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LMT MWS or GAP AR10?
- Thread starter 9mmkungfu
- Start date
Re: LMT MWS or GAP AR10?
MWS then send it to GAP?
If you go with GAP dont be dumb and select an Armalight pattern. KAC (DPMS) or any of the custon receivers would be much better to build on due to availability of lower components as well as the magazine availability.
MWS then send it to GAP?
If you go with GAP dont be dumb and select an Armalight pattern. KAC (DPMS) or any of the custon receivers would be much better to build on due to availability of lower components as well as the magazine availability.
Re: LMT MWS or GAP AR10?
I own a AR-10 'canadian' SASS cut down to 18", a LMT MWS, a KAC SR-25EMC, and a Noveske AR-10 18" N6. Each have their own appeal. I have Timney drop in triggers for both the SASS and the AR10.. great, crisp triggers comparable IMHO to KAC.
I don't find a great deal of difference between KAC and the LMT vs. AR10. There's lots of part and mag availability for the AR10-- the market is flooded. AR10 mags are cheaper than KAC OEM mags, but more expensive than the Magpul mags.
Just check out gunbroker. Armalite's customer service is awesome as well.
I know Magpul doesn't make a mag for the AR10 but so what? Each of these rifles have their own appeal. I love the Noveske N6 18"-- its the most accurate out of the bunch--- but it is slightly more ammunition sensitive. I haven't had any issues with the AR10 mags-- I have about 14 of them that I rotate regularly.
The KAC and LMT eat whatever you feed them. I don't have a spare bolt parts kit yet for the MWS. I'm not sure they are available or are compatible with the KAC bolt. All of them are comparable shooters.. right at or below a minute if I do my part. All of them are within a 1.5-2lbs of each other..
I will say the KAC is the 'softest shooting' out of the rifles.. I don't know what they did but the recoil management is great with the stock flash hider. I have a vortex flash hider for the Noveske and the MWS. I have a Surefire brake on the SASS for a 762SS can I have. Barrel profile on the SASS is about the same as the KAC. The profiles on the LMT and the Noveske are both HEAVY-- a bit thicker (and heavier). The MWS and the Noveske are both 1/10 twist (I think).
I don't think there is much point sending the MWS to GAP. I don't think they can do much with the barrel (other than profile it) unless LMT starts offering their barrel extension.
One benefit of the LMT and the Noveske's-- they seem to run faster (velocity). For the same ammunition types over the KAC. The Noveske has the best velocity for the length of the rifles.
I think both the MWS and the Noveske have a polygonal bore profile-- that may have something to do with it. I can share chrono info if your interested.
All of these rifles are very accurate as well and great cold bore-- no more than about .25-.5 minute POI shift. I run denatured alcohol after cleaning the rifle's bore on my working guns and it seems to help with the first clean, cold, bore shot..
Bottom line-- you can't go wrong. Price wise-- I think the MWS is the best thing going for the money.. It's at least 500-800 cheaper than the Noveske, almost half the KAC, and about the same as an AR10 SASS.
Machining of the KAC and the MWS beat Armalite IMHO hands down. Noveske's upper however is something of beauty. The machining on the SWS rail that he contracts out is incredible. The AR10 SASS probably has the roughest fit/finish out of all of them. If you pull apart a Noveske gun you'll see he does little things to pins, holes, etc.. He ensures every part that goes into the lower is finely finished/fitted over the stock part. There's additional beveling on the brass pins, the buffer pin, etc. over a stock Armalite parts kit.
I've shot a couple GAP AR10s.. they are shooters-- incredible deal for the money with the right tube on them. I just don't like Badger's forend extension. Blech.
One man's opinion tho...
Core
I own a AR-10 'canadian' SASS cut down to 18", a LMT MWS, a KAC SR-25EMC, and a Noveske AR-10 18" N6. Each have their own appeal. I have Timney drop in triggers for both the SASS and the AR10.. great, crisp triggers comparable IMHO to KAC.
I don't find a great deal of difference between KAC and the LMT vs. AR10. There's lots of part and mag availability for the AR10-- the market is flooded. AR10 mags are cheaper than KAC OEM mags, but more expensive than the Magpul mags.
