Leofoto, new Official Rifle Ball Head of PRS

[B y r o n]

Well they make too quality gear and constantly innovate.

They are nearly always sold out.

So
Why would they waste money on advertising ?


Leochyna wouldn’t have anything to copy if RRS didn’t make it first

Are you sure about that?

"Leofoto vs RRS
People used to think of Leofoto as a chinese copy or imitation of the Really Right Stuff tripods and gear, well not anymore. This inverted leg tripod design by Leofoto is a first in the industry and truly a game changer when it comes to shooting tripods."

I found that info here.

 

[BurtG]

Are you sure about that?

"Leofoto vs RRS
People used to think of Leofoto as a chinese copy or imitation of the Really Right Stuff tripods and gear, well not anymore. This inverted leg tripod design by Leofoto is a first in the industry and truly a game changer when it comes to shooting tripods."

I found that info here.

Oh really ? Here’s posts about the RRS 22i in 2020

RRS TVC-22i seated position

Can someone that has one of these measure the distance from tripod leg “foot to foot” when shooting from a seated position? I’m 6’ and looking to buy an RRS tripod and have settled on either the TVC-22i or the TFCT-34L. But, I’ve got a particular application where I’m constrained on the...

www.snipershide.com

When did LeoChynas come out ?

 

[st1650]

Of all the things to cheap out on, ballheads are the worst. Nothing more painful and rage inducing than seeing a fully kitted out custom action, alpha glass, and the shooter running it on an aluminum leg tripod with a cheap 50$ amazon Swiss ballhead. You can make it work with cheap legs if you fill them with expanding foam or even chink carbon fiber legs are fine but at the very least get an anvil or a rrs leveling head FFS.

 

[MPHReallyRightStuff]

Quoting an ignorant statement from someone who receives a commission..."Bold strategy Cotton"

 

[hic28]

Fuck leofoto.

 

[NateVA]

Are you sure about that?

"Leofoto vs RRS
People used to think of Leofoto as a chinese copy or imitation of the Really Right Stuff tripods and gear, well not anymore. This inverted leg tripod design by Leofoto is a first in the industry and truly a game changer when it comes to shooting tripods."

I found that info here.

Leofoto is actually latin for tripod, they invented the concept of the tripod itself and have been selling them for thousands of years. We're just saying random stuff, right?

 

[B y r o n]

Quoting an ignorant statement from someone who receives a commission..."Bold strategy Cotton"

Not sure if this was directed at me or not but since you might have access to source data, do you know when RRS came out with the inverted tripod or even when Leofoto came out with their's? Seems neither manufactures site seems to post this information.

 

[b6graham]

Are you sure about that?

"Leofoto vs RRS
People used to think of Leofoto as a chinese copy or imitation of the Really Right Stuff tripods and gear, well not anymore. This inverted leg tripod design by Leofoto is a first in the industry and truly a game changer when it comes to shooting tripods."

I found that info here.

so leofoto came out with the Anvil style ballhead too right? and RRS copied them just like with the inverted tripod?

 

[B y r o n]

so leofoto came out with the Anvil style ballhead too right? and RRS copied them just like with the inverted tripod?

I never said that, my post was only about the inverted leg tripod.

 

[MPHReallyRightStuff]

We first shipped a TVC-22i to an online order Feb 26, 2020.

We displayed it for the first time at Shot Show in January of 2020.

No we do not put date of first sale on every product listing we publish on the site, most companies don’t. We value innovation and try to create new products either not previously seen or with drastic improvements to solutions on the market.

I do not have the data for their products nor do I really care. As a shooter, I take pride in working with fellow service members, competitive shooters, and hunters that push the envelope to come out with great products that’ll help serve you. If our products don’t fit your budget, that’s fine. I do find it hard to defend our products against theirs though. If you do some homework you’ll find patent infringements and direct copies around every corner of their site from multiple companies. That New Zealand dealer pushes their IP infringing products continuously. We do well to help catch the infringing products from coming to the US. But the product ideas that can’t be patented just instantly have very similar looking competition. You be the judge.

FYI I wasn’t trying to be rude to you at all Byron. Making an observation, you taking a statement from someone who receives a monetary sum from a company they don’t even work for as gold is a risky move.




The video is posted Feb 2020 on YouTube, FB, and Insta.

 

[Milf Dots]

Fuck leofoto.

This ^^^ .

