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Re: Long range AR
Depends on what you mean by the "+" in your question, as well what is important to you at those ranges (accuracy, wind resistance, energy). Most any AR15 or AR10 is quite accurate and effective at 300 yards.
- Phil
Depends on what you mean by the "+" in your question, as well what is important to you at those ranges (accuracy, wind resistance, energy). Most any AR15 or AR10 is quite accurate and effective at 300 yards.
- Phil
Re: Long range AR
how far out are you looking to go is what i think Phil was asking. Not over 300 yds, are you planning on taking it to 7-800 ot further? If further you might want to look at a 308 ar platform.
how far out are you looking to go is what i think Phil was asking. Not over 300 yds, are you planning on taking it to 7-800 ot further? If further you might want to look at a 308 ar platform.
Re: Long range AR
You will want to get a barrell with a twist of at least 1" in 8". Shoot Sierra 77 gr bullets, which will feed thru the magazine or handload 80 gr bullets which will have to be hand fed (too long for the magazine). High power uppers are good for this as they shoot to 600 yds. You would probably also want a flat top upper to mount a scope and maybe a 20" bbl. Hope this helps.
Randy P.
You will want to get a barrell with a twist of at least 1" in 8". Shoot Sierra 77 gr bullets, which will feed thru the magazine or handload 80 gr bullets which will have to be hand fed (too long for the magazine). High power uppers are good for this as they shoot to 600 yds. You would probably also want a flat top upper to mount a scope and maybe a 20" bbl. Hope this helps.
Randy P.
Re: Long range AR
a 16" barrel might be fine, my 18" works well at 600. A big factor will be the quality of the barrel and rifle overall. A heavier barrel will help with accuracy. I have a JP in 18" medium contour, it is a tack driver.
as noted above, go with a 1/8 twist and shoot heavier bullets. The optics will not be as important as the rifle, my 2 cents
a 16" barrel might be fine, my 18" works well at 600. A big factor will be the quality of the barrel and rifle overall. A heavier barrel will help with accuracy. I have a JP in 18" medium contour, it is a tack driver.
as noted above, go with a 1/8 twist and shoot heavier bullets. The optics will not be as important as the rifle, my 2 cents
Re: Long range AR
My M4 with Aimpoint is fully capable of engaging man sized targets at 300 from standing supported.
If you are looking for a "precision" AR, then you want a 1:8 or 1:7 barrel 18-20" long. Free floated handguards, and a good optic. Anything else just supports the barrel. A light two stage trigger is a plus as well as a good stock.
You will want to set the rifle up to shoot 75-77gr projectiles. You can go 80gr if you want to single load them through the ejection port, but 77gr is the longest you can mag-load.
Depending on who you source the barrel from you are going to have a rifle accurate out to a lot more than 300 yards.
My M4 with Aimpoint is fully capable of engaging man sized targets at 300 from standing supported.
If you are looking for a "precision" AR, then you want a 1:8 or 1:7 barrel 18-20" long. Free floated handguards, and a good optic. Anything else just supports the barrel. A light two stage trigger is a plus as well as a good stock.
You will want to set the rifle up to shoot 75-77gr projectiles. You can go 80gr if you want to single load them through the ejection port, but 77gr is the longest you can mag-load.
Depending on who you source the barrel from you are going to have a rifle accurate out to a lot more than 300 yards.
Re: Long range AR
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shay_Ellafrits</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I plan on shooting 600 yards max with this. I want to get a 16 in heavy barrel. I know it is too short, but I want a carbine. I am going to get a flat top too. </div></div>
I'll hear it for saying this, but I would recommend a DPMS Sweet 16. It's a 16" heavy barrel and I had one that was plenty accurate out to 500 yards. Every kind of brass cased ammo I fed it shot under 1" at 100 yards. I stopped at 500 yards, because it was setup with a burris ballistic plex and that's where it ran out of dashes. I never had an issue with mine, and I had it setup with a 6 position stock. I was a great rifle.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shay_Ellafrits</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I plan on shooting 600 yards max with this. I want to get a 16 in heavy barrel. I know it is too short, but I want a carbine. I am going to get a flat top too. </div></div>
I'll hear it for saying this, but I would recommend a DPMS Sweet 16. It's a 16" heavy barrel and I had one that was plenty accurate out to 500 yards. Every kind of brass cased ammo I fed it shot under 1" at 100 yards. I stopped at 500 yards, because it was setup with a burris ballistic plex and that's where it ran out of dashes. I never had an issue with mine, and I had it setup with a 6 position stock. I was a great rifle.
