M1A or HK 91

[dragoon]

Re: M1A or HK 91

M1A . I consider 7.62 to be a long-range accuracy caliber . For short-range , I would use 5.56 , in the M-4 . While I think the REM 700 gives the best long-range accuracy , for semi-auto , I would look at the AR-10 , after the M1A . The H&K is tough , but it takes a lot to get comparable accuracy ...

 

[Downzero]

Re: M1A or HK 91

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Cartman</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: trobertson5-0</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> ...and you will have the finest 7.62mm battlerifle ever made. </div></div>

That may be true, but the FN-FAL is probably the 7.62 rifle adopted by more military forces worldwide than any other. </div></div>

Tell that to the guys carrying the new SR-25.

 

[Cartman]

Re: M1A or HK 91

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Downzero</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Cartman</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: trobertson5-0</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> ...and you will have the finest 7.62mm battlerifle ever made. </div></div>

That may be true, but the FN-FAL is probably the 7.62 rifle adopted by more military forces worldwide than any other. </div></div>

Tell that to the guys carrying the new SR-25. </div></div>

Historically I believe the FAL is still the one most widely adopted. Certainly that won't always be true as it is a very old design, but I don't think the SR-25 comes anywhere close to the worldwide distribution of the FAL at its most popular.

 

[jwfrazier]

Re: M1A or HK 91

Ghost: Is that a B@T mount on your 91? Good job getting the buffer and the low profile scope mount on there at the same time.

The buffer on the HK takes care of the "beating up the brass issue", but it will still throw brass about 25'.

I have not shot or handled an M1 so I am not qualified I guess to decide between the two. However I can tell you about the HK.

My particular 91, believe it or not, will shoot MOA at 100 yards most of the time. I think I just got very fortunate with mine, and this may jade my opinion a bit.

It is by far, and it is not even close, my favorite gun that I have ever owned or shot. It is the ONE gun that I know will always function every time no matter what.

The biggest (and only IMO) downside to it is that it is very heavy loaded up with all that ammo. Optics make it even heavier of course. If an M1 weighs even more, that is hard to believe, and would turn me off on one.

For long range work the the M1 can probably be modified to shoot more accurately. For an "end of the world, zombie take over" gun I can think of nothing better than the HK. I keep mine next to my bed every night for just this situation.

 

[marku]

Re: M1A or HK 91

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Historically I believe the FAL is still the one most widely adopted. Certainly that won't always be true as it is a very old design, but I don't think the SR-25 comes anywhere close to the worldwide distribution of the FAL at its most popular.
_________________________</div></div>

I cant wait till Centry International arms starts carring the SR25! Im gonna buy me a couple.


I like the idea of the M1A. Ive got a CIA HK clone built of a stainless action and new barrel. It tears up brass BAD. Chucks brass all over the place! I like the M1a just because you can reload for it and tailer a load that shoot well.

Id just get a AR10 with a 16" stainless barrel!

 

[GhostFace]

Re: M1A or HK 91

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jwfrazier</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ghost: Is that a B@T mount on your 91? Good job getting the buffer and the low profile scope mount on there at the same time.

</div></div>

No, it's the MFI low profile mount. It's sets lower than any mount made for the HK. It will allow you to use your sights with the mount still on the rifle. As you can see it will allow you to use it with the port buffer attached with out any hassle.

 

[Downzero]

Re: M1A or HK 91

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Cartman</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Downzero</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Cartman</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: trobertson5-0</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> ...and you will have the finest 7.62mm battlerifle ever made. </div></div>

That may be true, but the FN-FAL is probably the 7.62 rifle adopted by more military forces worldwide than any other. </div></div>

Tell that to the guys carrying the new SR-25. </div></div>

Historically I believe the FAL is still the one most widely adopted. Certainly that won't always be true as it is a very old design, but I don't think the SR-25 comes anywhere close to the worldwide distribution of the FAL at its most popular. </div></div>

I was referring to the comment about the finest battle rifle ever made.

 

[DustyJacket]

Re: M1A or HK 91

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lazuris</div><div class="ubbcode-body">... The only problem I have with the M1A is that they tends to breed if left in the safe for too long. </div></div>

I'll take one from the next litter....

