Looking at getting into NRL22/NRL22X. KIDD vs Vudoo

[IamJoHo]

So I'm looking at getting into NRL22 and possibly NRL22X. I am leaning towards a full KIDD Supergrade build. But what I am wondering is if the Vudoo for another $800-1000+ worth it. I believe they both guarantee a .5 moa at 50 yards. I am feeling like the the KIDD might be the better option because I can put the money saved into the optic. Also I plan to take the rifle up the street to Lapua and test with their ammo and would have that additional money to buy a case of the best grouping lot of ammo.

Let me know what you guys think. I know they are both supposed to be great rifles and I would love to hear from anyone that owns both.

 

[littlepod]

Just get a Bergara B14R for $900.

 

[Rickstir]

CZ 457 Pro Varmint $550. Very accurate rifle.

 

[IamJoHo]

Just get a Bergara B14R for $900.

CZ 457 Pro Varmint $550. Very accurate rifle.

Would you both say this would be more accurate than the KIDD?

 

[littlepod]

I would say that it would get you more practice and muscle memory to run a bolt than a semi auto if you ever plan on going to be fully competitive in PRS/NRL/NRL22. I haven't seen a single open winner running a semi-auto, or in Nationals in the top 20-30...

 

[Badjujuu]

I started off with Ruger Precision Rimfire then upgraded to CZ455 and eventually ended up with a Vudoo. Wife now shoots my CZ455 in MPA chassis with SwampFox glass and she easily keeps up.... (3/14 in NRL22 and 2/7 in Long Range last match we shot)

IMHO, bolt action is the way to go.....if I don't get another Vudoo, I'll be looking at CZ457

 

[MarkCZ]

So I'm looking at getting into NRL22 and possibly NRL22X. I am leaning towards a full KIDD Supergrade build. But what I am wondering is if the Vudoo for another $800-1000+ worth it. I believe they both guarantee a .5 moa at 50 yards. I am feeling like the the KIDD might be the better option because I can put the money saved into the optic. Also I plan to take the rifle up the street to Lapua and test with their ammo and would have that additional money to buy a case of the best grouping lot of ammo.

Let me know what you guys think. I know they are both supposed to be great rifles and I would love to hear from anyone that owns both.

I have a full Kidd Supergrade, a Tikka T1X, and a Bergara B14R. all shoot great, all will shoot 1/2 moa with good ammo. I got a Kidd Supergrade barreled action and put it in a Titan stock with Titan rear anchor, IMO best setup for a 10-22. A SG will run around $1300, a Vudoo will run 2 times that or more. I don't have a Vudoo, can't put that much into it right now.
Mark

 

[Tiger_Shilone]

I’ll quote myself in anther thread to save the typing, still relevant to the current conversation

My opinions:

I have a couple KIDD supergrades and 3 ruger 10/22's right now, also tikka, CZ (455/457), anschutz and vudoo bolt actions and have competed with them all. Save yourself the headache up front and get a bolt action. The semi autos are fun and awesome when they are working properly, but are a finicky lot and proper lube choices make or break the rifle reliability on a properly set up gun. On a set-up less than ideal, there are a ton of problems with the 10/22 platform that require a lot of troubleshooting and experience. I got tired of having a 10/22 run flawlessly during sight in or day practice and then getting FTF or other issues taking the rifle down during the middle of a timed string of fire in a match.

Seems like between 400-500 rounds is when the semi auto problems like to appear. Ammo brands also figure heavily into semi reliability. Mini mags have been the only ammo I haven't had problems with in a semi, but it's not match grade ammo. 10/22s are also a lot more involved to take apart and clean. Don't get me wrong, they are a fun gun, I've just had too many failures with SV ammo to trust them.

As far as accuracy goes, quality barrels all pretty much perform at or well under MOA at sub 100 yards on either platform. Past 100 yards the bolts are going to be a better bet from my past adventures.

 

[Criver600]

Get the Vudoo, like the previous post said beyond 100 advantage goes to the bolt action. As good as a semi-auto seems to be you will get unexplainable flyers, and reliability issues with match ammunition.

