Rifle Scopes More then 25x

[Mosdet]

Having used moa/mil (Mark 4)scope for all my long distance shooting I am ready to purchase another scope and switch to Mil/Mil. With that said, most of my shooting is done at paper with 2-3 tactical competitions a year mostly done for fun and to learn more about shooting. I do not intend to become a regular competitor.

What I would like:
Quality and resale value
more then 25x (mostly shoot at paper and want to see my hits)
Mil/Mil (making the switch)
56mm
FFP

This to my knowledge does not exist so drop the FFP and what are my options?

I know the PM2 is closest but really would like the extra magnification.

You will ask budget... As little as possible but 3k is not out of the question.

If the NXS 8x32 came in Mil/Mil it would be my choice.

Thank you,
-Mosdet

 

[savage110]

Re: More then 25x

Um, the S&B 50x scope, I believe its 12-50 PMII and comes in MIL/MIL, I dont see anyone needing more then 25x for spotting hits though. JMHO

 

[JRose]

Re: More then 25x

I really can't see the need for a 25x scope, much less more than that...

I was shooting a 12x scope a couple of weeks ago seeing my hits at 1k with ease. All that extra power does is give you distorted resolution, and a shit load of mirage.

Seeing hits on paper is a pain in the ass past 300y no matter what scope you use, unless you use some kind of Shoot-N-See.

Heed: Quality over quantity applies in many places, this one not being the exception.

 

[matchking]

Re: More then 25x

Why Mil/Mil and not MOA/MOA? If shooting primarily paper, wouldn't you want the finer adjustments? The 8-32x (or 12-42x) NXS could work. With that said, I also do not see the need for magnification of greater than 25x.

A 5-25x FFP scope is hard to beat for most uses. With a good 25x scope, one can usually spot 6.5 holes in paper @ 400 yards.

 

[TimResin]

Re: More then 25x

PR 5-25 is the only scope that is really going to meet your needs otherwise S&B 5-25 or 12-50

 

[matchking]

Re: More then 25x

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TimResin</div><div class="ubbcode-body">PR 5-25 is the only scope that is really going to meet your needs otherwise S&B 5-25 or 12-50</div></div>
I love the PR 5-25x, but it doesn't meet his "need" of greater than 25x.

 

[Mosdet]

Re: More then 25x

Matchking that makes sence I agree to go moa/moa but I want to learn to use mil.
The only reason I want more then 25 is that most of my shooting is done at 300yards and for grouping. My eyes arn't the best so the extra "X" would make it easier for me to see my hits. My groups at 300 are less then MOA and sometimes I can't distinguish each hit from the last. That is really the main reason.
S&B 12.5-50 is overkill I think 12.5 is too much and so is 50. I know what I am looking for is maybe not possible but I just though someone may know of something that I didn't.

 

[BigBrother]

Re: More then 25x

Why not get a good scope and a decent spotting scope ($200 - Konus to $1200 - Kowa) which will magnify to 60X or more?

You may be trying to extract too much function from one tool. If 12.5X is too much for you on the low end, I don't see how you'll get much above 25X.

 

[JRose]

Re: More then 25x

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BigBrother</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Why not get a good scope and a decent spotting scope ($200 - Konus to $1200 - Kowa) which will magnify to 60X or more?

You may be trying to extract too much function from one tool. If 12.5X is too much for you on the low end, I don't see how you'll get much above 25X. </div></div>

Wisdom

 

[Mosdet]

Re: More then 25x

I knew that was coming BigBrother! Lol Lazy... That is the answer

Don't want to have to use a spoting scope.

Thanks guys for the ideas. I appreciate it... Just wanted to make sure I was not missing a product that would fit my needs.

 

[BigBrother]

Re: More then 25x

Maybe it's out there, I don't know, but from everything I've seen they really seem to be two distinct tools for two different jobs.

At three price points, here are the spotting scopes I would recommend:

On the cheap (~ $200):
KonuSpot 80- really a truly good value. Almost as good as the Kowas (the top) at under 1/5th the price- I did a lot of hands on comparison before (and after) purchasing. May not be as rugged, I'm not sure, but definitely almost as clear. Here is Jim Owens' review and endorsement:

http://www.jarheadtop.com/KONUS.htm

Can be had on Amazon and Midway for $220, and currently on B&H Photovideo for $180!

Midrange (~$500):
Bushnell Excursion FLP:
http://www.bushnell.com/products/scopes/spotting-scopes/excursion-flp/

Includes an installed mildot reticle as standard. Currently the belle of the ball on here for a low price spotter since it allows for accurate calling of adjustments. Max power (45x) may be a little low for you and personally I found the optical quality good but not great. Can be had new for about $500.

High end (~$1000):
Kowas (821 and others). The gold standard in general purpose spotting for high power shooting. Many variants and options out there, but you're looking at approximately 1K no matter how you slice it (assuming new). I personally haven't observed enough of a quality difference to warrant the price over the more affordable brands, but I guess at this point it's in the "buy once cry once" category.

Of course then there are much higher models by ze Germans, but rest assured, NO scope will give you resolution to see holes beyond 600y, no matter its provenance. What they give you is better light gathering, better mirage reading, less chromatic aberration, etc. But it's just a limitation of current optics technology, and no brand will solve that.

Alternately, you can do the camera type set up where you have a remote camera pointed at the target and a monitor close by on the line. This gives you effectively infinite resolution anywhere

, but is obviously a more complex solution.