I have a friend with the HK91 - do as he did and get the recoil buffer, to cut down on brass damage.

I have a Rock River LAR-8. I am still breaking it in, but my groups are just under 1" at 100 yards. Hope to tighten that up a tad.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: M1A or HK 91

I can see my experience is way outta date. Those newer composite stocks for the M1A open a whole new vista of possibilities for my imagination.

Still haven't gotten near an HK, but brief experiences with a FAL make me like that one as a zombie/battle rifle, suitible for NATO battle pack Berdan ammo by the bushel. Can only favorably imagine how an HK-91 would up that ante.

Greg

 

[Mag 300]

Re: M1A or HK 91

Hard to deny that the H&K is not a great weapon there different and If I enver had to do an "entry" I would take the H&K
shorter easier to swing
an M1A I have an M21 is not a close weapon in my opinion.

Bill

 

[Cartman]

Re: M1A or HK 91

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Downzero</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

I was referring to the comment about the finest battle rifle ever made. </div></div>

Not sure why you quoted me then as I didn't comment on the finest battle rifle question.

 

[jwfrazier]

Re: M1A or HK 91

Thanks for the info Ghostface. I have the B@T, and I am able to see the irons right over the rail if I remove the optic, but I am unable so far to make the buffer work with it. Do you feel the aimpoint limits your capabilities with the 91? I have had a comp m2 on mine for a few years, but I think i'm going to switch to some kind of variable, maybe 1-4x.

John

 

[GhostFace]

Re: M1A or HK 91

I like it it alot on there. I was able to hit steel targets pretty consistant using "Kentucky elevation". I don't use it for any long range accuracy stuff, just plinking so to speak. If I did not have other rifles with scopes on them then I would opt for a magnified optic. If I had the money I would love to put a ACOG on it....

 

[MK14 SEI]

Re: M1A or HK 91

I sampled the HK 91 and liked it just fine, but the M14 is my all time favorite.

I have this MK14 SEI set up for iron sights.

My Mod 0 is waiting on optics...

 

[jwfrazier]

Re: M1A or HK 91

Nice Rifles H20. That bottom one looks like something out of "The Terminator"

 

[MK14 SEI]

Re: M1A or HK 91

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jwfrazier</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Nice Rifles H20. That bottom one looks like something out of "The Terminator"
</div></div>

Thanks!

They are just down the road from you in Athens... here is another

 

[Mumbles]

Re: M1A or HK 91

Between the HK-91 and the M1A I'd pick the M1A, but for the stated purpose of sub-300m/living in the woods, hunting zombies, etc. I'd pick the FAL, with the M1A Scout being a very close second.

The Hk-91 was designed specifically to frustrate people with normal hands. I sold my PTR-91 to buy a FAL, which has become one of my favorite rifles of all time, followed closely by my M1A Scout.

Everything about the PTR/HK91 is wrong. Stamped steel, brass mangaling, non-reachable safetied, last shot bolt hold openless, el cheapo plastic stocked, case hurling, horrible triggered garbage.

And the charging handle is heavy and almost at the muzzle.

And the mag release is in a useless spot and the paddle mag release is of questionable legality. There is a halfway excuse for a paddle mag release that moves side to side instead of forward and back. Better than the button one I suppose.

And putting the bolt back in the carrier always raises my blood pressure.

I might not hate it so much if it was in the same price range as an AK clone, because I think they're in the same class, and not everyone can afford a used FAL at $800 or a new FAL for over a grand. But $899 for a PTR-91 is no kind of deal. And the HK going for over $3000 makes me sick.

It's like the Mini-14 of battle rifles. Not everyone can afford an AR, but who wants a Mini when another $75 can get you an AR?

But whatever, if you like'em, cool. They're not all bad I guess. mine was pretty much 100% reliable and pretty accurate.

The FAL used to be the right arm of the free world. The G-3 is the right arm of what...? The RUF?