 

[B y r o n]

We first shipped a TVC-22i to an online order Feb 26, 2020.

We displayed it for the first time at Shot Show in January of 2020.

No we do not put date of first sale on every product listing we publish on the site, most companies don’t. We value innovation and try to create new products either not previously seen or with drastic improvements to solutions on the market.

I do not have the data for their products nor do I really care. As a shooter, I take pride in working with fellow service members, competitive shooters, and hunters that push the envelope to come out with great products that’ll help serve you. If our products don’t fit your budget, that’s fine. I do find it hard to defend our products against theirs though. If you do some homework you’ll find patent infringements and direct copies around every corner of their site from multiple companies. That New Zealand dealer pushes their IP infringing products continuously. We do well to help catch the infringing products from coming to the US. But the product ideas that can’t be patented just instantly have very similar looking competition. You be the judge.

FYI I wasn’t trying to be rude to you at all Byron. Making an observation, you taking a statement from someone who receives a monetary sum from a company they don’t even work for as gold is a risky move.




The video is posted Feb 2020 on YouTube, FB, and Insta.

I was only going on information I could find. I could not find any indication that he was receiving any benefit from Leofoto, only that he received money from Amazon. I did try and do a patent search but was unable to find any information.

 

[hic28]

This ^^^ .

 

[MPHReallyRightStuff]

An inverted tripod is not patent worthy in this general scenario. We have aspects of our tripod that are patented but no the idea of an inverted isn’t patented nor were we the first. That is why I believe I named the video “Our first” inverted tripod. You can go back to the 70’s and find inverted tubes. RRS was just the first company to make and donate products for this sport. When others saw there was money to be made, just like any other industry it became popular real quick.

I started going to events for RRS at the end of 2015 after I got off active duty. The only tripod products you will see before then are some Manfrotos, bushnells, and some more wallyworld specials with homemade fab work on it. Do some more research and you’ll be hard pressed to find a single arca-Swiss type rail, clamp, head, etc designed for shooters aside from the Hog Saddle and the bushnell kit contracts for the US Army in 2012. My point it’s not really about the chicken or the egg, more about the ethics of that company and do you want to align yourself with them. Do we want them to represent us shooters. Being an official sponsor of a league in effect means they do speak for the shooters. You better believe they will or are pushing that language left and right.

 

[B y r o n]

An inverted tripod is not patent worthy in this general scenario. We have aspects of our tripod that are patented but no the idea of an inverted isn’t patented nor were we the first. That is why I believe I named the video “Our first” inverted tripod. You can go back to the 70’s and find inverted tubes. RRS was just the first company to make and donate products for this sport. When others saw there was money to be made, just like any other industry it became popular real quick.

I started going to events for RRS at the end of 2015 after I got off active duty. The only tripod products you will see before then are some Manfrotos, bushnells, and some more wallyworld specials with homemade fab work on it. Do some more research and you’ll be hard pressed to find a single arca-Swiss type rail, clamp, head, etc designed for shooters aside from the Hog Saddle and the bushnell kit contracts for the US Army in 2012. My point it’s not really about the chicken or the egg, more about the ethics of that company and do you want to align yourself with them. Do we want them to represent us shooters. Being an official sponsor of a league in effect means they do speak for the shooters. You better believe they will or are pushing that language left and right.

So when the reviewer stated that the Leofoto inverted tripod was the first, and you claim you were not the first, the statement could be true!

I am not say RRS was not the first to donate to the sport.

I do find it interesting that Leofoto has a 10 year warranty where RRS is only 5 years. I also find it interesting that Leofoto says they use "TORAY 100% 10-Layer Carbon Fiber" and RRS does not list what brand or how many layers of carbon fiber are used in their tripods. I also find it odd that RRS does not specify the bowl size or their adapters so you can determine if they will fit other brands of tripods. 75 and 100 seem to be the common sizes but I see no reference to either.

I'm simply trying to find a good tripod at a reasonable price. I have not been able to find a justification for spending the amount of money that RRS wants for their product. I've also not been able to find anything that indicates the Leofoto has infringed on anyone as far as intellectual property with respect to their inverter tripods.

I'm not trying to argue, I'm simply looking for facts so that I can make an informed purchase.

 

[hic28]

So when the reviewer stated that the Leofoto inverted tripod was the first, and you claim you were not the first, the statement could be true!

I am not say RRS was not the first to donate to the sport.

