Sidearms & Scatterguns Looking to buy my first competition/race gun

[Yaaker]

Hey everyone. Let me start off by saying that I know the internet is full of related questions like "what's the best caliber for competition," and "what's the best platform to use for competition." My case is slightly unique because most of those don't seem to state any previous or current concerns regarding common calibers within the collection, or having another gun to fill certain roles in competition classes.

I already have a Ruger SR1911 that I have kept completely stock from the factory, and love it to death. I also have an XD-s in .45ACp for my EDC and love it too. My other handguns are all in .22lr beyond these two, so here are the pro-s and con-s in my eyes, and I would like your guys' opinions as to if I am heading in the right direction, especially if you have been down this road before..Keep in mind, at this point in time, I do not have the space or time to reload, so wildcat calibers like .38 super and 9x25 are out of the question for me. I figure once I nail down the caliber, then I will move on to selecting the firearm itself.

Last but not least, i'd like to go into the Open Class in terms of competing with this gun. I would also like to have a lower rail on it too for a tac light so it can double as a night stand gun. As I said before, I have the factory 1911 I can use for quite a few of the other competition classes like Single Stack, Production, Limited-10, and Limited 9I may be mistaken).

So....here we go....

.45 ACP
Pro's: same caliber as what I already have for the rest of my big bore handguns, puts me in 'major' scoring system
Con's: more expensive (not reloading right now), more recoil, reduced mag capacity

.40 S&W
Pro's: Less expensive than the .45, less recoil, higher capacity than the .45 offers, still in 'major' scoring system
Con's: Different caliber to buy and add to the collection

9mm
Pro's: Highest magazine capacity, lowest recoil, and cheapest ammo
Con's: Different caliber to buy and add to the collection, puts me in 'minor' scoring system

That being said, i'd also like your input on the gun itself. Of course this will have some dependency on the caliber. I can shoot about any handgun well, except Glocks, with little to no practice, so fit isn;t a huge issue, whether it be a CZ, a 1911, a 2011, an XDm, an FNX, an M&P, etc. I would LIKE to keep the price point under about $1500 with optic.

Thanks for reading, and even bigger thanks for your help!

 

[para72]

If you decide to go .40

Paraman1 is selling a para P16-40 set up for limited for $1100. It's in the for sale section. belt holster 4 mags with extension's. Not sure what extensions, but I know you can get +4's to bring round count to 20+1 in the pipe!

Hope this helps

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk

 

[para72]

If you decide to go .40

Paraman1 is selling a para P16-40 set up for limited in USPSA for $1100. It's in the for sale section. belt holster 4 mags with extension's. Not sure what extensions, but I know you can get +4's to bring round count to 20+1 in the pipe!

Hope this helps

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk

 

[ShtrRdy]

From my experience, an Open Class gun does not make a good night stand gun. An Open Class gun is like a Formula 1 race car or dragster.

What type of match do you intend to compete in?

 

[siscoe308]

Give a Glock 22 a fair shake, they are hard to beat price and performance wise. They also can slicked up to compete with ANY handgun out there.

 

[Yaaker]

From my experience, an Open Class gun does not make a good night stand gun. An Open Class gun is like a Formula 1 race car or dragster.

What type of match do you intend to compete in?

Fair enough. i can see the issues seen there. Perhaps I might, down the road, sell or trade my SR1911 for a 1911 with a rail. Having a rail on my race gun would still be a plus for me, so i'd have that option even if I end up never using it. I plan to compete in about any IDPA/IPSC/3 gun matches I can find in a decent proximity to my location. A lot of move/shoot types of matches.

 

[Yaaker]

Give a Glock 22 a fair shake, they are hard to beat price and performance wise. They also can slicked up to compete with ANY handgun out there.

I have owned Glocks in the past, but their grip angle does not agree with my natural POA. The 1911 style grip is for me - hence things like the FNX, CZ, XDm, etc being more to my liking.