Re: Long range AR
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LoneWolfUSMC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My M4 with Aimpoint is fully capable of engaging man sized targets at 300 from standing supported.
If you are looking for a "precision" AR, then you want a 1:8 or 1:7 barrel 18-20" long. Free floated handguards, and a good optic. Anything else just supports the barrel. A light two stage trigger is a plus as well as a good stock.
You will want to set the rifle up to shoot 75-77gr projectiles. You can go 80gr if you want to single load them through the ejection port, but 77gr is the longest you can mag-load.
Depending on who you source the barrel from you are going to have a rifle accurate out to a lot more than 300 yards. </div></div>
+1
I would stick with a minimum of an 18" barrel to keep velocities of the 75gr and heavier projectiles up as high a possible. It is amazing what 2" of barrel can cost you in terms of terminal ballistics and accuracy at extended ranges. Depending on whether you plan to be humping the rifle around and how much your final product will weigh with optics, etc., you might even think about the 20" barrel although it is not absolutely necessary.
Lilja, Krieger, Douglas, Lothar Walther, and many other manufacturers make excellent match barrels.
Flat-top/A3/A4 upper for ease of scope mounting. Also, plan to spend at least the cost of your rifle on quality optics and mounts/rings. The best rifle in the world is little more than a club without proper optics/mounts and a shooter who knows what they are doing.
You'll want a free-floated barrel for obvious reasons (there are too many mfgs to mention on this front...look around ARFCOM and here for pics). Personally, I like Daniel Defense, Larue, PRI, and Badger. YHM also makes some quality, lower cost alternatives for FF tubes if the DD and Larue stuff is too much for your wallet.
There are some great selections for triggers. Giesselle (sp?..sorry..can't spell). I have one in my POF 308 and it is excellent. I also like the Timney drop-in units.
The big question you'll need to ask yourself is are you going to put together a parts gun or are you going to have a good AR builder set up up with exactly what you want.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LoneWolfUSMC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My M4 with Aimpoint is fully capable of engaging man sized targets at 300 from standing supported.
If you are looking for a "precision" AR, then you want a 1:8 or 1:7 barrel 18-20" long. Free floated handguards, and a good optic. Anything else just supports the barrel. A light two stage trigger is a plus as well as a good stock.
You will want to set the rifle up to shoot 75-77gr projectiles. You can go 80gr if you want to single load them through the ejection port, but 77gr is the longest you can mag-load.
Depending on who you source the barrel from you are going to have a rifle accurate out to a lot more than 300 yards. </div></div>
+1
I would stick with a minimum of an 18" barrel to keep velocities of the 75gr and heavier projectiles up as high a possible. It is amazing what 2" of barrel can cost you in terms of terminal ballistics and accuracy at extended ranges. Depending on whether you plan to be humping the rifle around and how much your final product will weigh with optics, etc., you might even think about the 20" barrel although it is not absolutely necessary.
Lilja, Krieger, Douglas, Lothar Walther, and many other manufacturers make excellent match barrels.
Flat-top/A3/A4 upper for ease of scope mounting. Also, plan to spend at least the cost of your rifle on quality optics and mounts/rings. The best rifle in the world is little more than a club without proper optics/mounts and a shooter who knows what they are doing.
You'll want a free-floated barrel for obvious reasons (there are too many mfgs to mention on this front...look around ARFCOM and here for pics). Personally, I like Daniel Defense, Larue, PRI, and Badger. YHM also makes some quality, lower cost alternatives for FF tubes if the DD and Larue stuff is too much for your wallet.
