Night Vision MAWL BUIS/Backup Optic options

[Ike1985]

I purchased MBUS Pro offsets for my build but now I realized the MAWL will block them.

My build is:
Unity tactical fast riser
Eotech exps 3-0 (quick disconnect)

Should I just run inline MBUS Pro's and quick disconnect the eotech should It die(highly unlikely but nonetheless a bad way of doing things IMO)? Not a huge fan of offset optics as I think they would be digging into the dirt if I was shooting from the side. Any ideas?

 

[winniethepooh]

I’d ditch the buis. How many aiming devices do you need?

 

[Ike1985]

I'll have no backup then.

 

[RyanScott]

If you have an EOTech you need a backup.

 

[TheGerman]

The EOTech makes it tricky.

You either dont get it up high enough, or you do and it'll block everything.

Offset irons are gay anyways.

The only real solution I've found is a Wilcox rail with the front site riser.

 

[MarinePMI]

The only other thing I can think of, is to run the offset sites or RDS on the left side. Not optimal, since you'd be rolling the rifle away from your body to use them (assuming a RH shooter), but it is doable.

I've ditched most of my EOTech sites and switched to Aimpoints. Seems like whenever I'd grab a carbine with an EOTech, the batteries would be dead (PITA). With the Aimpoints, I just change the battery every other Christmas, and I'm GTG. Never have picked up a carbine with an Aimoint on it, and have dead batteries...

 

[Ike1985]

Looks like all I can do is QD the eote h and run inline sights. I cant run red sits due to astigmatism.

 

[jwramp]

Your MAWL has a vis laser, right? Sounds like a backup sighting system to me...

 

[Ike1985]

Your MAWL has a vis laser, right? Sounds like a backup sighting system to me...

It does but without magnification I probably wont be able to see if very far away unless its night time.

 

[jwramp]

If you’re that concerned with the EOTech failing you, either switch to a different RDS or pull it off the gun when it fails and use BUIS in their normal positions. No thanks to offsets.

 

[RyanScott]

An EOTech issue is to be expected, either due to short battery life or nighttime temperatures. If you can’t use upright iron sights and you can’t use canted iron sights I recommend an offset aimpoint.

 

[NighthawkCG]

The riser really throws a kink in it I think. You almost need to get two smaller risers for the two BUIS, ditch them, or like you said, take off EoTech if it fails. The other option, depending on your NV setup is to ditch the riser and run BUIS in the normal, top position. I run my KAC micros on the top with an EoTech (no riser) and MAWL. Can still aim passively with dual 14s, though it may not be as quick as with a riser. It also way outperforms an aimpoint for light transmission.

But yeah a lot of redundancy there...
1) EoTech
2) Vis Laser
3) IR Laser
4) BUIS

I'd stick with the EoTech, especially if you are using it for NV. Sure, the older ones have well documented issues. I had two and both had issues (1 battery drain, 1 delamination) and were sold back during the recall. I have since bought two new ones and I have not had delimitation, zero shift, or battery problems - and I use them more now than I did previously. Live in New England where temps vary quite a bit.

Some folks still have it out to EoTech and like to bash them, but haven't really dealt with newer ones.

 

[Victor-TNVC]

If you’re that concerned with the EOTech failing you, either switch to a different RDS or pull it off the gun when it fails and use BUIS in their normal positions. No thanks to offsets.

Pull it off when it fails? What happens if you do not have time for that?? What about just looking though the EO tech and acquire your irons...

As Pat Rogers always stated, shoot with your irons up all the time and in case of emergency and your RDS fails.

 

[NighthawkCG]

Pull it off when it fails? What happens if you do not have time for that?? What about just looking though the EO tech and acquire your irons...

As Pat Rogers always stated, shoot with your irons up all the time and in case of emergency and your RDS fails.

With an already lower 1/3 optic and unity riser, is it possible to use normal height BUIS/irons? Serious question, not being a smart ass. I guess one could use the EOTech window as a huge rear sight, but even with that it seems like the front sight would have to get some elevation to line things up properly.

 

[Victor-TNVC]

The riser really throws a kink in it I think. You almost need to get two smaller risers for the two BUIS, ditch them, or like you said, take off EoTech if it fails. The other option, depending on your NV setup is to ditch the riser and run BUIS in the normal, top position. I run my KAC micros on the top with an EoTech (no riser) and MAWL. Can still aim passively with dual 14s, though it may not be as quick as with a riser. It also way outperforms an aimpoint for light transmission.

