Rifle Scopes Leica PRS 5-30×56 with PRB Reticle

#51
I personally love the reticle. 0.1 open circle is small enough for me. I see the point of the spinner argument, but everything is a compromise and I would make this compromise for the nice open top half the reticle provides. The only thing that I might change is the first vertical tics that are only facing one direction (to the right), which on paper makes the center look a bit lop-sided. I would rather have the tics smaller and even across both sides. But I'm sure this would not matter in actual use, as everything on paper looks exaggerated compared to viewing through the scope.
 
#53
LA260 said:
Is this scope actually made by Leica or it's farmed out to LOW or somebody else? The price is just too low for a Leica..
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I was thinking the same thing, a top tier Leica in this category was expecting around $3500, but there is massive competition at the $3k level so maybe Cal was able to convince them to lower the price to entice shooters to give them a try, the "more bang for the buck" idea. We'll have to wait and see once we can get them in hand.
 
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#56
#58
I've never had hands on on any leica scopes. Any word on how the turrets feel? This scope is checking a lot of boxes even though I dont like the leica logo on the side.

The PRB article focuses on the reticle (understandably) but what more can people tell us?
 
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#59
Jackomason said:
I've never had hands on on any leica scopes. Any word on how the turrets feel? This scope is checking a lot of boxes even though I dont like the leica logo on the side.

The PRB article focuses on the reticle (understandably) but what more can people tell us?
Click to expand...

Turrets are very quiet. Not mushy but not super distinct. Re zero is a clutch system similar to NF, sig, etc.
 
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#63
Covertnoob5 said:
Turrets are very quiet. Not mushy but not super distinct. Re zero is a clutch system similar to NF, sig, etc.
Click to expand...
Thanks @Covertnoob5 = good intel. Sounds like you have used the scope. How would you rank the optical quality? Leica binos are absolutely stunning glass, both 10x and 15x models. You can put the 15x up against many high power spotters and it hangs right there. Also, how would you describe the ruggedness of the scope? Would you worry if you banged it on a rock?
again, thanks for this intel.
 
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#64
I just looked at the scope in person. It honestly looks nice, and checks a lot of boxes. The eyebox appeared to be forgiving at the typical 15-20x.

The tool-less turrets look good, not as seamless as on a TT though. And while you can re-zero without tools, you still need a tool to adjust the clutch for your actual zero stop, as @Covertnoob5 mentioned.

Like I mentioned before, only having 1 mil above horizontal is a deal breaker for me. As much as the rep wanted to convince me that he’s never needed it in his however many PRS matches, and that Austin Orgain is a better shooter than me (he most definitely IS) and he doesn’t need it, I use it in my shooting style. ??‍♂️
 
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#65
samb300 said:
I just looked at the scope in person. It honestly looks nice, and checks a lot of boxes. The eyebox appeared to be forgiving at the typical 15-20x.

The tool-less turrets look good, not as seamless as on a TT though. And while you can re-zero without tools, you still need a tool to adjust the clutch for your actual zero stop, as @Covertnoob5 mentioned.

Like I mentioned before, only having 1 mil above horizontal is a deal breaker for me. As much as the rep wanted to convince me that he’s never needed it in his however many PRS matches, and that Austin Orgain is a better shooter than me (he most definitely IS) and he doesn’t need it, I use it in my shooting style. ??‍♂️
Click to expand...

Awesome, thanks guys. In general feel I'm assuming it would be a contender with anything in its price range, NF S&B etc. Etc. Cant wait to hear how it stacks up in the real world. I may be an early adopter.

Edit to add: day time illumination?
 
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#66
samb300 said:
I just looked at the scope in person. It honestly looks nice, and checks a lot of boxes. The eyebox appeared to be forgiving at the typical 15-20x.

The tool-less turrets look good, not as seamless as on a TT though. And while you can re-zero without tools, you still need a tool to adjust the clutch for your actual zero stop, as @Covertnoob5 mentioned.

Like I mentioned before, only having 1 mil above horizontal is a deal breaker for me. As much as the rep wanted to convince me that he’s never needed it in his however many PRS matches, and that Austin Orgain is a better shooter than me (he most definitely IS) and he doesn’t need it, I use it in my shooting style. ??‍♂️
Click to expand...

Great feed back @samb300 thank you.
How much above the cross hairs would you want? 1mil seems enough to me, as I had hold unders of 0.4 or 0.5mils but never more than 1 mil. I guess I'm trying to understand a shooting situation where you would need more than 1mil. If you have dialed way up for 1000 yards and then need to hold under for a 600yd target, something like that?

