LMT Vs. KAC

A

Aircrew98

Private
Minuteman
Sep 20, 2010
13
0
44
United States
#1
I am driving myself crazy over what to buy. KAC or LMT. I realize either would be awesome, but am I missing something with the price difference in the LMT MWS 308 and a SR-25?

There is a pretty hefty premium for KAC equipment in this range and I could put the money towards glass. Maybe someone can enlighten me. Is this down to brand marketing and personal preference?
 
#2
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NavalAircrew</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am driving myself crazy over what to buy. KAC or LMT. I realize either would be awesome, but am I missing something with the price difference in the LMT MWS 308 and a SR-25?

There is a pretty hefty premium for KAC equipment in this range and I could put the money towards glass. Maybe someone can enlighten me. Is this down to brand marketing and personal preference? </div></div>

I have never used a KAC, and I bet they are really really nice, but I cannot fathom it could be much better then a noveske to cost twice as much...

In fact for as much as you pay for a KAC, I am surprised that it gets any bad reviews, but like any product it does..

I have however used LMT, and I like them. They are just milspec AR's, but still nice..

I did manage to scoop up a KAC SR-15 E3 Upper that I'm gonna put a Noveske N4 16" barrel on and thats gonna be my next little project build..

But to answer you're question, I think you can still get close to what you get out of a KAC rifle by going LMT and saving 2 or 3 times the money and buy other stuff..

Hell you can get an LMT and replace the barrel with a noveske barrel and get close to if not as good as accuracy as a KAC for half the money.. JMO..
 
#4
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

LMT has my vote.

I have been around plenty of Knights SR25s. I have shot a few Noveske 762 though I own an LMT. The LMT is so much easier on the wallet and the fit and function of LMT rifles are outstanding. KAC and Noveske are both well built rifles but I question the price tag.

My LMT is onlt a few weeks old but I ran 400 rounds of 147 through it with iron sights from 7 yards to 200 yards during a basic carbine class. Last week I had it down at Rifles Only with an Elcan 1.5-6, an Atlas bipod and ran 118LR through it. I only ran about 80 rounds from 50 yards out to 600 yards. The thing was a laser beam. I also like the idea of being able to switch the barrels with in a matter of minutes.
 
#6
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

From my experience with the M110 I don't believe they are worth the asking price. I'm not knocking the gun as a whole, I just do not believe it to be worth the $5000-ish price tag.

As for reliability, they have had trigger issues which was resolved, and I've heard of various other reliability issues with them... but I suspect that may be due to them getting some use as a battle rifle- a role for which was not the design intent.

Get what you want- just keep in mind that you're paying for a $5000-$6000 product that's true worth is likely half as much.
 
#7
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

I have had a DPMS LR-308 with a 24 inch barrel that was great for accuracy as long as you were shooting from a bench or prone. I hear that POFs are a bit on the heavy side. I hear that they are really accurate. I have noticed there are some "haters" out there though. I think KAC has an "AAH" factor with their previous unavailable status. I have to admit, something about them is just plain sexy.

I am leaning heavily towards LMT. Fair price. Cool factor with the British Spec Ops contract. Quick change barrel. I am hearing they are about 1-1.5 MOA. I have had the chance to toss one around, so I am curios about it's CQB ability. I want to have a dual purpose gun.
 
#12
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

Well, let me just say that I have an LMT and I love it, BUT if I had the cash and it was CA legal, I would definitely have a SR-25 EMC.

Have I ever played with an EMC? Nope. But its KAC, an SR-25 carbine, and its incredibly awesome looking.

All that being said, I am practically married to my LMT and I realy cant seeing myself ever getting rid of it. The chrome lined barrel is more than accurate enough (sub-moa for most), reliable as hell, and you can change the barrels with ease.

Even if I had the cash, I would still buy the LMT first and then the KAC.
 
#13
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

This is the age old debate. Why does anyone buy what they buy? Why does someone buy Gap over Savage and vice versa. They both shoot well. Yada yada yada.....one can on and on and why someone should buy this and why someone should buy that.
It really comes down to pride of ownership and personal preference. I love KAC and while I can't speak for others, for me its the clean, refined finish and a fresh different look on a classic design. Kacs don't look like "just another ar15 or ar10." I also like the little cool features like ambi-controls, factory barrel dimpling and the fact that not everybody has their rifles. Kac is just not assembling parts and givng them a cool product name. They are continually researching, and developing new and sometimes better/sometimes not, products in an effort to enhance and distance their rifles further from the AR rat race. Knights Armament may not be for everybody, but its definitely for me.
 