 

[wilshire1412]

Re: M1A or HK 91

I have owned both, I don't ever want to be without an M14 type ever again. I had a 91 many years ago with a whole bunch of fancy accesories to "enhance" the rifle. I concluded after a couple of range trips that the HK91 was just a pig, I found the recoil to be objectionable even with all the factory HK crap I had mounted on it and it was not my idea of an accurate rifle. I don't have any real experience with the FAL but from what I have heard they are better than the HK, recoil can be tamed through the adjustable gas system and IMO are better ergonomicaly. Of the three I have only ever heard of the M14 as being any type of accurate shooting rifle, and then usually after spending $$$ to make it so. For the OP, I would go with the SOCOM 16 in an old BM59 type folding stock and an aimpoint if I was trying for .308 in a CQB weapon.

 

[Mag 300]

Re: M1A or HK 91

What he said!!!!!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wilshire1412</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have owned both, I don't ever want to be without an M14 type ever again. I had a 91 many years ago with a whole bunch of fancy accesories to "enhance" the rifle. I concluded after a couple of range trips that the HK91 was just a pig, I found the recoil to be objectionable even with all the factory HK crap I had mounted on it and it was not my idea of an accurate rifle. I don't have any real experience with the FAL but from what I have heard they are better than the HK, recoil can be tamed through the adjustable gas system and IMO are better ergonomicaly. Of the three I have only ever heard of the M14 as being any type of accurate shooting rifle, and then usually after spending $$$ to make it so. For the OP, I would go with the SOCOM 16 in an old BM59 type folding stock and an aimpoint if I was trying for .308 in a CQB weapon. </div></div>

 

[nashlaw]

Re: M1A or HK 91

I owned an HK91 back in the '80s. It was a fine example, to me anyway, of German engineering. It was the model(91A2?) that had the collapsible stock. I did not really like the stock, but it was a shooter. Never scoped it, but with the irons it acquitted itself quite nicely.

 

[Switchblade]

Re: M1A or HK 91

I love my Fulton MAtchgrade M14, and my newly aquired R1A1(FAL Type). I hated the HK91 I had. It had similiar coking to the R1A1, but heavier. The fluted chamber kicks brass' ass, and those flute marks are NOT cosmetic. They go deep.
The M14 and R1A1 both shoot well with M118LR spec ammo, but the R1A1 really loves 46.4gr Varget with a 147. I can probably drop that a bit with H4895, but 2650fps from the 17" bbl is sweet

 

[mp45acp]

Re: M1A or HK 91

M1A loaded

 

[todg]

Re: M1A or HK 91

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Left.Nasty</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Looks like I am getting the M1A. Does anyone have experience with the J Allen Ent. stocks? I saw a picture online and it was a beautiful thing but is it functional. </div></div>

Very nice and it does improve accuracy. But at the cost of weight.

 

[Switchblade]

Re: M1A or HK 91

Only bad thing about all the M14 stocks is the three point scope mounts. Troy Industries is about the only one that has a monolithic rail set up with more hardware points for stability. Guess that's why it's issue.

 

[SoundFx]

Re: M1A or HK 91

I had a JAE for a while. Great looking, and definitely does add a significant measure of stability. However, the GEN1 version was just too heavy to be justified, imho. I understand the GEN2 version is significantly lighter.

 

[MK14 SEI]

Re: M1A or HK 91

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Switchblade</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Only bad thing about all the M14 stocks is the three point scope mounts. Troy Industries is about the only one that has a monolithic rail set up with more hardware points for stability. Guess that's why it's issue.</div></div>

I don't know that the M14 MCS from TROY has been issued...

 

[younggun22]

Re: M1A or HK 91

for your intended purposes i dont see how you can beat the FAL dead reliable, accurate enough for your intended purposes, all you have to do is pick a set up that suits your needs

 

[blacklable]

Re: M1A or HK 91

Hk91, my dad and I bot own hk's. My dad's is set up like a msg90, and mine is set up like a dmr. I've done 1,000 round toture test and haven't had a single malfunction.

 

[MK14 SEI]

Re: M1A or HK 91

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: blacklable</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've done 1,000 round toture test and haven't had a single malfunction. </div></div>

Both of my MK14 SEI rifles have endured 1500+ round "torture tests" including
firing with a sound suppressor installed ... not a single malfunction or mishap.