Personally, I love the open top half, as I have always desired having viewing area that doesn't have reticle on it. All I'm doing there is watching for splash or searching for target.
 
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#67
Would someone at SHOT ask Leica about the price vs build on this scope? I'm sure they'll give you a typically "sales" answer, but with the Magnus 2.4-16 SFP scope coming in more expensive than the 5-30 FFP with turrets, I'm just curious what compromises they made to meet this specific price point. Are they not using their high end glass like the Magnus, or what else were they able to do to bring the price down, is the scope not made in Germany? Anything that might give us a clue. I'm not saying the scope won't be a performer, it definitely has my curiosity for sure, but I think most of us familiar with Leica were expecting a price tag a bit higher.
 
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#69
samb300 said:
I just looked at the scope in person. It honestly looks nice, and checks a lot of boxes. The eyebox appeared to be forgiving at the typical 15-20x.

The tool-less turrets look good, not as seamless as on a TT though. And while you can re-zero without tools, you still need a tool to adjust the clutch for your actual zero stop, as @Covertnoob5 mentioned.

Like I mentioned before, only having 1 mil above horizontal is a deal breaker for me. As much as the rep wanted to convince me that he’s never needed it in his however many PRS matches, and that Austin Orgain is a better shooter than me (he most definitely IS) and he doesn’t need it, I use it in my shooting style. ??‍♂️
Click to expand...

That all sounds reassuring. Honestly, I'm good with having only 1 mil above the center line. I know it's not everyone's cup of tea, but the only thing I'd like to see added to the reticle are vertical and horizontal lines graduated in .1 mil hash marks, either separate from reticle (similar to the MSR and the like) or placed toward the outer sections of the prime horizontal and vertical stadia (like the CCH) for more accurate mil ranging. Going off of features, appearance and price point alone, this optic is quickly moving toward the top of my list of scopes I'm considering this year. Will be following developments with great interest.
 
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#70
jbailey said:
Great feed back @samb300 thank you.
How much above the cross hairs would you want? 1mil seems enough to me, as I had hold unders of 0.4 or 0.5mils but never more than 1 mil. I guess I'm trying to understand a shooting situation where you would need more than 1mil. If you have dialed way up for 1000 yards and then need to hold under for a 600yd target, something like that?

Personally, I love the open top half, as I have always desired having viewing area that doesn't have reticle on it. All I'm doing there is watching for splash or searching for target.
Click to expand...
4 mils above would be sufficient. That’s what their non-Xmas tree reticle has. I went into way more detail on my style of match shooting in previous posts, but yes long range hold unders and spinners are two specific examples where I prefer to have the option of using a hold under greater than 1 mil.
 
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#71
wjm308 said:
Would someone at SHOT ask Leica about the price vs build on this scope? I'm sure they'll give you a typically "sales" answer, but with the Magnus 2.4-16 SFP scope coming in more expensive than the 5-30 FFP with turrets, I'm just curious what compromises they made to meet this specific price point. Are they not using their high end glass like the Magnus, or what else were they able to do to bring the price down, is the scope not made in Germany? Anything that might give us a clue. I'm not saying the scope won't be a performer, it definitely has my curiosity for sure, but I think most of us familiar with Leica were expecting a price tag a bit higher.
Click to expand...

I'm guessing the answer is market based. S&B had to revamp their pricing on the PMii because they priced themselves out. I think (hope) leica had this realization from the beginning.
 
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#72
What scopes do you guys think Leica is looking to compete most directly against? SuB PMII, Nightforce ATACR, Kahles K256, Minox ZP5, Vortex Razor would be my guess... which are all in the relative price range ($3k ish) that this new Leica offering is in, with perhaps Leica looking to set their price at the low end in order to compete and find a large enough pool of buyers to matter.

I don't think they are looking at $4k and above market like TT, or Hensoldt; those scopes have tiny shares of the market, probably not enough for a large co. like Leica. ZCO also too new and too small to set a market price.

In this context, I think the Leica price makes sense. (And doesn't necessarily reflect a poorly made product.)
 
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#73
Jackomason said:
I'm guessing the answer is market based. S&B had to revamp their pricing on the PMii because they priced themselves out. I think (hope) leica had this realization from the beginning.
Click to expand...
That's what I'm hoping Jack, that Leica is pricing this based on the market they are competing with and not because they dumb'd it down in order to meet a price.
 
