M1 garand converted to .308 info

[Duegee krell]

A buddy of mine dropped off for me to test drive what he says was a 1945 M1 Garand that is a navy .308 conversion. It was initially in a folding paratrooper stock he still has.

First off i know nothing about garands except that i always wanted one.

The serial is 3239630
The barrel says sa-fg535448.
Then it says 54 a200 .308. The stock has a repaired crack and it has this scope rail. And a cheap ass nc star. Im gonna throw a aimpoint on it and kill the shit out if some hogs.

I can get it and 35 8 round mags a new mag carrier with over 300 rounds of m80 ball for $900.00. And ill get the folding stock to.

First off is this legit. Did they make em like this. Can it be converted back to 30-06. And whats it worth. Just a ball park. Thanks guys. Im pumped im finally getting a garand.

 

[Shadow knows]

I’m no Garand expert by any means but I listen. 25 years ago a guy I know bought 4 garands and had them shipped home. Turned out 3 were 308 and he gave those away. Idk, I have never seen a 308 one and would be nice to own also. Recoil would have to be a little easier.
I would have it looked at first, do some research to see what ammo it requires for a load. The 30-06 does not want warm loads or it will break the cycling system so I am told. I just buy M1 Garand 30-06 ammo and call it good.

Congrats btw.

 

[scharfschutze762]

Can I have your buddies number

 

[Waorani]

I'm sure the Garand experts will fill in the blanks but the Navy did rechamber some 30-06 barrels to .308. Doesn't necessarily mean this is a Navy Garand though.

And when your're talking about Garands - clips is correct.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

I have this scope in a scout mount on my Mosin 91/30. It's a lot nicer than the NC Star stuff. A selection of handgun scopes, which tend to conform well to the scout mounting concept.

The Navy did make .308's, but I don't know much about the serial number range(s).

Assume that the conversions were intended to shoot NATO Spec 7.62x51 or equivalent .308 ammo. IMI makes 168gr Semi Auto Match, and although it looks right, I cannot personally certify it appropriate for a 308 Garand.

This 308 Garand stuff is a bit outta my league, but I really dig the original .30-'06 Garands.

Greg

 

[Duegee krell]

Can I have your buddies number

Nah but you can be a gent and tell me what it is if ya know. Thanks for the help

 

[Pinmaster]

http://forums.thecmp.org/ is one place that I would ask if it were mine. I know that the early ones converted by the navy had a plastic looking plug in them in an attempt to avoid putting new barrels in them with the correct chamber. It seems that those are suspect as far as shooting goes. It dont recall of ever hearing of a 308 converted Garand being issued in a paratrooper stock. If it has the insert it may have a headspace problem.

I have seen a couple of legit ones in person, but the one that I had was converted outside of the military. They are fund guns for sure.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

http://forums.thecmp.org/ is one place that I would ask if it were mine. I know that the early ones converted by the navy had a plastic looking plug in them in an attempt to avoid putting new barrels in them with the correct chamber. It seems that those are suspect as far as shooting goes. It don't recall of ever hearing of a 308 converted Garand being issued in a paratrooper stock. If it has the insert it may have a headspace problem.

I have seen a couple of legit ones in person, but the one that I had was converted outside of the military. They are fund guns for sure.

This jibes with my reading, but I didn't want to play "Ogre for a day...".

A 'Net search uncovered

There were two versions of the M1 that would fire the 7.62mm NATO cartridge. Originally the Navy used an insert that went into the chamber and shortened it to 7.62 length. This insert was designed to stay in the chamber permanently, but on a few occasions it stuck to the cartridge case and was extracted and ejected with the empty case. The next round therefore created the problem above. Normally it did not "blow up the rifle" or cause injury to the shooter, but it often jammed either on the extraction cycle or when the next cartridge was chambering.

The Navy gave it up and rebarreled a number of M1 rifles to 7.62 - they were first marked in large characters on the left side of the receiver under the rear sight 7.62 NATO (about 100) and after that similar markings on the right side of the barrel. For a full description of this modification, see Bruce Canfield's book Complete Guide to the M1 Garand and the M1 Carbine. In my edition pages 145-149, may vary in other printings.