 

[nakoa01]

Had a kidd ans it ran flawless but was super super picky and this was at 50 yds. Had several CZs with custom barrels. Flawless and very nice rifle. The kidd at 1300 with top ammo was nice. But a cz provarmint and center x will shoot just as good at a fraction of the cost. Bought 2 bergaras and they shoot right with my vudoo at 50 yes if I am running center x theough them. Bought a vudoo. Now on 4 if them. Absoltutley the most consistent easiest rifle to shoot I have ever shot. No ammo testing no finicky etc etc. I count in then to do their thing like I do when I go outside and put the key in the ignition. They are so wonderful that I took a seperate insurance policy out for them should my house ever get broken into.
I don't shoot typically shoot past 50 yds. One windless day I decided to do so with my heaviest vudoo. 100yds, mobile pop up table, 22in kukri barrel, mdt ABC chassis, sightron scope, center x ammo. Was near windless day. I shot 6 5 shot groups, I had 2 fliers. Counting those fliers with no warm up groups, the avg was .72. I thought the groups sucked til I miced them. Holy cow.
Sold the kidd, sold my CZs...all of them, sold my steel bergara, miss it however.
To me, I like the bolt and magazine better. The magazine for me is easier to load and thr bolt is flawless. When I run my Vudoo fast and correctly its butter.
For me if I were shooting for small groups no doubt it would be a Vudoo. I personally think people get way too serious about fine tuning for prs. Shooting off barricades, off hand, and in the field the bergara will easily win you any match. That being said, so would a cz. CZ 457 precision in the manners stock had the best out of the box trigger and stock of anything out there. The bolt is crazy smooth and fast, and the mags are simply flawless. For a match rifle you do not need a new barrel. But if you wanted one I would highly recommend the full blown custom version sold by area 419. They have all the bells and whistles ready to go match rifle.
Still wont shoot off sand bags with a vudoo. Pick your poison. But dint believe buy once cry once. It's a rare disease but it's super deadly to the wallet. It's called Vudoorona. Like insiad I have more than one.
Last piece of advice, do not be afraid to buy a used one. I have bought 2 on here and they looked brand new. Shoot right with my other vudoo I bought from them. You can save some money and helps a fellow shooter out. If they have what you want. If not best customer service in the world is from Vudoo.

 

[Tortuga]

I went the decked out Bergara route and worked at saving where I could. Took advantage of sales on the Grayboe stock, TT Diamond and stalked the exchange for a used Kahles. Saved me $1100 vs. a V-22 and if I decide I must have a Vudoo, I already have everything to slap on the barreled action and then sell the Bergara off.

 

[Skok3y]

I have owned both the KIDD and Vudoo as well as several professional tuned CZs. None of them were the equal of the Vudoo.

The KIDD was nice and could hold 1/2” at 50, but it was rarely exceptional. With the cheap plastic stocks, it always felt less polished to. It really helps being able to choose a chassis that fits you.

All but one of my CZs was similar. My last CZ with a Lilja and tuner is the only rifle that could come close to my Vudoo and it is the only other rifle I’ve owned that made me feel like I could live without the Vudoo (but that was the 3rd professionally tuned CZ I’ve owned).

I purchased the Vudoo barreled action from Mile High, purchased a Timney trigger and later upgraded to a TT Diamond, purchased several chassis options, and installed them all myself. I’ve never been a builder and it could not have been easier. (Can’t do than with some other rifles.) The Vudoo came out of the box shooting better than I’ve ever shot with anything in my life. Once I tried out CenterX, it became an even better dream machine. I may purchase another.

I will tell people not to hesitate waiting and spending more on the Vudoo. If you are competing (as you mentioned), I would want to give myself the best chance, and I would get another Vudoo. If I were just competing with myself, I would probably still buy another Vudoo, because you do miss how easy it is after moving on.

 

[1911Shootist]

I went from a Savage MkII BV-SR, to a CZ 455 Tacticool, to a Kidd Supergrade, to a Bergara B14R. I've had custom 10/22's in the past as well.

If I set the best one at 100% in terms of accuracy, I'd rank them like this:
Bergara = 100%
CZ 455 = 90%
Kidd = 85%
Savage = 75%

The Kidd just had too many flyers and wasn't reliable enough. Time saved not working the bolt turned into time spent clearing jams and reloading.

