Low Effort Reloading - What's the bare minimum for precision rifle?

[rybe390]

Hey Folks!

Long story short, I've been reloading for a few years, mainly handgun and low volume rifle. As the thread title implies, I'm looking to find a process that's just "good enough" for precision rifle. I'm going to be jumping into precision rifle competition a bit more, and am going to be loading a higher volume of rifle than I ever have. I plan to load around 1,000 at a time, in batches. Run through that ammo, and load again, etc. For me, reloading is a bit of a hobby, but I really do it because it allows me to shoot more, make any ammo I want, and make better ammo, sometimes.

I'm trying to cut out all the BS and avoid rabbit holes. I'm trying to find a reloading process that doesn't focus on the tiny details, but worries about the 95% of steps that really matter. Looking for practical accuracy and low ES/SD. I really appreciate any help in advance on this topic. I know a lot of people like to get into the weeds with reloading, and I'm actively trying to do the opposite.

Folks who currently load a decent volume of rifle rounds, would you mind sharing your process start to finish, for both load development and the actual loading process? I'm putting mine below, please let me know if any of my steps are not needed, and if there's anything I need to be cutting out, or including. My goal is MOA or better ammo, so I can spend time shooting, and not on the bench. I will admit I don't know a whole lot about the reloading process and what can be done/should be done for this sort of reloading.

Load Dev:
10 rounds over magnetospeed, .2 jump until a bit over book max. Find flat spot in velocity
Load 15 rounds at that flat spot. Shoot 5 over chrono, 2x5 for groups. If it groups, we're good.
Reloading process, 1x fired brass:
Clean dirty brass in walnut media
Resize full length/deprime
Trim/Chamfer/Deburr with rcbs 3 way trimmer tool
Prime
Drop powder charges
Seat bullets
Done.

 

[straightshooter1]

"good enough" for precision rifle is kinda an oxymoron, huh???

 

[delfuego]

Wipe cases with cloth
Resize and decap at the same time
Tumble
Prime
Charge
Seat

Good measuring tools are critical
Cleaning dies more often required
Lots more time to drink beer

Flame Away....

 

[rybe390]

"good enough" for precision rifle is kinda an oxymoron, huh???

Oh trust me, I know. I'm a factory ammo and roll kind of guy but can't stand the increased prices recently. $1.25 at a minimum for 140 eld is killing me. I'm not looking to get .25 MOA ammo as I can't shoot that well, literally just want something that's accurate enough.

 

[smoothy8500]

Half MOA-ish all day is possible when in a node with a powder dropper that meters within +/-.1gr

Like delfuego, I prefer to shoot and drink beer. Only my Palma loads get trickled, everything else is just metered.

 

[Dai Bando]

rybe390,

I like your style.

Find the widest node and throw ball powder on a Dillon 550.

1. Size/deprime/prime
2. Add ball powder (6.5 Staball?)
3. Seat Bullet
4. Profit

I'd take a listen to that Scott Saterlee podcast discussing seating depth nodes as well.

I've got a .223AI that shoots killer way, way, way out there with thrown charges of ball powder.

The Dillon powder throw is damn impressive when measured on my FX-120i fwiw.

 

[Dai Bando]

Before someone asks.

MDS Episode #0014: Scott Satterlee and Hand Loading

Modern Day Sniper Podcast · Episode

open.spotify.com

 

[Steel head]

Speed node
Jump test
Size cases -.001-.002 or even neck size in non critical applications.
Prime
Throw charges on RCBS or hornandy electronic powder measure
Seat bullet
Neck turn on ELR cases.
Trim and anneal when necessary(about every fifth loading), no sorting brass, bullets or primers.

 

[Powder_Burns]

Sort brass and bullets by weight. Find the average weight and anything thats off gets culled. Then measure all the bullets for length, sort them in order. Anything off the average gets culled. Prep the brass-uniform pockets deburr flash holes anneal trim to length chamfer deburr and prime.
Trickle every charge on a scale that resolves to at least .05gr or better. Seat bullets with seating stem that matches ogive, double check all dimensions then box with all data written on the box and in log book. Then buy a new rifle and put all those loads in storage.