Just check out gunbroker. Armalite's customer service is awesome as well.
I know Magpul doesn't make a mag for the AR10 but so what? Each of these rifles have their own appeal. I love the Noveske N6 18"-- its the most accurate out of the bunch--- but it is slightly more ammunition sensitive. I haven't had any issues with the AR10 mags-- I have about 14 of them that I rotate regularly.
The KAC and LMT eat whatever you feed them. I don't have a spare bolt parts kit yet for the MWS. I'm not sure they are available or are compatible with the KAC bolt. All of them are comparable shooters.. right at or below a minute if I do my part. All of them are within a 1.5-2lbs of each other..
I will say the KAC is the 'softest shooting' out of the rifles.. I don't know what they did but the recoil management is great with the stock flash hider. I have a vortex flash hider for the Noveske and the MWS. I have a Surefire brake on the SASS for a 762SS can I have. Barrel profile on the SASS is about the same as the KAC. The profiles on the LMT and the Noveske are both HEAVY-- a bit thicker (and heavier). The MWS and the Noveske are both 1/10 twist (I think).
I don't think there is much point sending the MWS to GAP. I don't think they can do much with the barrel (other than profile it) unless LMT starts offering their barrel extension.
One benefit of the LMT and the Noveske's-- they seem to run faster (velocity). For the same ammunition types over the KAC. The Noveske has the best velocity for the length of the rifles.
I think both the MWS and the Noveske have a polygonal bore profile-- that may have something to do with it. I can share chrono info if your interested.
All of these rifles are very accurate as well and great cold bore-- no more than about .25-.5 minute POI shift. I run denatured alcohol after cleaning the rifle's bore on my working guns and it seems to help with the first clean, cold, bore shot..
Bottom line-- you can't go wrong. Price wise-- I think the MWS is the best thing going for the money.. It's at least 500-800 cheaper than the Noveske, almost half the KAC, and about the same as an AR10 SASS.
Machining of the KAC and the MWS beat Armalite IMHO hands down. Noveske's upper however is something of beauty. The machining on the SWS rail that he contracts out is incredible. The AR10 SASS probably has the roughest fit/finish out of all of them. If you pull apart a Noveske gun you'll see he does little things to pins, holes, etc.. He ensures every part that goes into the lower is finely finished/fitted over the stock part. There's additional beveling on the brass pins, the buffer pin, etc. over a stock Armalite parts kit.
I've shot a couple GAP AR10s.. they are shooters-- incredible deal for the money with the right tube on them. I just don't like Badger's forend extension. Blech.
One man's opinion tho...
Core
Re: LMT MWS or GAP AR10?
GAP AR-10. I have two, one in 260 and one in 308 and they're both very reliable and tack drivers. Yes, I do my part.
GAP AR-10. I have two, one in 260 and one in 308 and they're both very reliable and tack drivers. Yes, I do my part.
Re: LMT MWS or GAP AR10?
ETA: I swear when I read the title of this thread you were considering a POF or GAP...my mistake. No personal experience with the LMT, but what follows are some considerations for you. Sorry for any confusion...
Without knowing your intentions with the rifle, it is hard to make a reasonable recommendation between the two.
Both are excellent rifles, capable of sub-MOA accuracy, 100% reliability, and comparable prices (approx. $2500). The GAP 308 semis feature a 3/4 MOA guarantee which you'll find is easily accomplished with proper ammo and with the shooter doing their part. My P-308 20" is getting approx the same accuracy, but I am still working on developing "THE" load for it. I have had some groups in the 1/2 MOA range, but the rifle is consistently 3/4 MOA (still nothing to sneeze at).
The GAP can be had to your specs, with any number of options including barrel length/twist/contour/chamber, stock, grip, handguard, etc. The POF is basically only available from the factory with the same set of options/features with the only differences being barrel lengths (but can be easily customized by the end user to meet whatever specs you want aside from the bbl and handguard).
