KNS Question

[SpringerXD9sc]

I am working on my first AR build right now and needed some insite from the experts. I know this is a newby question but I appreciate the help

I ordered the .154 KNS pins last week and just recieved them tonight but the place I bought them from sent me the .155 size pins.

My question is will these pins work on a new LMT lower or am I going to have to send them back and get the smaller ones?

I would just try these if I could but I am not picking up my new lower until either Monday or Tuesday and would like to resolve this issue sooner than later if I need to.

 

[ORD]

Re: KNS Question

I would guess that you will need the 0.154" pins and that the 0.1555 pins you got by mistake will be too tight on a brand new, mil-spec lower. The 0.1555 pins were specifically designed for use on lowers with worn or out-of-spec hammer/trigger pin holes which shouldn't be a problem with your new LMT.

 

[jakhamr81]

Re: KNS Question

I'm pretty sure they will not fit. Prior to ordering a set I called up LMT to verify the size and they confirmed that the holes were .154". LMT has pretty good standards and the .155 are usually for worn out receivers.

 

[SpringerXD9sc]

Re: KNS Question

I was wondering if the .1555 pins do fit in the lower are there possibly any negative consequences from using the larger pins?

 

[LoneWolfUSMC]

Re: KNS Question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SpringerXD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I was wondering if the .1555 pins do fit in the lower are there possibly any negative consequences from using the larger pins? </div></div>

Yes, Pounding them in will punch out the holes to the larger diameter. Resulting in a receiver with the same loose ass holes as a work lower.

If they don't fit with hand pressure don't install them. If they do slip in easily then they will be just fine.

Also the KNS pins are really just a "look what I can do" type of thing. I have them on one lower just to see what the fuss is about. They don't do jack for an in-spec, semi-auto lower and don't do much for an in-spec full auto lower. Never once was I firing an issued M16A2 and had the pins walk out. How many thousands of rounds do you think make it through those?

 

[jakhamr81]

Re: KNS Question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Also the KNS pins are really just a "look what I can do" type of thing. I have them on one lower just to see what the fuss is about. They don't do jack for an in-spec, semi-auto lower and don't do much for an in-spec full auto lower. Never once was I firing an issued M16A2 and had the pins walk out. How many thousands of rounds do you think make it through those?</div></div>

Actually, they do serve a purpose. I had to install them in my LMT lower do to the fact that every time I fired the trigger pin came out of position, resulting in the trigger not working. KNS pins took care of that problem. They also prevent any future weae in a lower receiver around the trigger pin hole by preventing the trigger pin to rotate every time you pull the trigger. This is especially desiarable for people that have a full auto pre 1986 lower receiver, because once that lower is unservicable it can never be fixed. Problem is that when you have two peices of metal grinding against eachother some where will occur regardless of how in spec they are.

 

[ORD]

Re: KNS Question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SpringerXD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I was wondering if the .1555 pins do fit in the lower are there possibly any negative consequences from using the larger pins? </div></div>

If they fit...they fit (although there is no earthly reason that they should since it is a BRAND NEW lower and LMT is generally known for the quality of their lowers unless somehow they just got a "bad batch" with out-of-spec hammer/trigger pin holes). There will not be any "adverse" or "negative" consequences from using them if they fit...just don't try to force them if they do not fit easily into the pin holes (try them without the hammer/trigger in place first to make it easier on yourself).

As to the other posts re: the usefulness or lack thereof for the KNS pins...I usually give my standard "speech" about KNS pins to those interested in getting them, but since the OP has already ordered a set (albeit having received the wrong ones) and clearly made up his mind to get them and use them on his lower, I didn't see where preaching to the choir was really necessary (although I agree with the fact that 99.5% of the people who buy these don't really need them, nor will they ever see any benefits from using them short of suppressed fire, FA/burst fire on a registered lower, heavier recoiling calibers on the -15 and -10 lowers that tend to generate more force/abuse on the pins, etc., etc.).

 

[deersniper]

Re: KNS Question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LoneWolfUSMC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

I was wondering if the .1555 pins do fit i
Also the KNS pins are really just a "look what I can do" type of thing. I have them on one lower just to see what the fuss is about. They don't do jack for an in-spec, semi-auto lower and don't do much for an in-spec full auto lower. Never once was I firing an issued M16A2 and had the pins walk out. How many thousands of rounds do you think make it through those? </div></div>

Ehh. A RR runs around $8-$10K now, I will take every bit of protection that I can get.

-dan

 

[Strangedays]

Re: KNS Question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LoneWolfUSMC</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SpringerXD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I was wondering if the .1555 pins do fit in the lower are there possibly any negative consequences from using the larger pins? </div></div>

Yes, Pounding them in will punch out the holes to the larger diameter. Resulting in a receiver with the same loose ass holes as a work lower.

If they don't fit with hand pressure don't install them. If they do slip in easily then they will be just fine.

Also the KNS pins are really just a "look what I can do" type of thing. I have them on one lower just to see what the fuss is about. They don't do jack for an in-spec, semi-auto lower and don't do much for an in-spec full auto lower. Never once was I firing an issued M16A2 and had the pins walk out. How many thousands of rounds do you think make it through those? </div></div>
I have seen pins walk out at a match before so I do think they are more than a "look what I can do" I have never had my pins walk out but again I run KNS pins on all my guns. I have also been shooting with a buddy who's pins walked loose. I say better to have and not need than to need and not have.

 

[LoneWolfUSMC]

Re: KNS Question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jakhamr81</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Actually, they do serve a purpose. I had to install them in my LMT lower do to the fact that every time I fired the trigger pin came out of position, resulting in the trigger not working.</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: strangedays</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have seen pins walk out at a match before so I do think they are more than a "look what I can do" </div></div>

You will notice I said IN SPEC lowers. I think if you took the time to measure the holes and examine the lower parts kits you may find that the parts were not at the specifications required by the original technical data package.