#15
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jpach</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well, let me just say that I have an LMT and I love it, BUT if I had the cash and it was CA legal, I would definitely have a SR-25 EMC.

Have I ever played with an EMC? Nope. But its KAC, an SR-25 carbine, and its incredibly awesome looking.

All that being said, I am practically married to my LMT and I realy cant seeing myself ever getting rid of it. The chrome lined barrel is more than accurate enough (sub-moa for most), reliable as hell, and you can change the barrels with ease.

Even if I had the cash, I would still buy the LMT first and then the KAC. </div></div>

You might try to see if you can swap an upper with a SR-25 EMC owner, the MWS and EMC upper/lower are interchangeable (*note depening on what trigger is in the lower you may need to keep the LMT bolt carrier with the LMT lower)
 
#16
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

LMT all the way. KAC has some neat stuff that is built fairly well and looks sharp, but not one thing they've produced has been worth their asking priced.
 
#17
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

Haven't had the upportunity to hold any of the two.

But I really like the Knight. It's more of a battle rifle/carbine where the LMT is more designed for a DMR role.

The (front) weight of the LMT seams to be the problem. There are already people who have send their barrel out on diet.

But the price difference is to big to be put aside!

Just my 2C
 
#18
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

You could always try an Armalite. Shoots the same 7.62. This one weighs just under 11 pounds as pictured with a Geissele trigger and Leupold 3-9 MR/T:

15gwgp3.jpg
 
#19
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

My 18" barreled GAP AR-10 (Armalite upper/ lower) holds 5" groups at 1,000 yards.

KAC might hold its resale value better, but if you are looking for a reliable shooter, you can save significant money over a KAC.
 
#20
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: The Bart Man</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Haven't had the upportunity to hold any of the two.

But I really like the Knight. It's more of a battle rifle/carbine where the LMT is more designed for a DMR role.

The (front) weight of the LMT seams to be the problem. There are already people who have send their barrel out on diet.

But the price difference is to big to be put aside!

Just my 2C </div></div>

The weight is not a problem for me as I spend time with and M1A and M1 garand. I don't see the front end heavy part as an issue. I like the balance being just in front of the mag well. Carring it is easier and it helps control recoil.
 
#21
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

KAC makes a good gun. I have an SR-15E3 myself and really like it (the jury is out on whether he improvements on the bolt are worth getting a piece of non-standard gear). However I do think Knights has their 7.62 line priced for government contracts (which they seem to win a lot of).

The LMT is a great gun which survived a taxing MOD selection process that saw a top tier company with a lot of influence defeated (HK). I really like the ability to swap the barrels though most users will never make use of it.

Both use the exact same receiver. LMT and KAC share technology. The bottom line you have to ask yourself between the EMC and the MWS is do you want a 9lb gun that can swap barrels and costs less or an 8lb gun that can't and costs more?

Both are great but price, weight and barrel swapping are what it comes down to.
 
#25
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

We build rifles for certain performance criteria. We end up spending more on R&D for a specific type of weapon that a lot of companies spend on R&D in 10 years.

The money that went into the M110 SASS, and later the M110 Carbine will take years to pay off, as well as to build guns that are both accurate and reliable makes a considerable investment in time and material.

Pricing is affected by government contracts, as we effectively do not sell the M110 commercially.

Last year we introduced the SR-25 EMR and SR-25 EMC, which where a decreased price commercial gun.
 
#26
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

Take some advice from someone who has spent a ton of money on a rifle...

BLUF, Who cares what name is on the gun! Its the holes in the target that make the difference. A $1300 AR10 will put the same holes in the paper as the M110.

Are you a good enough shooter where spending a couple thousand more will make a difference?

Are you buying an expensive gun to impress others at the range, and stroke your ego, or are you a good enough shooter where spending the extra money will make a difference?

Would you rather have an AR10 and several thousand rounds of ammo to practice with, or just have a rifle.

Remember that as soon as you fire one round down the tube, its a used gun, and the value drops. I am willing to bet that if you put 1000 rounds of ammo down the tube of an AR10, you wouldnt loose nearly as much in depreciation as you would with the same round count in the M110.

No doubt the KAC and LMT are good, but spending more money on the gun wont make you a better shooter.

You can get a gun that shoots just as good for a lot less.