While you may ultimately get a slight accuracy advantage with the GAP (maybe an addt'l 1/4 MOA or less), I'd put my P-308 up against any 308 semi-auto on the market right now.
The other thing to consider is the wait-time you may be able to tolerate. I know that GAP did have one ready-to-go LR-308 rifle, but I am not sure if it is still around or not. If it is gone, you could experience a considerable wait to get a full build done unless you buy one from a current owner (they come up for sale here once in a while). On the other hand, several dealers have the P-308 rifles in stock and available for immediate shipment.
The question more or less comes down to whether you want/need a DI or short-stroke piston gas system. If you are going to be shooting the rifle suppressed, I'd advise you to lean toward the POF. Otherwise, get with GAP and have the rifle built by the best to your specs.
ETA: I swear when I read the title of this thread you were considering a POF or GAP...my mistake. No personal experience with the LMT, but what follows are some considerations for you. Sorry for any confusion...
Without knowing your intentions with the rifle, it is hard to make a reasonable recommendation between the two.
Both are excellent rifles, capable of sub-MOA accuracy, 100% reliability, and comparable prices (approx. $2500). The GAP 308 semis feature a 3/4 MOA guarantee which you'll find is easily accomplished with proper ammo and with the shooter doing their part. My P-308 20" is getting approx the same accuracy, but I am still working on developing "THE" load for it. I have had some groups in the 1/2 MOA range, but the rifle is consistently 3/4 MOA (still nothing to sneeze at).
The GAP can be had to your specs, with any number of options including barrel length/twist/contour/chamber, stock, grip, handguard, etc. The POF is basically only available from the factory with the same set of options/features with the only differences being barrel lengths (but can be easily customized by the end user to meet whatever specs you want aside from the bbl and handguard).
While you may ultimately get a slight accuracy advantage with the GAP (maybe an addt'l 1/4 MOA or less), I'd put my P-308 up against any 308 semi-auto on the market right now.
The other thing to consider is the wait-time you may be able to tolerate. I know that GAP did have one ready-to-go LR-308 rifle, but I am not sure if it is still around or not. If it is gone, you could experience a considerable wait to get a full build done unless you buy one from a current owner (they come up for sale here once in a while). On the other hand, several dealers have the P-308 rifles in stock and available for immediate shipment.
The question more or less comes down to whether you want/need a DI or short-stroke piston gas system. If you are going to be shooting the rifle suppressed, I'd advise you to lean toward the POF. Otherwise, get with GAP and have the rifle built by the best to your specs.
Re: LMT MWS or GAP AR10?
The GAP rifle I am considering has the DD 14" rail, so no "blech" Badger setup
It also has the Geissele Match trigger and seems to be priced reasonably. I do have a Gemtech Sandstorm that I plan on using with it also. Although it is an Armalite-pattern, the generation 2 mags don't seem to have issues and are priced reasonably during the 12-days of Armalite sale (Christmas).
Hmmm.
The GAP rifle I am considering has the DD 14" rail, so no "blech" Badger setup
Hmmm.
Re: LMT MWS or GAP AR10?
My vote is GAP all the way. You have tons of options and they are great to work with. I got my GAP in Feb. and it's incredible. I went with the DPMS parts because the wait for Armalite parts was outrageous and they said there wouldn't be a difference in accuracy once they got finished with it. They guarantee 3/4 MOA but they can do much better. I've shot several 1/2 MOA groups with 178 AMAX loads from HSM. Everything else has been around MOA or better but it definitely seems to perfer the 178s. If you go with GAP you have to be ready to wait. It took them a year to finish mine but it was definitely worth the wait!
My vote is GAP all the way. You have tons of options and they are great to work with. I got my GAP in Feb. and it's incredible. I went with the DPMS parts because the wait for Armalite parts was outrageous and they said there wouldn't be a difference in accuracy once they got finished with it. They guarantee 3/4 MOA but they can do much better. I've shot several 1/2 MOA groups with 178 AMAX loads from HSM. Everything else has been around MOA or better but it definitely seems to perfer the 178s. If you go with GAP you have to be ready to wait. It took them a year to finish mine but it was definitely worth the wait!
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