 

[OldmaninNeb]

Re: More then 25x

I can see we have few tri-focal shooters. I had to go higher to see my shots on paper. 42x and i can ladder my ,223 @350 yds but only then. My swaro doesn't go high enuf to see that (just me n my poor eyes, but love to shoot)

 

[Ian A. Kelbly]

Re: More then 25x

Check out the new March X scopes. They have a 5x-50x56mm scope that is perfect for what you want. If that is not enough they even have a 8x-80x56mm, both are in MOA/MOA. They are excellent scopes and they only weigh 30ozs. If you want lower end power you can check out the 2.5x-25x42mm in MOA/MOA or MIL/MIL. All scopes can be illuminated or just set up for day shooting at targets. The website is http://www.deon.co.jp/march/

You can also contact me at kelbly.com or [email protected]

Thanks,
Ian Kelbly

 

[bward]

Re: More then 25x

I woud also look at march scopes. They have great glass.

 

[frankythefly]

Re: More then 25x

I know how you feel I use a straight powered 10 IOR which I love dearly but every comp I go to everyone wants to do stuff out to 1000+. I have been looking at the Mark 4 Er/t 8.5 x 25, it is FFP, 1/10 MIL turrets, The new M5 turrets are really nice! no resemblance to the m1. If you want straight power go for a march or a nightforce. My friend uses a 10-42 NXS and has that thing all the way up at a 1000 and he uses it to shoot at a nickel. I believe the march scopes are rather limited in adjustment which you will find in all the high power scopes minus USO, the march may also be only 1/8 clicks that is all I ever seen.

 

[gstaylorg]

Re: More then 25x

You're not alone popgunz...I also use a lot higher mag than most here seem to advocate for a given range. I'm not all that old, but my vision is simply not what it used to be, and I can guess it will only get worse in the future. If I can't see the target clearly, what's the use? I just ordered an NF 5.5-22x50 NXS so that I can get (see) out to ~800 yd. I've tried to get the job done with my NXS 3.5-15x50, and it's simply not enough for my eyes. I'm only shooting paper, so I could use really big targets, but it's a pain to have to go downrange and change them so often. Maybe it's different with a torso-sized steel target...never done that so I can't say. Aging stinks!

 

[427Cobra]

Re: More then 25x

I have a 5.5-22 NSX and a PR 5-25, I too have shot groups at 300, 600 and 1k, having more than 25 is IMHO useless for this kind of shooting, I'm giving serious thought on replacing both my scopes for 4-16 Hendsolts, simply having more mag is no in no way better than quaility glass.

 

[bward]

Re: More then 25x

For punching paper I recently traded my Nightforce 12-42 NXS for a March 50x and couldn't be happier. The glass is better and I have around 25-30 more MOA adjustment.

 

[wiganbear]

Re: More then 25x

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mosdet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Having used moa/mil (Mark 4)scope for all my long distance shooting I am ready to purchase another scope and switch to Mil/Mil. With that said, most of my shooting is done at paper with 2-3 tactical competitions a year mostly done for fun and to learn more about shooting. I do not intend to become a regular competitor.

What I would like:
Quality and resale value
more then 25x (mostly shoot at paper and want to see my hits)
Mil/Mil (making the switch)
56mm
FFP

This to my knowledge does not exist so drop the FFP and what are my options?

I know the PM2 is closest but really would like the extra magnification.

You will ask budget... As little as possible but 3k is not out of the question.

If the NXS 8x32 came in Mil/Mil it would be my choice.

Thank you,
-Mosdet </div></div>

A S+B PM11 would fit the bill if you can get one in the States for your budget. You can get it with all the options you ask for.

I own one in the 2nd Focal Plane with 1/4 moa clicks. I shoot all types of comps with my rifle and needed a scope that did it all. I've owned it about 6 months and would buy another no problem (apart from the price!!!!!!!!)

 

[Aqua Mark]

Re: More then 25x

Get a good spotting scope. With my Kowa I can see clothing, vehicle details, etc at over a mile that I could not do with a rifle scope. Good for seeing holes in paper too.

Even a $225 Konus will get the job done..

 

[ssgp2]

Re: More then 25x

I guess mirage is not a problem in your area...

 

[Mosdet]

Re: More then 25x

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: frankythefly</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have been looking at the Mark 4 Er/t 8.5 x 25, it is FFP, 1/10 MIL turrets, The new M5 turrets are really nice! no resemblance to the m1. </div></div>

Not knocking Leupold but this scope is $2600. When spending this amount of cash I think an extra 400-600 would be well spent on a PMII. 50 vs 56mm and time tested design and function is worth the extra cash to me.

 

[Mosdet]

Re: More then 25x

Guys, I want to thank you for all the thought and info in this thread. Also glad to see that I am not alone in looking for more "X" due to my eyesight.

 

[gugubica]

Re: More then 25x

You could always try one of those add on magnifiers.

 

[OldmaninNeb]

Re: More then 25x

I've done the magnifiers, not worth it! I'm tickled to see I'm not alone in the eye dept. wait til ya drop off the 60yr old cliff you younmg ones I didn't even need glasses til 40! ,,, March scopes looking good but no prices shown. I'm not competing so I choose most my shooting days. Wind is the constant in Nebraska! I like using official BB gun targets @ 100 yards, lotta targets before I need to 4 wheel down n change it. I love the input of this site!