 
#27
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DP425</div><div class="ubbcode-body">From my experience with the M110 I don't believe they are worth the asking price. I'm not knocking the gun as a whole, I just do not believe it to be worth the $5000-ish price tag.
</div></div>

you may be familiar with the (M110) rifle but... definately not the price tag.
 
#28
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

Will the FA762SS suppressor adapter fit on the EMC without modifications? I have been told the LMT barrel needs to be turned down and i was wondering if the same was true with the EMC. Also, will the adapter even fit on it due to the gas block since it needs over 2 inches of barrel to fit?
 
#29
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: skinney</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DP425</div><div class="ubbcode-body">From my experience with the M110 I don't believe they are worth the asking price. I'm not knocking the gun as a whole, I just do not believe it to be worth the $5000-ish price tag.
</div></div>

you may be familiar with the (M110) rifle but... definately not the price tag.</div></div>

I would buy ten M110's if they were only $5000.
 
#33
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: skinney</div><div class="ubbcode-body">U got it, i would have one as well if they were "only" 5K. </div></div>

I think a lot of people are thinking of the SR-25 rifles which can be had for a measly ~5k.
 
#35
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BCP</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: skinney</div><div class="ubbcode-body">U got it, i would have one as well if they were "only" 5K. </div></div>

I think a lot of people are thinking of the SR-25 rifles which can be had for a measly ~5k. </div></div>

yup i got a couple, the Mod 0 is among my collection, i saw he posted (M110) and just wanted to make sure for those who don't know, they (M110) cannot be had for a measly 5k.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: skinney</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DP425</div><div class="ubbcode-body">From my experience with the M110 I don't believe they are worth the asking price. I'm not knocking the gun as a whole, I just do not believe it to be worth the $5000-ish price tag.
</div></div>

you may be familiar with the (M110) rifle but... definately not the price tag. </div></div>
 
#36
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Super Bee 950</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Take some advice from someone who has spent a ton of money on a rifle...

BLUF, Who cares what name is on the gun! Its the holes in the target that make the difference. A $1300 AR10 will put the same holes in the paper as the M110.

Are you a good enough shooter where spending a couple thousand more will make a difference?

Are you buying an expensive gun to impress others at the range, and stroke your ego, or are you a good enough shooter where spending the extra money will make a difference?

Would you rather have an AR10 and several thousand rounds of ammo to practice with, or just have a rifle.

Remember that as soon as you fire one round down the tube, its a used gun, and the value drops. I am willing to bet that if you put 1000 rounds of ammo down the tube of an AR10, you wouldnt loose nearly as much in depreciation as you would with the same round count in the M110.

No doubt the KAC and LMT are good, but spending more money on the gun wont make you a better shooter.

You can get a gun that shoots just as good for a lot less.

</div></div>

I Totally Agree........
 
#37
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

Figure out what your needs and desires are then purchase the rifle that best fits those needs.

Looking for pure precision, look at the OBR, GAP, some of the Armalites, etc.

If you want an accurate battle rifle, then focus on Armalite, LMT, KAC, etc.

For example, if you look at the KAC MK11, and the EMC they are built for different roles. Rapid fire with the MK11 is 5 rounds a minute for 4 minutes according to its manual. While the EMC is built so you could run it like a M4. Your not going to get match winning accuracy out of a Dragunov but it will work fine in combat. Different rifles are built with different purposes in mind.

I think you will find that KAC tried to optimize the EMC to be able to do everything well. That performance comes at the high pricetag. The LMT (what I purchased) offers a little more modularity, as a much higher weight. For me the cost savings and performance of the LMT more then makes up for the weight.
 
#40
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: skinney</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DP425</div><div class="ubbcode-body">From my experience with the M110 I don't believe they are worth the asking price. I'm not knocking the gun as a whole, I just do not believe it to be worth the $5000-ish price tag.
</div></div>

you may be familiar with the (M110) rifle but... definately not the price tag. </div></div>

You're right- the M110's that are in the wild are MUCH higher than that. But you can get an SR-25 for about $5000. And while they are NOT the same gun, they are fairly close. When people think about having their own M110- they generally are thinking in terms of an SR-25, or will quickly settle for an SR-25 when they see the price of the M110.

Anyway, nothing has really changed still not worth $5k IMO
 
#41
Re: LMT Vs. KAC

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KevinB-KAC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">No uppers are not sold seperately
</div></div>
Thank you
 
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