I do find it interesting that Leofoto has a 10 year warranty where RRS is only 5 years. I also find it interesting that Leofoto says they use "TORAY 100% 10-Layer Carbon Fiber" and RRS does not list what brand or how many layers of carbon fiber are used in their tripods. I also find it odd that RRS does not specify the bowl size or their adapters so you can determine if they will fit other brands of tripods. 75 and 100 seem to be the common sizes but I see no reference to either.

I'm simply trying to find a good tripod at a reasonable price. I have not been able to find a justification for spending the amount of money that RRS wants for their product. I've also not been able to find anything that indicates the Leofoto has infringed on anyone as far as intellectual property with respect to their inverter tripods.

I'm not trying to argue, I'm simply looking for facts so that I can make an informed purchase.

Hopefully I can help with some objective observations. I have shot in some of the shittiest conditions around the country, places that test equipment.

The only tripods I have not seen lockup or completely fail has been RRS. The lock rings, threads, ball heads, seem to be the weak links of the China branded tripods. There are plenty of people who can verify what I’m saying because they were at the same matches.

I am not sponsored by RRS. I also say fuck leofoto because they blatantly copied one of my products as well.

 

[MPHReallyRightStuff]

As far as our inverted tripod and the one you linked m, I will hold firm ours came out first, but that’s just a statement I’m saying and I have no dates of their gear. Take it for what it’s worth.

My statement about inverted tripods were around in the 70s was specifically for why the invented tripod can’t be patented.

I’m not going to rant about anything else. Chose what you want and what works for you. If you don’t value 100% US made products fell free to go the Italian or Chinese routes. If you do value that standard, you’ll be hard pressed to find a better one.

 

[tba]

I grew up in the 50's. At that time it was very popular to badmouth Japanese products.

 

[Milf Dots]

So when the reviewer stated that the Leofoto inverted tripod was the first, and you claim you were not the first, the statement could be true!

I am not say RRS was not the first to donate to the sport.

I do find it interesting that Leofoto has a 10 year warranty where RRS is only 5 years. I also find it interesting that Leofoto says they use "TORAY 100% 10-Layer Carbon Fiber" and RRS does not list what brand or how many layers of carbon fiber are used in their tripods. I also find it odd that RRS does not specify the bowl size or their adapters so you can determine if they will fit other brands of tripods. 75 and 100 seem to be the common sizes but I see no reference to either.

I'm simply trying to find a good tripod at a reasonable price. I have not been able to find a justification for spending the amount of money that RRS wants for their product. I've also not been able to find anything that indicates the Leofoto has infringed on anyone as far as intellectual property with respect to their inverter tripods.

I'm not trying to argue, I'm simply looking for facts so that I can make an informed purchase.

One can get a good tripod at a reasonable price, and still avoid buying OEM C**** products... How about SLIK... ? Or a used RRS?

 

[vh20]

I grew up in the 50's. At that time it was very popular to badmouth Japanese products.

For good reason.

 

[Dobermann]

IP notwithstanding, does RRS PRS do anything to support PRS?

Fixed it for you!

 

[The Godfather]

So when the reviewer stated that the Leofoto inverted tripod was the first, and you claim you were not the first, the statement could be true!

I am not say RRS was not the first to donate to the sport.

I do find it interesting that Leofoto has a 10 year warranty where RRS is only 5 years. I also find it interesting that Leofoto says they use "TORAY 100% 10-Layer Carbon Fiber" and RRS does not list what brand or how many layers of carbon fiber are used in their tripods. I also find it odd that RRS does not specify the bowl size or their adapters so you can determine if they will fit other brands of tripods. 75 and 100 seem to be the common sizes but I see no reference to either.

I'm simply trying to find a good tripod at a reasonable price. I have not been able to find a justification for spending the amount of money that RRS wants for their product. I've also not been able to find anything that indicates the Leofoto has infringed on anyone as far as intellectual property with respect to their inverter tripods.

I'm not trying to argue, I'm simply looking for facts so that I can make an informed purchase.

Sounds like you’ve done the research! Go for it! I’d also suggest a nice Tasco scope and paintball/ripoff Atlas bipod to go with your $8500 Tac Ops…

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

One can get a good tripod at a reasonable price, and still avoid buying OEM C**** products... How about Two Vets, Slik... ? Or a used RRS?

Did 2 vets start getting their tripods made in the USA now? They used go be made in China but I remember the owner saying they'd like to change that, so did they?