But yeah a lot of redundancy there...
1) EoTech
2) Vis Laser
3) IR Laser
4) BUIS

I'd stick with the EoTech, especially if you are using it for NV. Sure, the older ones have well documented issues. I had two and both had issues (1 battery drain, 1 delamination) and were sold back during the recall. I have since bought two new ones and I have not had delimitation, zero shift, or battery problems - and I use them more now than I did previously. Live in New England where temps vary quite a bit.

Some folks still have it out to EoTech and like to bash them, but haven't really dealt with newer ones.

Yes, if we're talking tall risers, that cannot co-witness directly with the EO in a last ditch effort you can use the window itself as a sight. I still like EO's when using NOD's.

 

[jwramp]

Pull it off when it fails? What happens if you do not have time for that?? What about just looking though the EO tech and acquire your irons...

As Pat Rogers always stated, shoot with your irons up all the time and in case of emergency and your RDS fails.

The dude asked about using his EO on a riser. You won’t be able to see the BUIS at all if it’s way up on a riser. Don’t know if name-dropping Pat is appropriate under these circumstances. Do any of the guys on your staff leave their BUIS up and hidden behind tall mounts? Doesn’t seem like the modern approach. Do your checks before going out with your rifle and if the EO is down, ditch it. If you seriously can’t trust it, then find a different sight. Augee has a great write-up over on the arfcom for why he trusts them and they’re so popular among professionals. EO-hating isn’t very productive any more but if you’re really scared of them, there’s other options out there.
You’ll see less and less BUIS on modern night fighting rifles where there’s already two or three sighting systems mounted. RDS/laser/RDS tube/etc.

 

[WhereNow&How]

You’ll see less and less BUIS on modern night fighting rifles where there’s already two or three sighting systems mounted. RDS/laser/RDS tube/etc.

Yeah, but what are they gonna do if Rocket Man or his Sister or some other sinister agent lets off a man made EMP or mother nature just decides to do what it has done for millions of years. MO BETTA to have plan A, B, C, D, E, & F.

Carrington Event - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[TheGerman]

The dude asked about using his EO on a riser. You won’t be able to see the BUIS at all if it’s way up on a riser. Don’t know if name-dropping Pat is appropriate under these circumstances. Do any of the guys on your staff leave their BUIS up and hidden behind tall mounts? Doesn’t seem like the modern approach. Do your checks before going out with your rifle and if the EO is down, ditch it. If you seriously can’t trust it, then find a different sight. Augee has a great write-up over on the arfcom for why he trusts them and they’re so popular among professionals. EO-hating isn’t very productive any more but if you’re really scared of them, there’s other options out there.
You’ll see less and less BUIS on modern night fighting rifles where there’s already two or three sighting systems mounted. RDS/laser/RDS tube/etc.

I dont get all the EOTech hate. It's kind of funny. I use the EXPS3 on my nighttime SBR and was considering the Wilcox rail with front riser for a BUIS during the day.

I think the problem OP will run into is what does he do that one time the battery goes down after an hour. Obviously he can just put a new battery in it, but looking at it from a RFN standpoint, the visable laser on the MAWL or PEQ15 isn't worth a shit outside in the sunlight. If he's only shooting at night, he has the redundancy of the IR laser but during the day he really doesn't have a backup.

The giant irony here is, the only RDS I've ever had go out while shooting was an Aimpoint lol Talk about horrible timing.

 

[jwramp]

Guess I will die then.

LOL I wonder how NV tubes and power circuits would do in an EMP... is shielding a part of the mil requirements for them? I’ve heard about shielded tubes for aircraft use but I’d assume that’s to keep from messing with the plane, not the other way round. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[WhereNow&How]

Guess I will die then.

LOL I wonder how NV tubes and power circuits would do in an EMP... is shielding a part of the mil requirements for them? I’ve heard about shielded tubes for aircraft use but I’d assume that’s to keep from messing with the plane, not the other way round. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Hmmm, I think you already answered that question. Why would they shield them if unshielded would fare well in an EMP event.

That little Rocket Prick fry my NODS gonna be some ass whoppin gonna happen.

 

[jwramp]

*furiously fashions faraday cage around my helmet bag*

 

[WhereNow&How]

*furiously fashions faraday cage around my helmet bag*

On a serious note, its probably not a bad idea to store them in Ammo Cans. Just line the inside with cardboard so the unit doesn't touch the metal, remove the rubber lid seal so you have continuous metal to metal seal, then remove the batteries.

