Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

lukeyn

lukeyn

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Jan 10, 2007
119
0
Ohio, USA
#1
Bought the Gunvault Multi-vault deluxe. Wife and I had the discussion of keeping the pistol locked & loaded ready to go. Or mag in, without one in the chamber in the odd chance one of my boys (5 and 3) figures out the combination they still would need to rack the slide. The safe has a 4 digit combo. I hear horror stories of children being shot because the gun was not fully secured.


My question is, what are your views on a self-defense pistol with children?
 
#4
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

Teach Teach Teachum My kids would't touch one of mine unless I told them so. BUT a heck of a lot of love and trust is involved.
 
#5
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

First, do you have a dog? If not GET ONE, they are fun and a good one will be the best damn sentry you could ask for. Second, the only reason I think one would need a weapon cocked, locked and ready to rock is if the MF is already in your room, in that case you're probably boned anyhow. Third, most likely you would be alerted (if you have a hound worth a shit) and have some time to lock n' load. Fourth, it sounds like your main malfunction is that your boys might crack your safe, in that case it doesn't matter if its ready to rock, or there are stray rounds scattered about with the an empty mag next to your pistol. If they are that interested in what is in YOUR safe then it is irrelevant how your weapon is stored if they are able to crack the code. My theory is lay the smack down the first time you catch either one messing with that damn safe. Don't punish one, punish both, that way they will keep each other in check.
 
#6
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

Do not make guns taboo, if they are interested show them so much they aren't curious, anytime they have an urge to see one pull it out and answer any question they have about it.

Then take them out and shoot a watermelon with it. After it explodes tell them to put said watermelon back together, and explain to them why they cant play with guns
 
#7
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hayboy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Teach Teach Teachum My kids would't touch one of mine unless I told them so. BUT a heck of a lot of love and trust is involved.</div></div>

Growing up I knew where the loaded shotgun was - I was told not to touch it and never did.
Then again, an accidental shooting involving children not only gets you the felony - but even worse, how much guilt you can you bear in the worst case scenario? Teach discipline first, firearms safety second. I think most parents know where they stand with discipline and their kids by age 5 - if you were firm with discipline and the kids rarely disobeyed you might get by with "don't do that".
As far as the watermelon goes, I've seen that, even suggested it to others for younger kids esp. girls, it drives home the concept of shooting causing destruction, but not life and death. Once the concept of life & death and been introduced to the child - whether via a pet, relative, etc., I think observation of hunting - this animal is dead and not coming back to life (minus the celebratory yee-hahs) drives home the point gun = death = do not touch until you are older and with mommy or daddy's permission.
 
#8
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

I agree with most of what is already said teaching them why they can't play with it is better than making it off limits. Remember our parents wanted all of us to wait to get laid that worked out well didn't it.
 
#9
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

Thanks for all the replies. The oldest isnt the one I am worried about. He is more interested in the double barrel than anything else. He has been out shooting, the 2 1/2 year old though is the one that messes around with our other safe pressing buttons. Not that he is interested in the gun or whats in the other safe, he just likes to press the buttons. He has been disciplined, but my main worry is not everything is gauranteed. I have a dog who is pretty good at letting me know if anyone is around, but the dog generally sleeps upstairs in the kid's room.
 
#10
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

Teaching the boys about the firearms will do a better job than any safe.
At age three, Torin came into the room at my Pop's house, and announced that he had found a 'Block' hanging on the back of the bedroom door. When asked what he does if he finds a gun he stated,"I stop, find Mom, Dad, or Pop, and tell them where I found the gun" Do you tell anyone else about the gun? "No, only you guys, no one else has to know"
At that point, he decided to locate all five of the Glock's that were in the house.
Smart Kids leave stuff alone. Curious kids play with it. Let them handlee the firearms and remove the curiousity
 
#12
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

+1 to the above, always teach kids and make sure they can see the weapon anytime they request if you are around (cuts the curiosity factor)

I always keep my home defense gun loaded, chambered and ready. My old rule is, all the way loaded or all the way unloaded no in between and never deviate from the condition you decide to keep it.
 