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#74
samb300 said:
I'm referring to PRS stages where you can't touch your scope on the clock, but aren't required to keep it at a true zero. So you can dial the elevation for 700yds. Hold under for the 500 and 600 targets, dead on at 700, and hold over for 800, 900, 1000. You end up staying in the center of the reticle.

I also use it to save time on near-far stages. All of my club matches are 90 seconds. When we have a 300/600 stage (back and forth, 1 shot each) there is not enough time to dial each target. If there is no wind, I prefer to dial for the 600yd target for higher precision, and hold under for the 300yd target where I can get away with a worse wind call.
Click to expand...

You're not alone, I use hold unders pretty regularly. I am running a non-tree reticle though so for some stages the decision to hold over or under is dependent on my need for precise wind holds.

I think on those near/far multiple position stages with no time to dial I'd still prefer to hold under on the larger/closer target and have the crosshairs for precision on the smaller/farther target.
 
#75
Tono said:
I hope that this is accurate as I'm in the market for a scope.

Once these hit the streets, I really want to know more about the glass, edge distortion, depth of field, parallax, CA and such.

Specs from EuroOptics webpage: (https://www.eurooptic.com/Leica-PRS-5-30x56-i-PRB-Riflescope-51300.aspx)

Scope Weight:36.3 oz Net
Scope Length:14.37 inch
Magnification Range:5-30x
Scope Objective Diameter:56mm
Scope Tube Size / Mount:34mm
Turret Adjustment (Click Value):.1 MIL
Elevation Turret Details:32 MIL
Parallax Adjustment:adjustable, 21.9 yds / 20 m to infinity
Reticle Position:First Focal Plane
Reticle Details:PRB Reticle
Field of View:9 yds - 1.42 yds @ 109 yds
Exit Pupil:9-2 mm
Eye Relief:> 90 mm
Light Transmission> 90%
Illuminated Reticle:Yes
Scope Finish:Black
Product TypeRiflescopes
UPC799429513009
MPN51300
Click to expand...

FOV seems on or above par with other scopes in its class, the k525i is at 7.2yards~ @100yrds as an example. And a pretty close parallax but that doesnt do much for me.
 
#76
My general impressions of the scope from a PRS perspective are, it’s good. Reticle is ok. Could use a few changes, but generally not bad. Turrets are pre production so anyone that felt the current ones at the show just be aware of that. Even the 2 floor samples had different feeling elevation turrets.

Price point is on purpose to serve a market they are looking to compete in.

I won’t judge glass quality indoors.
 
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#77
I am getting aroused.... The 10 mil turrets, form factor, tool-less turrets (even the onboard allen key) Leica glass, FOV, nice reticle, and of course the price all point towards a potentially awesome and competitive scope. I can't wait to see some more on this new scope. Hell I'm not even in the market but this looks good enough to check out.
 
#83
I've said this elsewhere here, but I have a Magnus on my hunting rifle and frankly, a better hunting scope I have not had. Glass is excellent and tracking is spot on. (Even if turret feel is not up to TT level).

I am really interested in Ilya's review.
 
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#89
I'm very interested in this scope. So few good tool-less turret options. TT is out of my $ reach.
If I have one rimfire and one centerfire match rifle, but shoot different ammos, Center-X and SKM and SKLR above 40 degrees and Bi-Polar below 40, I want to adjust the turret easily instead of adding/substracting dope on the fly. My brain and fingers can't cope, lol. A quick flip turret re-zero would be great, and this parallaxes down to 20m as well, hmmmm.
Also, if I'm shooting one steel match stage that maxes at 600y, I want to shoot my 175smks, but if i'm shooting out to 1200y, then I want my 185jugs or 178bthps. Both my rimfire and centerfire ammos all shift zeros within .2-.6 mils depending, enough that i want to re-zero the turret instead of pull an allen, fiddle with tiny screws, and spin internals. I run a Razor 2 and AMG for center and rim fire for reference.
This type of toolless turret is so welcome IMHO, glad to Leica bring it @$2500. I was saving for ZCO/TT and hoping ZCO goes toolless someday, but if this turns out to be a great scope, my focus is on Leica. Hope to see some good verified reviews and photos down the road, and very excited for Ilya's!
 