There are some great selections for triggers. Giesselle (sp?..sorry..can't spell). I have one in my POF 308 and it is excellent. I also like the Timney drop-in units.
The big question you'll need to ask yourself is are you going to put together a parts gun or are you going to have a good AR builder set up up with exactly what you want.
Re: Long range AR
fwiw: I prefer 18" to 20" barrel length for shooting 600 to 800 yards. 600yds & "-" prefer 16" . Just depends on what your trying to get out of it. With how modular the AR platform is the configurations are endless. If this is mainly for shooting at the local range without lugging around you can go as heavy as you want. If you hunting/carrying this rig = Distance/Time spent lugging this around will determine size/contour/length, IMHO.
These .223 MV Originally posted by MSTN on the ar15 forum. Of course these MV are based on this tested platform & will differ with ammo./rifle configuration. But, it gives an idea the +/- to barrel length in an AR15 .223/5.56 platform.
MK 262 VELOCITY DATA
__________________________________
7.5" 2053 FPS ... 10.5" 2363 FPS
DIFFERENCE 310 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 103 FPS
10.5" 2363 FPS ... 14.5" 2576 FPS
DIFFERENCE 213 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 53 FPS
14.5" 2576 FPS ... 16" 2669 FPS
DIFFERENCE 93 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 62 FPS
16" 2669 FPS ... 18" 2769 FPS
DIFFERENCE 100 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 50 FPS
18" 2769 FPS ... 20" 2818 FPS
DIFFERENCE 49 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 25 FPS
M855 VELOCITY DATA
__________________________
7.5" 2244 FPS ... 10.5" 2639 FPS
DIFFERENCE 395 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 132 FPS
10.5" 2639 FPS ... 14.5" 2861 FPS
DIFFERENCE 222 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 56 FPS
14.5" 2861 FPS ... 16" 2938 FPS
DIFFERENCE 77 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 51 FPS
16" 2938 FPS ... 18" 3046 FPS
DIFFERENCE 108 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 54 FPS
18" 3046 FPS ... 20" 3061 FPS
DIFFERENCE 15 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 7.5 FPS
XM193 VELOCITY DATA
_________________________________
7.5" 2364 FPS ... 10.5" 2755 FPS
DIFFERENCE 391 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 130 FPS PER INCH
10.5" 2755 FPS ... 14.5" 2984 FPS
DIFFERENCE 229 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 57 FPS PER INCH
14.5" 2984 FPS ... 16" 3075 FPS
DIFFERENCE 91 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 61 FPS
16" 3075 FPS ... 18" 3245 FPS
DIFFERENCE 170 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 85 FPS
18" 3245 ... 20" 3254 FPS
DIFFERENCE 9 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 4.5 FPS
__________________________________________
Have a great one,
FTK
fwiw: I prefer 18" to 20" barrel length for shooting 600 to 800 yards. 600yds & "-" prefer 16" . Just depends on what your trying to get out of it. With how modular the AR platform is the configurations are endless. If this is mainly for shooting at the local range without lugging around you can go as heavy as you want. If you hunting/carrying this rig = Distance/Time spent lugging this around will determine size/contour/length, IMHO.
These .223 MV Originally posted by MSTN on the ar15 forum. Of course these MV are based on this tested platform & will differ with ammo./rifle configuration. But, it gives an idea the +/- to barrel length in an AR15 .223/5.56 platform.