#13
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

First, I applaud you for thinking about your kids around firearms. Although, from most people on this forum, I would expect nothing less.

My personal view on a firearm for home-defense, is have it chambered. WHY? Because when you're nervous, listening, planning in your mind for that "what do I do" moment that woke you in the night, it's <span style="font-weight: bold"><span style="text-decoration: underline">NOT</span></span> the time to short stroke the racking of your pistol and have it out of battery!!! Hell, I wouldn't have an empty on a pump shotgun!! I teach shooters, new and experienced alike. I probably teach 2-4 people a week on average. So many of them want to ease the slide forward. Some may argue that the racking of the slide is what may deter the intruder. So if it deters people, why don't cops carry them that way and use it as a level of the use-of-force matrix? You mean I should've racked my slide on those high-risk traffic stops I've made all these years? Just sayin'!

I have two kids myself. For me, I'm not so worried about my kids as I am their friends!!! I don't have my guard down with my kids. But i have little to no idea what moral fibers their friends have in their lives! Like other posts above have said and I agree 100%, do NOT have it be a mystery to them. Take the time to have them informed and take the "secrecy" out of guns in the home.

Chamber it, lock it, teach about it, be involved, hope you never have to use it.

Cheers!

-G45
 
#14
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

Thats kind of where I get nervous. If Kameron finds it, he may want to show off sort of speak to his younger brother. I will definitely take the time though to take the "curiousity" factor away from them. I am a young parent so I havent finished reading the how to book about children. Thanks for the advice. I think I will still keep it without on in the chamber, but like I said, I will try to take the taboo away from it. I let the oldest help me clean the firearms. So I guess it is time to start with the youngest man in the house.
 
#15
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Glock45</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My personal view on a firearm for home-defense, is have it chambered.</div></div>

An unloaded gun don't kill nobody. Meaning exactly what Glock45 said - it isn't ready when you need it to be. It's still tough to decide though with children in the home, even when the guns are locked up - there is always that concern in your mind.

Educate them, a lot. <span style="font-style: italic">Never </span>touch a gun unless mom or dad is there, and come find us fast if you ever find one.
 
#17
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sdkidaho</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Educate them, a lot. <span style="font-style: italic">Never </span>touch a gun unless mom or dad is there, and come find us fast if you ever find one.</div></div>

I guess I never really thought about taking the taboo away through education although it makes a TON of sense. A good family friend on my wife's side is a Sheriffs Deputy in CA. One day he came home from work and was unloading some things into his safe in the garage. He became complacent on his way back to his vehicle and his daughter slipped into the garage and into the safe where she got her hands on one of his pistols. Truly a sad story... The say they took all the proper precautions to keep their child safe it is unclear if they taught gun safety or if guns were a no no all together.

Just make sure the safe is locked up when you cannot devote your un divided attention to any little hands in the room.
 
#18
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kraigWY</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I keep my loaded 642 in my pocket. Not much chance of the grandkids getting at it.</div></div>




adopt me please
 
#19
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

I had a thought about having it on the ready at night, and unloading it before I leave for work. Yes its alot of thought, but I have a routine of checking the doors every night anyways. And if there are days I forget to unload it, the gun is still in the 4 digit safe while the wife is home alone with the kids.
 
#20
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

Each gun owner needs to make a reasonable & responsible decision based on many factors, each specific to their situation. How old / mature are the kids?, what kind of neighborhood do you live in? etc.

For me, I believe the bigger risk is with curious children (my own and their friends) having accidents over home invasion.

I realize I'm on one end of the safety spectrum, but I like the idea of several lines of defense.

1) I have one simple rule for my kids to remember. My intention is to teach them to understand that firearms are not scary or evil, they can be a lot of fun, but they are tools that absolutely must be respected.