 

[nakoa01]

I have owned both the KIDD and Vudoo as well as several professional tuned CZs. None of them were the equal of the Vudoo.

The KIDD was nice and could hold 1/2” at 50, but it was rarely exceptional. With the cheap plastic stocks, it always felt less polished to. It really helps being able to choose a chassis that fits you.

All but one of my CZs was similar. My last CZ with a Lilja and tuner is the only rifle that could come close to my Vudoo and it is the only other rifle I’ve owned that made me feel like I could live without the Vudoo (but that was the 3rd professionally tuned CZ I’ve owned).

I purchased the Vudoo barreled action from Mile High, purchased a Timney trigger and later upgraded to a TT Diamond, purchased several chassis options, and installed them all myself. I’ve never been a builder and it could not have been easier. (Can’t do than with some other rifles.) The Vudoo came out of the box shooting better than I’ve ever shot with anything in my life. Once I tried out CenterX, it became an even better dream machine. I may purchase another.

I will tell people not to hesitate waiting and spending more on the Vudoo. If you are competing (as you mentioned), I would want to give myself the best chance, and I would get another Vudoo. If I were just competing with myself, I would probably still buy another Vudoo, because you do miss how easy it is after moving on.

What he said

 

[Kevin1]

I have a Kidd Supergrade and is reliable, but I have to clean it (at least the chamber) every 150 rounds. It is also lighter and much quicker than a Vudoo.

My Kidd Supergrade will shoot in the high 0.3s at 50Y and around 1” at 100Y.

My Vudoo will shoot in the low 0.2s at 50Y and around 0.70” at 100Y.



The Kidd Supergrade is the gun I have the most fun shooting. But if I want to do serious target work I’ll pick the Vudoo over the Kidd.



Below pics of groups


Kidd

Vudoo

 

[Nfrantz87]

Don't rule out building a RimX

 

[Broncovan]

Would you both say this would be more accurate than the KIDD?

I shot a 5-5 shot group that averaged just over 3/4" at 100 yards with mine with Eley 10x ammo and another 5-5 round average of 1.1" with SK Standard Plus.
50yd groups are in the .3's regularly.
First thing I did was drop it into a KRG Bravo stock. AI sized mags, decent trigger (not quite as nice as my TT primary, but close) less than 1/2 the price of a Vudoo, Remington 700 footprint. Needless to say, I'm very happy with my Bergara.

 

[IamJoHo]

Just ended up find a local Vudoo dealer that has a bunch of barreled actions in stock. Will be picking one up later this week. Now I need to find some good deals on used gear to finish the rest of the build.

Thanks everyone for your responses.

 

[Pvt.Donut]

I'd think for NRL22 you would want a bolt rifle. The KIDD looks to shoot very well but the issue you'll run into is since it's a semi auto you'll need to engage the safety when transitioning positions. I assume it still uses a crossbolt safety which to me seems a bit slow and awkward when you're on the clock and you have to switch it back and forth up to 5 or so times per stage. With a bolt rifle you just need to have your bolt back to transitition.

 

[IamJoHo]

I'd think for NRL22 you would want a bolt rifle. The KIDD looks to shoot very well but the issue you'll run into is since it's a semi auto you'll need to engage the safety when transitioning positions. I assume it still uses a crossbolt safety which to me seems a bit slow and awkward when you're on the clock and you have to switch it back and forth up to 5 or so times per stage. With a bolt rifle you just need to have your bolt back to transitition.

Thats a great point. I didnt realize this or think about this. Thanks for that bit of insight.

 

[1911Shootist]

I'd think for NRL22 you would want a bolt rifle. The KIDD looks to shoot very well but the issue you'll run into is since it's a semi auto you'll need to engage the safety when transitioning positions. I assume it still uses a crossbolt safety which to me seems a bit slow and awkward when you're on the clock and you have to switch it back and forth up to 5 or so times per stage. With a bolt rifle you just need to have your bolt back to transitition.

I think that goes both ways. With these 700 style riffles, I find I have to hold my bolt back to prevent it from moving forward and stripping off a round as I move forward into a position, potentially causing a misfeed and otherwise unnecessary reload. Either type of rifle requires some hand manipulation.