MK 262 VELOCITY DATA
__________________________________
7.5" 2053 FPS ... 10.5" 2363 FPS
DIFFERENCE 310 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 103 FPS
10.5" 2363 FPS ... 14.5" 2576 FPS
DIFFERENCE 213 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 53 FPS
14.5" 2576 FPS ... 16" 2669 FPS
DIFFERENCE 93 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 62 FPS
16" 2669 FPS ... 18" 2769 FPS
DIFFERENCE 100 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 50 FPS
18" 2769 FPS ... 20" 2818 FPS
DIFFERENCE 49 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 25 FPS
M855 VELOCITY DATA
__________________________
7.5" 2244 FPS ... 10.5" 2639 FPS
DIFFERENCE 395 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 132 FPS
10.5" 2639 FPS ... 14.5" 2861 FPS
DIFFERENCE 222 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 56 FPS
14.5" 2861 FPS ... 16" 2938 FPS
DIFFERENCE 77 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 51 FPS
16" 2938 FPS ... 18" 3046 FPS
DIFFERENCE 108 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 54 FPS
18" 3046 FPS ... 20" 3061 FPS
DIFFERENCE 15 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 7.5 FPS
XM193 VELOCITY DATA
_________________________________
7.5" 2364 FPS ... 10.5" 2755 FPS
DIFFERENCE 391 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 130 FPS PER INCH
10.5" 2755 FPS ... 14.5" 2984 FPS
DIFFERENCE 229 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 57 FPS PER INCH
14.5" 2984 FPS ... 16" 3075 FPS
DIFFERENCE 91 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 61 FPS
16" 3075 FPS ... 18" 3245 FPS
DIFFERENCE 170 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 85 FPS
18" 3245 ... 20" 3254 FPS
DIFFERENCE 9 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 4.5 FPS
__________________________________________
Have a great one,
FTK
Re: Long range AR
Mine is nothing more than a Rock River Varminter 24". It shoots very well out of the box. My work rifle has a hard time at 600 yards with our 55 grain duty ammo and the 20" barrel. It'll hit the target and backer.....just sideways. I am sure I'll get better results with heavier bullets.
Mine is nothing more than a Rock River Varminter 24". It shoots very well out of the box. My work rifle has a hard time at 600 yards with our 55 grain duty ammo and the 20" barrel. It'll hit the target and backer.....just sideways. I am sure I'll get better results with heavier bullets.
Re: Long range AR
I use 18" stainless barrels exclusively out past 300yds. Here are some that we had for demo's. A couple of different configurations: btw two with rails still for sale.
I use 18" stainless barrels exclusively out past 300yds. Here are some that we had for demo's. A couple of different configurations: btw two with rails still for sale.
Re: Long range AR
My range only goes to 300yds, but my 26"er did the job pretty well. Bucked the wind a little better than most since you can get even the 77gr SMKs moving pretty quick with that much barrel.
My range only goes to 300yds, but my 26"er did the job pretty well. Bucked the wind a little better than most since you can get even the 77gr SMKs moving pretty quick with that much barrel.
Re: Long range AR
i went with a 20 inch kreiger 1/7.7 twist it like 77 and really like the 80's but they wont fit in the mag, i have pics somewhere ill see if i can find them
i went with a 20 inch kreiger 1/7.7 twist it like 77 and really like the 80's but they wont fit in the mag, i have pics somewhere ill see if i can find them
Re: Long range AR
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shay_Ellafrits</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I guess Ill get a 16" upper and a 20". I'll just have 2 ar setups. </div></div>
Good Choice.... I have an eotech 553 on my M4. However, if you are going to shoot at range glass is where you need to put your money -- S&B PM II is what I use to reach out and touch someone.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shay_Ellafrits</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I guess Ill get a 16" upper and a 20". I'll just have 2 ar setups. </div></div>
Good Choice.... I have an eotech 553 on my M4. However, if you are going to shoot at range glass is where you need to put your money -- S&B PM II is what I use to reach out and touch someone.
Re: Long range AR
Here's my start, switching out handguard and butt as soon as I can, It's a stock Rock River Predator Pursuit, with NM Barrel and trigger, shoots pretty good, just 100yd so far. I have a 500 yd match in September, we'll see how she does. I'm shooting 80 gr Amax and SMK's with about 24.4 Varget, this is my 7 twist bolt gun load. I will single feed these. I have some 77gr SMK's seated mag length set to test.
These things are money pits, I want to replace the 8.5-25X50 Leupold with a NSX 2.5-10X32...maybe??