All the culled stuff, use for fouling shots or plinking.

 

[straightshooter1]

Hey Folks!

Long story short, I've been reloading for a few years, mainly handgun and low volume rifle. As the thread title implies, I'm looking to find a process that's just "good enough" for precision rifle. I'm going to be jumping into precision rifle competition a bit more, and am going to be loading a higher volume of rifle than I ever have. I plan to load around 1,000 at a time, in batches. Run through that ammo, and load again, etc. For me, reloading is a bit of a hobby, but I really do it because it allows me to shoot more, make any ammo I want, and make better ammo, sometimes.

I'm trying to cut out all the BS and avoid rabbit holes. I'm trying to find a reloading process that doesn't focus on the tiny details, but worries about the 95% of steps that really matter. Looking for practical accuracy and low ES/SD. I really appreciate any help in advance on this topic. I know a lot of people like to get into the weeds with reloading, and I'm actively trying to do the opposite.

Folks who currently load a decent volume of rifle rounds, would you mind sharing your process start to finish, for both load development and the actual loading process? I'm putting mine below, please let me know if any of my steps are not needed, and if there's anything I need to be cutting out, or including. My goal is MOA or better ammo, so I can spend time shooting, and not on the bench. I will admit I don't know a whole lot about the reloading process and what can be done/should be done for this sort of reloading.

Load Dev:
10 rounds over magnetospeed, .2 jump until a bit over book max. Find flat spot in velocity
Load 15 rounds at that flat spot. Shoot 5 over chrono, 2x5 for groups. If it groups, we're good.
Reloading process, 1x fired brass:
Clean dirty brass in walnut media
Resize full length/deprime
Trim/Chamfer/Deburr with rcbs 3 way trimmer tool
Prime
Drop powder charges
Seat bullets
Done.

Reloading process, 1x fired brass:

Clean dirty brass in walnut media (medium grain rice does great and less dusty)
Resize full length/deprime (without an expander ball; don't use a bushing die)
Expand with an Expansion Mandrel
Trim/Chamfer/Deburr with rcbs 3 way trimmer tool
Prime
Drop powder charges (use a RCBS Charge Master for "good enough" precision with low SD's and good ES's)
Seat bullets

Done . . . "good enough".

 

[mkollman74]

"good enough" for precision rifle is kinda an oxymoron, huh???

Not really... At least IMHO. We should all be searching for the least amount of effort required to satisfy the accuracy demands we have. Do I really need to weight sort bullets to hit a 1 MOA target at 1200 yards...? My experience says, "NO". Primer pocket uniforming? Neck turning? Weight sorting brass?

 

[Powder_Burns]

That stuff only has to be done once though. To each his own, but I’ll invest the extra 30 minutes in initial brass prep for cases I’ll end up reloading 6 or 7 times if it means potentially reducing vertical spread.

 

[rybe390]

Speed node
Jump test
Size cases -.001-.002 or even neck size in non critical applications.
Prime
Throw charges on RCBS or hornandy electronic powder measure
Seat bullet
Neck turn on ELR cases.
Trim and anneal when necessary(about every fifth loading), no sorting brass, bullets or primers.

This is my type of list!

Questions I have for you:
Speed node: are you doing this as a 10 round over a Chrono? Do you just pick a random seating depth and call it good for this? If not, what's your depth for this?

Seating test: what are your go to depths to test? I've seen everyone recommend 4 depths and pick the best. Not looking for further refinement.

Trimming: I don't plan to anneal for now. Do you not trim every resize? This is curious to me and would certainly make the process easier. Do you have a length gauge you just use to skip that step?