 

[NateVA]

So when the reviewer stated that the Leofoto inverted tripod was the first, and you claim you were not the first, the statement could be true!

I do find it interesting that Leofoto has a 10 year warranty where RRS is only 5 years. I also find it interesting that Leofoto says they use "TORAY 100% 10-Layer Carbon Fiber" and RRS does not list what brand or how many layers of carbon fiber are used in their tripods.

I'm not trying to argue, I'm simply looking for facts so that I can make an informed purchase.

1. Wasn't Leofoto founded in 2014? So if the first inverted tripods were in the 1970s your statement quite literally could not be true due to... how time works?

2. I find it interesting how Vortex/Leupold have a lifetime no questions asked warranty and Tangent Theta/ZCO have only a limited one for manufacturer defects. Maybe there's a reason for that.

3. I don't think RRS feels the need to expand on every detail of their manufacturing process given everyone with any sense at all knows they're the best by a country mile. Plus what separates various higher-end tripods is almost never how many layers of carbon fiber the legs have. And the more they explain, the easier it is for "other companies" to copy their processes.

You might not be trying to argue but some of your questions are leading and/or phrased in a borderline insulting way.

 

[beetroot]

We first shipped a TVC-22i to an online order Feb 26, 2020.

We displayed it for the first time at Shot Show in January of 2020.

No we do not put date of first sale on every product listing we publish on the site, most companies don’t. We value innovation and try to create new products either not previously seen or with drastic improvements to solutions on the market.

I do not have the data for their products nor do I really care. As a shooter, I take pride in working with fellow service members, competitive shooters, and hunters that push the envelope to come out with great products that’ll help serve you. If our products don’t fit your budget, that’s fine. I do find it hard to defend our products against theirs though. If you do some homework you’ll find patent infringements and direct copies around every corner of their site from multiple companies. That New Zealand dealer pushes their IP infringing products continuously. We do well to help catch the infringing products from coming to the US. But the product ideas that can’t be patented just instantly have very similar looking competition. You be the judge.

FYI I wasn’t trying to be rude to you at all Byron. Making an observation, you taking a statement from someone who receives a monetary sum from a company they don’t even work for as gold is a risky move.




The video is posted Feb 2020 on YouTube, FB, and Insta.

That NZ dealer got a lot of grief recently for trying to get Leofot to make a copy of the Able Table.

There's quite a few people that don't seem to keen on the way they do business but at the same time they support quite a few shooting events down here.

Not sure what will happen to them but people in NZ seem to have very short memories.

 

[lash]

Not sure what will happen to them but people in NZ seem to have very short memories

Unfortunately, so do most people of any culture/location.

 

[Cascade Hemi]

I don't care if RRS donates to PRS. Some prize table at some match somewhere is meaningless. I don't have any involvement in PRS. As a buyer, and user, of RRS products I don't feel like they have much support for the consumer. I have spent thousands of dollars on RRS, and maybe one hundred dollars on Leofoto, and I find the whining a huge turn off. Either take legal action or shut up, your IP is your problem. I'd probably feel differently if I didn't think RRS would soak me at the first opportunity.

 

[hic28]

I don't care if RRS donates to PRS. Some prize table at some match somewhere is meaningless. I don't have any involvement in PRS. As a buyer, and user, of RRS products I don't feel like they have much support for the consumer. I have spent thousands of dollars on RRS, and maybe one hundred dollars on Leofoto, and I find the whining a huge turn off. Either take legal action or shut up, your IP is your problem. I'd probably feel differently if I didn't think RRS would soak me at the first opportunity.

I believe they have tried taking legal action many times over and it goes nowhere because China doesnt give a fuck and it unenforceable.

Hell, the lawyers I talked to said we would be better off burning the cash in a fire pit because at least it would keep us warm than trying to get in a patent battle with a Chinese company

 

[NateVA]

Out of curiosity I took a look at Leofoto's inverted tripods and all of them were put on the website in February and April of 2021. So about a year or more after RRS started shipping theirs. For anyone else who was curious I hope that helps clear it up.

 

[Fig]

I grew up in the 50's. At that time it was very popular to badmouth Japanese products.

True, but that's before they went socialist in the '80s and tanked and stagnated their entire economy. Arc of success.

We can only hope that the Chinese will abandon mercantilism for socialism, then they too will become a basket case...
Though, unlikely since they basically stopped their entire economy for fifty years and caused massive starvation. They're too smart to give communism another go.