Here's my start, switching out handguard and butt as soon as I can, It's a stock Rock River Predator Pursuit, with NM Barrel and trigger, shoots pretty good, just 100yd so far. I have a 500 yd match in September, we'll see how she does. I'm shooting 80 gr Amax and SMK's with about 24.4 Varget, this is my 7 twist bolt gun load. I will single feed these. I have some 77gr SMK's seated mag length set to test.
These things are money pits, I want to replace the 8.5-25X50 Leupold with a NSX 2.5-10X32...maybe??
Re: Long range AR
Why not get away from the .223 all together and get something like the 6AR. It was designed to shoot XC so 600yrds was in the plan from the beginning. Its based off the 6.5 Grendel so it has great lapua brass. Its a very simple cartridge to load for and with no special fire forming, and everything you need is all on the one website, http://www.6mmar.com/Page_1.html
just get a good lower put together buy one of his uppers and your good to go
Why not get away from the .223 all together and get something like the 6AR. It was designed to shoot XC so 600yrds was in the plan from the beginning. Its based off the 6.5 Grendel so it has great lapua brass. Its a very simple cartridge to load for and with no special fire forming, and everything you need is all on the one website, http://www.6mmar.com/Page_1.html
just get a good lower put together buy one of his uppers and your good to go
Re: Long range AR
6mmar isn't based off the grendel case, Grendel is a 6.5 case, but it would be a decent XC gun.
There are a few guys running it already, i'm interested in long term(3000k plus) results.
6mmar isn't based off the grendel case, Grendel is a 6.5 case, but it would be a decent XC gun.
There are a few guys running it already, i'm interested in long term(3000k plus) results.
Re: Long range AR
If you are looking for a factory built gun, it is hard to beat the RRA Varmint or predator pursuit guns. Several of my friends have these and all shoot very well, sub-moa 5 shot groups with BH varmint ammo.
I had Compass Lake Eng. put together an upper for me. It is an 18 Douglas SPR contour in 1/10(just to try something different). It is a varmint gun that doesn’t weight a ton like the RRA’s. I put this on a RRA lower with NM trigger and it runs like a champ. It is easy to make an AR shoot you just have to decide how your going to use it and pick between the thousands of vendors.
If you are looking for a factory built gun, it is hard to beat the RRA Varmint or predator pursuit guns. Several of my friends have these and all shoot very well, sub-moa 5 shot groups with BH varmint ammo.
I had Compass Lake Eng. put together an upper for me. It is an 18 Douglas SPR contour in 1/10(just to try something different). It is a varmint gun that doesn’t weight a ton like the RRA’s. I put this on a RRA lower with NM trigger and it runs like a champ. It is easy to make an AR shoot you just have to decide how your going to use it and pick between the thousands of vendors.
Re: Long range AR
Well, if you were shootin' with irons from prone with a sling, I'd say you da man; thing is, you've got a scope, so, since understanding where the barrel is pointed should not be an issue, you appear to have some serious issues with the principles of marksmanship, as well as your understanding for the factors and elements of a steady position.
Well, if you were shootin' with irons from prone with a sling, I'd say you da man; thing is, you've got a scope, so, since understanding where the barrel is pointed should not be an issue, you appear to have some serious issues with the principles of marksmanship, as well as your understanding for the factors and elements of a steady position.
Re: Long range AR
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Scottmilk9</div><div class="ubbcode-body">6mmar isn't based off the grendel case, Grendel is a 6.5 case, but it would be a decent XC gun.
There are a few guys running it already, i'm interested in long term(3000k plus) results.
</div></div>
says here that it is based off a 6.5 Grendel...they just neck it down to 6mm. http://www.6mmbr.com/gunweek068.html
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Scottmilk9</div><div class="ubbcode-body">6mmar isn't based off the grendel case, Grendel is a 6.5 case, but it would be a decent XC gun.
There are a few guys running it already, i'm interested in long term(3000k plus) results.
</div></div>
says here that it is based off a 6.5 Grendel...they just neck it down to 6mm. http://www.6mmbr.com/gunweek068.html
Re: Long range AR
<span style="font-weight: bold">Custom AR-10 in .308</span>
I shoot this regularly to 1000 yards.