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#91
StrayDog said:
I'm very interested in this scope. So few good tool-less turret options. TT is out of my $ reach.
If I have one rimfire and one centerfire match rifle, but shoot different ammos, Center-X above 40 degrees and Bi-Polar below 40, I want to adjust the turret easily instead of adding/substracting dope on the fly. My brain and fingers can't cope, lol. A quick flip turret re-zero would be great, and this parallaxes down to 20m as well, hmmmm.
Also, if I'm shooting one steel match stage that maxes at 600y, I want to shoot my 175smks, but if i'm shooting out to 1200y, then I want my 185jugs. Both my rimfire and centerfire ammos shift zeros within .2-.6 mils depending, enough that i want to re-zero the turret instead of pull an allen, fiddle with tiny screws, and spin internals. I run a Razor 2 and AMG for center and rim fire for reference.
This type of toolless turret is so welcome IMHO, glad to Leica bring it @$2500. I was saving for ZCO/TT and hoping ZCO goes toolless someday, but if this turns out to be a great scope, my focus is on Leica. Hope to see some good verified reviews and photos down the road, and very excited for Ilya's!
Click to expand...

It is not a toolless re-zero like TT. You can open up the turret without tools, but you still need to use a small hex wrench to reset the zerostop.

ILya
 
#92
wjm308 said:
Would someone at SHOT ask Leica about the price vs build on this scope? I'm sure they'll give you a typically "sales" answer, but with the Magnus 2.4-16 SFP scope coming in more expensive than the 5-30 FFP with turrets, I'm just curious what compromises they made to meet this specific price point. Are they not using their high end glass like the Magnus, or what else were they able to do to bring the price down, is the scope not made in Germany? Anything that might give us a clue. I'm not saying the scope won't be a performer, it definitely has my curiosity for sure, but I think most of us familiar with Leica were expecting a price tag a bit higher.
Click to expand...

Do you really think they'll tell you those things?

LOL
 
#93
koshkin said:
It is not a toolless re-zero like TT. You can open up the turret without tools, but you still need to use a small hex wrench to reset the zerostop.

ILya
Click to expand...

Thanks Ilya, never played with a TT.
But does that mean if I set zero-stop 1.0 full Mil low, then I can still reset my turret zero within that range without resetting the actual zero-stop, cuz I could live happy with that... My old NF F1 is set low like this, so I can re-align a turret zero without hitting the zero-stop, but to do that without allens would be cool.
 
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#96
StrayDog said:
Thanks Ilya, never played with a TT.
But does that mean if I set zero-stop 1.0 full Mil low, then I can still reset my turret zero within that range without resetting the actual zero-stop, cuz I could live happy with that... My old NF F1 is set low like this, so I can re-align a turret zero without hitting the zero-stop.
Click to expand...

I think so, but I did not look that far. I will investigate all of that very carefully when I have the scope.

ILya
 
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#98
wjm308 said:
ILya has a way of getting information out of people ;)
Click to expand...

Manufacturing companies consider most of the technical, manufacturing, and sourcing information related to their products to be highly confidential if not outright proprietary.

Whatever they tell him (or anyone not employed) is but a fraction of what there is, and Ilya will be the first to tell you himself.

While I don't work in optics mfg, I do work in a project engineering/project management capacity in a highly technical mfg industry and have for the last 25 yrs.

So I'm not really speculating about this. There is NFW we would divulge the kinds of things you're asking to someone not in our payroll.
 
#99
308pirate said:
Manufacturing companies consider most of the technical, manufacturing, and sourcing information related to their products to be highly confidential if not outright proprietary.

Whatever they tell him (or anyone not employed) is but a fraction of what there is, and Ilya will be the first to tell you himself.

While I don't work in optics mfg, I do work in a project engineering/project management capacity in a highly technical mfg industry and have for the last 25 yrs.

So I'm not really speculating about this. There is NFW we would divulge the kinds of things you're asking to someone not in our payroll.
Click to expand...
This is not always the case, while some manufacturers prefer to keep as much as possible under wraps, there are ways of finding certain things out. For example, not many companies do not want you to know where their scopes (or certain models) are OEM'd, but we find out that LOW makes scopes for Vortex, Bushnell, Sig, etc. We can also find out where scopes are manufactured by the country stamp on the scope, so if the Leica PRS were to have Japan stamped then we know it's probably not to the quality of the Magnus and so forth. So while what you say is probably true to a point some of this information has a way of making itself known over time.
 
#100
I asked the rep. Made in Portugal.
24B1219A-DD87-414D-9038-7BF3FA818C36.jpeg
 
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