 

[MPHReallyRightStuff]

@Cascade Hemi Respectfully, what can I do better in your opinion to support the consumer? Apologies you feel like my involvement on the hide is whining. Someone made a comment that was opposite of my truth so I stated it. Product knowledge is a word of mouth game, if you are not speaking out your simply throwing the dice and hope people research.

I enjoy helping out and attending PRS, NRL Hunter, and Military matches personally. If that is not your cup of tea that is completely fine, just giving background. I am concerned about your statement about the company hence me reaching out. I don't own the company, I just initiated the division and run it. I like working with shooters and coming out with products when a problem needs solving. Although I run the division I make sure myself and my one employee are on the phones everyday listening to customers and taking part in this community. Please whether you want to do this here or in PM I would like to know your thoughts.

As far as the legal stuff, yeah been there, still there, and its painful as @hic28 stated. Biggest problem , a company like this makes a product and sells it to as many US dealers as possible who are unknowing of the IP issues. Then I have to deal with lawyers and talk to those companies, many receive letters to stop selling and they are left holding the products. Rinse and repeat, its crappy.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

As far as our inverted tripod and the one you linked m, I will hold firm ours came out first, but that’s just a statement I’m saying and I have no dates of their gear. Take it for what it’s worth.

My statement about inverted tripods were around in the 70s was specifically for why the invented tripod can’t be patented.

I’m not going to rant about anything else. Chose what you want and what works for you. If you don’t value 100% US made products fell free to go the Italian or Chinese routes. If you do value that standard, you’ll be hard pressed to find a better one.

From what I can tell Leofoto took a little over a year to announce their copy. Most of what I’m seeing puts them at April 2021 release.

@B y r o n you can go right to Leofotos US website and click on the big capitalized “PROGRAM” tab > “Affiliate Program” and read all about their 8-10% commissions kick backs to the influencers. So when someone who makes a living writing reviews or doing video reviews gets paid for you to buy one brand vs the other it hardly takes a genius to figure which one they’re going to recommend.

 

[Taylorbok]

@B y r o n the Leofoto is litterally named after the RRS version.

 

[slowworm]

I believe they have tried taking legal action many times over and it goes nowhere because China doesnt give a fuck and it unenforceable.

Hell, the lawyers I talked to said we would be better off burning the cash in a fire pit because at least it would keep us warm than trying to get in a patent battle with a Chinese company

Putting all issues of Chinese manufacture aside for a moment. So I'm not defending Leofoto. Also, not a lawyer but...

IP dress is certainly enforceable in the US, and if RRS really had a solid claim, they could get it enforced. The issue is that they actually have a fairly weak case.

The issue is really that ball heads are not new and were not invented by RRS. Also, anyone here who talks about using an RRS rail is impinging on the IP of Arca Swiss, who developed the rail spec and released the first ball head to use it sometime in the 90s I recall. And Newtons first reflecting telescope used a ball head. And Gitzo had the first carbon fiber tripod on the mass market.

So RRS is not an innovator here, and every rail we use is an arca swiss rail made by XYZ company. They make a good quality product derived from other companies originals. Heck, Arca Swiss ball heads have been made forever, probably long before RRS founders were even born.

The form of a ball head is governed by what it needs to do. Oddly enough, the form driving function issue has been litigated to death, in all places in the guitar industry. The body shape of most guitars cannot be trademarked or patented when the shape of the body is driven primarily by playability. So, the Les Paul, Strat, Tele and SG body styles are not protected from copying, which is why you have seen so many generic versions of them from so many vendors.

But the Gibson flying V body is protected, because it is purely stylistic. So, you will only ever see a flying V from Gibson or Epiphone, and Gibson really does protect that IP with venom and vigor.

Headstock shapes however are purely stylistic and are protected, which is why you will only ever see a Fender shaped headstock on a Fender branded or licensed product. Likewise, the classic Gibson tilted headstock is very much protected. Both Fender and Gibson protect that IP.

If RRS had a design that really was form over function, they would have a much stronger case. But then it would not be as usable. As it is, if they really try to enforce what they claim is their IP, they will have to also argue why they are so different from the Arca Swiss original and that the form is not driven by function.

I'm not saying any of this is fair or justified (I think it isn't fair on the whole), but that is pretty much how I interpret things as they stand with current case law.

 

[vh20]

As a buyer, and user, of RRS products I don't feel like they have much support for the consumer. I have spent thousands of dollars on RRS...