 

[Victor-TNVC]

The dude asked about using his EO on a riser. You won’t be able to see the BUIS at all if it’s way up on a riser. Don’t know if name-dropping Pat is appropriate under these circumstances. Do any of the guys on your staff leave their BUIS up and hidden behind tall mounts? Doesn’t seem like the modern approach. Do your checks before going out with your rifle and if the EO is down, ditch it. If you seriously can’t trust it, then find a different sight. Augee has a great write-up over on the arfcom for why he trusts them and they’re so popular among professionals. EO-hating isn’t very productive any more but if you’re really scared of them, there’s other options out there.
You’ll see less and less BUIS on modern night fighting rifles where there’s already two or three sighting systems mounted. RDS/laser/RDS tube/etc.

Name dropping? Bullshit JW, Pat was a dear friend of mine and I was honored to call him my friend. Maybe you should come off your high horse, sit back and learn at times. Funny you come to Hide and you start flexing all your so-called knowledge. Get over yourself. Read what I said above in the other post.

Many out there understand your desperately trying to make a name for yourself in the Industry...

 

[jwramp]

Name dropping? Bullshit JW, Pat was a dear friend of mine and I was honored to call him my friend. Maybe you should come off your high horse, sit back and learn at times. Funny you come to Hide and you start flexing all your so-called knowledge. Get over yourself. Read what I said above in the other post.

Many out there understand your desperately trying to make a name for yourself in the Industry...

Well you got me there - see here how my draft horse is clearly higher than all the others.

Sorry for the delayed response, was waiting for all the edits to your post to be wrapped up.

 

[WhereNow&How]

@Victor-TNVC

Well being that OP specifically stated he was running a Unity Tactical fast riser so he can get the advantage of having his Sight high enough for I assume the passive NV shooting that is the current hotness, having standard irons up and co-witnessed is not possible. Even if it was physically possible (SkyScraper Irons) would you want them up cluttering a already limited NV scene in darkness. Another light blockage item in an already challenged environment?

So while Mr. Pat Rodgers advice would have likely been spot on in the context he was stating at the time, I have to concur with JW that his advice and your use of that advice is not relevant to the problem the OP is trying to overcome.

In the context JW was referring to, taking the Eotech off to access the Irons is likely the only viable option available.

That being stated, I do not understand how JW can be accused of being on a high horse.

 

[Victor-TNVC]

Naw was gonna say more but someone you know said it wasn't worth it so I edited it. We all see you for what you wanna be...There's too many good men who served and have been shot at who know a helluva a lot more than you

 

[Victor-TNVC]

@Victor-TNVC

Well being that OP specifically stated he was running a Unity Tactical fast riser so he can get the advantage of having his Sight high enough for I assume the passive NV shooting that is the current hotness, having standard irons up and co-witnessed is not possible. Even if it was physically possible (SkyScraper Irons) would you want them up cluttering a already limited NV scene in darkness. Another light blockage item in an already challenged environment?

So while Mr. Pat Rodgers advice would have likely been spot on in the context he was stating at the time, I have to concur with JW that his advice and your use of that advice is not relevant to the problem the OP is trying to overcome.

In the context JW was referring to, taking the Eotech off to access the Irons is likely the only viable option available.

That being stated, I do not understand how JW can be accused of being on a high horse.

Simple his comment to me about Pat, and I commented in my other post about the risers.

 

[Victor-TNVC]

Also JW, won't edit, but name dropping "Augee" whom among others you've pissed off lately just to spread your community "Industry knowledge" may not be appropriate.

 

[WhereNow&How]

Well you got me there - see here how my draft horse is clearly higher than all the others.

Yours might be bigger, but mine has Auto Pilot. He Auto Gates too. 28 mph Singlefooter here man. Never has had a bit in his mouth. 100% Stud Horse can ride beside mares in season. He will turn his head to look at them and I say NAW and that head straightens out for a while then we repeat the cycle.

Here's what he likes doing best though.

 

[TheGerman]

Yeah not sure whats going on with this thread, but anyways, like I said, OP. I think your only option (if wanting a BUIS for during the day where your IR/visable laser wont help) is to find the Wilcox Riser rail (5/8 height was made for the shorter XPS3) and put the EoTech on it.

Then mount your rear BUIS on the rear portion of that same rail so its also raised the same height, and get the Wilcox front sight riser to do the same with the front sight.

I also looked at the ARMS risers with the see-thru channels, but if I remember right, those only line up with the see thru channel if you're using an ARMS SIRS rail.

If this is a night time only gun, then your IR laser will be the fallback, or the other way around, depending on what you're wanting to do.

 

[jwramp]

Not sure if his proper title is preferred to be “TNVC_Augee” and maybe using his first name was too casual... but here’s the post I was referring to for anyone interested in some more of the EOTech info. That whole thread actually has some decent discussion that may be relevant to this one as well. Sorry I didn’t include the link last night.