 

[Yaaker]

Oh, I should also add, I am by no means making this thread to find the justification to make a potentially bad purchase decision. I am asking because I understand many of you have much more experience in this area, and I genuinely want your input and feedback.

 

[sgtkeebler]

Instead of jumping right into open use what you have and shoot single stack or limited. Go out and get used to shooting competitions. You'll meet a lot of experienced shoots out there and I'm sure you can ask/try out lots of different setups and see what you like the most.
I just stick with my glock 34 for production and limited, 9mm is cheap and all I do is add a magwell and grab my +5 mags for limited.

 

[RTL]

Instead of jumping right into open use what you have and shoot single stack or limited. Go out and get used to shooting competitions. You'll meet a lot of experienced shoots out there and I'm sure you can ask/try out lots of different setups and see what you like the most.

+1 and do a lot of reading here.
Brian Enos's Forums... Maku mozo!

 

[ddavis]

I don't do much handgun competition stuff. I do hang around a lot of people who are into that kind of thing though. Some of them are VERY good at it. The general consensus is to use a 9mm if you are shooting 3 gun where power factor doesn't matter, or .40 for everything else. The reason people like 40 is that you can load it up to make major or load it down for shooting steel or practice, etc. I started out shooting local competitions with a .45 XD. 45 is about the worst choice overall because you get more recoil than 9 or 40, with less mag capacity. Personally, when I get a "race gun" it will be a 9mm because I think power factor limits are a stupid antiquated way of giving 1911 shooters a built in handicap like several of the other rules (single stack, etc.) so I don't really care to shoot in disciplines where there is power factor. I prefer 3 gun nation rules in general.

 

[Yaaker]

Excellent points, to everyone thus far. i am really getting a lot of good info here. It seems like 9mm is probably the way to go, and I figure if I practice enough (something that will happen more with the cost of 9mm ammo vs the others) then maybe being in the Minor scoring system won't be as much of an issue. Again, I don't plan on dropping $3K on a gun right now. I might not even like open class. So if I fall in love, then down the road when i have the capabilities to reload, I'll look into something like 9x25 or 38 super.

That being said, I usually try to not add a new caliber to the collection, and due to the roles of my other .45's, I doubt i'll wind up ever buying another 9mm beyond a competition gun. Do you think it will be a good idea to add the 9mm to the safe with it being just a single gun?

I suppose now it will come down to the gun itself. Keep in mind I want to shoot open class. So far I have been looking at all the below, and shoot them all great. Factory triggers don't bother me as i'll replace it anyways. What are some of your preferences/experience with these? Keep in mind I am trying to keep it under $1500 all in (mags, holster, optic, trigger, slide lightening if needed, etc). At this point I suppose i'll limit it to the 9mm caliber. I also plan to stick with an RMR for an optic. I don't like the size of the C-More, and I don't like the durability of the Burris FF. If you have any other suggestions, I'd love to hear them. Please keep my pricepoint and needs in mind though. No Glocks please.

XDm 5.25
FNX Tactical
M&P Core
Sig P226 (wish I could afford the new X-series)
I may look into some CZ's as well.

 

[titandriver]

Where ya at in Montana?

 

[Yaaker]

Where ya at in Montana?

Bozeman good sir!

 

[titandriver]

You're in luck then! The Gallatin Action Shooters are hosting a USPSA match tomorrow (07 June) at the range in Logan. If you can get out there to at least watch & perhaps get a feel for what division you could shoot and how the game is played. Dennis Gentry is the match director there and he can show you around a bit.

See ya!

Rich

 

[titandriver]

Bozeman good sir!

You're in luck then! The Gallatin Action Shooters are hosting a USPSA match tomorrow (07 June) at the range in Logan. If you can get out there to at least watch & perhaps get a feel for what division you could shoot and how the game is played. Dennis Gentry is the match director there and he can show you around a bit.