Personally, I wouldn't mind having one of the Springfield Armory 308 Garands they made for the commercial/civilian market back around 2000, but the asking price is way outside my league these days.

I think a basic field grade with one of these in 7.62x51 would be my choice. After looking into the rebarreling process, it may be a lot less scary than I had originally thought. The same barrel in 30-'06 would probably be pretty much the same process. Ammogarand.

A CMP 'Special' with a Criterion 308 barrel runs at around $1250 these days direct from CMP.

Greg

 

[NineHotel]

Can't see from the pics if it is a reweld or the make of the receiver. Find a competent battle rifle smith in the area and have him look it over.

Buy the rifle, not the story.

 

[Badfinger]

I own a .308 M1 Garand but I think Springfield Armory was building them in the early eighties when I got mine. If I recall correctly you have the option of either 30-06 or .308 built on whatever receivers they had in stock. My receiver was made in November of 1940. It looks like the one you have was built in January of 1945. The .308 wasn't introduced until 1952.

 

[Waorani]

Italy (and probably some other countries) also converted many to 7.62 NATO. I wouldn't think any Navy/other military conversions would be marked .308. I'd bet a more recent build with value dependent on receiver. There are rewelds and even cast reproductions out there.

 

[Duegee krell]

I own a .308 M1 Garand but I think Springfield Armory was building them in the early eighties when I got mine. If I recall correctly you have the option of either 30-06 or .308 built on whatever receivers they had in stock. My receiver was made in November of 1940. It looks like the one you have was built in January of 1945. The .308 wasn't introduced until 1952.

Yes that is correct and the markings say 54 on the barrel so it is a 45 action like he said and 54 on the barrel. I think he’s somewhat right. This guy is as serious a dude i know. A stand up guy

 

[Duegee krell]

Here are more refined pics of the barrel markings and serial

 

[JMGlasgow]

If I'm reading it right, the barrel is dated 3-54? The receiver serial number indicates it is October, 1944. There were 308 conversions later on, you can convert it back to 30-06 with a barrel change, or have it rechambered. If it were my rifle, I'd take the scope mount off, put it back to iron sight only and replace the stock parts that were put on for the optic.

 

[Waorani]

If it's a rechambered 30-06 barrel, the stock should also be 1/2" shorter than original so probably have to swap that out too if putting an original bbl back on it. If it runs well in 308, you might be ahead of the game to just leave it. But I'd also lose the scope mount.

 

[Eddystone]

I shot a M-1 in the USAF. Davis Monthan AFB, rifle team, the rifles were all M-1s in 308. We ran a 175 grain SMK over 4895 at the time. Good shooting rifles.

 

[NukeMMC]

I haven't seen all the Navy MK2s or MK2 Mod 1 (MK2-1) rifles, but I have seen quite a few as they were issued as SECNAV Trophy rifles for a very long time. I have a Match Grade A MK2-1 that has the original, serialized box from Crane. I helped Dobber (the Navy Match rifle armorer) with some of the work on this rifle during the 1991 Interservice Matches at Quantico. Every other SECNAV rifle I saw and every Navy-supplied barrel were marked "7.62MM and/or 7.62 NATO". Guys like Don McCoy, Ray Kerbs and Dobber were Navy Match armorers and built some hard shooting M1s. If you get your hands on a McCoy M1 ... KEEP IT. Some folks like Fulton Armory, Sam Dayton, etc have built 308 M1s . Not sure how they stamped their barrels.

SECNAV Trophy -06 Garands with paperwork run about $1500-2000. A MK2-1 will fetch $2000-2500 with paperwork. I have never seen a Grade A for sale, so don't know what it's value is. To me, mine is invaluable.

The 7.62 M1 excelled past the M14 Match rifles in the slow fire stages of the NMC. The extra 2" of barrel length gave a slightly higher velocity for a given load (maybe 50fps), but the real advantage was in the extended sight radius.