 

[mp45acp]

Re: M1A or HK 91

This thread is STILL going?

Have you decided yet on the rifle?

 

[tylerharrell]

Re: M1A or HK 91

I am going to get an M14 with a 18" barrel and a Sage EBR fixed synthetic stock. I just haven't been able to find one yet. I want the gun that mp5sdnk has in the picture he posted. That shit looks sweet! God knows I can't shoot so I have to look cool.

 

[MK14 SEI]

Re: M1A or HK 91

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Left.Nasty</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am going to get an M14 with a 18" barrel and a Sage EBR fixed synthetic stock. I just haven't been able to find one yet. I want the gun that mp5sdnk has in the picture he posted. That shit looks sweet! God knows I can't shoot so I have to look cool. </div></div>

I had one like that that, the custom butt stock and cheek riser were furnished and installed by Tony at LAW483.com
Tony lives in Texas. I purchased the Cali SAGE from Josh at Clyde Armory.

 

[TorF]

Re: M1A or HK 91

Here's a stock G3 in action and a shooter who knows how to use it. 24:33 minutes into the video: http://www1.nrk.no/nett-tv/klipp/279486

Range 130m. Group is less than 10cm. Real time scoring on electronic target.

None of the other 7.62NATO battlerifles performs over a long period of time and use as a G3/HK91. If the going gets tough the HK91 is the rifle to have.

 

[Mumbles]

Re: M1A or HK 91

Cool video, I watched it all, even though I had no idea what was being said. I got mesmerized by the bolts working.

This rifle convinced me that the G-3 is the most rugged of the three

For fighting I'd still rather have an M1A or a FAL though.

 

[matrxx]

Re: M1A or HK 91

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jimmy2Times</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I own both as well. IMNSHO, the HK91 is (as almost all HK weapons are) is a piece of garbage. I'd take the M1A or an FAL over an HK91 any day.

The HK91 is such a piece of shit that if you put me in a room with a hungry tiger and a HK91, I'd let the hungry tiger eat me before I picked up the HK91 and shot it. </div></div>

I own them all, just because you can not carry it all day long, and not fast enough, don't blame on the gun. That "garbage" is real, I'm not the only one who can feel it. Get skill, brother.

 

[Swamper]

Re: M1A or HK 91

I own an M1a. Gotta love them for history, military contractor parts, function and handling.

That said, The AR-10(T) is the semi-auto .308 rifle to own and shoot. Will take a scopesight better than any other semi out there, parts are readily available, custom barrels are available, and the design is proven and simple.

Would not buy any .308 semi other than an AR-10.

 

[matrxx]

Re: M1A or HK 91

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Swamper</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> ....

That said, The AR-10(T) is the semi-auto .308 rifle to own and shoot. Will take a scopesight better than any other semi out there, parts are readily available, custom barrels are available, and the design is proven and simple.

Would not buy any .308 semi other than an AR-10. </div></div>

what he said

 

[MK14 SEI]

Re: M1A or HK 91

I owned a sweet ArmaLite AR-10A4 SPR and sold it to fund another MK14 SEI build

 

[wilshire1412]

Re: M1A or HK 91

I own two M1A rifles, my next semi auto .308 will be an 18" FAL. HK makes a rugged .308 but it is a bruiser and IMO awkward to handle. I would definetly with an AR .308 of some sort if I was just looking for accuracy and an optics platform. I'm weird so I like old outdated guns.

 

[SmokeRolls]

Re: M1A or HK 91

I had an M1A1 National match. Loved the weapon. I hated the scope mounting with the three point Springfield scope mount. I know you can get a better mount with aftermarket companies but it was a direction I didn't want to travel. I traded it for a sweet AR-10 and I havn't looked back although I still liked the M1A1. I have since bought another AR-10 in 16" barrel and I love them both...All the great features that we love about the AR-15 just larger and less jamming issues due to spent gasses. You still have the spent gasses but they seem to affect the AR-10 way less in my opinion. It just always fires VERY accurately all the time.......Can't ask for more.....SmokeRolls