. But i do shoot 6x47 Lapua and H4350 and RL16 are the best powders.

My experience also is that berger 90 target are the best bullet in this weight category.

What are your groups at 100?

Also the groups at 300? What was the the height smaller than the width? If so then wind was an issue not your load.


David

Using 42.3 4350 and 87grVmax, 10 shots at 100 1.25” “round” group. 10 shots at 200 2.25” “round” group. 15 shots at 300 4” “round” group.

 

[XP1K]

What are your results past 200yrds?

I haven't punched paper with it past 100. I might be able to squeeze that in this week sometime though.

 

[XP1K]

Using 42.3 4350 and 87grVmax, 10 shots at 100 1.25” “round” group. 10 shots at 200 2.25” “round” group. 15 shots at 300 4” “round” group.

that's the only load you've tried ? I wouldn't even entertain that as acceptable. How is the load for es/sd, and are they loaded to book length ? If they are, push the seating depth a little in either direction. Or keep playing with the charge. It needs work but I'm sure you can probably find a combo that it likes.

 

[Powderburns]

Will do. Will be slow going with winter in my neighborhood.

 

[Garvey]

Using 42.3 4350 and 87grVmax, 10 shots at 100 1.25” “round” group. 10 shots at 200 2.25” “round” group. 15 shots at 300 4” “round” group.

What other charges did you try?
At what distance?

 

[Powderburns]

What other charges did you try?
At what distance?

With the 87gr. from 40.8 to 44.8 in .5gr increments. 44.8 flat primer. 42.3 showed the best groups. 3 shot groups with each charge. 3 at 100,200 and 300. All at .005 off the lands. I’ve been though a lot of components with 4350. Maybe start over with a different powder? I’d like to use the 95gr Bergers.

 

[Garvey]

Don't start over with another powder. You have almost found what the rifle is capable of. Sometimes, no matter what we do, there's no magic potion that is going to make a 1 MOA rifle a 1/2 MOA rifle.

Keep your 42.3 gr charge.
The next thing you do is test bullet jump increments. Go to 200 yard paper. Test in .005" increasing increments. One of two things is going to happen.
1. You'll find a seating depth that shoots better.
2. No new seating depth will make an improvement

Keep in mind, seating the bullet deeper, you may create increased chamber pressure, where you did not have it before. So, inspect your brass as you go, like always.

 

[Powderburns]

Thank you!

 

[Top O' Texas]

I don't have the 87vmax, but I do have the 75 for 243win. The throat is way short and need to uni-throat it an extra 30-50thou more. Most of my coal testing on various bullet weights and brands show it doesn't meet coal load data. I've only done QL data, but not 100% reliable? I'm guessing it's "H" 4350?

 

[Dstoenner]

Using 42.3 4350 and 87grVmax, 10 shots at 100 1.25” “round” group. 10 shots at 200 2.25” “round” group. 15 shots at 300 4” “round” group.

Based on you 100 yard target, take it and multiply by 3 as a level of expectation. So 3x1.25 = 3.75. 4 is a little more but not grossly more. And remember there is a range of what you see just like at 100 yards.

The posts about doing a charge ladder, then picking the best and trying a seating depth change to fine tune it is good advice.

David

 

[Powderburns]

I don't have the 87vmax, but I do have the 75 for 243win. The throat is way short and need to uni-throat it an extra 30-50thou more. Most of my coal testing on various bullet weights and brands show it doesn't meet coal load data. I've only done QL data, but not 100% reliable? I'm guessing it's "H" 4350?

A4350. I’m sure those 75s are jumping quite a bit. This is why I like the Berger 95VLD it takes up more real estate.

 

[Powderburns]

Based on you 100 yard target, take it and multiply by 3 as a level of expectation. So 3x1.25 = 3.75. 4 is a little more but not grossly more. And remember there is a range of what you see just like at 100 yards.

The posts about doing a charge ladder, then picking the best and trying a seating depth change to fine tune it is good advice.

David

You you bet thanks

 

[Aftermath]

Don't worry about seating too deep and increasing chamber pressure because you seated too deep. That's truly not the way it works. Seating the bullet farther from the rifling (deeper into the case) DECREASES chamber pressure until the bullet is seated very very deep into the case. I can explain why but I don't care to, if you are interested, please study. There are all sorts of research articles with hard data supporting this readily found by rudimentary search methods. There are threads on this forum that dive into the science, too.

Assuming your powder charge is not showing pressure...
1) seat bullets to just barely touch the lands, load 5 rounds, shoot for group
2)Increase powder charge 0.2 gr. load 5 rounds, shoot for group
3)Repeat until you begin to see pressure signs. once you see pressure signs, stop shooting, pull those bullets, dump the powder and go back down one or 2 steps. You just found your max charge weight, pressure will decrease from this point forward using this method.
4) Seat bullets 0.002" deeper. Load 5, shoot for groups.
5) Repeat.
Somewhere in there, you will find a seating depth that shoots lights out.
Now it's time to shoot using a chronograph and develop DOPE.

I use this method every time i develop a load. Once I find that magical seating depth with an associated max charge weight, I use to see if I can get more velocity by holding that seating depth and increasing the charge weight. What I discovered is that accuracy was negatively impacted. I am not saying that I would not be able to find another seating depth that would perform at the increased velocity but I'd be testing even more. For what? Another 40 fps? Pass
The other thing I have found is that there are usually 2 and sometimes 3 different seating depths that provide acceptable accuracy. I ALWAYS choose the one closest to the rifling. Therefore, I find it and I am now done with load development instead of wasting resources and barrel life finding another.
In general, I can find a suitable load for any rifle using less than 200 rounds of ammo.