Gives me sub MOA performance. Out shoots me...
<span style="font-weight: bold">Custom M-4gery in .223</span>
Only 1:9 Twist barrel. Shoots 62gr BTHP well in the 400-500 yard range.
<span style="font-weight: bold">Custom AR-10 in .308</span>
I shoot this regularly to 1000 yards.
Gives me sub MOA performance. Out shoots me...
<span style="font-weight: bold">Custom M-4gery in .223</span>
Only 1:9 Twist barrel. Shoots 62gr BTHP well in the 400-500 yard range.
Re: Long range AR
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sterling Shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well, if you were shootin' with irons from prone with a sling, I'd say you da man; thing is, you've got a scope, so, since understanding where the barrel is pointed should not be an issue, you appear to have some serious issues with the principles of marksmanship, as well as your understanding for the factors and elements of a steady position. </div></div> I am going to use this primarily for yote hunting. i just want to be able to take my game as humainly as possible. I have no problem with shooting accurately.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sterling Shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well, if you were shootin' with irons from prone with a sling, I'd say you da man; thing is, you've got a scope, so, since understanding where the barrel is pointed should not be an issue, you appear to have some serious issues with the principles of marksmanship, as well as your understanding for the factors and elements of a steady position. </div></div> I am going to use this primarily for yote hunting. i just want to be able to take my game as humainly as possible. I have no problem with shooting accurately.
Re: Long range AR
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EmergencyNrse</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
<span style="font-weight: bold">Custom AR-10 in .308</span>
I shoot this regularly to 1000 yards.
Gives me sub MOA performance. Out shoots me...
<span style="font-weight: bold">Custom M-4gery in .223</span>
Only 1:9 Twist barrel. Shoots 62gr BTHP well in the 400-500 yard range.
</div></div>
you can hit a consistent group at 4-500 yards with an eotech and magnifier?
I've got the eotech but I didn't want to get a magnifier because I have never seen one in person... don't want to spend $350 and have it be good for 100 yards or something ya know?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EmergencyNrse</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
<span style="font-weight: bold">Custom AR-10 in .308</span>
I shoot this regularly to 1000 yards.
Gives me sub MOA performance. Out shoots me...
<span style="font-weight: bold">Custom M-4gery in .223</span>
Only 1:9 Twist barrel. Shoots 62gr BTHP well in the 400-500 yard range.
</div></div>
you can hit a consistent group at 4-500 yards with an eotech and magnifier?
I've got the eotech but I didn't want to get a magnifier because I have never seen one in person... don't want to spend $350 and have it be good for 100 yards or something ya know?
Re: Long range AR
I stand corrected on the basis of the case. it is based off of the 6.5 grendel. I appologize for my lack of research.
I stand corrected on the basis of the case. it is based off of the 6.5 grendel. I appologize for my lack of research.
Re: Long range AR
$$$ but POF P308 20'' barrel shoots 2'' groups at 500 meters with federal SKM 168 match ammo
$$$ but POF P308 20'' barrel shoots 2'' groups at 500 meters with federal SKM 168 match ammo
Re: Long range AR
I have both a JP 16" and 20" .223 rifle. Both have 1:8 twist bbls. They are real shooters. Both guns will shoot 1.5" groups at 300 if I do my part. Load is a 55gr Nosler BT w/H335. I shoot 3 gun and use the 16" gun for matches with targets at 300 and in. 20" rifle for matches w/ targets beyond 300. At 500 the 55gr NBT gets blown around. I think I'm going to try some heavier bullets for the longer targets. Nice part about the 1:8 bbl, is that they will shoot both the 55's and 77's great. For 3 gun you need to be able to hit a 10" target at 300 and beyond. You can see 4" and 6" steel inside of 300. This can be done with a 1-4x optic. You just need to know your dope.