 

[rybe390]

Reloading process, 1x fired brass:

Clean dirty brass in walnut media (medium grain rice does great and less dusty)
Resize full length/deprime (without an expander ball; don't use a bushing die)
Expand with an Expansion Mandrel
Trim/Chamfer/Deburr with rcbs 3 way trimmer tool
Prime
Drop powder charges (use a RCBS Charge Master for "good enough" precision with low SD's and good ES's)
Seat bullets

Done . . . "good enough".

Sounds good. I'm on the right track it seems.

For full length resize and then use a mandrel, this is where I get lost. Does a Hornady full length die not fit this bill? Why would you do it in 2 steps?

I use a Hornady dropper for now. I want to get an rcbs, I feel like it'll reduce ES a bit but who knows.

For seating, are you crimping during seating or just letting neck tension do the work?

Thank you!!!

 

[Steel head]

This is my type of list!

Questions I have for you:
Speed node: are you doing this as a 10 round over a Chrono? Do you just pick a random seating depth and call it good for this? If not, what's your depth for this?

Seating test: what are your go to depths to test? I've seen everyone recommend 4 depths and pick the best. Not looking for further refinement.

Trimming: I don't plan to anneal for now. Do you not trim every resize? This is curious to me and would certainly make the process easier. Do you have a length gauge you just use to skip that step?

I do two rounds of each on the chrony starting at .02 off the lands or mag length if I can’t get close.

My seating test is pretty coarse .02 increments so after the initial I test .04, .06, .08 and .1

I measure my chamber and know how long the neck can be I trim it when it gets within 5 thou of max.
I trim maybe every fifth load at most.

You do want to anneal before 5-7 loadings, I use a torch.

 

[Dthomas3523]

There’s two sides to the coin when doing the minimum. And it depends on what the minimum is.

Doing the minimum brass prep and such will make your small batch statistics virtually worthless. If you do the minimum and chrono even up to 10rnds, there’s a very real possibility of high statistical variance.

Also, what is your minimum performance? Bug holes at 100? That’s easy and can be done with a powder drop and bullet seating.

Small ish targets at a fixed distance like 1k? You can work on tweaking positive compensation and make up for those faster or slower than average Bullets.

Want to hit small targets at every distance between 100 and 1200yds? Well now the minimum required work involves a lot of brass prep and a good powder scale (sorting brass and messing with primer pockets has the least ROI if any at all). You’ll need your ES to be under the fps variance that will either miss the target or significantly increase your chances of missing. This number is determined by the distance/speed/target size. I.E. if you’re shooting at ipsc you can have a higher ES than a 1 moa plate and be fine.

 

[straightshooter1]

Sounds good. I'm on the right track it seems.

For full length resize and then use a mandrel, this is where I get lost. Does a Hornady full length die not fit this bill?

Not if it's a bushing die like this:

Better to have something like this (without the expander ball):

Why would you do it in 2 steps?

To reduce/eliminate runout. When you size without the expander ball, you'll need to expand the neck with the proper sized expander mandrel so as to get the neck tension you're after.

Also, it helps a lot (when not using an expander ball) to have the sizing die honed so that the neck is only reduced ~.002 - 003 below where you're going to have your neck tension measurement, which will reduce work hardening and help a lot in maintaining good runout.

I use a Hornady dropper for now. I want to get an rcbs, I feel like it'll reduce ES a bit but who knows.

For seating, are you crimping during seating or just letting neck tension do the work?

Since I reload for bolt gun, there's no need for crimping.

 

[rybe390]

Thanks so much for all the help here folks.

After a bit of reading and help from you all, sounds like I have a new reloading process.

Load process
Tumble
Resize and decap
Expander mandrel
Trim/chamfer/deburr - will explore doing this every few loadings once I learn how to measure chamber, as well as explore annealing before resizing.
Prime
Powder throw
Seat

For load dev, I'm going to start with seating.
Jump test. Scott Satterlee test of 30, 50, 80, 100, 120 thou. Load 5 of each
Chrono test with best coal. 2-3 of each load to reduce variance
Test/confirm flat spot with 10-15 of proper load, 5 loaded 10-30 thou long, 5 loaded 10-30 thou short.