What kind of problems have you experienced with their customer support?

 

[hic28]

@slowworm, @MPHReallyRightStuff correct me off I’m wrong but I believe it’s not the inverted ball that is the IP, but the locking mechanism designed for control and ease of use with one hand while controlling the rifle with the other which is the first of its kind.

 

[MPHReallyRightStuff]

The Lever Release Anvil had a strong case that is why it has won and been pulled from the US market. But it is still being sold in other countries. Aside from that I can not answer alot of the IP questions at the moment.

 

[Cascade Hemi]

@Cascade Hemi Respectfully, what can I do better in your opinion to support the consumer? Apologies you feel like my involvement on the hide is whining. Someone made a comment that was opposite of my truth so I stated it. Product knowledge is a word of mouth game, if you are not speaking out your simply throwing the dice and hope people research.

I enjoy helping out and attending PRS, NRL Hunter, and Military matches personally. If that is not your cup of tea that is completely fine, just giving background. I am concerned about your statement about the company hence me reaching out. I don't own the company, I just initiated the division and run it. I like working with shooters and coming out with products when a problem needs solving. Although I run the division I make sure myself and my one employee are on the phones everyday listening to customers and taking part in this community. Please whether you want to do this here or in PM I would like to know your thoughts.

As far as the legal stuff, yeah been there, still there, and its painful as @hic28 stated. Biggest problem , a company like this makes a product and sells it to as many US dealers as possible who are unknowing of the IP issues. Then I have to deal with lawyers and talk to those companies, many receive letters to stop selling and they are left holding the products. Rinse and repeat, its crappy.

Users on this forum have reported warn out leg locking mechanisms and having to pay hundreds of dollars to have RRS fix them. I don't remember the exact amount I spent because it's been so long but I think I'm in well over $1300 and out of warranty.

 

[LeftyJason]

Whenever I get a tripod I'm going with rrs. Their hq (where stuff is manufactured as well) is 48 miles from my house. I was down for my nephews wedding on a Friday afternoon and was in the area with my camera. Wife and I went in their showroom (@MPHReallyRightStuff himself wasn't there) and the employees let us play with stuff. The wife understands more why I want the nice tripod cause I let her play with it letting the employees help her. They were great. We previously had a Manfrotto 055carbon tripod for a month before it was stolen quite a few years ago.

I even learned about the new butterfly locking lever. Missed that here somehow. It's nice. Also learned that I don't need an L. Too short to need the L. Going tvc34 with a bh55 head. Also learned about the leg qd collar. That's nice too. Bought an arca foot for my new lens when I was there.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

Users on this forum have reported warn out leg locking mechanisms and having to pay hundreds of dollars to have RRS fix them. I don't remember the exact amount I spent because it's been so long but I think I'm in well over $1300 and out of warranty.

Why should RRS cover wear and tear for free? Pretty much every warranty excludes normal wear and tear and it's completely unreasonable to expect a company to cover that. It's also completely unreasonable to expect a product with wear items to last a lifetime with no service and you said it yourself though that they're worn out.

 

[MPHReallyRightStuff]

@Cascade Hemi I understood and thank you for the insight. The plastic anti-twist pieces that are ware items and worn faster when practicing for fast deployment are found here https://rrssoar.com/anti-twist-sleeves/ and are 2$. The actual twist locks with the rubber molded and the aluminum interior are ordered through me. I do not know of many that have ever worn out, but they can be replaced for 20$ ish dollars if its not determined to be a defect. If that happens I typically just send them out because it happens so rare something must be up.

We will still work with you if your product is out of warranty, you are a customer and I want you to continue to be happy. Warranty is just replacing all products due to manufacturer defects and workmanship. If they break a full section of carbon or something going to down a cliff or running over with a truck is a little outside of warranty and yes that would cost 100s of dollars depending on the scale.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

@Cascade Hemi I understood and thank you for the insight. The plastic anti-twist pieces that are ware items and worn faster when practicing for fast deployment are found here https://rrssoar.com/anti-twist-sleeves/ and are 2$. The actual twist locks with the rubber molded and the aluminum interior are ordered through me. I do not know of many that have ever worn out, but they can be replaced for 20$ ish dollars if its not determined to be a defect. If that happens I typically just send them out because it happens so rare something must be up.