I have both a JP 16" and 20" .223 rifle. Both have 1:8 twist bbls. They are real shooters. Both guns will shoot 1.5" groups at 300 if I do my part. Load is a 55gr Nosler BT w/H335. I shoot 3 gun and use the 16" gun for matches with targets at 300 and in. 20" rifle for matches w/ targets beyond 300. At 500 the 55gr NBT gets blown around. I think I'm going to try some heavier bullets for the longer targets. Nice part about the 1:8 bbl, is that they will shoot both the 55's and 77's great. For 3 gun you need to be able to hit a 10" target at 300 and beyond. You can see 4" and 6" steel inside of 300. This can be done with a 1-4x optic. You just need to know your dope.
Re: Long range AR
Will a 16" barrel shoot to 600 yards? Sure. Do you want to enter high-power or match competition with a 16" barrel: nope. Depends on how serious you want to get. The 223REM cartridge is stretching at 600 yards. This is why match shooters will use a 26" barrel: to get everything they can from the tiny 223 cartridge. A 20" barrel is the default and can compete well at 600 yards. A longer(26"+) barrel is highly recommended if you want to shoot at 800-1000 yards.
Bottom line is guns are optimized for the intended purpose and only you can decide what that purpose is. A 20" barrel is a great all-around length that will allow you to compete in long-range high power matches as well as shorter ranger 3-gun matches.
Will a 16" barrel shoot to 600 yards? Sure. Do you want to enter high-power or match competition with a 16" barrel: nope. Depends on how serious you want to get. The 223REM cartridge is stretching at 600 yards. This is why match shooters will use a 26" barrel: to get everything they can from the tiny 223 cartridge. A 20" barrel is the default and can compete well at 600 yards. A longer(26"+) barrel is highly recommended if you want to shoot at 800-1000 yards.
Bottom line is guns are optimized for the intended purpose and only you can decide what that purpose is. A 20" barrel is a great all-around length that will allow you to compete in long-range high power matches as well as shorter ranger 3-gun matches.
Re: Long range AR
Past Youtube vid/clips from "ScottyS" here on SH.
Rig: 24" Varmint 1:8 Twist .223Rem
<span style="font-weight: bold">Load: 60 Grain Hornady V-Max; 23.5 grains AA2300
Distance: 680 Yards</span>
<object width="425" height="350"> <param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/jJWLP81qCAE"></param> <param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param> <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/jJWLP81qCAE" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"> </embed></object>
Rig: 24" Varmint 1:8 Twist .223Rem
<span style="font-weight: bold">Load: 75 Grain Hornady HPBT
Distance: 860 Yards</span>
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IMHO: Anything long range takes A LOT of: Proper Training, Trigger time [Dry&Live], Practice & Familiarity with "ones own rig/ammo/setting" to get "consistent" hits at distance. Applies to anything & any caliber.
As "ScottyS" has shown, he knows "HIS" rig/ammo = WIN
<span style="font-style: italic">* Thanks Again to "ScottyS" for making these video clips. </span>
Have a great one,
FTK
Past Youtube vid/clips from "ScottyS" here on SH.
Rig: 24" Varmint 1:8 Twist .223Rem
<span style="font-weight: bold">Load: 60 Grain Hornady V-Max; 23.5 grains AA2300
Distance: 680 Yards</span>
<object width="425" height="350"> <param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/jJWLP81qCAE"></param> <param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param> <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/jJWLP81qCAE" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"> </embed></object>
Rig: 24" Varmint 1:8 Twist .223Rem
<span style="font-weight: bold">Load: 75 Grain Hornady HPBT
Distance: 860 Yards</span>
<object width="425" height="350"> <param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/7B9NkQldeu0"></param> <param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param> <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/7B9NkQldeu0" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"> </embed></object>
IMHO: Anything long range takes A LOT of: Proper Training, Trigger time [Dry&Live], Practice & Familiarity with "ones own rig/ammo/setting" to get "consistent" hits at distance. Applies to anything & any caliber.