 

[Dthomas3523]

Thanks so much for all the help here folks.

After a bit of reading and help from you all, sounds like I have a new reloading process.

Load process
Tumble
Resize and decap
Expander mandrel
Trim/chamfer/deburr - will explore doing this every few loadings once I learn how to measure chamber, as well as explore annealing before resizing.
Prime
Powder throw
Seat

For load dev, I'm going to start with seating.
Jump test. Scott Satterlee test of 30, 50, 80, 100, 120 thou. Load 5 of each
Chrono test with best coal. 2-3 of each load to reduce variance
Test/confirm flat spot with 10-15 of proper load, 5 loaded 10-30 thou long, 5 loaded 10-30 thou short.

If you’re new to loading, I’d start out just about something like .020 or .050 off lands. Then just work on loading different charge weights and chrono.

The point being to get your process down until you start seeing consistent chrono numbers, indicating your brass prep and charge weights are consistent.

Jumping straight into load development can produce false numbers and you end up with a load that’s not properly developed.

I’d continue running factory ammo while practicing loading for a few weeks. Once you start seeing reliable numbers, then jump into load development.

 

[sandwarrior]

rybe390,

I like your style.

Find the widest node and throw ball powder on a Dillon 550.

1. Size/deprime/prime
2. Add ball powder (6.5 Staball?)
3. Seat Bullet
4. Profit

I'd take a listen to that Scott Saterlee podcast discussing seating depth nodes as well.

I've got a .223AI that shoots killer way, way, way out there with thrown charges of ball powder.

The Dillon powder throw is damn impressive when measured on my FX-120i fwiw.

Staball is dirty as shit! My brass is hard to clean afterwards. And my barrel takes twice what a regular single base powder takes to clean the carbon out of.

It meters great though, and shoots consistently so far. I haven't taken it out in the super cold to see how it shoots.

If you want a clean powder, depending on your cartridge, H4895, IMR4064, IMR/H4350 (AA4350 is okay). If shooting a little gun the best powder I've ever used is AA 2015.

 

[Steel head]

I’d continue running factory ammo while practicing loading for a few weeks. Once you start seeing reliable numbers, then jump into load development.

This for sure.
A simple or advanced approach to reloading is useless if your chasing your tail.

 

[buffybuster]

If you want to load accurate high volume ammo this is what I have found to work:

1. Select components that are forgiving: bullet that is jump tolerant, powder that throws consistently in your powder measure, primer and brass that is reasonably consistent.
2. Old fashion load development to find the node. Once you have a load that shoots to your satisfaction in a node, pick the midway point as your volume load.
3. Setup progressive press for that node (powder measure, bullet seating, crimp, etc). Double check powder will drop at least within 0.2grs. Ball or SSC powders are going to drop the most consistently.
4. Run 20 rounds through to test. I have found ammo loaded this way to be entirely adequate to 600yds. After that, I want my ES to be tighter. You can pretty easily make 100rds/15min.

I size/deprime/trim beforehand, but I know others that do it at the same time. I don't like tumbling loaded rounds to remove the caselube or having tacky ammo. Your preference.

 

[morganlamprecht]

i know lots of people that have wanted simple and effective without 1000 steps and 100 bullet tests for long time

below is exactly what i started doing about 5-6 months ago...in the years past, ive done all the standard accepted powder, jump, sorting, etc tests plenty of times...

starting with fired, dirty brass or new...