See ya!

Rich

 

[ZLBubba]

Frankly, if you're already set up with 45, then get a solid, used 1911 and be done with it. You'll shoot in a tough class but who gives a shit about good competition? Good competition in my mind only raises the bar and pushes you to hone your skills. Look for a Dan Wesson or Springfield TRP. If you're at the $1500 price point, then save for a couple extra months and get a Les Baer. Once you have it, that gun will last you a lifetime and you'll never regret owning it. Plus, having a solid 1911 means that your comp gun can also be your home defense or carry gun, unlike the fancy race guns with optics on them. I simply don't see a point in competition for competition's sake, but that's just me (and part of the reason why I love IDPA and precision rifle comps instead of benchrest stuff).

This isn't to say I don't love my Glocks, but you'll be way happier in the long run with a solid, mid-range 1911 than you will with any of the options you listed above. Just my 2 cents.

 

[steve123]

It would be hard to get into one for $1500 but I'd look into a used STI 2011 in 40. Once you've shot one it's hard to put just about any other pistol between your palms.

 

[AZ SCORPIO]

XDm 5.25
FNX Tactical
M&P Core
Sig P226 (wish I could afford the new X-series)
I may look into some CZ's as well.

I have and shoot at the range both the .45 XDm and the P226. I am much more accurate with the P226 than I am with the XDm - but I think that has mostly to do with recoil right now (i.e. flinch, anticipation, follow through - so not a recoil issue, a user issue with recoil...). I loved the P226, but recently changed my grip and getting used to a new hold on the gun and now find it "harder to shoot" (i.e. trigger pull seems very stiff) but my new hold has made me even more accurate. So - it is just a muscle memory issue at this point. Also, if I were to compete with a P226, I would certainly get some trigger work done and get a lighter pull and shorter reset.

I like the XDm, but I have good sized hands and some find the xDM .45 quite a large grip requirement.

If I were to enter competition, I would go with 9mm. For all the same reasons you have already listed above - recoil, cost of ammo, etc. For me, the 9mm is quicker for follow on/next shots.

My <$0.02.

BTW - this may be exactly the rig you are looking for! A P226 in 9mm with short trigger reset with 11 mags.

http://www.snipershide.com/shooting...226-enhanced-elite-10-mags;-$825-shipped.html

 

[Yaaker]

Thanks for all of the replies thus far everyone!

As far as weapon choices go, I have shot all the ones I mentioned, and I shoot them all well. I am not a huge fanboy of any manufacturer (although I trust my like the an XD-s every day), so I am getting down to what would you choose as a competition gun? If I went with the Core or FNX, I would get the model with an RMR, do a little trigger work and maybe some slide lightening, buy some mags and gear, and get to it. . Obviously I would need to also get an optic and such for an XDm or a 226. Which route would you go, and which route do you think would have an end result of the least amount of cash out of pocket vs quality?

 

[Outdoorsman9]

I got a fully tricked out 5.25 XDm on order through the custom shop at Springfield. If I remember I'll let you know how it shoots. Could be a while though....

 

[c ward]

Nothing with optics will be IDPA legal

 

[Yaaker]

I got a fully tricked out 5.25 XDm on order through the custom shop at Springfield. If I remember I'll let you know how it shoots. Could be a while though....

I look forward to it!

 

[Hummerdawg]

It would be hard to get into one for $1500 but I'd look into a used STI 2011 in 40. Once you've shot one it's hard to put just about any other pistol between your palms.

Yep but you free up some money by selling off all the other clunker pistols you previously thought were good guns

 

[steve123]

Yep but you free up some money by selling off all the other clunker pistols you previously thought were good guns

Totally!


Search my recent posts. I made a few comments on just that.

Another plus is since I can reload 40 all the way down to 125 PF with 140's or easily exceed major I'm not switching dies and shell plates as much as I used to when I reloaded for 357 sig, 40, 10mm, 9mm, 38S, 45, etc, which was a PITA. ...KISS...