As "ScottyS" has shown, he knows "HIS" rig/ammo = WIN
<span style="font-style: italic">* Thanks Again to "ScottyS" for making these video clips. </span>
Have a great one,
FTK
Re: Long range AR
+1 on the 6mmar. I had one .1's at 100yds. 10 shot groups under 3/4moa at 550yds in less than ideal conditions. Worth the money!
+1 on the 6mmar. I had one .1's at 100yds. 10 shot groups under 3/4moa at 550yds in less than ideal conditions. Worth the money!
Re: Long range AR
The 3 most important things to building an accurate long range AR are barrel(at least 1-8" twist) , trigger (top line single stage), and scope(clear and repeatable).
This is the SR-22 Viper built by Volunteer Armory in Tennessee. It is very accurate out to 800 yards.
The 3 most important things to building an accurate long range AR are barrel(at least 1-8" twist) , trigger (top line single stage), and scope(clear and repeatable).
This is the SR-22 Viper built by Volunteer Armory in Tennessee. It is very accurate out to 800 yards.
Re: Long range AR
Shay, FWIW I was looking at pretty much the same deal (16" out to 600yds, wanted a carbine length rifle etc.)......got a lot of feedback off the guys here.
After a lot of thought, going to compromise on the original spec ancd I'm going to go up to 18" stainless with a custom profile (heavy target behind gas block,, 0.750" to muzzle). Probably a Lothar Walther or Border (being on the opposite side of the pond to you limits the choice).
Trigger will likely be a Geiselle two stage adjustable (if I can find one...).
Good luck with your build...post pics/range reports when you're done.
Shay, FWIW I was looking at pretty much the same deal (16" out to 600yds, wanted a carbine length rifle etc.)......got a lot of feedback off the guys here.
After a lot of thought, going to compromise on the original spec ancd I'm going to go up to 18" stainless with a custom profile (heavy target behind gas block,, 0.750" to muzzle). Probably a Lothar Walther or Border (being on the opposite side of the pond to you limits the choice).
Trigger will likely be a Geiselle two stage adjustable (if I can find one...).
Good luck with your build...post pics/range reports when you're done.
Re: Long range AR
Shay,
If you are ever down state, 4 hours south of where you are & want to try my 6.5 Grendel you are more than welcome to do so.
Closest range (20 minutes away from my house) is only 100 yds but at least it will give you an idea as to what the cartridge is capable of.
PM me if you are ever in my area & it is warm out/not raining.
Shay,
If you are ever down state, 4 hours south of where you are & want to try my 6.5 Grendel you are more than welcome to do so.
Closest range (20 minutes away from my house) is only 100 yds but at least it will give you an idea as to what the cartridge is capable of.
PM me if you are ever in my area & it is warm out/not raining.
Re: Long range AR
I have a jp enterprises 18" with the tunable gas block, low mass operating system and break their is no recoil at all. The rifle hardly moves when fired. I spent a good portion of time talking with the 3 gun guys and this is the type of set up that they run to keep on target. If you want real fast follow up shots, I could not think of a better way to go. They also sell these barrels with a heat sink to help with cooling. I am not sure how well it works but it sure looks cool! I will try and post picks tonight.
I have a jp enterprises 18" with the tunable gas block, low mass operating system and break their is no recoil at all. The rifle hardly moves when fired. I spent a good portion of time talking with the 3 gun guys and this is the type of set up that they run to keep on target. If you want real fast follow up shots, I could not think of a better way to go. They also sell these barrels with a heat sink to help with cooling. I am not sure how well it works but it sure looks cool! I will try and post picks tonight.
Re: Long range AR
Unless, you plan to hunt big game, 6mmAR or 6.5 Grendal. Both beat any of the .223 loads in a smaller package than the AR-10s. If you're going to hunt, go with the AR-10s - 6.5 CM, .260 (although match bullets must be seated quite deep) or .308 (tried and true).
Unless, you plan to hunt big game, 6mmAR or 6.5 Grendal. Both beat any of the .223 loads in a smaller package than the AR-10s. If you're going to hunt, go with the AR-10s - 6.5 CM, .260 (although match bullets must be seated quite deep) or .308 (tried and true).