But hey, if you don't care about sloppy machining and want to bolt on another part to fix it, rock on!

We have several old M16's that have been converted to M4 spec in my department. We also have quite a few personally owned rifles. All are serviced by professionals armorers. Amazingly enough we don't have pins falling out all over the place. Remember these are rifles used in defense of life. Not a plinker or range rifle.

Add the KNS pins if you want to. All the guys at the range will marvel at your fashion sense.

 

[LoneWolfUSMC]

Re: KNS Question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: deersniper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ehh. A RR runs around $8-$10K now, I will take every bit of protection that I can get.

-dan </div></div>

Really? Where are you finding them that cheap? The last time I checked RDIAS were running around that price. If registered lowers have come down that far I need to start saving for one.

 

[jakhamr81]

Re: KNS Question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LoneWolfUSMC</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jakhamr81</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Actually, they do serve a purpose. I had to install them in my LMT lower do to the fact that every time I fired the trigger pin came out of position, resulting in the trigger not working.</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: strangedays</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have seen pins walk out at a match before so I do think they are more than a "look what I can do" </div></div>

You will notice I said IN SPEC lowers. I think if you took the time to measure the holes and examine the lower parts kits you may find that the parts were not at the specifications required by the original technical data package.

But hey, if you don't care about sloppy machining and want to bolt on another part to fix it, rock on!

We have several old M16's that have been converted to M4 spec in my department. We also have quite a few personally owned rifles. All are serviced by professionals armorers. Amazingly enough we don't have pins falling out all over the place. Remember these are rifles used in defense of life. Not a plinker or range rifle.

Add the KNS pins if you want to. All the guys at the range will marvel at your fashion sense.</div></div>

So when you find that your lower is out of spec what is your recommendation? Just put the trigger pin back in place after every shot, Replace the out of spec registered lower with an in spec lower?

My rifle was also serviced by a professional armorer that services all of our M4s and SR25s that are used in the line of duty as well as weekend plinkers and the pins still fell out after every shot. Sometimes you get something that is out of spec, My choices were to send it back to the manufacturer and argue that it is out of spec, hope that they replace it, have it sent to my FFL, re submit a Form 1 to the ATF, pay another $200, and wait another 6 months. Or I could simply install a set of anti- walk pins.

If you need them use them, if you think you may ever need them install them. It is better to have them installed and never need them than to find out you needed them when you have to take a follow up shot that your life depends on and your trigger pin is out of place. And plus like LoneWolfUSMC said, "everyone at the range will marvel at your fashion sense", Is a win win situation.

 

[AK10mm]

Re: KNS Question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LoneWolfUSMC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Add the KNS pins if you want to. All the guys at the range will marvel at your fashion sense. </div></div>

I was Sporting one of your Ammo Wallets at the range one day.Couple of guys remarked on it,I told 'em their plastic boxes offended my Sense of Fashion,So I hear ya loud and clear LoneWolf.

 

[Strangedays]

Re: KNS Question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LoneWolfUSMC</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jakhamr81</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Actually, they do serve a purpose. I had to install them in my LMT lower do to the fact that every time I fired the trigger pin came out of position, resulting in the trigger not working.</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: strangedays</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have seen pins walk out at a match before so I do think they are more than a "look what I can do" </div></div>

You will notice I said IN SPEC lowers. I think if you took the time to measure the holes and examine the lower parts kits you may find that the parts were not at the specifications required by the original technical data package.

But hey, if you don't care about sloppy machining and want to bolt on another part to fix it, rock on!

We have several old M16's that have been converted to M4 spec in my department. We also have quite a few personally owned rifles. All are serviced by professionals armorers. Amazingly enough we don't have pins falling out all over the place. Remember these are rifles used in defense of life. Not a plinker or range rifle.

Add the KNS pins if you want to. All the guys at the range will marvel at your fashion sense. </div></div>
I have never had an issue myself even before running the KNS pins. I have a seekins lower and the pins are tight. I know for a fact one of the lowers at the range was a DPMS and a LMT so maybe the two have sloppy holes sometimes? And thanks I like the fashion sense of the pins on the range, everyone loves the eye candy, LOL

 

[Strangedays]

Re: KNS Question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SANDRAT</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LoneWolfUSMC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Add the KNS pins if you want to. All the guys at the range will marvel at your fashion sense. </div></div>

I was Sporting one of your Ammo Wallets at the range one day.Couple of guys remarked on it,I told 'em their plastic boxes offended my Sense of Fashion,So I hear ya loud and clear LoneWolf.

</div></div>
This is classic!

 

[deersniper]

Re: KNS Question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LoneWolfUSMC</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: deersniper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ehh. A RR runs around $8-$10K now, I will take every bit of protection that I can get.

-dan </div></div>

Really? Where are you finding them that cheap? The last time I checked RDIAS were running around that price. If registered lowers have come down that far I need to start saving for one. </div></div>

The market has gotten soft and probably will continue to get softer as people sell toys to make mortgage payments, etc.

RDIAS and RR are running pretty close together now. Both have their pros and cons. If you are serious about buying one, check out ar15.com armory section, M16 section. Lots of info there.

Heres a link to the M16 I bought. I'm still waiting on the paperwork to clear, should be soon.

Night vision and machine guns will drain your wallet quick. Makes precision rifles seem cheap.

 

[LoneWolfUSMC]

Re: KNS Question

tell me about it. Just helped the department buy $70K worth of night vision.

I still haven't caught the full-auto bug because I can shoot FA weapons anytime I want. Just can't see paying that much for something I can do for free.