 

[Ruff 364]

I'd think for NRL22 you would want a bolt rifle. The KIDD looks to shoot very well but the issue you'll run into is since it's a semi auto you'll need to engage the safety when transitioning positions. I assume it still uses a crossbolt safety which to me seems a bit slow and awkward when you're on the clock and you have to switch it back and forth up to 5 or so times per stage. With a bolt rifle you just need to have your bolt back to transitition.

That's a non-issue, you can train to work a safety without thinking about it. The 10 rounds in two minutes time limit and .2 seconds to work a safety isn't going to make or break you in a match.

I've been running a TacSol 10/22 in NRL22 since the beginning, and I'm a lefty as well. Left side charging handle and a reversed safety and it's good to go.

I'm currently building a Rim X as the 10/22 platform is no longer viable in the game. The safety was never a problem.

 

[littlepod]

That's a non-issue, you can train to work a safety without thinking about it. The 10 rounds in two minutes time limit and .2 seconds to work a safety isn't going to make or break you in a match.

I've been running a TacSol 10/22 in NRL22 since the beginning, and I'm a lefty as well. Left side charging handle and a reversed safety and it's good to go.

I'm currently building a Rim X as the 10/22 platform is no longer viable in the game. The safety was never a problem.

Agree.

I shot a 10/22 for a few months, and was clearing stages out in like 60s. They give you more than enough time regardless of bolt / semi. All my bolts shot better with less effort.

I think that goes both ways. With these 700 style riffles, I find I have to hold my bolt back to prevent it from moving forward and stripping off a round as I move forward into a position, potentially causing a misfeed and otherwise unnecessary reload. Either type of rifle requires some hand manipulation.

I haven't had issues with this. When I transition, I do muzzle up, not down. Never had my bolt slide forward enough to strip a round. I've now run my Vudoo for 7 months, in a dozen matches.

 

[hlee]

I have a kid super grade that shoots lights out at 50 yards. The 50 y kyl (8 targets, smallest is 1/4”) is not really a challenge with it. It can hang with the vudoos, but just barely. After I bought it, I was able to take high score in 3 consecutive local prs style 22lr matches. Then, life got in the way and I took some time off. In the interim, the number and percentage of vudoo shooters at that match grew. Same rifle, same shooter, same ammo, same targets, but i went from shooting high score to shooting top 10. That I know of, there is only one other regular shooter with a semi auto- and I’d say that vudoos outnumber all others by a wide margin. I actually heard the match director refer to the event as a “vudoo match,” as in “that is what happens when you bring a ‘X‘ to a vudoo match...” If you want to shoot a semi auto, and I believe there are advantages to shooting a semi (not breaking your position on a wobbly prop to run the bolt is chief among them), buy the Kidd. But, if you want to be truly competitive every day, I think that the vudoo has the Kidd beat.

 

[1911Shootist]

I haven't had issues with this. When I transition, I do muzzle up, not down. Never had my bolt slide forward enough to strip a round. I've now run my Vudoo for 7 months, in a dozen matches.

My Bergara must be smoother than your Vudoo then

Jokes aside, I do move rather efficiently (3gun/USPSA background), and this is really only an issue on stages with the ladder or heavy fore/aft movement of the rifle.

 

[littlepod]

My Bergara must be smoother than your Vudoo then

Jokes aside, I do move rather efficiently (3gun/USPSA background), and this is really only an issue on stages with the ladder or heavy fore/aft movement of the rifle.

When bolt has slightly moved forward, does it cause a double feed on the next round or what jam happens?

 

[1911Shootist]

When bolt has slightly moved forward, does it cause a double feed on the next round or what jam happens?

Nothing bad happens until I either jar the rifle backwards or pull the bolt back. If I don't notice that it stripped a round, then I've got an issue.

 

[Pvt.Donut]

I didn't mean to imply there was an issue one way or the other, just bringing up one thing most don't think about until they're at a match. I also have the issue on my Bergara of the bolt stripping a round when I move, something that I'll have to train myself to correct. Either rifle type would work just fine.