1) amp anneal (flame annealing or not annealing im sure can replace, but thats on the user to make sure its done right or brass consistency doesnt change)
2) if brass is super dirty/muddy/sandy ill dry tumble it for 30-45 min prior, otherwise lube and go
3) size...standard full length w/ button or full length w/ bushing that sets necks .002-.003 under loaded w/ no button...ive used either version for different calibers (the actual size value of this bushing may or may not be .002 under loaded, neck size can/will change based on brass hardness/thickness and fired chamber size...if you take a .223rem, .255 neck and run it thru it a .245 bushing, i bet it doesnt come out .245...step it to .250, .248, and then .245, itll be spot on, but thats too many press passes for my taste...so if i want a .245 sized neck, ill use a .246 or .247 bushing to make that happen)
4) wet tumble w/ pins + lemishine + dish soap for 30-45 minutes
5) dry...i have a dehydrator...can use oven, or air, whatever
6) trim/debur if needed
7) prime w/ slight crush
8) if brass was neck sized with bushing (no button), run it over an expander .001 under bullet diameter...if it was standard FL sized w/ button i dont bother
9) charge w/ chargemaster
10) seat bullet

**dont randomly mix brass, bullet, powder, or primer lots without confirming it wont change anything...u could scatter your results before u ever get started

^^ ive left out some of the above steps like tumbling at all, just wiping cases off instead...not expanding...and didnt seem to notice any glaring negatives, but i didnt test or verify any of it more than 10-15 rounds...not as thorough as what was used below

for "finding the load"...using lapua and hornady brass (lapua consistently gives about 25% less ES in every scenario)...ive only done this with hornady and berger bullets, i cant say it works with anything else, bergers seem to typical fly better over 1000s of rounds ive shot, hornadys may match the bergers for smaller sample sizes, but overall bergers win, they just cost more...especially if u get into questionable/finicky hunting or match bullets, youre on your own...

1) take 10 rounds...when loading i start from max and work down because i know the ceiling, when shooting i start from low for safety/pressure reasons...so say max is 43gr, i start 43, then next round is 42.7, 42.4, etc......for 223 sized cases i do .2gr, for creed/308 sized, i do .3, for mid mags .4, large mags .5, etc
2) seat bullet .050-.100" off the lands...ive done some barrel/bullets .050, some .075, and some .100...ive changed some of them also and noticed no appreciable, consistent change
3) fire each round, recording velocity...i do it at 1 shot per 1/4" dot w/ labradar

once i get home, i pick a velocity...done...no other jump/powder tests

ive also loaded 15-20 rounds of a generic ammo loaded with 130 bergers/lapua brass/h4350 and given it to 3 other shooters w/ 6.5 creed barrels...they all reported ~1/2moa, as good or better than any factory they shoot...didnt watch them shoot it, took their work for it

example; last 2 barrels i messed with i wanted 109s @ 2925-2975 and 144s @ 2700-2750....39.8 and 41.3 of the powders i used gave me 2955 and 2731

i load up more, confirm zero, confirm dope (typically 3-5 shots @ 500 and 5-10 @ 800, could be 3 and 3 @ each range, but i like to be sure)...go shoot

i did the above w/ 3 different load combos, in 3 different barrels for our last 3 local club matches at 3 different ranges

match 1 (6.5creed, first time ever at this range): 130 bergers w/ h4350, .100" off - tied 1st, 66/71 impacts including 4/4 on 1200 yd target...93%
match 2 (6creed, barrel1): 108 bergers w/ h1000, .100" off - 1st, 72/82 rifle impacts, 4 of these "misses" were from timing out...72/78 rounds fired...92.3%
match 3 (6creed, barrel2): 108 bergers w/ h4350, .050" off - tied 1st, 70/76...92.1%

everyone of these barrels (and the 4-5 other match barrels i have) consistently shoot 2"-3" @ 500 and 4"-6" @ 800....yes theyve shot smaller, rarely have they shot bigger, but no cherry picking, those are the averages from a standard atlas bipod, rear bag, on a steel range with no flags in south tx 90*+ mirage

the load and barrel changes w/ match data were done purposely to support an idea...changed barrels and loads to reduce the change of "getting lucky" that whatever i picked in 1 barrel would work out...results are what they are

some pics from the last 2 trips out with 109s and 144s...