We will still work with you if your product is out of warranty, you are a customer and I want you to continue to be happy. Warranty is just replacing all products due to manufacturer defects and workmanship. If they break a full section of carbon or something going to down a cliff or running over with a truck is a little outside of warranty and yes that would cost 100s of dollars depending on the scale.

So in a nutshell to replace both components if someone can manage to wear them out costs less than a box of ammo? That's hardly expensive. Good luck getting any parts or service on a chinese tripod outside of the warranty, you'd be buying a new tripod because that's just how the cheap import game works.

 

[RFutch]

@Cascade Hemi I understood and thank you for the insight. The plastic anti-twist pieces that are ware items and worn faster when practicing for fast deployment are found here https://rrssoar.com/anti-twist-sleeves/ and are 2$. The actual twist locks with the rubber molded and the aluminum interior are ordered through me. I do not know of many that have ever worn out, but they can be replaced for 20$ ish dollars if its not determined to be a defect. If that happens I typically just send them out because it happens so rare something must be up.

We will still work with you if your product is out of warranty, you are a customer and I want you to continue to be happy. Warranty is just replacing all products due to manufacturer defects and workmanship. If they break a full section of carbon or something going to down a cliff or running over with a truck is a little outside of warranty and yes that would cost 100s of dollars depending on the scale.

I'm glad to see this. I am wanting to upgrade my tripod, and though I'm not expecting a vortex type of warranty, I do want to spend money with someone who cares if customers are happy in long run.

 

[Cascade Hemi]

Why should RRS cover wear and tear for free? Pretty much every warranty excludes normal wear and tear and it's completely unreasonable to expect a company to cover that. It's also completely unreasonable to expect a product with wear items to last a lifetime with no service and you said it yourself though that they're worn out.

Well next time I'll buy the Chinese knock off for less than half the price, when it's worn out I'll just buy it again and still be money ahead. Why should any company support any customer service? Market competition for starters. There isn't just a little difference in price, it's a staggering difference and there plenty of alternatives than just Leofoto. No one said lifetime either, barely over five years is the example I gave.

 

[JLP83]

So when the reviewer stated that the Leofoto inverted tripod was the first, and you claim you were not the first, the statement could be true!

I am not say RRS was not the first to donate to the sport.

I do find it interesting that Leofoto has a 10 year warranty where RRS is only 5 years. I also find it interesting that Leofoto says they use "TORAY 100% 10-Layer Carbon Fiber" and RRS does not list what brand or how many layers of carbon fiber are used in their tripods. I also find it odd that RRS does not specify the bowl size or their adapters so you can determine if they will fit other brands of tripods. 75 and 100 seem to be the common sizes but I see no reference to either.

I'm simply trying to find a good tripod at a reasonable price. I have not been able to find a justification for spending the amount of money that RRS wants for their product. I've also not been able to find anything that indicates the Leofoto has infringed on anyone as far as intellectual property with respect to their inverter tripods.

I'm not trying to argue, I'm simply looking for facts so that I can make an informed purchase.

Try to use one of each for rear support on gravel or really any surface. It’s pretty obvious which brand has invested more into their product.

 

[jakelly]

I would pay retail for an HS Precision stock before I bought a Leofoto.

 

[jakelly]

I would hunt exclusively with a Troy pump AR before I bought a Leofoto.

 

[jakelly]

What a cesspool is PRS?!? What’s next sign Lon up as the spokesman?

 

[Cynical]

@Cascade Hemi I understood and thank you for the insight. The plastic anti-twist pieces that are ware items and worn faster when practicing for fast deployment are found here https://rrssoar.com/anti-twist-sleeves/ and are 2$. The actual twist locks with the rubber molded and the aluminum interior are ordered through me. I do not know of many that have ever worn out, but they can be replaced for 20$ ish dollars if its not determined to be a defect. If that happens I typically just send them out because it happens so rare something must be up.

We will still work with you if your product is out of warranty, you are a customer and I want you to continue to be happy. Warranty is just replacing all products due to manufacturer defects and workmanship. If they break a full section of carbon or something going to down a cliff or running over with a truck is a little outside of warranty and yes that would cost 100s of dollars depending on the scale.

Pretty solid customer service, especially with a guy that has like a 2 year history of dogging RRS on here.

 

[Cascade Hemi]

The truth hurts. For someone "dogging RRS for years", some of my feedback has gone into product improvements. What a terrible person I am, first I buy their product, then I give user feedback. Absolutely horrible.

Example of how shitty I am: