As for the cost, what are you guys spending on rifles already? This thing is no more expensive than a full custom build with a Nightforce or similar optic.
ouch, you pay 9k for a rifle and optic? I hope they at least give you a kiss after they fuck you
Actually my last one was $5500; maybe $2500 for the ATACR? I can’t remember. Close enough to 9K. Maybe you are shooting Rem 700s and Douglas barrels; I don’t know. The guy who built my last one built the rifle that won the last natl F class championship. I decided to have him build me a rifle after he pounded 20 shots into 1.9 inches at 500 yards.
I posted on this subject in another thread; I thought I would post here as well:
I just joined this site due to the Ventus discussion. My focus is first shot cold bore hits. Anyone can adjust the first shot and hit; that doesn't fascinate me much. And as we all know, the wind is a deal killer when it comes to first round hits. My goal is to hit within five inches of my point of aim out to 800 yards, and within six inches past that. Anything else is a miss. I rarely miss at 800; my hit rate at 1200 is about 75%. I take a long time to estimate the wind, as I will explain below.
anyone can have a high hit percent when you wait until the wind dies. This does not impress anyone. Play by someone else’s rules and lets see what that hit percent drops to. I’d put money on below 40%
No kidding. I shoot in the late afternoon when the wind is blowing but on average it is not blowing hard. My average wind call is probably 2 MOA at 800; 3 MOA at 1200. I shoot 28 N with 195s, 300 RUM with 225 ELDs, Edge with 300 Bergers and 2 Lapuas with 285 ELDs. So the average wind I am shooting in is probably 6 mph. Once I hold more than 3 MOA wind at 800 or beyond, my hit rate does go down. But it will never be 40% on first round shots at 800.
I am old enough to remember how range estimation was a skill; I used a custom reticle from Premier, together with a modified Ranging 1000 rangefinder. I would average the two distances; worked fairly well out to 500. Then, on Jul 30, 1993, I bought a Leica Geovid, becoming the first person to buy one in the US. In one fell swoop, my days of estimating distances were over. What used to take five minutes was now instant - and without error.
Range estimation is still a skill. Those “custom reticles” are still around, ZCO just came out with a new one.
Still trying to figure out your weird flex on having the first geo vid in the US. This is about as likely as My college girlfriend telling me I was her first
Well, I could care less if you believe it or not - I gave you the date and will supply the serial number if it is causing you angst. A lot of people are taking the “wait and see” approach, thinking the cost and capability will increase in a year or two. Maybe it will, but maybe it won’t. In the case of LRs, it took a long time for a LR to surpass the Geovid.
I see a lot of parallels here to LRF tech. The first one was expensive and heavy, but it was absolutely a game changer. Nothing came to close to it in terms of technology for quite some time (early Bushnell RFs were crap). Time moved on and today we have much more capable devices for a fraction of the cost.
as is with all technology, now tell us about the tape driven computers. Simply drawing a parallel.
Do I regret paying $4500 for my Geovid back in 93? Hell no - I quickly moved on from range estimation as the biggest issue to inherent rifle accuracy, and then wind. I was hitting at long range while others were waiting for the price to come down.
rarely miss at 800 and 75% at 1200 but “inherent rifle accuracy” being your biggest issue”
Before LRs 500 yards was long; a one MOA rifle was plenty to hit a 10 inch target. Past that I learned it wasn't.
The way I estimate wind today is very similar to what I did to estimate range back in the day. I rely principally on mirage, normally by using the side parallax on my NF scopes (I know, a spotter situated so I can look thru that the same time I am aiming is better). But on cloudy days, like last week, where the wind was gusting all over the place, there was no mirage. In the desert foliage doesn't blow much and when it does the direction is often hard to identify. I look for what it is doing behind rocks etc to identify direction, and well as use a shock corded wind flag and my hand held anemometer.
wtf are you talking bout looking through a spotter the same time you are aiming? I will admit, I do wish I had X-ray vision to look behind rocks to see what the wind is
F class and XTC shooters position their spotter so they can look quickly at the mirage; ever been to one of those matches? Maybe you are looking at leaves blowing; I don’t know. If I can’t see the mirage clearly, the wind direction can be difficult if it is gusting and switching from say 5 to 7 o’clock. Vegetation that is blocked by rocks won’t be blowing; obviously I don’t see through rocks.