3- 109s @ 500

5- 109s @ 500

5- 144s @ 500

2 + 3- 109s @ 800

first 3- 144s @ 800

adjusted wind .2mil, shoulda went .3mil...3 more- 144s @ 800

one of the trips i shot a total of 20 rounds of 144s...2 shots misread when my muzzle brake blew the lab crooked and 1 i forgot to arm it for the first shot...100 yds zero, 500 yd plate, 500 yd tyl rack, and 800 yds

groups above are either 3 or 5 shot and generally thats all i shot at that distance that day, i just count them all together for every distance...they ALL need to be 1/2 to 3/4moa (or better) at whatever distance im shooting...if i shoot 3 shots at 800 within 4" and then make a wind adjustment and shoot another 3 on a 6" dot...any adjustments in wind/elevation i make, need to match what happens down range...good enough for me, im not positive i could shoot any better to tell the difference consistently from a bipod and squeeze bag

the smallest barrel ive done it on was a 9-10lbs hunting rifle w/ 22" 3b bartlein in 6.5prc...results were no different...below is 9 or 10 rounds of 135 berger hunters, firing 1 shot every 2.5-3min @ 800 yds...~7.5” wide

IMO the most important factor in consistently hitting reasonable targets in field conditions is that your dope is as close to perfectly centered in elevation and of course...wind....not if your rifle shoots a .2 vs .7 on one day during countless rounds of load tweaks

 

[ifgator]

3) fire each round, recording velocity...i do it at 1 shot per 1/4" dot w/ labradar

Can you expand on step three? What 1/4" dots are you referring to? On the target? If so what do you learn by doing this? Are you looking for flat spot on a spreadsheet?

I'm also am assuming that you have figured out that by using good components and consistent powder then a velocity flat spot will provide the consistent vertical spread you need to kick ass down range.
I think I've gotten too deep in my rabbit holes and now I want to be shooting more and learning dope. Thanks for everyone's insights

 

[morganlamprecht]

Can you expand on step three? What 1/4" dots are you referring to? On the target? If so what do you learn by doing this? Are you looking for flat spot on a spreadsheet?

I'm also am assuming that you have figured out that by using good components and consistent powder then a velocity flat spot will provide the consistent vertical spread you need to kick ass down range.
I think I've gotten too deep in my rabbit holes and now I want to be shooting more and learning dope. Thanks for everyone's insights

similar to below...first is a 6.5prc, 2nd two are 308s

Crazy as it sounds, I’m not really looking for anything with the dots, just prefer doing this instead of blasting them into the dirt, I’m only doing this so I know how much powder I need to hit whatever velocity I want...In cartridges I’m familiar with I can usually guess within 25-50 fps from the start, but in a brand new cartridge or powder type, etc, I don’t want to pick a charge that say launches 140s @ 2600 from a 6.5creed...I’ve never seen flat spots hold over multiple tests, and I don’t have high ES numbers no matter what charge I load...if I wanted better numbers, I’d buy better quality brass, if I wanted lower still, I’d sort components...in what I’ve tested and seen, those make a real difference faster than whatever the powder charge is...I prefer pretty much every bullet to hit really close to the same poi, but I’ve had a couple barrels that don’t hold poi as well as these, and they still shot well at distance

Shot the 6.5 creed 144 hybrid load from the above post #23 this weekend @ 1770 yds...first time past 800 yds for them

first 3 shots were a few tenths low and tweaked my BC off those to get on target, moved from .345 to .342 g7

then went 4/9 on the 18” wide ipsc below
2 of the misses we had no call, the other 3 hit spot on water line with the impacts...wind got me just off the edges (unmarked impacts are from buddy’s 338)...not sure I could even shoot any better, even if I had a “better” load

from what I’ve seen...good components, good process, good barrel...great results, without endless tweaks and adjustments