 

[Spiff034]

Yep, if you get an open gun you will not be shooting IDPA. You'll also be shooting 3 gun against guys with xrails and 22 round mag Saigas for shotguns. In USPSA you will be at a big disadvantage with a .40 because of the mag capacity, and at a big disadvantage with a 9mm because you aren't going to load it to major levels.

You'd be much better off buying an M&P9, G17, G34, or XDM and using it in Production or Limited (minor)(USPSA), SSP or ESP (IDPA), and Tac Optics or Limited/Tac Irons in 3 gun. And if you decide later to shoot open, you'll have the experience to make a good decision on what to buy. Or, you'll be able to throw a dot on the gun you already have and go to town.

 

[Yaaker]

Well, it seems by both the poll and the posts that 9mm is definitely going to by my way to go!

 

[Yaaker]

Ok guys, sorry to revive this guy. I have come across a lot of Glocks lately where people would have the grips altered to remove the finger grooves and the back hump, effectively changing the grip angle, which is what I don't like about them. I may put Glocks back on the list then, with the intention of having this work done. What do you think of this new gun option list?

Glock 34; (undercut, frame stippling and alterations mentioned above, slide cuts, RMR, KKM Threaded match barrel, comp, LW Guide Rod, Zev upper parts kit, Zev trigger, Zev mag release, upgraded firing pin springs and striker)

XDm 5.25; (slide cuts, RMR, match threaded barrel, comp, upgraded guide rod, parts kit, PRP trigger, etc. Similar to the G34 in terms of upgrades)

FNX Tactical; (comp, RMR, trigger and internal upgrades)

M&P Core; (threaded match barrel, comp, RMR, trigger and internal upgrades)

Clearly my list for the G34 is much more complete, but you get the gist. I found another G34 build online I love and took a lot of the parts from that for my own list. Given the guns and work needed above, keeping my budget of roughly $1500 in mind, what route would you go?

 

[BERTMAN77MK2]

I would " upgrade" to the new Glock .45 longslide and not look back!
A real comp gun!

 

[Yaaker]

Thanks Bertman. There is one thing that's bugging me still about the Glock....no matter how much money I put into it and upgrade it, it's still a Glock lol.

Also, since I am not very versed in the rules of the shooting sports, can any of you guys answer this for me - can I have the RMR, match barrel, and comp on there to shoot open class, but take the comp and RMR off to shoot in limited or a different category?

 

[Kuto]

Instead of jumping right into open use what you have and shoot single stack or limited. Go out and get used to shooting competitions. You'll meet a lot of experienced shoots out there and I'm sure you can ask/try out lots of different setups and see what you like the most.
I just stick with my glock 34 for production and limited, 9mm is cheap and all I do is add a magwell and grab my +5 mags for limited.

I would have to agree, I showed up to competition shooting with a Beretta 90 - TWO....people there at the club told me I was nuts and at a huge disadvantage.....I figured they knew what they were talking about.....so I purchased a para p16-40 and started competing in limited.....took me a while to get used the lighter trigger pull (just me I guess) and the thing just gave me jamming problems that you wouldn't believe......I have known people that have had paras with no problems and others with many as wsas my experience....anyway I got fed up with it and sold to some one at the club that swapped barrels....I went back to the beretta and won production local circuit last year.....

Open guns are rather expensive and finicky from what I have seen, production also gives you the opportunity to shoot your night table gun.....IMO I would suggest you get any 9mm that you want and start shooting at matches and get the hang of competing and see where it takes you.....good luck!

 

[oneluckysob]

If you do decide to go with an XDm, call Scott @ Springer Precision :: The XD Specialists just got some parts for my 5.25 from him; a Bar-sto barrel threaded for his shorty comp in 9mm was the big ticket item along with a fastfire mount. His work is top notch and has a strong following on other forums.