"If you ever want to touch them, that's okay, just let me know and we'll do it together. Never touch a firearm or let anyone else touch it when you're not with Mom or Dad, you must tell Mom or Dad right away."

2) Let them witness you shooting in a safe and ethical way. I gave them a job (supervised of course) so my kids became part of the experience and felt included. I started by letting them sit with me behind a clay pigeon chucker and pull the chord. Working up to shooting a BB gun, .22LR, larger caliber firearms and hunting as they demonstrated skills and understanding of safety considerations.

3) I keep my firearms unloaded in a locked safe, and usually have trigger locks on them as well. I know it's over the top, but whatever. I like to say I have a healthy level of paranoia when it comes to firearm safety. Witnessed two too many accidental shootings in the service.

4) I store my ammunition and reloading supplies in a locked cabinet / locked ammo cans.
 
#21
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

I like these threads, being young and recently married, we are talking about kids.

I grew up, no safe in the house, all the guns were in two closets, the one in the hallway, or the one in my room. They were unloaded, with the ammo where I couldnt get to it. I didnt touch any of them, unless I asked to do so. But I also got my first bb gun when I was 5 or so. My first 22 around 7 or 8, shotgun around 10. They were kept in my closet, ammo on the floor. I could go shoot ANYTIME I wanted. I just had to ask. Another thing, I had to buy all my own ammo, with my allowance.

I think you have to take the mystery out of guns. I like the idea of installing, no one is to touch these without mom and dad around.
 
#22
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

I will never keep a loaded firearm inside my home, children or no children, safe or no safe.

Defensive responses that require split second offensive action are outside my comfort zone.

I've been subjected to home invasion, robbery, and violence, and this is still my viewpoint.

That's because I have also been subjected to episodes where instantaneous offensive response would have been woefully inappropriate. I can count several relatives who are alive because I chose to deliberately complicate my response process so I would have time to grasp a better hold of the situation.

It's a personal choice and it does not reflect any criticism.

Locking something away from a kid only tends to throw down a gauntlet to their ingenuity. I would rather they knew how to handle a firearm, and more importantly, when not to, and stop throwing "cause I said so" roadblocks in their faces. You mistrust a kid, and they'll mistrust you right back. Said by a Grandfather of three, and a Scouting Leader with well over 40 years experience.

Greg
 
#23
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

Personally I lock my firearms up I have taught my kids basis safety. As a kid my dad didn't lock his guns up, my 22 and shotgun were kept in my closet. I made my oldest son memorize the firearms safety rules before he could get a BB gun and I'll do the same with my 3 year old son and my 1 day old daughter.
 
#24
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

I'd never consider having a loaded firearm in the same house as my kids. I wouldn't even consider putting the ammo and gun in the same safe. You might be able to teach your kids to a level where you feel comfortable that they "get it" but heaven forbid you are wrong or that their friends who come round don't.

Having said that the statistics aren't in my favour. There is somewhere in the region of 11,000 firearm related homicides in the US a year vs under 500 accidental deaths in children from guns. The odds are low on an accident if you secure your firearms safely and educate your kids but it is still not a risk i would be willing to take.
 
#25
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

I think a locked storage is essential for a responsible gun owner. I would hate to report a theft and have to admit they weren't locked. In some states, that's actionable.

If my Grandkids bring a friend into the house, they understand that they are responsible for the friends behavior, and that my guns, which are always locked up, are none of their friends' (or anyone else's) business. If they want to be able to keep using them, they know that's the bottom line.
 
#26
Re: Locked in loaded in child-proof safe?

I have a three year old. And I plan someday soon to take her to the range and watch me shoot my 308. Im sure the loud boom will make her realize that the shiney rifle in my closet is dangerous. Heh, then next year, (if I can convince my wife by then) I'll buy my daughter her first 22.
 
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