From Scott Duff's webpage:

U.S. Navy M1 Garand (and other) Rifles (FFL Required)​

The following is a listing of Secretary of the Navy Trophy rifle variations:

1. M1 Rifle Mk 2 Mod 1 Grade B match rifle in 7.62 MM with 1-minute sights. Grade B match rifles were first released by the Navy as a Trophy Rifle in 1996. They are very desirable collector pieces.
2. M1 Rifle Mk 2 Mod 1 in 7.62 MM using a new SA produced barrel (1965-67 mfg.), two sub-variations; one converted by Harrington & Richardson (H&R) the other by American Machine & Foundry (AMF) of York, PA. The AMF version is by far the rarer of the two (possibly only 10%). These variants have become very scarce over the last few years.
3. M1 Rifle in caliber .30-06. Often marked “O-65, O-66 or O-67” on flat of receiver behind rear sight. These are usually encountered in unissued condition following rebuild. According to Jeremy Cheek's published article in the June 2004 issue of the Garand Collectors Association Journal, these rifles are USMC M1 rifles rebuilt at Marine Corps overhaul depots.
4. Remington Model 720 bolt action rifle. These rifles were purchased by the Navy from the Remington Arms Co. immediately following the attack on Pearl Harbor. Their hand-cut checkering is an example of pre-War craftsmanship. They have become very rare and are highly sought after by collectors. They look nearly like works of art.

Navy non-Trophy Rifle variations are:

1. Mk 2 Mod 1 Grade A match rifle in 7.62 MM with ½-minute sights. They are the rarest of all; it is believed that few, if any, have been released by the Navy. I’ve never seen one.
2. Mk 2 Mod 0 in 7.62 MM using a .30-06 barrel with insert to convert to 7.62. This is also a very scarce variation and highly sought after by collectors. I have only seen a handful of real ones in over 15 years.

Some pictures of mine:

 

[Old Dog 1]

I haven't seen all the Navy MK2s or MK2 Mod 1 (MK2-1) rifles, but I have seen quite a few as they were issued as SECNAV Trophy rifles for a very long time. I have a Match Grade A MK2-1 that has the original, serialized box from Crane. I helped Dobber (the Navy Match rifle armorer) with some of the work on this rifle during the 1991 Interservice Matches at Quantico. Every other SECNAV rifle I saw and every Navy-supplied barrel were marked "7.62MM and/or 7.62 NATO". Guys like Don McCoy, Ray Kerbs and Dobber were Navy Match armorers and built some hard shooting M1s. If you get your hands on a McCoy M1 ... KEEP IT. Some folks like Fulton Armory, Sam Dayton, etc have built 308 M1s . Not sure how they stamped their barrels.

SECNAV Trophy -06 Garands with paperwork run about $1500-2000. A MK2-1 will fetch $2000-2500 with paperwork. I have never seen a Grade A for sale, so don't know what it's value is. To me, mine is invaluable.

The 7.62 M1 excelled past the M14 Match rifles in the slow fire stages of the NMC. The extra 2" of barrel length gave a slightly higher velocity for a given load (maybe 50fps), but the real advantage was in the extended sight radius.

From Scott Duff's webpage:

U.S. Navy M1 Garand (and other) Rifles (FFL Required)​

The following is a listing of Secretary of the Navy Trophy rifle variations:

1. M1 Rifle Mk 2 Mod 1 Grade B match rifle in 7.62 MM with 1-minute sights. Grade B match rifles were first released by the Navy as a Trophy Rifle in 1996. They are very desirable collector pieces.
2. M1 Rifle Mk 2 Mod 1 in 7.62 MM using a new SA produced barrel (1965-67 mfg.), two sub-variations; one converted by Harrington & Richardson (H&R) the other by American Machine & Foundry (AMF) of York, PA. The AMF version is by far the rarer of the two (possibly only 10%). These variants have become very scarce over the last few years.
3. M1 Rifle in caliber .30-06. Often marked “O-65, O-66 or O-67” on flat of receiver behind rear sight. These are usually encountered in unissued condition following rebuild. According to Jeremy Cheek's published article in the June 2004 issue of the Garand Collectors Association Journal, these rifles are USMC M1 rifles rebuilt at Marine Corps overhaul depots.
4. Remington Model 720 bolt action rifle. These rifles were purchased by the Navy from the Remington Arms Co. immediately following the attack on Pearl Harbor. Their hand-cut checkering is an example of pre-War craftsmanship. They have become very rare and are highly sought after by collectors. They look nearly like works of art.