Let's face it, holding up an anemometer like a Kestrel (there is nothing magic about the Kestrel's ability to measure wind) is not terribly accurate. At 1200 yards my bullets are flying higher at some points than I can hold it. The wind effect is almost always greater than I measure with an anemometer. Last week, on that cloudy day, I hit 1 MOA left at 800 yards - I held 1.75 MOA right but total drift was 2.75 - or was it? That rifle can shoot 1/2 MOA at 800, so my true drift was anywhere from 2.25 to 3.0 (bullets don't travel in a straight line - half hit to the right of our point of aim, half hit to the left, the distance being a function of your accuracy).
how did you miss 1 MOA left at 800? Bad wind call – my point was there was no mirage and a storm was blowing in. Wind was gusty and switching. I thought you never miss at 800!??! No, I said I rarely miss. But I take my time and wait for the right condition – it surely isn’t when the dies. I bet if you do your part all day every day that rifle truly is a 1/2 moa rifle. It sure seems like you are talking down to us with all your know it all bullet do’s and don’t Hey, sorry if I offended anyone. I never said anyone here didn't know what they were doing, and didn't directly insult anyone or act disrespectful. Much of what I know I learned from someone else - everything I posted about wind I learned from F class shooters.
Thus, the first redeeming feature of the Ventus: you can practice wind calls and not have to worry about the impact of rifle accuracy. That itself is huge.
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I typically shoot at 1200 and 1300 yards (these are oriented 45 deg from my 800 yard target) during my practice sessions, which I do at least once a week and will do once per day when my Colorado retreat is finally built. HUMBLE BRAGGGGGG.No, a demonstration of my commitment to being able to shoot long range every day.But last week, I didn't even bother shooting past 800 - the wind was gusty and constantly shifting. oh no! What about that rarely missing at 800! Guess this proves you don’t shoot in wind. I couldn’t make a good wind call. I am a hunter, not a wanna be sniper. I could have made a guess using my hand held, but even a hit would have meant nothing – it would have been luck. The wind was gusting fast enough to change during the TOF. Here is the second thing I think the Ventus will do: if you constantly "zap" the wind and see it moving more than a few miles per hour in a second or two, you know a first round hit at 1200 is going to be lucky, simply due to the impact a nearly 2 second TOF creates in a constantly changing wind.
Oooffff Not sure what this means; at some point TOF becomes a problem. Why do you think DARPA created the EXACTO program (guided sniper bullet)?
The Ventus will only measure to 500, but it will extrapolate the effects over 500 past that. Who doesn't think that is better than what you can do without it? Yes, the wind can change after you measure the speed. But I think most of us determine the prevailing condition, calculate the solution, and then fire when that condition is present. What would be cool is if the Ventus can be focused halfway between your target and your position, thus showing mirage. Zap the wind when the prevailing condition exists. Shoot when you see that either in your spotter or with your parallax focused close (spin it back quickly before taking the shot of course).
A lot of you guys apparently think Mr. Fudd is the only one who sees value in the Ventus. false Did we ever say that about LRFs? GPS? nope, didn’t say that either As for only the affluent being able to buy one, how much do you spend on a rifle build, and how many of those do you have? Hell, I spend more on most hunts than this costs, so for me it is a no brainer. more of that bragging No, I am serious hunter. Buying something like a Ventus, when put in that context what I spend on hunting is a no brainer. For you, maybe not. Apparently you don’t hunt or if you do don’t venture far. A guy who can afford a G650 is going to get there faster than a guy flying a Super Cub; it might not be fair, but it's life.that g650 also can’t put you down in a backwoods grass strip where you can hunt to your hearts content. Tool for the job buddy. Thanks for the tip.