Navy non-Trophy Rifle variations are:

1. Mk 2 Mod 1 Grade A match rifle in 7.62 MM with ½-minute sights. They are the rarest of all; it is believed that few, if any, have been released by the Navy. I’ve never seen one.
2. Mk 2 Mod 0 in 7.62 MM using a .30-06 barrel with insert to convert to 7.62. This is also a very scarce variation and highly sought after by collectors. I have only seen a handful of real ones in over 15 years.

My Garand was purchased in OKC approximately 10-15 years ago from a gentleman from Little Rock Arkansas. He advised me that his brother was in the Navy for 40 years and that he was an excellent shot. Serial number is 3810603 and mates to an Oct 1941 manufacture. However stock is New. There is an Eagle emblem on the left side new the bolt. There is a P in a circle on the handle grip. Can you confirm this as an authentic M1 Variant. ? Markings on right side of barrel ar 1 10 308 WIN. SHORT CHAMBER.
Thanks Old Dog 1

Some pictures of mine:

 

[mzvarner]

I am no expert by any means, but I recently got my first M1. Here is a little info from one of the M1 "bibles"

Your receiver dates between July and August 1941
You would need to pull the rear handguard (watch a video, dont just "figure it out")

Yes the navy fitted a sleeve in the chamber to make their rifles conform to NATO standards adopted by the US government. From the book it sounds like this was because of a budget issue.

 

[NukeMMC]

That sounds like a commercially procured barrel was installed. Navy barrels were all 7.62.
The stock is probably tefinished, as the P and eagle stamps are acceptance proofs by DoD/War Dept. There is also probably a box with 3 letters stamped somewhere near the rear sight on the left side of the stock.

 

[Orlando]

This is what a original BM59 stock looks like

There are Reese stocks that have a single bar, the wood is original the metal is not

 

[Doll_Girl999]

The barrel markings show a 3/54 date on a standard .30-'06 barrel.It is probably an "insert" rifle put together by someone other than the military.....

 

[Random Guy]

The barrel markings show a 3/54 date on a standard .30-'06 barrel.It is probably an "insert" rifle put together by someone other than the military.....

I agree. The military marked their barrels '7.62 NATO' and not '308W'. This is an old thread from 2018 and the original poster has apparently been banned, but just thought I'd mention one item re the odd-ball bushing. An advanced collector I know once showed me an old plastic bag with a metal chamber bushing and paper insert that read something about '30-06 to 308W caliber conversion'. I think it might have been sold by Brownell's decades ago and presumably it was used for converting old 30-06 M1s or maybe M1903s to the 'newer' 308W round, but I can't recall the details. Its the only commercial chamber 'converter' piece that I have ever seen.

I assume it was based on the drawing that the Navy devised back in the 1960s (see attached), and I would never trust such a thing given the propensity of the old Navy Mk 2 Mod 0 chamber inserts to randomly get stuck to a fired cartridge and ejected along the spent case, thereby immediately rendering the rifle inoperable. CMP sold a couple hundred of the last Navy Mk 2 Mod 0 barreled actions back in 2012-13, but warned customers that the bushings can and do come out in use, and thus I always considered those rifles more of an interesting collectible rather than a shootable rifle. The Navy quickly learned the insert was problematic and adopted the Mk 2 Mod 1, with the only difference being they had a new 1965 or 66' SA-made barrel chambered for the 7.62 NATO round. This was a much better way to convert their inventory of M1s from 30-06 to 308W/7,62x51mm....